The UK should have a Stolen Valour Act - We've just been had by a lowlife impersonating a Military

I am going to start at the beginning.

My partner is ex-Special Forces (UK) and now is involved in offering clients security advice and support when operating in hostile environments.

We run a company together and do background checks and meet a lot of ex-military personnel as part of our day to day grind.

One of our clients employs a lot of ex-military (strong work ethic, focused...and many of the management are ex-military, so they like to support those leaving the services).

We were introduced to one of their team - who runs some major events in Aberdeen for the Oil and Gas sector...running endurance and escape and evasion courses for keep fit fanatics who want to raise cash for ex-military personnel, etc.

Now this guy has been passing himself off as a Royal Marine Captain....getting the buy in from loads of businesses around town...turning up to our home in Camo gear and wearing medals to various remembrance day parades.

The power of Groupthink is huge - he has been passing under the radar because all of the groups, clients and people have automatically thought that because the company has taken him on, that references have been checked and all is good in the woods.

Something niggled my partner and I - we did a bit of background checking and it turns out he is an ex metropolitan policeman who was chucked out of the force for credit card fraud in 2005....he has never ever been in the marines.

He has built up a whole imaginary career for himself in the Royal Marines and has lied to everyone, his employers, his girlfriend and the whole fundraising community.

Now we're about to have a powwow with him to tell him to get out of Dodge.

He has been smart - he has been told to cease and desist by the Marines, but because he is not doing anything supposedly illegal, then the police wont jump. However, if he was impersonating a police officer...or even a traffic warden...then he would get humped!

I think this is rather unfair as he is basically gaining a whole reputation, getting into businesses he would never get into and building a life around pretending he has medals such as the military cross...which men die for.

I love the American Stolen Valour Act - I really believe that there is a place for this law in the UK and I am livid and disappointed that this guy will be able to pick up his bags and just take off to the next town with his lies.

Any of you got any experience of this? How do you feel about people creating lives around lies?

I get that some people embellish on their CVs, but this guy has taken it to a whole new level.

Do you think they should be imprisoned for longer than a month?

reply to post by stellify


Yeh, easy solution. Blanket. Heavy military/ex-military friends, blindfold and dark room.

I can go into specifics if you need.

I'm going to play the devils advocate. Putting aside the 2005 fraud charges, Hows he doing at those business's he's gotten himself involved in? Is he a good businessman? Do people like him?

It may have been his life long dream to be this "person" but since he couldn't cut it this is the next best thing for him.. is it really fair he cannot get introduced to those contacts/businesses simply because those contracts are normally only for military people? That sounds like favoritism to me and not letting someone have an opportunity simply because they didn't live a certain way seems wrong, as long as he can handle the business and do good at them i say he can stay.

That's what I gleam from your post, I may have another opinion if i knew more about the situation.[.

Of course there is always the possibility that he's trying to defraud people with this mask - have you really had an indication of that or is all this just supposition?

reply to post by stellify



i had a friend a few years back who was my manager, he used to go an about 'missions' when he was in special ops. he'd get drunk and tell tall tales about killing people and infested swamps and rescue missions just to get respect from people around him and also to bed women, we all knew it was bs so when my life moved on i checked him out...his previous jobs were a garbage man and a greens keeper on a golf course.

now i look back on his storys and find it amusing that he 'lived' in a fantasy to get laid and get friends.

reply to post by stellify


i reccommend " the act of a good kicking "

reply to post by stellify


He's trying to make money, all the 'best' at this lie cheat and steal.
Thats how it goes.
If you don't like it then I guess you'll never make it to the top.

Sorry for the cynicism but it's true.

This incident reminds me of this case

www.dailymail.co.uk... article-1268027/Exposed-The-fake-war-hero-medals-claimed-fought-Goose-Green.html

The use of the Armed Forces Act 2006 was used.

Don't automaticaly take the word of one individual officer in cases like this. Often the Police would have no or little knowledge involving such cases due to being a military issue.

You may be better off contacting your Police forces HQ for clarification of any offences that may have been committed.

If he has been using these fantasy credentials to obtain money he may have committed the offence of obtaining property by deception.

The offence of obtaining property be deception is created by s15(1) of the Theft Act 1968 which provides:

"A person who by any deception dishonestly obtains property belonging to another, with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it, shall on conviction on indictment be liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 10 years."

The actus reus of this offence is complete if the defendant (1) by deception (2) obtains (3) property (4) belonging to another. The mens rea consists of the defendant acting (1) dishonestly (2) with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it, and (3) deliberately or recklessly making the deception.

Originally posted by JohnPhoenix
I'm going to play the devils advocate. Putting aside the 2005 fraud charges, Hows he doing at those business's he's gotten himself involved in? Is he a good businessman? Do people like him?

It may have been his life long dream to be this "person" but since he couldn't cut it this is the next best thing for him.. is it really fair he cannot get introduced to those contacts/businesses simply because those contracts are normally only for military people? That sounds like favoritism to me and not letting someone have an opportunity simply because they didn't live a certain way seems wrong, as long as he can handle the business and do good at them i say he can stay.

That's what I gleam from your post, I may have another opinion if i knew more about the situation.[.

