Was Jesus Really Tempted by Satan?, page 2

reply to post by SuperiorEd

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Did Satan get permission from Jesus to tempt him, then tempt him? Or, was Satan sitting down and playing chess with God when the issue of Jesus came up, and God said, sure go tempt him. If Jesus is the "Son of God" so is Satan, according to Job, making them brothers. Surely Jesus would recongnize him and know his tactics.

Did Jesus come back and tell his disciples how he met Satan and was not tempted? Did he tell them the conversation he had with Satan, and the lengths that he went to, trying to get him, Jesus, to kneel before him? Sounds out of charactor, that he would share something like that, without sounding weak or bragging.

Is that why the story is told in the 3rd person, and not by Jesus himself?

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by SuperiorEd

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Did Satan get permission from Jesus to tempt him, then tempt him? Or, was Satan sitting down and playing chess with God when the issue of Jesus came up, and God said, sure go tempt him. If Jesus is the "Son of God" so is Satan, according to Job, making them brothers. Surely Jesus would recongnize him and know his tactics.

Did Jesus come back and tell his disciples how he met Satan and was not tempted? Did he tell them the conversation he had with Satan, and the lengths that he went to, trying to get him, Jesus, to kneel before him? Sounds out of charactor, that he would share something like that, without sounding weak or bragging.

Is that why the story is told in the 3rd person, and not by Jesus himself?

Make sure you know the difference between holding an answer or verifying the question. Are you asking a question and then going to the text to check the answer, or are you holding an answer and then checking the text for verification? Depending on your reasoning, you will either disprove yourself or the Bible by your reasoning. The former is preferable to the later. Pride will blind us by holding a theology as our answer. If we approach the subject from humility, the answer will already be there in the text from comparison to less and greater relevance. To rightly divide truth, you need only trust that all paradoxes can be resolved. Hillel's Seven Rules apply to all of scripture. LINK Start with questions and end with answers that agree throughout scripture.

Jesus and God are one. They are in agreement. Jesus didn't live and then take His place with God. He was already there. Satan is a fallen Angel apart from communion with God. He is temporal and finite. The paradox you are creating in your mind is holding a preconceived answer and then searching to confirm the relevance. Start with questions and end with answers.

reply to post by JB1234

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Thanks for that well thought out commentary. So, the telling of the story of Jesus' temptation fulfills a prophecy, that's a good reason to add it to the scriptures, imho.

Being tempted is to be human. One would conclude that if Jesus was human he was tempted. He may have been tempted by lust, trepidation, anger, or pride. We are not told of what other struggles he may have endured. Its just the telling of this story thats kinda "fishy," pardon the pun (sign of the fish), about this.

According to the thread I sourced, All Roads Lead to Rome, many of the early christians were Druid slaves. There were a lot of problems in Rome, including an over population of slaves and citizen unemployment. Nero, after buring Rome, blamed the Christians and sacrificed them to appease the citizens of Rome.

I believe Jesus was a real man, but Christ was not his last name, I don't think. Joseph Christ? Maybe, but many people think "Christ" comes from the word Cronnos, a Druid God. The Vatican makes use of many Druid symbols, like the Celtic cross.

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by JB1234

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Thanks for that well thought out commentary. So, the telling of the story of Jesus' temptation fulfills a prophecy, that's a good reason to add it to the scriptures, imho.

Being tempted is to be human. One would conclude that if Jesus was human he was tempted. He may have been tempted by lust, trepidation, anger, or pride. We are not told of what other struggles he may have endured. Its just the telling of this story thats kinda "fishy," pardon the pun (sign of the fish), about this.

According to the thread I sourced, All Roads Lead to Rome, many of the early christians were Druid slaves. There were a lot of problems in Rome, including an over population of slaves and citizen unemployment. Nero, after buring Rome, blamed the Christians and sacrificed them to appease the citizens of Rome.

I believe Jesus was a real man, but Christ was not his last name, I don't think. Joseph Christ? Maybe, but many people think "Christ" comes from the word Cronnos, a Druid God. The Vatican makes use of many Druid symbols, like the Celtic cross.

I like how you keep an open mind. I was an buddhist/atheist for most of my life, turned to Jesus Christ in the last 4 years (I'm 28). The thing that did it for me was actually the research to debunk that this guy named Jesus really did come back form the dead. What I found was that most new testament scholars, both Christians and non Christians, both people who love and hate the bible will give you a couple events recorded in scripture as historical events.

1. empty tomb: whether the body was stolen, or taken or whatever other conjecture has risen out of this statement, most historians will say that there was an empty tomb.

2. The Apostles, and several other people believe they interacted with the Risen Jesus. Again, this doesn't prove it, but it does declare that several people, including enemies of Jesus did BELIEVE they saw and interacted with the risen Christ.

3. The sudden explosion of Christianity in the 1st century. Psychologists and historians alike will agree that something happened to spark a flame for the Christian faith to birth in the first century. The bible itself has two of Jesus' brothers who didn't believe in any of this "Messiah" thing until after the resurrection

A very good resource for this is
garyhabermas.com...

a bit off topic, let me know if it's retracting too far away from the OP. I'm new at ATS.

BTW...Christ was not his last name

Originally posted by SuperiorEd

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by SuperiorEd

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Make sure you know the difference between holding an answer or verifying the question. Are you asking a question and then going to the text to check the answer, or are you holding an answer and then checking the text for verification?

