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Could There Be A Black Hole In The Sun?

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posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:19 PM
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Fusion of elements lighter than iron produces energy.

Fusion of elements heavier than iron abosrbs energy.

For fusion to occur, protons (which usually repel one another) must overcome their electrostatic opposing force to allow the attractive nuclear force to bind the nuclei.

We know that when a star explodes, it produces elements heavier than iron, and what results is a black hole. That would make sense because black holes are energy absorbers.

So is it possible that the interior of a star is undergoing fusion of heavy elements, and the exterior of the star is undergoing fusion of lighter elements?

Could it be possible that the fusion energy going out equals the fusion energy going in and so there is a mid-point where space is being stretched to form hydrogen like an event horizon that operates in two directions?

Then, eventually the absoprtion force overcomes the production force or the production force overcomes the absorption force, and the what is left is either a white dwarf or a black hole.

Could the theoretical White Hole actually be the same thing as a star?

Is a black hole actually just the fusion of heavy elements without undergoing fusion of lighter elements so that it is purely absorbent.

Is a white dwarf actually just the fusion of lighter elements without undergoing fusion of heavier elements so that it is purely productive.

In the latter case, considering that there is no longer a force that is generating hydrogen for future fusion processes, then that would explain the deterioration of a white dwarf into a black dwarf as all the fuseable light elements get fused up.

Could gravity be the result of the simultaneous pulling force and the pushing force happening in a star so that when we are facing the star, we are being pushed towards the earth, and when we are facing away from the start (at night), we are being pulled towards the earth?

Help me out here nuclear and astro physicists.


edit on 14-9-2011 by smithjustinb because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:21 PM
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Why, of course there is!!!

PROOF:


S&F!!!



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:24 PM
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reply to post by RoswellCityLimits
 


haha i love that song



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:33 PM
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reply to post by smithjustinb
 

Our sun cannot even turn into a black hole. It will first grow to red giant before it finally dies and turns into a white dwarf.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:35 PM
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Originally posted by juleol
reply to post by smithjustinb
 

Our sun cannot even turn into a black hole. It will first grow to red giant before it finally dies and turns into a white dwarf.


At which point the energy going out would overcome the energy going in.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:36 PM
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Since I am still here and able to reply to this thread I would say no.

2nd line



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:37 PM
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it depends if your personal deffinition of a black hole assumes neutron collections or pure vacuum, science does not know but assumes the former, and is thwarted by the fact you can't pack neutrons that tightly because they chain react, thus nukes.

great song also =D got me to pick up my guitar for the first time in about a week



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:41 PM
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No. Stars like the Sun just aren't massive enough to become black holes. Instead, in several billion years, the Sun will cast off its outer layers, and its core will form a white dwarf - a dense ball of carbon and oxygen that no longer produces nuclear energy, but that shines because it is very hot. A typical white dwarf is about as massive as the Sun, but only as big as Earth, which is one percent of the Sun's present diameter.

So i think this is the real answer.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 01:57 PM
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Originally posted by Nikola014
No. Stars like the Sun just aren't massive enough to become black holes. Instead, in several billion years, the Sun will cast off its outer layers, and its core will form a white dwarf - a dense ball of carbon and oxygen that no longer produces nuclear energy, but that shines because it is very hot. A typical white dwarf is about as massive as the Sun, but only as big as Earth, which is one percent of the Sun's present diameter.

So i think this is the real answer.


Not really, because then I just say that perhaps the white dwarf is the result of the star overcoming its absorbing force that is the internal black hole so that it is strictly productive. Instead of the absorbing force overcoming the productive force and becoming strictly absorbent.

I edited my post to include that possibility.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:03 PM
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Originally posted by smithjustinb

Originally posted by Nikola014
No. Stars like the Sun just aren't massive enough to become black holes. Instead, in several billion years, the Sun will cast off its outer layers, and its core will form a white dwarf - a dense ball of carbon and oxygen that no longer produces nuclear energy, but that shines because it is very hot. A typical white dwarf is about as massive as the Sun, but only as big as Earth, which is one percent of the Sun's present diameter.

So i think this is the real answer.


Not really, because then I just say that perhaps the white dwarf is the result of the star overcoming its absorbing force that is the internal black hole so that it is strictly productive. Instead of the absorbing force overcoming the productive force and becoming strictly absorbent.

I edited my post to include that possibility.


Is this your opinion or did you read about this somewhere?



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:03 PM
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Originally posted by Nikola014
No. Stars like the Sun just aren't massive enough to become black holes. Instead, in several billion years, the Sun will cast off its outer layers, and its core will form a white dwarf - a dense ball of carbon and oxygen that no longer produces nuclear energy, but that shines because it is very hot. A typical white dwarf is about as massive as the Sun, but only as big as Earth, which is one percent of the Sun's present diameter.

So i think this is the real answer.


It doesn't seem possible that a white dwarf could produce heat for as long as wikipedia says it could without undergoing some kind of nuclear reaction instead.

That time period is 10^19 years AT LEAST.

