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People Who Pronounce and Spell the Name of Jesus In Weird Old Testament Variants are Going to Hell

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posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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Originally posted by the4thhorseman
reply to post by jmdewey60
 


No you are missing my point with the whole story of Job. Job had faith in a savior, a savior he did not know by name but Job knew he would see his Savoir. Yet he believed in Him. I am saying GOD knows the heart and He knows who we are speaking of when we speak of Jesus, Christ, Son of God, Yahshua, Yehoshua, Y'shua, Yeshua, Iesous, Iesus.

What was the name of Christ before He was a man? I can't even seem to find an agreement on how to spell the actual Hebrew name.
Maybe you are missing my point of the whole thread.
If everything was fine as it was, a hundred and fifty years ago, where everyone had a Bible and could read about Jesus and believe to be saved, then why is it now necessary to change this by making claims that we need to use a different name?
The answer, or at least it seems to be the obvious answer to me, is that there is no good reason to do it.
The next question is, Could there be a bad reason to do that?
Again, as it seems to me, the answer is, Yes there is a bad reason to do it.




posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 04:20 PM
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reply to post by the4thhorseman
 



What was the name of Christ before He was a man?

I don't know about a name, but based on the evidences, I would say you could have called him "angel of the LORD", one like a son of man, and possibly a few other things.


I can't even seem to find an agreement on how to spell the actual Hebrew name.

One reason I hate languages that only have consonants and semi-vowels. EliYah.com has a good study on this here.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 04:23 PM
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Originally posted by NewAgeMan
I think the OP's issue, if I can intuit it, boils down to the notion that Jesus, in his death and resurrection, represents a whole new spiritual basis and foundation, but that Yahweh of the OT represents God as an actor or agent, as a separate entity. The NEW Covenent then, is a whole new reality, and Jesus' father in heaven, the Absolute as Absolute Love and Goodness without compromise, not even the creator God as a role that God may have assumed, but God the Most High, as the Transcendant Godhead at one with Jesus, and though him, we ourselves. There is a demarcation here, a delimiter, of before, and after, the death and resurrection of Jesus, a shift and an exchange of kingdoms, spiritually, and to the degree that we might be given to understand it and integrate it, psychologically, as a formative causation, of the love of God through Jesus Christ who said "I have only one commandment. Love one another as I have loved you."

bump post...

people tend to get too wrapped up in being right relative to another's wrong, so I'm just asking everyone to pause and given consideration to a new possibility, of a purely spiritual nature.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 04:31 PM
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reply to post by NewAgeMan
 
Fair enough...I'm just hoping for some information clarifying that I've somehow misunderstood what's been posted here, as a good bit of it smacks too much of attributing the works and words of god in the old testament to evil, which seems to walk way too close to blasphemy of the holy spirit, as when the pharisees tried to ascribe the works of Christ to Beelzebub.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 04:43 PM
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I can't believe this thread hasn't been removed.

I've seen no elucidation of what the author thinks the correct spelling and pronunciation of Jesus, is...neither are any of the 'damned' given any indication of the 'wierd' variants.

This thread has a been a fishing expedition from the start...and disagreeing with the author will get you 'clubbed', and accused of being possessed and going to hell...christians, muslims, buddhists, people who can't read Hebrew like the author can read Hebrew...you get where I'm going here, don't ya?!

Akushla



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 04:44 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by WarminIndy
 



You have told us we are going to hell for believing in Yehushua, even though it is merely His name in Hebrew.
How can this be true?
Let me see if I can see how this would apply.
We can have a hypothetical Jew who was born in Israel who was strictly taught to never utter a word which was not in Hebrew, and spent their life in seclusion or in communities that strictly enforced rules for never speaking a word not of Hebrew. Somehow, this young person is able to escape the ever watchful eye to see or hear about a thing called a New Testament and wants to read it, but needs it to be in Hebrew to understand it. Oops there is no such thing, nor would anything like that ever be allowed in Israel.


That really makes no sense. Strictly taught to never utter a word not in Hebrew? Apparently you don't know any Jewish people. The Apostle Paul sat at the feet of the great teacher Gamaliel.

en.wikipedia.org...

In case you did not know. Jewish people are very keen on learning.

en.wikipedia.org...

You really do not know anything about Jewish people at all.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 04:56 PM
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reply to post by akushla99
 
As far as I can tell just setting jm to "posts in thread", it looks like the whole point is that someone somewhere said you've got to use the hebrew variants of the names or you won't have salvation, as applies to those who *refuse* to use the name Jesus since it's what's written in the bible (even though what's written in the bible is actual Iesous, for the most part, and is merely one language's version of what we would call Joshua - and was finally translated AS Joshua in the book of Acts to clarify it was not a reference to Christ).

