Question for some scientists about the nature of reality, death, and the (lack of) after life...

I'm posting this here instead of the religious section because I want strictly scientific answers...

1) Is it safe to assume that the universe is intelligent due to the process of evolution and the complex structure of the human body?

2) Is science pointing toward reincarnation? We are all made of atoms and when we die, our bodies break apart so life > death > soil > food > sperm/egg/seed > life, is this accurate from a strict scientific view?

3) Is science pointing to all of us being one, and consciousness being an illusion? Think about it, we are all atoms and the only scientific reason why our consciousness exist is because of neurons communicating. If we break neurons down, they are also atoms, so in a sense, aren't we all one (atoms), and our consciousness is an illusion due to a build up of atoms (neurons)?

4) Is science pointing towards atheism, or theism, or pantheism or deism? What are your opinions where science seems to be headed...

I'm asking this because I want my beliefs to match with reality so I'm asking from a strict scientific point of view, once again.

Thank!

i just had a steak, i don't feel the urge to go to a pasture and start grazing.

i also don't think i became part cattle.

reply to post by arpgme

1) Is it safe to assume that the universe is intelligent due to the process of evolution and the complex structure of the human body?

Not only safe, but obvious. Do you do anything to produce your life other than think and move your body? Do you activate the growth in your hair, or make your eyes see? Do you make the sun shine or the earth turn? Do you replace the cells in your body every 7 years? The answer is no to anything other than thinking and moving around. All the processes in the universe are totally independent of the two things we actually do. Our body is a bio-mechanical suit that we wear to sense the rest of reality. Consciousness is what you are.

2) Is science pointing toward reincarnation? We are all made of atoms and when we die, our bodies break apart so life > death > soil > food > sperm/egg/seed > life, is this accurate from a strict scientific view?

Jesus said in Luke 10, "You must be born again." Divine justice implies a final judgment. A final judgment implies that there are previous judgments. You are consciousness and the body is used as the vehicle to move and think. At your essence, you are information. The acorn contains the enfolded oak tree as its essence. This essence can be passed on again and again.

3) Is science pointing to all of us being one, and consciousness being an illusion? Think about it, we are all atoms and the only scientific reason why our consciousness exist is because of neurons communicating. If we break neurons down, they are also atoms, so in a sense, aren't we all one (atoms), and our consciousness is an illusion due to a build up of atoms (neurons)?

The Bible calls God's creation of the universe an image. I am in an image now (ATS) by speaking with you from digital information. An image is information as a symbolic representation of what it is. LINK

4) Is science pointing towards atheism, or theism, or pantheism or deism? What are your opinions where science seems to be headed...

Science is an inadequate way to describe God. Atheism is blindness to the Holy Spirit since it says that consciousness does not pre-exist matter. It makes the claim that matter pre-exists consciousness. This is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit and the ultimate pride of man against God. Disbelief in God is denying that consciousness pre-exists matter. Since the observer is necessary to collapse the indeterminate wave of infinity, then science has demonstrated the pre-existence of consciousness. Apart form the observer, matter cannot be transmuted.

Again, consider the acorn. What is the essence of all living matter? Information. According to entropy in information theory, we can expect a degradation in bits of information over time. Life defies entropy in information and adds to the complexity of a closed system. This is not observed in nature apart form consciousness. Again, another proof. If you read the link I have provided, you will see the science in the Bible. Big as life itself.

Originally posted by randomname
i just had a steak, i don't feel the urge to go to a pasture and start grazing.

i also don't think i became part cattle.

But the cow did become part of you.

reply to post by SuperiorEd


You are speaking about the bible and I'm asking for scientific evidence about my questions, which is why I posted this question in the science section....

Originally posted by randomname
i just had a steak, i don't feel the urge to go to a pasture and start grazing.

i also don't think i became part cattle.

You became part of the steak that you ate, and it will be broken down and a part of it will turn into nutrients and stuff and become a part of your whole body, right?

reply to post by arpgme

1) Is it safe to assume that the universe is intelligent due to the process of evolution and the complex structure of the human body?

