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Another Ad by the Swifties

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posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 11:00 AM
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Another Ad by the Swifties, as theyve been called in some circles
I would suggest that by Bush saying hes not involved with the Swifty advertisements is so that he, or the Republican handlers can avoid Bush's military record, or lack of being brought into the mudpit of Washington's political arena, either way the Bush team has done there damage, I personally look forward to seeing the Democrats bring Bush AWOL into the pictrure.
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This time they claim that.
Kerry:. randomly shot at civilians,
Kerry:. cut of limbs, blown up bodies...
Kerry:. razed villages in a fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan...
Kerry:. crimes committed on a day to day basis...
Kerry:. ravaged the countryside of South Vietnam

Analysis: Kerry's testimony after returning from Vietnam helped launch his political career and is certainly fair game for a negative ad. He was a leader of Vietnam Veterans Against the War and had just led a major Washington protest against the conflict. The strength of this spot, by the independent group that has roiled the campaign by accusing the senator of lying about his military record, is that it uses Kerry's own words and voice.
More

view 60 second ad
or
Direct link RealPlayer

Benjamin L. Ginsberg, is the chief outside counsel to the Bush campaign.
Ginsberg said that a group of "decorated Vietnam War veterans came to me and said, 'We have an important point to get out in the debate under the First Amendment, the American right of free expression. . . . Help us,' they said, and I did."

His remarks were first reported by the Associated Press. He said he did not participate in strategy planning or in the development of messages, and did not discuss Bush campaign activities with the Swift boat veterans, or vice versa

On Saturday, the Bush campaign dismissed from its veterans steering committee a volunteer and Vietnam veteran, retired Col. Kenneth Cordier, who appeared in a Swift boat veterans ad. The campaign said Cordier had not previously disclosed his participation with the Swift boat group.

Democrats also said their allegation of collusion was supported by a flier at a Bush-Cheney office in Florida promoting a Swift boat event, and by close relationships in the past between backers of the veterans group and Bush aides such as political adviser Karl Rove.

Don Simon, an election-law expert with the campaign finance watchdog group Democracy 21, said Ginsberg's dual role "is not per se coordination" between the Bush campaign and the veterans group. That would occur only if Ginsberg has been transferring information between the two -- a question that likely would not be resolved before the election even if the FEC chooses to investigate the matter. But, Simon said that "as a matter of common sense, it certainly raises questions."

Larry Noble, who runs the Center for Responsive Politics watchdog group, said the Ginsberg situation is not by itself improper, but "when you're looking at common lawyers, it adds another level to it."





[edit on 25-8-2004 by Sauron]




posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 11:04 AM
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The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth are proven liars and a disgrace to the uniform.



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 11:27 AM
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The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth are proven liars and a disgrace to the uniform.



Good propaganda.


Distraction from the truth.
If Kerry is telling the truth, then he should open up his records and prove that his critics are wrong. Maybe he is afraid of something?

And the open bias. What about Fahrenheit 911, which is a greater pack of lies, half-truths, and rumors than any of this SBVT issues? Bush has openly called for a stop to the SBVT ads. Where is Kerry calling for Michael Moore to stop his film full of lies and creative editing? Why hasn't Kerry called for the end of MoveOn.org? Why is the Democratic Party 527 groups spending five times the amount of money that Republican 527 groups?

Hmmm, Christmas in Cambodia was "seared" in Kerry's memories, and then it turns out that Kerry lied, or more accuratly..."mis-remembered". It seems that both sides lie then.

I find it interesting that there is so much propoganda on the $200K that was donated to the SBVT by a wealthy Texas Republican, yet little to NO interest in the $12 Million that was donated by George Soros to defame the Bush Administration. What happened to truth and Denying Ignorance?

Guess people would rather spread propaganda...



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 02:32 PM
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Really, you people are amoral and bordering on simply evil. The qualifyer is I'm talking about Rove Republicans.

This "non-affiliated" group, who counts among it's members Bush's Veterans Advisor and his Campaign Lawyer, now foiled and discredited on one attempt, shift their raison d'etre and try a smear from a diffrent angle!?!?!?!

The F-9/11 bullysh***t: Bush and the rest of the henchmen were ready to sue, investigate & prosecute O'Neill, DiIllio, Clark , etc. for making comments....and these were Republicans. Where are the law suits from the Bush Administration against Michael Moore!?! If it's slander or if it's false, where are the item by item denouncements form the Bush team!?!? All that said, F-9/11 could have been made from researching ATS alone; meaning, we already got to the meat on just about everyting covered in the movie..... why the "amazement" over his packaging of it?