I'm OK with that, but when we came down to calling the god the jews swore to on Sinai a 'genocidal murderer god' or some such who's been downgraded to simply being an angel with the appearance of Christ in the new testament, as well as stating that there's no evidence for the history of the jews as given in the bible and calling it all mythology - I start getting really confused and more than a little concerned since that undermines everything that Christ was built on.

edit on 9/20/2011 by Praetorius because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 04:58 PM
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Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
I think the OP's issue, if I can intuit it, boils down to the notion that Jesus, in his death and resurrection, represents a whole new spiritual basis and foundation, but that Yahweh of the OT represents God as an actor or agent, as a separate entity. The NEW Covenent then, is a whole new reality, and Jesus' father in heaven, the Absolute as Absolute Love and Goodness without compromise, not even the creator God as a role that God may have assumed, but God the Most High, as the Transcendant Godhead at one with Jesus, and though him, we ourselves. There is a demarcation here, a delimiter, of before, and after, the death and resurrection of Jesus, a shift and an exchange of kingdoms, spiritually, and to the degree that we might be given to understand it and integrate it, psychologically, as a formative causation, of the love of God through Jesus Christ who said "I have only one commandment. Love one another as I have loved you."

bump post...

people tend to get too wrapped up in being right relative to another's wrong, so I'm just asking everyone to pause and given consideration to a new possibility, of a purely spiritual nature.


The thing is here, the maker of this post is anti-Orthodox Christian saying he is a Christian, and saying all the rest of us are going to hell, for saying Jesus in the Hebrew. He has made the assertion that Hebrew was not really a language until the State of Israel in 1948.

He is not honest because he can't say what faith system he is using to make his theology. He knows the very scriptures that tells us not to receive any Gospel that is not the one we have been taught. So far he has told us, the posters, that because we believe in Jesus as we have been taught, are going to hell.

At least you, in your username, have defined your theology. And when I say theology I mean the system of religious ideals you study and believe.

He has said that people who say the Hebrew word for Jesus are going to hell. We have explained to him that even though there is a small group of people who think you must use only the Hebrew, the rest of us understand there are different languages and we are ok with people speaking the name Jesus. And he has condemned these people by saying they believe in esoterical thinking, but then says the OT and portions of the NT is allegorical. But by studying in the manner he does is also esoteric.

That was the original issue, the people who say Jesus in Hebrew are going to hell. He believes in an allegorical hell, then tells us we are going to this "allegorical" hell. That is what the issue is.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:00 PM
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Originally posted by Praetorius
reply to post by akushla99
 
As far as I can tell just setting jm to "posts in thread", it looks like the whole point is that someone somewhere said you've got to use the hebrew variants of the names or you won't have salvation, as applies to those who *refuse* to use the name Jesus since it's what's written in the bible.

I'm OK with that, but when we came down to calling the god the jews swore to on Sinai a 'genocidal murderer god' or some such who's been downgraded to simply being an angel with the appearance of Christ in the new testament, as well as stating that there's no evidence for the history of the jews as given in the bible and calling it all mythology - I start getting really confused and more than a little concerned since that undermines everything that Christ was built on.


Yes Pratorius. That is it exactly.
edit on 9/20/2011 by WarminIndy because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:03 PM
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Originally posted by Praetorius
reply to post by akushla99
 
As far as I can tell just setting jm to "posts in thread", it looks like the whole point is that someone somewhere said you've got to use the hebrew variants of the names or you won't have salvation, as applies to those who *refuse* to use the name Jesus since it's what's written in the bible (even though what's written in the bible is actual Iesous, for the most part, and is merely one language's version of what we would call Joshua - and was finally translated AS Joshua in the book of Acts to clarify it was not a reference to Christ).

I'm OK with that, but when we came down to calling the god the jews swore to on Sinai a 'genocidal murderer god' or some such who's been downgraded to simply being an angel with the appearance of Christ in the new testament, as well as stating that there's no evidence for the history of the jews as given in the bible and calling it all mythology - I start getting really confused and more than a little concerned since that undermines everything that Christ was built on.

edit on 9/20/2011 by Praetorius because: (no reason given)


As far as I can tell, the 'bible prophet of revelation' has no problem inferring someone is a wife basher. I think the intent of the thread is disingenuous, and a fishing trip, from the start!

Akushla



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:07 PM
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Originally posted by WarminIndy

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
I think the OP's issue, if I can intuit it, boils down to the notion that Jesus, in his death and resurrection, represents a whole new spiritual basis and foundation, but that Yahweh of the OT represents God as an actor or agent, as a separate entity. The NEW Covenent then, is a whole new reality, and Jesus' father in heaven, the Absolute as Absolute Love and Goodness without compromise, not even the creator God as a role that God may have assumed, but God the Most High, as the Transcendant Godhead at one with Jesus, and though him, we ourselves. There is a demarcation here, a delimiter, of before, and after, the death and resurrection of Jesus, a shift and an exchange of kingdoms, spiritually, and to the degree that we might be given to understand it and integrate it, psychologically, as a formative causation, of the love of God through Jesus Christ who said "I have only one commandment. Love one another as I have loved you."

bump post...

people tend to get too wrapped up in being right relative to another's wrong, so I'm just asking everyone to pause and given consideration to a new possibility, of a purely spiritual nature.


The thing is here, the maker of this post is anti-Orthodox Christian saying he is a Christian, and saying all the rest of us are going to hell, for saying Jesus in the Hebrew. He has made the assertion that Hebrew was not really a language until the State of Israel in 1948.