So white dwarfs can produce heat for that long by just "stored thermal energy"? I don't buy it.
edit on 14-9-2011 by smithjustinb because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:04 PM
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Originally posted by MrOysterhead

Originally posted by smithjustinb

Originally posted by Nikola014
No. Stars like the Sun just aren't massive enough to become black holes. Instead, in several billion years, the Sun will cast off its outer layers, and its core will form a white dwarf - a dense ball of carbon and oxygen that no longer produces nuclear energy, but that shines because it is very hot. A typical white dwarf is about as massive as the Sun, but only as big as Earth, which is one percent of the Sun's present diameter.

So i think this is the real answer.


Not really, because then I just say that perhaps the white dwarf is the result of the star overcoming its absorbing force that is the internal black hole so that it is strictly productive. Instead of the absorbing force overcoming the productive force and becoming strictly absorbent.

I edited my post to include that possibility.


Is this your opinion or did you read about this somewhere?


It's an idea I created to support my theory.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:17 PM
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Originally posted by smithjustinb

Originally posted by MrOysterhead

Originally posted by smithjustinb

Originally posted by Nikola014
No. Stars like the Sun just aren't massive enough to become black holes. Instead, in several billion years, the Sun will cast off its outer layers, and its core will form a white dwarf - a dense ball of carbon and oxygen that no longer produces nuclear energy, but that shines because it is very hot. A typical white dwarf is about as massive as the Sun, but only as big as Earth, which is one percent of the Sun's present diameter.

So i think this is the real answer.


Not really, because then I just say that perhaps the white dwarf is the result of the star overcoming its absorbing force that is the internal black hole so that it is strictly productive. Instead of the absorbing force overcoming the productive force and becoming strictly absorbent.

I edited my post to include that possibility.


Is this your opinion or did you read about this somewhere?


It's an idea I created to support my theory.


Well kuddos to you for putting some thought into a theory.

But when someone gives you an idea and you respond with "Not really, because I just say...." then you are giving no other possibility but your own ideas and you are making them up on the fly.

Based on what little bit of general knowledge I have of black holes.....I would say that if one existed "inside the sun" then the sun and our planet wouldnt be here.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:35 PM
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Originally posted by MrOysterhead

Originally posted by smithjustinb

Originally posted by MrOysterhead

Originally posted by smithjustinb

Originally posted by Nikola014
No. Stars like the Sun just aren't massive enough to become black holes. Instead, in several billion years, the Sun will cast off its outer layers, and its core will form a white dwarf - a dense ball of carbon and oxygen that no longer produces nuclear energy, but that shines because it is very hot. A typical white dwarf is about as massive as the Sun, but only as big as Earth, which is one percent of the Sun's present diameter.

So i think this is the real answer.


Not really, because then I just say that perhaps the white dwarf is the result of the star overcoming its absorbing force that is the internal black hole so that it is strictly productive. Instead of the absorbing force overcoming the productive force and becoming strictly absorbent.

I edited my post to include that possibility.


Is this your opinion or did you read about this somewhere?


It's an idea I created to support my theory.


Well kuddos to you for putting some thought into a theory.

But when someone gives you an idea and you respond with "Not really, because I just say...." then you are giving no other possibility but your own ideas and you are making them up on the fly.


Yeah but the ideas still follow the same logic.


Based on what little bit of general knowledge I have of black holes.....I would say that if one existed "inside the sun" then the sun and our planet wouldnt be here.


Unless there is an equal force acting against the absorbing force of the black hole, thereby keeping everything in check. The outward force would overcome the absorbing force.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:38 PM
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reply to post by smithjustinb
 


What is this force you speak of?

That goes against everything we know about black holes.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:52 PM
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OP, do you have any data to suggest that the existing model is wrong? If so, what anomalies does your hypothesis explain that the existing theory cannot accommodate for, i.e. what specifically is wrong with the existing model, where is the data to demonstrate it and how does your hypothesis resolve it? How would your hypothesis be tested and validated/nullified? What useful predictions does your hypothesis make that can be tested and validated?



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:52 PM
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Double post!
edit on 14-9-2011 by john_bmth because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:52 PM
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The internal black hole idea won't work. You are taking away the internal pressure that keeps the star from collapsing.

There is a theory of parasitary black holes: www.sciencedaily.com...



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:53 PM
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Originally posted by MrOysterhead
reply to post by smithjustinb
 


What is this force you speak of?

That goes against everything we know about black holes.



The fusion of lighter elements in stars releases energy (and the mass that always accompanies it). For example, in the fusion of four hydrogen nuclei to form helium, seven-tenths of 1 percent of the mass is carried away from the system in the form of kinetic energy or other forms of energy (such as electromagnetic radiation)[2] However, the production of elements heavier than iron absorbs energy.


And what do we really know about black holes? We have theories.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 03:01 PM
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Originally posted by moebius
The internal black hole idea won't work. You are taking away the internal pressure that keeps the star from collapsing.

There is a theory of parasitary black holes: www.sciencedaily.com...



A star is a sphere of gas held together by its own gravity. The force of gravity is continually trying to cause the star to collapse, but this is counteracted by the pressure of hot gas and/or radiation in the star's interior.




In this theory, I defined gravity as the pushing and pulling of a star on an object with the elements heavier than iron undergoing fusion creating the pull and elements lighter than iron undergoing fusion creating the push. Therefore, the gravity won't be collapsing the star because the outward force of the star equals the inward force.

So the pressure of the star to not collapse is actually caused by the nuclear reactions themselves.



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