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Fear Mongering

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posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 04:11 PM
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reply to post by LunaKat
 


You bring up an interesting point. There is no argument about the pastor being a fear monger. It was the way he spread his message, that brought fear to people, in my opinion.

I guess I should change the title to "Fear mongering on ATS"

The point of my thread was to find out why this term is being used so much to describe people we do not know.
Where do you draw the line between fear and information when people perceive these two emotions differently?




posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 04:12 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 




What I want to ask is, how do you determine a person's desired result? More so, that of an ATS member? Is it really fair to call someone on ATS(or anywhere) a fear monger when/if you cannot be sure their intentions for spreading a message?


ATS is like a public common where, with but some minor display of manners & decorum, one can come and say most anything. (It's curious how this place survives in this particular time... and I have a few theories but, that's not this thread's purpose.)

Here on this green, we come to share our fears and sometimes, to spread them. Do we do this intentionally or do we simply want someone to reply and say... yeah, I know what you're saying?

It's prolly both. Some come here to stir the pot with a slab o'fear to see what will rise to the top or... what aturn of the wrench will produce. But others just speak their fears here to find kindred souls who, like them, have been victims of it all.

My personal view is that there are wheels in motion that won't be stopped. There is an ending that could be... and maybe should be feared by the sane. But in the end, there is nothing anyone can do now so, it's all rather pointless unless we attach some principle. With that, we can identify the the mechanism, the course and the outcome... even if we are helpless to do anything about it.

Fear is way overrated at this point. We should have been afraid 30 or 40 years ago when it mattered.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 04:15 PM
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Originally posted by buildingthenations
reply to post by LeTan
 


Honestly i have no fear in much, because i put my faith in God, I just know whatever happens is supposed to according to His will.

I believe all media control is to keep the masses in fear, by our elites.
your thoughts?
ECCLESIASTES 12
... Faith is stronger than meaningless wit of the knowledge... From Faith comes ALL THE KNOWLEDGE WITHIN... But remember... A little faith is no faith at ALL


Public warning to 'FEAR MONGERS';
A CRIME TO THE INNOCENT HUMAN MIND... IS NO DIFFERENT THAN A CRIME TO THE HUMAN FLESH.

His Sheeple said to him, "Who are you(?) to say these thing to us?

"You don't UNDERSTAND(Jordan Maxwell thing
who I am from what I say to you... Rather, you have become like the Judeans(Fear Mongers of the time), for they love the tree(God/Orginal Source Code/Whatever) but hate its fruit(knowledge), or "THEY" love the fruit but hate the tree"


Mr X-ULTRA/QUANTUM... Asking; What is or who is an elite???... Do you not give power to that which you worship... Are ye not Gods too??? This would be that time for ALL IN FAITH... This is not another W2K AJ(lol)... By they way all and most of these big events are diversions in the material world to keep you grounded from the spiritual happening at the same time... Always know what the other hand of God is doing


Disclosure Project;
This is just an opinion and all "Allegedly"... please consult with your spiritual adviser before taking this Holy Cow Crap seriously... After all that's what you pay them for



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 


I'm not sure where the line is LeTan..good question I suppose. To me, anything that is being discussed that is down the road or in the future should be able to be discussed without making people afraid. I guess it all depends on the delivery of the information. And really depends on the responses...are the responses coming back that show people are getting afraid or no? If yes, then it was fear mongering. It really all does come down to fortune telling. People don't like fortune tellers thats why its not legal everywhere. But fortune tellers aren't just the people with the tarot cards or the crystal balls or what have you. Its also people spreading information to create drama and fear. Why else would they do it?



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 04:23 PM
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reply to post by CosmicWaterGate
 


I do not wish to turn this into a religious debate.

What is your contribution to the matter? You say fear mongering is a crime upon the mind.

In that case, lets say a tornado warning is issued and a family that lives in a vicinity fears for their life. However, the tornado never reaches ground and blows by without incident. The family is safe, but they were still gripped by fear in that time because of the warning.

Since the warning scared them, should it have not been issued at all to prevent what you would call a mind crime?



