It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

The Sun is going down on Atheism

page: 4
9
<< 1  2  3    5  6  7 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 02:57 AM
link   
reply to post by spacedoubt
 


Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist--he denies the Father and the Son. -1 John 2:22




posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 03:06 AM
link   
reply to post by RevelationGeneration
 


Well that's a relief. Then it can't be me.

You know, you are not helping our cause RG.

The love of God, as Jesus taught and represented, that's the missing ingredient, the missing element in our world. It's a FAIL in love, and we're failing too, you in obvious ways, and me in how you make me feel as a fellow Christian believer. It's so sad, I wish I could find the humor of the Lord in it, and I can, praise God!


edit on 14-9-2011 by NewAgeMan because: typo



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 03:11 AM
link   
reply to post by GmoS719
 


Well I have never been religious – none of my family or friends are religious – the people I knew growing up weren’t religious – so now what?

This is from the UK – but seems to be the general trend across Europe
www.whychurch.org.uk...

Here’s what the times had to say about it
www.timesonline.co.uk...


By 2050 there will be just 3,600 churchgoing Methodists left in Britain, Christian Research predicts. Anglicans will be down to 87,800, Catholics to 101,700, Presbyterians to 4,400, Baptists to 123,000 and independents to 168,000.


but basically as the granny's are dying off there are no youngsters to replace them - The church see it as a catastrophe – I see it as evolution



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 03:14 AM
link   

Originally posted by racasan

but basically as the granny's are dying off there are no youngsters to replace them - The church see it as a catastrophe – I see it as evolution



Churches come and go but Christ is forever.

Even so, the Church of England is right to see the de-Christianization of the UK as a tragedy. The blame can be laid squarely at the feet of the secular humanists who taught three generations of Europeans to hate their own culture and religions. Anf the COE played a role in this process too, with its wishy-washy attitudes.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 03:15 AM
link   
reply to post by RevelationGeneration
 


I wrote my post myself.
You quoted someone else.
What do YOU think, personally. Without a scriptural reference.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 03:17 AM
link   

Originally posted by GmoS719

If a father punishes his child for doing something wrong.
Does he hate his child?
No. It isn't hate.


If a father punishes his child for doing something wrong – its so the child wont repeat its mistake in the future and the punishes is usually just a “short sharp shock”

But if a father punishes his child for doing something wrong – for ever and ever then that’s not a father that’s a monster



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 03:23 AM
link   
reply to post by Partygirl
 


I don’t hate my culture – just the opposite in fact, I do dislike religion and most people I know have a deep distrust of it, I think one of the reasons for that is the history of christianity in Europe ( its a very dark and brutal story)



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 03:26 AM
link   
So there are Atheists. So what?

Is ridicule and scorn the best method of representing God?

Really?

How many Christians, Muslims, etc. have walked away from their faith because they were ridiculed and scorned by an Atheist?

There is far more convincing evidence that there is not a God based on the behaviors of his ambassadors of faith. If not for what I know, I too might be convinced.

My concern is not for the Atheist, no, my concern is for those who have so limited their understanding of God that they cannot fathom that he made Atheists for a GOOD reason.

With Love,

Your Brother



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 04:01 AM
link   
reply to post by racasan
 


According to that:

"theists and Agnostics represent 33% of the population and are still in the minority."

As for this comment:



but basically as the granny's are dying off there are no youngsters to replace them - The church see it as a catastrophe – I see it as evolution

You raised a good point.

But I am a young adult, and from the UK, that recently became a believer in Christianity. I do agree that most of the UK's younger generation has been brainwashed by secularism, i am humbled to be in the minority that's fighting back against the materiel focused money driven life-style.
edit on 14-9-2011 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 04:05 AM
link   
reply to post by GmoS719
 


blabla...

On hydro energy right now. Balanced PC system so I probably can fix it myself if it breaks down.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 04:08 AM
link   
reply to post by IAMIAM
 


But atheist's aren't made, they are conditioned (mostly with secular brainwashing). Considering everyone has the natural instincts that there is a higher power then themselves, some just fail to realize this higher power is the God of the bible.
edit on 14-9-2011 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 04:49 AM
link   
First I must agree with the title-claim, that the sun is going down on atheism. That is...... on positivistic (gnostic) atheism, which made as unfounded postulates as some theists do, by absolutely stating: "There IS no 'god' " (as opposed to the equally unreasonable postulate: "There IS a (the) 'god' ").

It's impossible to make a precise statistics on it, but it's my distinct impression, that a majority of contemporary 'atheists' are AGNOSTIC atheists (a group I nominally don't belong to, though I sympathisize with many of its ideas).