Of course there is always the possibility that he's trying to defraud people with this mask - have you really had an indication of that or is all this just supposition?

edit on 19-9-2011 by JohnPhoenix because: sp

No worries - devil's advocates are very welcome. Thanks for coming in with an alternative viewpoint. It really does assist my perspective

The contacts he is making are not closed to those who arent military. Basically, he's acting as the trusted advisor to a few keen charities (unsure if payment is being made at this point) and is 'leading' various simulated escape and evasion events and corporate outdoors days...without the right expertise and without the right insurances, etc. Putting people at risk.

His story is that he is a Captain in the Royal Marine's Reserve - getting pulled out of work to take part in missions...and returning to work once that's done.

He is pretty clever...he even complained to us that he thought someone was impersonating him...saying they were a Marine's officer to run Commando style courses and was using his name and credentials. It threw us off the track for at least a month!!!! D'oh...how stupid did we feel?

He told us a month ago he was heading to Afghanistan as part of a reserve unit. Turns out he is currently onboard a subsea vessel as part of a crew - we checked the manifests and he is on them....

I have done all the birth record checking to make sure we are not mixing him up with someone else (there has only been one man with his name born in the UK in the last 50 years...and we can track him through electoral record, etc, and also tie him to an exact birthplace through his family), we've been in touch with RMR - HQ Scotland, and they have continually asked him to cease and desist.

It's been eye opening...

I have no issues with someone covering up their past....however, he had the opportunity to start afresh when he started working with his current employer. He could have said he was a marine in the past and proved himself professionally...gaining a good reputation for being good at what he does...an ROV tool technician.

Instead, he runs around aberdeen in Camo gear...pretends to be a Captain...has his photo taken with guns...wears medals like the military cross to remembrance day parades and leads people into dangerous situations in the forest without the proper kit, skill or insurance...

What was actually wrong with him just being who he is..?

Why has he felt the need to live as a pathological liar?

I have had this man in my home and fed him...

He told my partner that he was having issues due to battlefield induced PTSD....my partner welcomed him in with open arms...offering him advice and telling him all about his PTSD...

Not knowing that he would take those tales and pass them off as his own to get off work for three months!

The guy is certifiable...

Rant over

reply to post by studio500


Hi - thanks for this. RMR Scotland are currently building up a dossier to submit to the police. We're getting involved with witness statements and have submitted the background check evidence we have gained so far.

Thanks for the advice.

reply to post by wedidgothacked


It seems there are so many of these idiots about - I cant understand the need to live as someone else...

Is getting laid that important?

reply to post by stellify


Report him to the police and the Royal Marines along with alerting your nearest barracks and legion hall.

Make sure you tell only the truth about him. That should be enough to see him punished and you safe from prosecution.

*Making people aware of who they are dealing with is a good thing to do. People will be glad you warned them about this fraudster.

Originally posted by LightAssassin
reply to post by stellify

 

Yeh, easy solution. Blanket. Heavy military/ex-military friends, blindfold and dark room.

I can go into specifics if you need.

Yep - that has been mentioned!

There's a few paras just back from a hard tour of Afghanistan who could be available to dispense retribution...

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
reply to post by stellify

 

i reccommend " the act of a good kicking "

Am with you.

Originally posted by Raivan31
reply to post by stellify

 

He's trying to make money, all the 'best' at this lie cheat and steal.
Thats how it goes.
If you don't like it then I guess you'll never make it to the top.

Sorry for the cynicism but it's true.

I'm glad my values are different to those you state. Some people do subscribe to morality - we may be bottom feeders...but if being certifiably insane is what it takes to get to the top, then I am happy where I am.

There are a few different organisations dedicated to publicly outing these frauds ( I believe the slang term is "Walt" in the U.K.?)

Try contacting one of these links below, in the least I am sure they can point you in the appropriate direction for your location....

www.anzmi.net...

militarygear.com...

www.abc.net.au...

Good luck outing the rat bastard.

reply to post by Exuberant1


Hi

He's been reported now to the police - issue is that because he is not ex-military, then the military cant do too much.

The case gainst him needs to be prove on financial or business gain to be successful...

He's been clever, Because there's a grey area of responsibility for prosecution, etc., most of these guys can get away with it.

reply to post by stellify


Well if he is wearing the medals in a parade that were not awarded to him, that is an offence under the Armed forces act 2006, also it is an offence if the intention is to deceive, to pretend to be member of armed forces, or a veteran under this same act.

I would continue to gather as much evidence as you can. ie documentation, photographic evidence of him wearing said decoration and any possible evidence wherby his impersonation as a veteran or armed service personnel would lead to renumeration in any way.

Why not also consider an online downing street petition for the enforcement of a UK version of the Stolen Valour Act?

You never know if you campaign enough you may get sufficient signatures for the government to take notice.

reply to post by Drunkenparrot


Thanks drunken parrot - those links you posted are eyeopening.

I never realised how many people scammed being in the military!

Originally posted by stellify

He's been reported now to the police - issue is that because he is not ex-military, then the military cant do too much.

You'd be surprised at what military men will do when they find out about this sort of person.

Just make them aware of him.

Been sort of a victim of this type of thing myself.

My ex wife got her current fella to pretend to be me so that she could get a load of stuff from my regimental association, SAAFA and the British legion.

She knew my army number et al so it was all to easy to do. I did not find out until I needed some help myself and was given short shrift for already recieved help. Suffice to say I kicked up a dust storm. I dont think those two morons will do it again!