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 04:31 PM
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LeTan a question if I may? I think you mentioned something about if you were talking about an earthquake... I guess my biggest question with a lot of stuff I see on ATS (and I skip over) is that if someone really had good information on an upcoming disaster, why would ATS be the place they'd bring that to? I mean, why don't they take that to people who can actually do something about it? A bunch of people reading forum posts can't exactly do anything about it. I guess thats my biggest question.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 04:49 PM
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Originally posted by LunaKat
LeTan a question if I may? I think you mentioned something about if you were talking about an earthquake... I guess my biggest question with a lot of stuff I see on ATS (and I skip over) is that if someone really had good information on an upcoming disaster, why would ATS be the place they'd bring that to? I mean, why don't they take that to people who can actually do something about it? A bunch of people reading forum posts can't exactly do anything about it. I guess thats my biggest question.


My opinion on that, is because ATS is the only place you will get people to help you with your information. In a lot of good posts, the poster simply addresses the information and then waits on speculation to be added, and then re analyzed.

For me, ATS is like family. If I look out my window tomorrow and I see something has gone down, I will call my family and friends, but while I am on the phone, you bet your ass I am going to be posting it on here.

Another reason why people do not take the information to people who can "do something about it", is that there is nothing these people really can do. They can issue a warning, but the poster in the situation has already done that to a degree. Furthermore, these people who you want to take the information to will have probably already known about the situation with their gear and technology.

Of course, this is my opinionated answer to your question. Who knows why people do what they do?
edit on 17-9-2011 by LeTan because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 04:50 PM
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Originally posted by LeTan

Originally posted by nusnus
I recognize fear mongering as the action of warning on life and death by using very few facts or pieces of information that don't constitute a reason for fear.

For example, some dude writes an article on Elenin years back, then someone comes and adds onto it, then another and another and these personal ideas are accumulated to create an illogical fear of an object based completely and utterly on speculation.

So fear mongering = the publishing of fear based on speculation.

Its the downright use of words like: were going to die, something is coming, get ready etc that is called fear mongering.

Because it creates fear from nothing. And its wrong.

It can also be masked as pure suggestion. The human mind is susceptible to suggestions at times, and suggesting that we need to fear something because of the 'unknown' qualities of that thing is fear mongering and utterly unnecessary.
edit on 17-9-2011 by nusnus because: (no reason given)


Do these prospects bring fear to you?
When someone says "we are going to die". Some of us are already aware that we are going to die sometime, and it's going to happen whether we fear it or not.

When someone says "something is coming" Some of us wonder what it is, since this forum as pretty much destroyed the fear of the unknown for most of it's members. We do not fear it, we are simply curious.

When someone says "get ready" Some of us wonder "for what?". Again, curiosity, not fear.

I ask, when you address someone as a fear monger, who do you speak for? If you speak for yourself, would that not imply your own fear?


Good point. No I do not fear these things. If I did I wouldn't be able to lash back at them. I'd simply be afraid and fall into the same trap. However I speak on behalf of those who are affected by these kind of messages. I see it on here. One person says it, then another echoes it, then another, and another approves, says they thought the same thing. So all they do is contribute their fear. I've seen people say things like: I've been spooked by this for a while now, I've told my family to get ready, my children are afraid, we are stocking up food and selling assets.

There are cases of people where entire families are affected at the prospect of the coming apocalypse.

Just today I received mail in the mailbox about a seminar done by one of the local churches: are you ready for the apocalypse?

And all the time I'm like: WHAT??! This is what happens when people come out and fear monger.
edit on 17-9-2011 by nusnus because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 05:11 PM
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reply to post by nusnus
 


I see your point. Now, if the person were to say the same message, but in a different manner, say....

"I have KNOWN about this for awhile now. I've told my family to be prepared, my children are spooked, but they know what to do. I have sold my assets and have been stocking up on food."

If put this way, perhaps the aspect of fear would be exponentially less. Good example from you indeed.
Perhaps it is the way that people present their findings and information that puts them at risk of being a fear monger.

Maybe, it is the method and presentation and the perception of the people that draw the line between information sharing and fear mongering. It would be good to keep this in mind.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 05:44 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 


Sorry but I just don't see how using the words fear monger means that you are yourself afraid. That is just basically wrong. A fear monger attempts to make people fearful, usually those who have insufficient information on a subject to make a reasoned decision.

