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President Vaclav Klaus demands unrest end, says the state must intervene with force

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posted on Sep, 15 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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Czech President Vaclav Klaus on September 12th stated that the unrest in Northern Bohemia must come to an end and the state will see to it with merciless force. This statement was made in regards to the protests and riots occurring across Northern Bohemia between the ethnic Czechs and the Gypsies. Klaus said: "The state must mercilessly intervene here, intervene with force so this unrest ends. That is simply evident.”

Why are these protests even occurring? Two reasons: the corruption of Czech government and attacks by the Roma (Gypsy) minority. The Czech protesters were confronted by police during a protest where the protesters are accused of attacking the police who then responded using pyrotechnics and water cannons. 200 people then protested in Varnsdorf claiming the police use of these weapons was a disproportionate response and said that the way police handle gypsy crimes were much kinder than the response given to the ethnic Czechs.

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But if we are to track back to why these protests by ethnic Czechs in the region are occurring we may find out some important information.

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Ethnic tension now appears to be growing in the region after two violent attacks by Roma youths on white people. The latest incident in the main town of Rumburk saw 20 Roma youths attack six white men with nightsticks after leaving a disco.

"They started beating us with truncheons and telescopic nightsticks," Michal Nemecek, one of the victims, told Deutsche Welle. "They shouted ‘you white bastards' at us. We definitely weren't the ones who provoked the attack - six against 20? We would have been crazy. They were just walking along the street and we were the first ones they ran into."
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The Rumburk attack follows an incident in the nearby town of Novy Bor, in which a group of five Roma youths attacked three white men in a bar with a machete, leaving one of them seriously injured. This attack is also being treated as racially motivated.
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Observers have warned of serious racial tensions in the area, which is already suffering high levels of unemployment and poverty. There have been reports that real estate agents have been relocating Roma families to the region from elsewhere in the country after buying up their apartments, concentrating a large number of poor, poorly educated and unemployed people in one area.





The government has made threats and it is not working. The party involved in the protests has now picked up two seats in the town of Krupka on the 11th.

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posted on Sep, 15 2011 @ 04:44 PM
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reply to post by Misoir
 


Seems like the situation there is very, very complicated. There's no easy way out of it. On one hand Europe has a big problem with Roma people. They seem to keep shuffling them from one country to another. France, at one point, paid their Roma to move back to Romania. (Romania is not the ancestral home of the Roma people, but a large concentration of them currently live there). The Roma are nomads who originate from India, and made Europe their home a few hundred years ago.

I've been trying to figure it all out. Is it senseless racism on the part of the Europeans, or is there some valid reasoning behind their disdain for the Roma? Does Roma culture differ so much from the European cultures that it caused friction between them and the natives, or is simple racism responsible for the way they live? It might be a little bit of everything.

Either all Europeans are racists, or the Roma culture is incompatible with native Europeans, or current Roma culture is a result of European racism. Whatever the case, I find it odd that they don't seem to be able to blend into any culture out there (either by choice or by force) without some friction arising.



posted on Sep, 15 2011 @ 05:03 PM
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reply to post by 2manyquestions
 


My family is from Hungary which has a rather large Roma population and let me tell you, they absolutely hate them. There are many reasons such as they were always perpetually poor, had more children than the Hungarians, committed excessive number of crimes, and refused to learn the language or blend in at all. Of course today Europe is far more tolerant to them, for example the housing that was set up in Northern Bohemia which is now the spotlight of protests by ethnic Czechs.

Roma has been roaming around Europe since the great migration; they never settled anywhere and are always on the move for some reason. It is without argument they have almost their own society of sorts, separate from the whites. Their crime rate is higher overall, so is their poverty, fertility, and the lack of assimilation after hundreds of years really say something about them overall.

I do not doubt racism fuels some of the problems being experienced but to simply push aside hundreds of years old conflict as racism is ridiculous (I am not accusing you of saying that). They were given ample time, opportunity, and so forth but have denied it. I am sure there are many Roma’s who have integrated into European society over hundreds of years but there remains the ones loyal to their own culture which is in direct conflict with European culture.



posted on Sep, 15 2011 @ 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by Misoir
reply to post by 2manyquestions
 


My family is from Hungary which has a rather large Roma population and let me tell you, they absolutely hate them. There are many reasons such as they were always perpetually poor, had more children than the Hungarians, committed excessive number of crimes, and refused to learn the language or blend in at all. Of course today Europe is far more tolerant to them, for example the housing that was set up in Northern Bohemia which is now the spotlight of protests by ethnic Czechs.

Roma has been roaming around Europe since the great migration; they never settled anywhere and are always on the move for some reason. It is without argument they have almost their own society of sorts, separate from the whites. Their crime rate is higher overall, so is their poverty, fertility, and the lack of assimilation after hundreds of years really say something about them overall.

I do not doubt racism fuels some of the problems being experienced but to simply push aside hundreds of years old conflict as racism is ridiculous (I am not accusing you of saying that). They were given ample time, opportunity, and so forth but have denied it. I am sure there are many Roma’s who have integrated into European society over hundreds of years but there remains the ones loyal to their own culture which is in direct conflict with European culture.


Believe me when I say I understand where you're coming from. I was born in Slovakia and I visit there often. That's right on your border. When I was in school, we had Roma children with us in class. They were good kids in my opinion, but had a huge disadvantage in that their parents were not very supportive of them attending school on a regular basis, and were too poor to provide proper hygiene. There was a Roma girl in my class, and I remember that we tried teaching her to read. We would get a real kick out of her finally catching on and learning. Unfortunately she would miss a lot of school time, so even though she was capable of learning, her parents simply did not care or would pull her out of school for a week at a time.