From my own experience I'm not surprised, that the thread author already at this point starts to make an orchestrated scenario. It's uncertain, if agnostic atheists are included in the 'statistic group' (come to that soon) which is criticised here on 'technical' (i.e. factual) ground and is included in the holy wrath of the author.

So my first point is: Does the author create a 'false category' or is this thread ONLY directed towards positivistic, gnostic atheism. Does he/she actually know the difference, and does he/she care about the intellectual dishonesty implied, if ignorance isn't a part of possibly creating a false category.

*****

This benefit of doubt I will not give to the author, when it comes to the 'statistics', which openly are so cosmetic, that it should be embarrasing just to present such (but then, 'the aim justifies the means' for a missionary christian).

a/ The basic statistic is from 1995 (supported by an ESTIMATE from 2004). Much has happened since then and the subject appears to have some kind of 'taboo' on it, as it is difficult to find any recent, reliable numbers.

b/ These statistics are based on nominal adherence. At that time (1995) many e.g. european countries still had some unclear bounderies between state and church(es), something which has changed since, and citizens were often born into passive, nominal membership of a religion, where you actually had to take the trouble to cancel you memebership. Many declared non-theists still choose to stay as members for 'formal' and practical reasons, but can not be counted as 'religious' on that ground.

c/ The presently most reliable way of considering religious adherence would then be active churchgoing (specific for each religion) and political representation (as the political scene has polarized itself on that point, active religionists vote religiously). And here the european outcome is clear: Religion is RATTLING down. A US survey shows a similar, but much smaller, tendency in the same direction.

d/ The author's category-creation is in the case of statistical implications clearly a 'false category' created for propaganda purposes (~intellectual dishonesty), as follows:

Quote from OP: [" Since the vast majority of the world's population is "religious" and believes in "God"]

Nope, buddhists and hindus, while mostly being semi-religions, do not operate with a concept 'god' even slightly resembling the 'god' the author refers to, and the statistical inclusion is purely cosmetic and propagandistic. The proper word in this context would have been: Metaphysical.

e/ A 2006 POLL of 2000 households in Minnesota (for the sake of the flying spaghetti monster... a POLL, ....in US) is brought up as if having ANY significance at all (outside Minnesota or US).

*****

On 'truth'.

Quote: ["Could it really be that only 2% of 6 BILLION people - have the truth while the remaining 5 billion 850 million people have it all wrong? Gee - what are the odds of THAT?"]

Truth is not decided by public vote. Pragmatic choices are. Apparently the author find it convenient to disregard this important difference, so he/she can continue with the orchestrations.

*****

Quote: [" On top of that his numbers are shrinking and his influence is waning. It truly is the twilight of atheism. The sun is setting on the one... that God calls ... A FOOL"]

The debate standard of the author declares itself here. No need for more comments on that.

*****

Finally I see the 'intelligent design'-concept brought up again. It's bosh.

*****

Altogether I would describe this thread as another theist mix of semantics run amok, pseudo-rational arguments and the the usual sermon-like circular argumentation.

But we need more of that. It sure as bleep scares people away from this kind of religion. So DO go on.



edit on 14-9-2011 by bogomil because: spelling, paragraphing



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 05:07 AM
link   

Originally posted by GmoS719
reply to post by RevelationGeneration
 

IMO, Everyone goes through the atheist faze. Even if they still believe in God.
They tell everyone else that they don't.
Then most people mature and grow out of it.
The rest of them, go to hell.
Yes I said it, Hell is real even if you don't believe in it.
To my atheist brothers and sisters, Don't end up like the rest of the 2%.



edit on 14-9-2011 by GmoS719 because: (no reason given)


Oration is not actually prohibited by forum rules, but as a debate-contribution its value is questionable from a rational perspective.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 05:16 AM
link   

Originally posted by graphuto

Originally posted by GmoS719

Originally posted by subtopia
It is not your eyes that you are using or you would see the absence of any factual knowledge of the existence of a god in the way the christian belief portrays it, except for the reactions of men who enjoy the suffering of women in childbirth. What kind of loving entity would do that to a woman.


What kind of woman would trade eternal life for a fig?
lol


Nailed it! Everyone is forgetting the free will part of it. Where EVERYTHING is pointing to "BELIEVE, BELIEVE" and people just simply CHOOSE not to. Ridiculous.


The 'logic' in this is rather muddy. What "EVERYTHING....pointing" are you talking about (faith transgressing its own competence and authority through circular argumentation and invasive methods?)