He is not honest because he can't say what faith system he is using to make his theology. He knows the very scriptures that tells us not to receive any Gospel that is not the one we have been taught. So far he has told us, the posters, that because we believe in Jesus as we have been taught, are going to hell.

At least you, in your username, have defined your theology. And when I say theology I mean the system of religious ideals you study and believe.

He has said that people who say the Hebrew word for Jesus are going to hell. We have explained to him that even though there is a small group of people who think you must use only the Hebrew, the rest of us understand there are different languages and we are ok with people speaking the name Jesus. And he has condemned these people by saying they believe in esoterical thinking, but then says the OT and portions of the NT is allegorical. But by studying in the manner he does is also esoteric.

That was the original issue, the people who say Jesus in Hebrew are going to hell. He believes in an allegorical hell, then tells us we are going to this "allegorical" hell. That is what the issue is.


The OP in another thread stated he was part of a 7th Day Adventist church, if that clears anything up.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:21 PM
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reply to post by akushla99


I think the intent of the thread is disingenuous, and a fishing trip, from the start!

What is a fishing trip? Is that like tricking people into giving info, or something?
Try this: Hover over member under my avatar until the dropdown shows posts in thread. Read all my posts. If everything is answered in my posts, then fishing was productive.




edit on 20-9-2011 by pthena because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by Praetorius
reply to post by NewAgeMan
 
Fair enough...I'm just hoping for some information clarifying that I've somehow misunderstood what's been posted here, as a good bit of it smacks too much of attributing the works and words of god in the old testament to evil, which seems to walk way too close to blasphemy of the holy spirit, as when the pharisees tried to ascribe the works of Christ to Beelzebub.

Understood.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:24 PM
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Originally posted by daikaiju


The OP in another thread stated he was part of a 7th Day Adventist church, if that clears anything up.


I think he posted in here that he does not go to church any more and that was for personal reason. That was early on. Maybe he had been at some point in his life but I have met Seventh Day Adventists and some things he says does not sound like it.

I don't know, I think he just has his own theology that is made up from mixing a lot of theologies. I will ask those I know who are Seventh Day Adventists. The ones I know are vegetarians and go to services on Saturday, which I have no problem with because Paul taught us in Colossians 2:16

"Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:"

I follow a more traditional Christianity that goes to church on Sunday, but I am ok with someone who goes on Monday. Thursday or Saturday.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:34 PM
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reply to post by WarminIndy
 


Two days ago in the other thread he said he was a member but just has not been to church in 6 months, and your right I also been around 7 Day Ads and he does not sound like one.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:49 PM
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reply to post by WarminIndy
 
I personally don't get shades of the seventh-day adventists out of this. They're probably closest to myself in christian theology, and acknowledge the old testament, the trinity as typically understood, and as far as I'm aware don't express any significant doubts about jews or hebrew...main target is the Roman catholic church and the pope.

Only real differences from mainstream christianity with the SDAs is their adherence to the sabbath as a sign of true believers, healthy living like vegetarianism and other good points, not believing in immortality for the unsaved (annihilationism), not believing in a pre-tribulation rapture, and the only one I'm aware I really disagree with is their interpretation of the millenial kingdom (in heaven, while Satan & co. get earth).

What's been mentioned in this thread seems to be something else entirely.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by Praetorius


What's been mentioned in this thread seems to be something else entirely.



I know. That is why I kept asking but he would not answer those. He has a hodge-podge of Hinduism, Jainism, Zoroastrianism, Islam, and Christianity. He continually flip-flopped on the most basic things that even he said. He would post something and then wonder where we got that he posted it.

Maybe he is BaHai.
edit on 9/20/2011 by WarminIndy because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 06:05 PM
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His talk of other's swallowing demons, taking poision, being bitten by snakes, etc. etc., it's all a little disconcerting, on the basis of the golden rule.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 06:06 PM
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Originally posted by WarminIndy

Originally posted by Praetorius


What's been mentioned in this thread seems to be something else entirely.



I know. That is why I kept asking but he would not answer those. He has a hodge-podge of Hinduism, Jainism, Zoroastrianism, Islam, and Christianity. He continually flip-flopped on the most basic things that even he said. He would post something and then wonder where we got that he posted it.

Maybe he is BaHai.
edit on 9/20/2011 by WarminIndy because: (no reason given)


Or he is on here to just troll around and bait people into arguments.
He would not be the first around here to behave like that.



posted on Sep, 20 2011 @ 06:13 PM
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Originally posted by NewAgeMan
His talk of other's swallowing demons, taking poision, being bitten by snakes, etc. etc., it's all a little disconcerting, on the basis of the golden rule.


Swallowing demons? I missed that one, perhaps I should read through all of these to find it. I know I had mentioned that my relatives are from snake-handling churches. They also drink Strychnine. Even if their views do not agree with Orthodox Christianity, at least they are honest when they say why they believe it.

The question about the Oneness doctrine was from me, and he thanked me for not arguing on that one. I never argue on Oneness because it is pointless. I always think like this, if you say you believe in something, you should be able to justify your reason for doing so. I think he is disingenuous also. I think someone posted that.




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