This massive deficit in their education contributes heavily to the lack of employment. I learned that in their culture the women are expected to be married at 16 years of age, and due to pregnancy as a result of that marriage they never continue with their education. They like having big families, but without a job they have difficulty raising multiple children. This doesn't stop them from having more, which is a mistake on their part (unless they don't mind living in complete poverty). To feed these big families without a job, some decide to commit crimes such as theft to keep themselves alive. It creates a huge conflict in cultures where this behavior is unacceptable (which happens to be most cultures around the world).

The stealing and thieving is abhorred by the communities where they live, and local people start looking down on anyone who even resembles a Roma in skin color. Those that steal create conflict for the Roma who are trying hard to escape the poverty by looking for work the honest way. It's a vicious cycle.



posted on Sep, 15 2011 @ 05:43 PM
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reply to post by 2manyquestions
 


I generally agree with your point of view on this issue. It is a conflict of culture and I highly doubt it is going to end anytime soon unless the Roma abandon their culture for the overwhelmingly majority cultures in which they reside. Since that has not happened for the past thousand years or so it is hard to imagine it ending at all. The Roma will always like there alongside the whites, living with different cultures and disliking each other.

What irritates me about this story is that the government did crack down harder on the Czechs than on the Romas, but since I am not there this opinion comes only from what I have read. A similar thing happened in Hungary back in April and the media demonized the protesters as fascist racists. What really hurt was when the Red Cross showed up with a van to take the Roma out of town for an Easter event, the media claimed they were being evacuated. In reality this van and Easter celebration was setup weeks, probably months, before these protests it was just an inconvenient time for the protesters.

Long story short the party which helped organize the protests and night watch ended up winning the mayoral election after the residing mayor resigned out of humiliation that he could not control the situation. Jobbik won and this will be their first chance at governing, they won 17% of the vote back in 2010 and finally entered government as the third largest party just a couple seats behind the Socialists. My family back in Hungary is strong Jobbik fans.

I actually do not live in Hungary and unfortunately have not been given the opportunity yet to visit, but I am still young so it should be no problem. My family came here as refugees back in 1956 when the Hungarian Revolution failed; they escaped to Austria then sought refugee status in the United States. I do not remember the entirety of the story but that summarizes.



posted on Sep, 15 2011 @ 06:43 PM
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reply to post by Misoir
 


I really wish we could discuss this with people from the Roma community so we can get a grip on what's going on. Since I do not live there anymore, it's hard to find someone who would make for some good conversation on this subject. When I do visit, I am often intimidated by the idea of interviewing the Roma people. On one hand I don't want to fear them, but on the other hand some of them do give me the chills just the way that they look at me. I once walked down the street with four Roma women coming in my direction. As they were passing me I nodded to say hello, and they gave me a terribly hateful stare. If looks could kill I would have been dead on the spot. In some cases there is intense hate between the whites and the Romas.

Whites can also be quite terrible to them (obviously). The racist jokes are only the beginning. They talk about them as if they were subhuman. They don't do it so much to their faces anymore, but in private when the conversation comes up it is quite unnerving. It makes me uncomfortable that anyone could talk about another human being that way.

While I was in Europe, I was very tempted to walk into one of the Roma settlements and ask them how their situation could be improved, but then I thought "What if my questions offend them? How will they react?" Am I afraid because of all the stereotypes, or do I have a valid reason to be afraid? Am I racist??? I just don't know. Maybe if I lived there on a permanent basis I would have a more educated opinion on it all. There are good Roma and there are bad Roma. I've met both.

Here's how I look at it; If they want to stop living in poverty, they need to change some of their cultural habits.

1.) They need to consider saving marriage until after they finish at least high school.
2.) They need to consider having only as many children as their salary allows.
3.) They need to be more supportive of their children attending school, and even going beyond high school in order to learn a trade or skill.
4.) They need to police their communities by shaming those who steal.
5.) They need to respect the laws of the country they choose to live in.

As for the whites, they need to stop talking down to them as if they were animals. One must treat a person on a case to case basis, and not on the premise that if a person is born into a certain culture, it must mean they are horrible people. Many of them are good, honest people who try to break away from the stereotype, but the preconceived idea that Roma are dishonest thieves keeps them from getting hired the honest way. It's disgusting.

It will take decades, maybe generations before any of this makes a difference.



posted on Sep, 28 2011 @ 03:12 PM
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The situation with Roma people is escalating lately both here in Slovakia and in Czech Republic (where I travel a lot). The latest attacks and crime waves were just a catalyst setting off the tension that has been building for a long time among the local non-Roma population, since the fall of communism.

I am positive the problems with the Roma people could still be fixed without bloodshed or radicalisation, if only the moderate politicians cared. Just ending the positive discrimination, financial motivation for endless breeding and enforcing already valid legislation equally regardless of ethnicity would be a huge improvement and step in the right direction.

Unfortunately, instead of acting, moderate politicians ignore the problem, crack down on protesters who have a valid cause instead of cracking down on gypsy criminality, and demonise anyone who points out the positive discrimination. Its no wonder people have to turn to ultranationalists in such a situation.



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 01:03 AM
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reply to post by Maslo
 


The Roma should be sent to Russia to settle in Russia's South Western Asian border land. Ethnicities who sole survival plan is leeching off of other cultures makes me sick. The Roma should be given land of their own to settle and form their own communities and Europe should exist for European peoples.



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 03:16 AM
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reply to post by korathin
 


I agree. But pseudohumanists who dont have to deal with the Roma criminality directly would never allow such solutions. They would rather wait until the problem explodes into bloody civil war and genocide.



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