No. Simple basic understanding of physics will help you understand why.

2) Is science pointing toward reincarnation? We are all made of atoms and when we die, our bodies break apart so life > death > soil > food > sperm/egg/seed > life, is this accurate from a strict scientific view?

No. I refer to the above statement.

3) Is science pointing to all of us being one, and consciousness being an illusion? Think about it, we are all atoms and the only scientific reason why our consciousness exist is because of neurons communicating. If we break neurons down, they are also atoms, so in a sense, aren't we all one (atoms), and our consciousness is an illusion due to a build up of atoms (neurons)?

No again. Yes, consciousness is a result of our brains which is made up of atoms, but it's not an illusion, it's a physical result of a physical process. The atoms in your brain are not the same exact atoms in my brain, hence we are not one. We are unique individuals who hold unique beliefs separate from one another.

4) Is science pointing towards atheism, or theism, or pantheism or deism? What are your opinions where science seems to be headed...

None of the above. Science nor religion can conclusively prove where existence came from, why it even exists or by what process brought it about. We're not technologically or mentally advanced enough to even begin to understand a concept such as that. As it stands right now, it's your beliefs versus mine. You have your arguments and I have mine, but neither of us has direct evidence that proves our beliefs. Then again, I choose to believe correctly!

I'm asking this because I want my beliefs to match with reality so I'm asking from a strict scientific point of view, once again.

You're not ready for reality. None of us are. That's why we're still bitching like little school girls at a justin beiber concert about it.

reply to post by arpgme

You became part of the steak that you ate, and it will be broken down and a part of it will turn into nutrients and stuff and become a part of your whole body, right?

You also drank the piss of Hitler, does that mean you're now a part of Hitler?

On being pronounced brain dead in 1973, and then coming back again after more than 30 minutes, I found that the real me is "Non Dimensional".

And the world I experience (human Species & Universe) is just that, an experience, I am having at present.

The Real Me, is like a "Partition" of LIFE which experiences a manufactured universe, interpreted as what the human Species interprets it to be.

But what is actually there, is far far different than what we experience it as.

Originally posted by arpgme
I'm posting this here instead of the religious section because I want strictly scientific answers...

Then you must ask strictly scientific questions.

1) Is it safe to assume that the universe is intelligent due to the process of evolution and the complex structure of the human body?

It is never completely safe to make any assumption, and that holds truer for matters of this nature, than for many others. The universe is a structure that we know next to nothing about , when compared with its total volume, and the sheer amount of potential that a space that large has to astound, confound, and utterly confuse any system of examination applied to it. Our capacity to study the universe is actualy quite limited, and to make any assumptions regarding the possibility of the universe itself being an entity of intellect , rather than an enigmatic mass of unkowns, is not mere arrogance, but utterly unfounded.

2) Is science pointing toward reincarnation? We are all made of atoms and when we die, our bodies break apart so life > death > soil > food > sperm/egg/seed > life, is this accurate from a strict scientific view?

Science neither points toward, nor away from any particular faith, belief, or philosophy. It studies, records, experiments , and records again. That is the limit of its power as a tool of man for describing his surroundings. It is not a key to the secrets of what may lie beyond the universe, nor an instruction manual or briefing on the meaning of every last element of human existance, or indeed any other life. It is merely a tool for gathering information. Ones own interpretation of the results of the labours of science, is up to the individual, and of course, open to peer review.

3) Is science pointing to all of us being one, and consciousness being an illusion? Think about it, we are all atoms and the only scientific reason why our consciousness exist is because of neurons communicating. If we break neurons down, they are also atoms, so in a sense, aren't we all one (atoms), and our consciousness is an illusion due to a build up of atoms (neurons)?

An illusion would be if we had consciousness and thought, without the presence of connective neurons. If you go down that road, then every accumulation of atoms, electrons, quarks, and bosons means nothing, and is perhaps a lie. Existance is a sham. We never attained conciousness, and we are nothing but a figment of the imagination of some vast unknowable psyche beyond our ken. But that is not scientificaly valid, and neither is the question.