I'll tell you what: Let Kerry & Bush debate once a week from now until Nov.2. It can even be a two on one, with Dick Cheney sliding his hand up Bush's arse & playing puppet master like he did with their 9/11 commission testimony.

Just start talking policy, accomplishments and proposals at some point. If not, resign yourself to wear the Fascist label that so aptly applies by avoiding what counts. & focusing on a collective American mindF***K as a re-election strategy!!!



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 02:45 PM
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What a beautiful ad. If I was king of the world, I would put John Kerry in a small austere room and let him watch this ad on a 50" plasma screen television with surround sound audio till the day he dies.



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 03:00 PM
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Originally posted by Bout Time
Where are the law suits from the Bush Administration against Michael Moore!?! If it's slander or if it's false, where are the item by item denouncements form the Bush team!?!?


Why waist the time and money, half of America knows it is only MM's opinion. It sure didn't help Kerry in the polls...oh hey...neither did the Dem. National Convention. I wonder how much money the Democrates through away to throw that party?



with Dick Cheney sliding his hand up Bush's arse & playing puppet master like he did with their 9/11 commission testimony.


If G.W. is a puppet then Kerry's strings are being played by the same puppet master.



collective American mindF***K as a re-election strategy!!!



What about Kerry claimimg he is a war hero when Kerry himself said that the enemy was the American troops in Veitnam? So who or what was Kerry defending America from to call himself a "War Hero"?



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 03:09 PM
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Ha, ha, ha, well if some one a commander in chief that have not fear to go after enemy and take care of it I guess Kerry won, it say so in the ads,

Now bushy likes to hide in the white house and have his dirty works done by somebody else and the heck with our soldiers casualties as long as is not him.

Way to go King George.



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 03:27 PM
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That new ad only REPEATS what John Kerry said himself for years... If the ad is a lie then John Kerry is a liar. END OF STORY



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 03:47 PM
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So, we had an always clean, always moral, always righteous campaign by our military in Vietnam?
You guys are really trying to hang your hat on that?!?! Swifties & Grady speak for ALL vets from that era?!?!?

Reach out with both hands & get a clue, don't tramp your muddy shoes of ignorance through these forums interjecting that Kerry ever said American troops are the "enemy" in the context you're suggestiing....but please do keep trying to avoid this:


Just start talking policy, accomplishments and proposals at some point. If not, resign yourself to wear the Fascist label that so aptly applies by avoiding what counts. & focusing on a collective American mindF***K as a re-election strategy!!!



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 03:50 PM
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Originally posted by Bout Time
Really, you people are amoral and bordering on simply evil. The qualifyer is I'm talking about Rove Republicans.

etc, etc, etc...


More great name-calling and propaganda. I can homestly say Kerry is a decent person, but I just don't think he has what it takes. It seems the "other" side needs to launch into "evil, anti-christ, fascist, nazi, Hitler, etc " crap just to make themselves feel better. Not to mention the addition of curses to make it seem more dramatic. Ho-hum!

What counts is that Bush states a problem, gives a plan, and then follows through, whether you like it or not.

Kerry states a problem and then no real plan. Just that he will do things better than Bush. He seems to have the one point plan for America and the issue..."I am not Bush" or "I would do things the same, but better".

Honestly, my wife is MONDO Kerry and she has gotten very disheartened by the fact that he (in her words) "never says anything". Kerry is actually converting her to Bush himself.



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 03:58 PM
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Originally posted by Bout Time
Reach out with both hands & get a clue, don't tramp your muddy shoes of ignorance through these forums ...


I don't think anyone can claim to know it all. Thank goodness we have such a wise sage among us to guide us to the (pre-biased) light.

How wonderful. Just like Kerry's "if I was in that classroom on 9-11" speech. Glad he knows everything and would react perfectly too. Amazing how his hindsite is 20/20. Bush's hindsite is always just a conspiracy plan.



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 04:45 PM
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Just start talking policy, accomplishments and proposals at some point.


If you're not concerned or angry, you're not paying attention. Or, you're Republican & have it on automatic pilot.

This Swiftie "issue" has legs to you!?

It doesn't concern you that it dominates the mass media?