What???????

Depending on your reasoning, you will either disprove yourself or the Bible by your reasoning.

It's not my intention to "disprove" the Bible. I just don't believe it to be "the word of God" or infallable. I think I see some manipulation, by the Catholic Church, to create a story that I think is condradictory to the person as described as Jesus.

Pointing out the discrepancy and asking why they might have done this is are the issues I'm interested in exploring. I think it takes not one thing away from Jesus Christ and his legacy to doubt the veracity of this story.
You have not answered my question of how the story was brought forward to included in the Bible. Jesus was alone in the desert, there were no witnesses.

Jesus and God are one. They are in agreement. Jesus didn't live and then take His place with God. He was already there.

I don't agree with that statement. That may be your belief, but it quite a stretch if you ask me.

The paradox you are creating in your mind is holding a preconceived answer and then searching to confirm the relevance. Start with questions and end with answers.

What paradox?

reply to post by GeorgeH

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Haha! I actually used to work at "The Miracles" book store, on Maui, where they did the course. I am familiar Dr. Helen Schucmen.

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by GeorgeH

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Haha! I actually used to work at "The Miracles" book store, on Maui, where they did the course. I am familiar Dr. Helen Schucmen.

Read CIM and actually was quite into it for a while. Then I was woken up and figured out what the real source is.

this is part 7 and part 8 of my film where I actually take a second to address it from a biblical perspective.

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

reply to post by windword

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LOL

"Ere Babylon was dust, the Magus Zoroaster, my dear child,
met his own image walking in the garden.
That apparition, sole of men, he saw.
For know there are two worlds of life and death: One that which thou beholdest;
but the other is underneath the grave,
where do inhabit the shadows of all forms that think and live
Till death unite them and they part no more....",

that's from Shelley's Prometheus Unbound,by the way.

Did Satan really tempt Jesus in the desert?

so you've received an overabundance of "explanations" from the religious-paradigmers
[tripping over themselves,IMO]
with some sprinkling of "explanations" from the material-paradigmers

religious say yes
materialists say no

the magical paradigm says What if?/maybe

one of the most interesting things about studying mythologies and not generally known,
is that every story, has at least 2 versions.

all of the Great Magicians, Mystics, Religious Founders had what is known as an Adversary, which by the way, is one of the meanings of Satan, Shelley's lines above allude to Zoroaster's [Zarathustra] 1st encounter with his own adversary. [funnily enough, according to one legend, when Zarathustra became king of Bactria his consorts name was exactly the same as his adversary's.]

basically those who strive towards the Good and the Pure as they gain in spiritual.... whatever
are ridding themselves of their negativism,their flaws, their dislikes, the Bad things in them.

where does this stuff go when the masters of virtue ascend into the realm of the Cleansed?
what if it "refuses to die" and develops a life of its own, like becoming to great degree a real walking talking person?

the most recent mythological level retelling of this story is Stephen Kings The Dark Half
it could be said it forms a backdrop theme in Fight Club as well.

reply to post by FaceLikeTheSun

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I really like this reply...altho I will have to say I am surprised at ur question of Elijah...Did he get transported thru time from his when to Jesus's when...that I thought was a question you should know the answer to already as when King Saul wanted Samuel to guide him into going to war, even though Samuel was dead at the time and he had outlawed witchcraft...He went to a witch disguised altho the witch saw thru the disguise she conjured Samuel up from the dead...You see the spirit lives on after we die...Elijah's spirit lived on thru the ages as your's n mine surely will too...

The real question is where will we spend eternity....Heaven or Hell

reply to post by windword

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the story is told by his disciples, these men were inspired by the Holy ghost to write the things they wrote...So if you want to know whether it was Jesus braggin or not...I suggest you read the scriptures more often...or start reading them...

Originally posted by Stephen3267
reply to post by FaceLikeTheSun

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I really like this reply...altho I will have to say I am surprised at ur question of Elijah...Did he get transported thru time from his when to Jesus's when...that I thought was a question you should know the answer to already as when King Saul wanted Samuel to guide him into going to war, even though Samuel was dead at the time and he had outlawed witchcraft...He went to a witch disguised altho the witch saw thru the disguise she conjured Samuel up from the dead...You see the spirit lives on after we die...Elijah's spirit lived on thru the ages as your's n mine surely will too...

The real question is where will we spend eternity....Heaven or Hell

The interesting thing is that with the particular event you are reference 2 Samuel and the Witch of Endor, I believe this was a special occasion of God allowing Saul to see the dead spirit of Samuel. He went against every command of God and it was too late. You will also notice that the witch of Endor screamed in terror. That's because she expected her "familiar spirit" or "demon" or "fallen angel" whatever you want to call it, (the new agers call em "ascended masters" etc.) and instead the spirit of the dead Samuel came up.

There is a new book written by Gary Stearman called "Time Travelers of the Bible" Havent read it yet, but looks pretty awesome. www.prophecyinthenews.com...

reply to post by FaceLikeTheSun

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Look, either Jesus was the "Son of Man" which he said he was, or "Son of God." Satan, fallen or not, is a "Son of God." Satan is a creation the way ones son is a creation.

Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the Sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.

Jesus is called the Son over 200 times throughout the N.T. The Father is referred to as distinct from the Son over 200 times. Over 50 times Jesus the Son and the Father are mentioned in the same verse, according to letusreason.org.

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