4) Is science pointing towards atheism, or theism, or pantheism or deism? What are your opinions where science seems to be headed...

I'm asking this because I want my beliefs to match with reality so I'm asking from a strict scientific point of view, once again.

This question in particular, cannot be answered scientificaly, because it is posed using unscientific terminology. Science cares not to comment on any form of faith. Its results are deciphered, and understood to the best of the ability of its operatives, but in essence, ones belief in its results, is a choice of the individual, as previously mentioned. To even involve science in what appears to be an utterly philosophical internal debate you are having, is to completely misunderstand where the barriers lie , between science and faith.
One may certainly have either faith or science independant of one another, and equally , scientific understanding does not present a barrier to faith , for all those who respect its efforts to quantify the glory of creation. However, to attempt to mingle science and faith , even in the smallest of ways, is to skew unbiased science, or to attempt to legitimise often flawed beliefs held in religion and faith.

The questions you have asked would be better answered if you removed the barrier that you have put down against being answered by those of faith, or those who are learned in philosophy. Science cannot help you here, because it is impartial , and deals only with the physical , recordable reality in which we currently exist. It has no frame of refference to examine gods and texts for thier individual benifits, and will never have, not in this life time anyway.

Originally posted by arpgme
1) Is it safe to assume that the universe is intelligent due to the process of evolution and the complex structure of the human body?

I would say, from a scientific point of view, no. We've seen no evidence that life exists on other worlds, only our own. And sadly, we probably won't for some time to come. That of course, doesn't mean there isn't - only that it hasn't been observed which is one of the key principles to scientific study. Personally, I don't see how it *couldn't* exist elsewhere and think there's loads in our own Solar system.. I have no proof, of course

2) Is science pointing toward reincarnation? We are all made of atoms and when we die, our bodies break apart so life > death > soil > food > sperm/egg/seed > life, is this accurate from a strict scientific view?

I wouldn't say it does - it may point that the molecular/atomic components of one thing are reused in another, but that who you are as a person, is not. Mainly because we still don't know what it "is" to be human, to have consciousness and to have a "soul" as it were. We cannot prove the soul exists, nor exactly what consciousness is or "where" in our bodies it is: is it an aggregation of all of our bits or is it just in the head/mind/brain? If the former, then does an amputee have "less" consciousness and soul than someone who is completely intact? Again, science, at the moment, cannot answer these question.

3) Is science pointing to all of us being one, and consciousness being an illusion? Think about it, we are all atoms and the only scientific reason why our consciousness exist is because of neurons communicating. If we break neurons down, they are also atoms, so in a sense, aren't we all one (atoms), and our consciousness is an illusion due to a build up of atoms (neurons)?

Perhaps, yes. Traditional scientific study would no doubt show that upon complete dissection and deconstruction, we're all made of exactly the same components, just in different amounts. And i doubt science, at the moment, will find anything that points of a "soul" or consciousness. I'd love if we had some new technology that could "see" or weigh the "esoteric" or "ethereal" nature of what we carry with us - but again, that's just opinion and belief.

4) Is science pointing towards atheism, or theism, or pantheism or deism? What are your opinions where science seems to be headed...

I would say atheism. Again, science is about analysing observable phenomena - and things like God and religious belief are not observable phenomena that science can study. It wouldn't be to prove a negative.

I'm asking this because I want my beliefs to match with reality so I'm asking from a strict scientific point of view, once again.

Well, i wouldn't rely on science 100% for your belief structure. While I consider myself rational and logical and an atheist, I still firmly believe in UFOs, ET and other unexplanable paranormal/esoteric things which science would argue, "doesn't exist".

reply to post by arpgme


If you need something to believe in, something that matches closely to reality, then believe in existence. It's the only thing we can know with any certain degree of certainty that it exists. Even if we are the imaginings of some other entity dreamed up during their sleep cycle, their existence led to our existence in one form or another.

You can't deny the existence of existence. So focus on that. Existence is older than the Bible, older than any God, and older than the Big Bang. It's always been here.