You believe in Bush's policies & think they're sound; wouldn't you wanted them compared to the last letter vesus Kerry's!?!

There's a clear message from Kerry, as well as a clear plan, on every platform issue we have occurring in our country; are you confusing the media's bias towards hissy-fight-Jerry Springer-sensationalism-to-feed-the-"ignorant"-masses as him Not having any!?!


Please, I'm old enough & have earned my scars. I can refute as ferociously as I like the ignorance of a poster trying to twist Kerry's testimony into a false self serving misrepresentation. I know you took away the truth that Kerry made no such contectual statement that he viewed his fellow fighting men as the Enemy during the Vietnam campaign.

Unilateral conviction is not leadership. Having a wrong plan & sticking to it is not leadership. "Faith based" is not a one size fits all leadership tool. They've shown nothing, and Bush in particular, in the way of solutions to any problem occurring today.

AND, I'm a NYer....we even curse when we say I love you!!
I'll try & tone it down if we start to hear some meat coming out of the Rove Republican convictions.



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 04:51 PM
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Bout Time,

The reason they are coming with this slander against Kerry is because the Republicans can not find anything good to say about their candidate so to avoid embarrassment they are targeting Kerry.

What a pity.



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 04:58 PM
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Originally posted by Bout Time
Just start talking policy, accomplishments and proposals at some point. If not, resign yourself to wear the Fascist label that so aptly applies by avoiding what counts. & focusing on a collective American mindF***K as a re-election strategy!!!


You say i should talk about policy, accomplishments and proposals?


I am not running for Pres., however, you should ask your candidate to do the same. What policies, accomplishments, and PROPOSALS has Kerry brought to the table? P-R-O-P-O-S-A-L-S
Kerry says he is going to do the same job as Bush but better
And thats a proposal?

School us Bout Time, what really counts? If it isn't the war on terror then what is sooo important that we are all missing? The only person focusing on a collective American mindF***K as a re-election strategy is Kerry.
collective American mindF***K
.



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 04:59 PM
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Que triste, pero qu quiere usted de pendejos?



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 05:30 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043
Bout Time,

The reason they are coming with this slander against Kerry is because the Republicans can not find anything good to say about their candidate so to avoid embarrassment they are targeting Kerry.


Nobody is saying bad stuff about Bush, right?


Lets see...calling Bush names like fascist, etc is ok.
Any word against Kerry? Slander.

More finger pointing and distraction. 200K for 527 ads versus 5+ million. Hmm, who is trying hardest to play dirty?



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 05:45 PM
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Originally posted by Bout Time
Que triste, pero qu quiere usted de pendejos?


Orale vato! So, if we don't accept personal insults in English...do you think Spanish is ok?

"Pendejo/Pendeja = Idiot, jackass"

Hmm, apologize or should a warn be issued?



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 06:08 PM
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What I don't understand is, while Republican cronies are busy focusing on Kerry's Viet Nam records (conveniently leaving out Bush's pampered lack of), why are Kerry's people not attacking Bush on all the other fronts in which his policies are a disaster? Here's one, the environment:

This administration, in catering to industries that put America's health and natural heritage at risk, threatens to do more damage to our environmental protections than any other in U.S. history. Here is NRDC's account of what the Bush administration has done and is doing on environmental matters:

www.nrdc.org...

(not some biased campaign website)

Isn't the very environment in which we breathe MORE IMPORTANT than things Kerry may or may not have said some 35 yrs ago?

Or, faith based initiatives:

Faith-based policies initiated by President Bush when he served as Texas governor have had adverse consequences for state residents and would serve as bad models for the nation, a Texas public policy group charged.

Five years into the faith-based initiative in Texas, the program is unregulated, prone to favoritism and co-mingling of funds, and dangerous to the people it's supposed to serve, representatives of the Texas Freedom Network Education Fund told reporters at a Capitol Hill news conference.

Bush's initiative forced people in need into sectarian programs in which they had to engage in religious activities as a condition of receiving essential services, Smoot charged. The program also resulted in preferential treatment for religious providers in government contracting, she said.

www.crosswalk.com...

Can anybody argue that the line between church and state is more blurred now than it has EVER BEEN?

But if we must discuss this SBVfT BS, then we must:

Financing for the organization derives in large part from a Texas fat cat whos an old, close pal of Karl Rove. The White House, needless to say, disavows any connection, stating that Mr. Bush never has and never will say anything to dishonor Mr. Kerrys service.