Let's take earthquakes as an example. There are some people, and regrettably some members, who either because of a lack of knowledge or out of badness attempt to wind up others about potential earthquake events using unlikely scenarios. I am not going to name names but believe me I can.

Yes I have used the term fear mongering to these people and I will continue to do so where i think it is justified, but that does not mean I am afraid of what they are saying. FAR FROM IT.

There is a certain Doctor out there on the web who only recently tried to wind people up with the threat of a mag 10 that would damage 6 American nuclear reactors seriously. This person attempted to persuade the readers that he was an expert on the subject. He was not, and failed in his prediction and in his maths. THAT is fear mongering and I assure you that by calling such people fear mongers it does not in any way suggest that I am afraid.

I really do not understand what these people get out of it.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 05:49 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 



In that case, lets say a tornado warning is issued and a family that lives in a vicinity fears for their life. However, the tornado never reaches ground and blows by without incident. The family is safe, but they were still gripped by fear in that time because of the warning.

Since the warning scared them, should it have not been issued at all to prevent what you would call a mind crime?


It depends entirely upon the reason the warning was issued, and to some degree by whom.

If the weather service issue such a warning then you are entitled to believe them and to take action accordingly, and also perhaps to be afraid. If the tornado does not hit this should not be a problem as no malice was intended.


Maybe, it is the method and presentation and the perception of the people that draw the line between information sharing and fear mongering.


No not the percepti9on because you can never be aware of how all people are going to react to the information.

It is the intent or motive that matters.
edit on 17/9/2011 by PuterMan because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 05:56 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 


Firstly thanks OP for this thread,

According to definition a fear monger is;


One who spreads the idealogy of fear through propoganda to fulfill a concealed agenda. Similar to a terrorist, but it fights with information and not direct violence. Politicians, media personas, and internet posters can all be fearmongers.


www.urbandictionary.com...

The term fear monger, as i would agree with other posters is loosely thrown around to simply discredit posters.

I have no fear within, so I take everything I hear as a kindly reminder by others of the coming events, despite how it is presented.

Peace


edit on 17-9-2011 by InnerPeace2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 05:56 PM
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reply to post by PuterMan
 





If the weather service issue such a warning then you are entitled to believe them and to take action accordingly, and also perhaps to be afraid. If the tornado does not hit this should not be a problem as no malice was intended.


I agree with you 100%.
Could the same not be said about the members of ATS?



It is the intent or motive that matters.


Whether the intent/motive is a persuasive one, the fact still remains that it is the person affected is entitled believe them and to act accordingly. Yes, that is their choice.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 06:08 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 



Could the same not be said about the members of ATS?


Tricky one that. The problem here is one of anonymity. We can all see who the weatherman is and we are all aware that a certain level of knowledge is required for him to carry out his job (forget front men for a minute), but you don't have a clue who I am so if I give advice about an earthquake scenario that I say is going to happen you have no reference point on which to decide whether what I am saying is, or may be, true or not.

This is certainly very true of new members who seem to arrive at ATS for the purpose of 'mongering' fear - mongering fish, basically selling fear.

The ATS community needs time collectively to judge the merits of a member and to decide if that member actually does have the knowledge.

There have been 'geologists' on ATS who I know full well are NOT geologists. I am not a geologist and have always said so but I did study geology at College/Uni levels but never took a formal qualification for various reasons that do not matter. The point is I am happy to tell people I am not a geologist.

ATS can make their mind up about me over a period of time and collectively decide whether I speak with forked tongue or not. That is the problem with ATS, or rather with believing what is said on ATS.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 06:09 PM
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Originally posted by PuterMan
reply to post by LeTan
 


Sorry but I just don't see how using the words fear monger means that you are yourself afraid. That is just basically wrong. A fear monger attempts to make people fearful, usually those who have insufficient information on a subject to make a reasoned decision.


Perhaps you are right.

On another note..Correct me if I am wrong, but you see fear as the result of lack of information? In this case, would the opposite also be true? If indeed something was going on, and the presenter gave a lot of information on the subject... lets use for example, a major earthquake.