And 'free will' is actually supposed to BE free will. Not falling in step with YOUR subjective opinions. There's nothing ridiculous about disagreeing with self-proclaimed 'truths'.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 05:35 AM
link   
bogomil raises some good points

first there are only a few Strong atheist

there’s a scale that some use to measure religiousness(!) Like this:
1.00: Strong theist. 100% possibility of God. In the words of C.G. Jung, 'I do not believe, I know".

2.00: Very high probability 'I cannot know for certain, but I strongly believe in God.

3.00: Higher than 50 per cent but not very high. Technically agnostic but leaning towards theism.

4.00: Exactly 50 per cent. Completely impartial agnostic.

5.00: Lower than 50 per cent but not very low. Technically agnostic but leaning towards atheism.

6.00: Very low probability, but short of zero. De facto atheist.

7:00: Strong atheist. 'I know there is no God, with the same conviction as Jung "knows" there is one.

Even Dawkins only rates himself as a 6, I’m about a 5.5 - 6

Second your statistics seem a bit odd – finding any reliable data on this subject is difficult, I know many Brits who just tick the Christians box on the census when they are not church goers or religious in any way

And you seem to including people who don’t really fit into your category such as Buddhists who don't believe in god(s)


Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by racasan
 


According to that:

"theists and Agnostics represent 33% of the population and are still in the minority."

As for this comment:



but basically as the granny's are dying off there are no youngsters to replace them - The church see it as a catastrophe – I see it as evolution

You raised a good point.

But I am a young adult, and from the UK, that recently became a believer in Christianity. I do agree that most of the UK's younger generation has been brainwashed by secularism, i am humbled to be in the minority that's fighting back against the materiel focused money driven life-style.
edit on 14-9-2011 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)


As for England
Having walked around a typical British market town on shopping days for a few years, I have only seen evangelicals doing their thing twice and both times they where totally ignored by the shoppers – but the second time was really funny

Doing the shopping with a friend we heard two evangelicals preaching. The female of the two (and what a real harpy she was) was waxing lyrical about how the power of the lord could make people in wheel chairs walk again if only they believed strongly enough

the friend I was with is a person in wheel chairs – he went up to her and offered to break one of her legs by running over it with his chairs so she could give him a demonstration

Oddly she declined the invitation and at that point her male companion must have suddenly remembered he had an appointment because they packed up and left – the crowed that had gathered watch this was highly amused – the best bit was, as they left the woman was actually shrieking I don’t think I have ever heard such a demented sound as she was making


edit on 14-9-2011 by racasan because: (no reason given)

edit on 14-9-2011 by racasan because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 05:59 AM
link   

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by IAMIAM
 


But atheist's aren't made, they are conditioned (mostly with secular brainwashing). Considering everyone has the natural instincts that there is a higher power then themselves, some just fail to realize this higher power is the God of the bible.
edit on 14-9-2011 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)


What appears to be either your political 'philosophy' or your understanding of how societies function could do with some more factual knowledge.

In the context of religion, western liberal, egalitarian, constitutional, SECULAR democracies makes it a POINT to emphasize and keep up the egalitarian principle between religions.

Christians have as much civil rights (and obligations) as everybody else, and for some of the more obnoxious christians this is actually a protection.

This post seems very peculiar...are such egalitarian principles 'brainwashing'? Is it, that you somehow feel, that you have some elitist privileges denied you from this egalitarian 'brainwashing'. That you are 'above' egalitarian principles?

It's only fair you answer this yourself



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 06:04 AM
link   

Originally posted by Partygirl

Originally posted by racasan

but basically as the granny's are dying off there are no youngsters to replace them - The church see it as a catastrophe – I see it as evolution



Churches come and go but Christ is forever.

Even so, the Church of England is right to see the de-Christianization of the UK as a tragedy. The blame can be laid squarely at the feet of the secular humanists who taught three generations of Europeans to hate their own culture and religions. Anf the COE played a role in this process too, with its wishy-washy attitudes.


Disregarding your semantically colourful argumentation, I still have a question:

What does the word 'taught' imply in this context. It's rather vague in the present context and can lead to all kinds of associations.



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 07:31 AM
link   

Originally posted by BruceEFury
The bible said a bat was a bird...
Wrong... A bat is a mammal.
Mammal's don't lay eggs.


where's this verse at? i'm interested in reading it.
thanks



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 07:45 AM
link   
14.7%-16% of the world population is NON religious....get your facts right dude



posted on Sep, 14 2011 @ 07:52 AM
link   
reply to post by BruceEFury
 


platypus and echidna= mammals that lay eggs. FYI




top topics



 
9
<< 1  2  3    5  6  7 >>

log in

join