Youre doubtless also aware that since waking up to the knife at his jugular, Mr. Kerry has called on the publisher of Unfit for Command (Regnery, home to Laura Ingraham and William F. Buckley Jr.) to pull the book from the shelves, and on the F.E.C. to look into Bush links to the TV commercialschances of which are as likely as Ho Chi Minh City changing its name back to Saigon. Mr. Kerry has also accused Mr. Bush of having the SBVfT "do his dirty work for him," and demanded that the President denounce the groups activities. Mr. Bush predictably has declined to cooperate, artfully saying that he wants all soft-money "527 Committee" ads off the air, not just those of SBVfTa prescription that would hurt Democrats far more than Republicans. So thats not going to happen, either. A spokesman for Mr. Bush, meanwhile, has suggested that Mr. Kerrys unpunctual lather may be a sign of mental unbalanceprecisely what another spokesman hinted about John McCain when he exploded over Bush-supporting ads questioning his patriotism during the 2000 South Carolina primary. In between hugging Commander-in-Chief Bush and being bussed on the forehead by him, Mr. McCain himself has likened the SBVfTs campaign to what was done to him when he ran for President (so has Vietnam triple-amputee Max Cleland, who was defeated for re-election to the Senate from Georgia under similar circumstances). Mr. McCain branded the SBVfT charges "dishonest and dishonorable" and echoed Mr. Kerrys recommendation to Mr. Bushto zero effect.

Finally, if you read The New York Times, The Washington Post, The Boston Globe or the Los Angeles Times (unlike, oh, 99 percent or so of the voting public), youre cognizant, too, that exhaustive investigation of official U.S. Naval records fails to substantiate a single one of the SBVfTs major charges. Instead, the commendations and "after-action reports" in Pentagon archives contradict themsometimes in words written by those presently doing the accusing. Ten of the 11 men who sailed in the two boats Mr. Kerry commanded also back their former skipper. The eleventh, a laid-off "home inspection field manager" named Steven Michael Gardner, is an SBVfT member who accuses Mr. Kerry of repeatedly shying from engaging the enemy. "He wouldnt go in there and search," Mr. Gardner told The Boston Globe in March. "That is why I have a negative viewpoint of John Kerry."

What amounts to cowardice in wartime is a damning charge. But theres one little catch. By Mr. Gardners own admission, then-Lt. Kerry threatened to court-martial him for machine-gunning a sampan from which he thought fire was coming. When the shooting stopped, Mr. Kerrywhod been in the wheel house when Mr. Gardner, then others opened up without orderpersonally inspected the flimsy native craft. No weapons were found, just a woman and the body of a little boy. "[Mr. Kerry was] screaming at the top of his lungs," Mr. Gardner told The Globe. "What the hell do you think youre doing?"

Green Beret Lt. Jim Rassman didnt think he was being fired at when a mine explosion blew him off Mr. Kerrys Swift boat; he knew the splashes all around him were being made by real ammo. "I was sure I was going to die," he said. Then, above him, a long right arm reached out to pull him to safety; it belonged to John Kerry, whod been thrown against the wheel house by the blast, which wounded Mr. Kerrys left arm, according to the citation that accompanied his Bronze Star. Said Mr. Rassmann: "He saved my life."

Not according to Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. They say no one was firing anywhere near Lts. Rassmann and Kerry that day.

www.observer.com...



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 06:45 PM
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Originally posted by Bout Time
Que triste, pero qu quiere usted de pendejos?


ha, ha, ha, ha, is being in a long time the funniest thing I read in spanish very funny. Are you fluent in it?

And ZeddicusZulZorander with all your respect only in certains part of latin america it is considered bad on others is just an every day word.


( I am a spanish teacher after all)


by the way pendejo means,
pubic hair,
the male of the bee species,
dumb no very inteligent,
coward not able to confront enemy and that as much I can come out with it.

[edit on 25-8-2004 by marg6043]

[edit on 25-8-2004 by marg6043]



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 07:04 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043
And ZeddicusZulZorander with all your respect only in certains part of latin america it is considered bad on others is just an every day word.



So I guess if in my country, or city, or town, or office...a word is an everyday word, then it is ok and should not be taken as offensive? I could call people anything I wish?


I understand what you are saying, but even by you're own admission...it is the same as "idiot". So again...my original question is valid.




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