With the information the researcher provides, would this lessen the fear people would have on the earthquake? I do not believe so. I think, the reason is because the fear is of the earthquake, it does not matter if it is someone posting a few pictures and graphs or a researcher putting his portfolio up.

I feel that the delivery and reception of the information is the key factor to fear mongering.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 06:21 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 



On another note..Correct me if I am wrong, but you see fear as the result of lack of information? In this case, would the opposite also be true? If indeed something was going on, and the presenter gave a lot of information on the subject... lets use for example, a major earthquake.

With the information the researcher provides, would this lessen the fear people would have on the earthquake? I do not believe so. I think, the reason is because the fear is of the earthquake, it does not matter if it is someone posting a few pictures and graphs or a researcher putting his portfolio up.

I feel that the delivery and reception of the information is the key factor to fear mongering.


Now we are getting down to having to quantify the fear. Yes fear is often because of a lack of information, but the possession of the information may not remove the fearfulness.

What do we have here? We have reasoned fear for one's life or family for example based on knowledge - the deliverer of which is not a fear monger, and irrational fear built on erroneous information maliciously presented where there is no basis for the fear and no need for concern, the deliverer of which is indeed a fear monger.

There are two VERY different types of fear not in their effect but in their cause. One is reasoned and real and the other is induced and irrational.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 06:29 PM
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Good point.

Lets take another example though. Let's say a person sees a report on a website or the news about a super volcano acting up, they know enough about volcanoes to know that this is bad, but they do not have the education to describe what is going on in scientific detail. They post the link and present it to ATS.

How do you determine if this person is a fear monger? His intentions are unclear except in the way he presents it.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 06:31 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 



would the opposite also be true


Sorry I am answering this separately. Yes indeed someone can present information in reasonable manner and a person can still be irrationally afraid.

You cannot call the deliverer a fear monger just because some people chose not to believe. We have a perfect example with comet Elenin.

Many knowledgeable people have placed the facts in front of people explaining that Elenin is (or was) a comet not bigger than 5 km across that cannot affect the gravity of earth and will not hit earth.

Despite this there are even now still people out there who believe ELEnin with hit earth and that it is 500 miles across and 10 times more massive than Jupiter and has a fleet of spacecraft trailing it. (Did I miss anything?)

You could call this self fear mongering, but there are also those out there who perpetuate the myth and use it to sell books videos etc. THOSE people are fearmongering with an ulterior motive. The people who still believe them are ignorant of the facts, or chose not to believe them so that is their choice.

Unfortunately some of them push this view themselves possibly out of some sort of mutual doom need I don't really know, and at that point they become fear mongers as they are pushing an unrealistic scenario onto gullible people who do not have the knowledge to know otherwise.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 06:36 PM
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reply to post by LeTan
 



Lets take another example though. Let's say a person sees a report on a website or the news about a super volcano acting up, they know enough about volcanoes to know that this is bad, but they do not have the education to describe what is going on in scientific detail. They post the link and present it to ATS.

How do you determine if this person is a fear monger? His intentions are unclear except in the way he presents it.


Happens all the time on ATS but I think the main point is that people who genuinely present something of that nature come across as genuine. The genuine person presents the link to ATS with a question along the lines of "what do you guys think?" etc.

I think it is relatively easy to spot those and additionally these people respond to input.

The malicious fear monger does not respond to input and usually presents as little information as possible, with few or no links, whilst hyping up the scenario.



posted on Sep, 17 2011 @ 06:39 PM
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You cannot call the deliverer a fear monger just because some people chose not to believe. We have a perfect example with comet Elenin.

Many knowledgeable people have placed the facts in front of people explaining that Elenin is (or was) a comet not bigger than 5 km across that cannot affect the gravity of earth and will not hit earth. Despite this there are even now still people out there who believe ELEnin with hit earth and that it is 500 miles across and 10 times more massive than Jupiter and has a fleet of spacecraft trailing it. (Did I miss anything?)


I forgot the factor of multiple sources. I guess I can conclude that in some cases, the term may be appropriate, but I think "troll" would be more fitting in most cases.




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