Freemasons are Good Guys(Spirit Science), page 6

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reply posted on 1-10-2011 @ 07:05 AM by network dude

reply to post by DRAZIW

here you go professor,
a few years ago, during the winter, I was pumping gas. it was late. A homeless man came up to me and asked if I had any change for him. He looked cold and miserable. I gave him 5 bucks. Now I know he was going to either buy some mad dog or some drugs with that money, but I figured if he could forget about being miserable for one night, then that might be a good thing.

Did I do the right thing?

reply posted on 1-10-2011 @ 07:40 AM by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by network dude
A homeless man came up to me and asked if I had any change for him. He looked cold and miserable. I gave him 5 bucks. Now I know he was going to either buy some mad dog or some drugs with that money...

I bought the Mad Dog.

edit on 1-10-2011 by AugustusMasonicus because: networkdude has no beer.

reply posted on 2-10-2011 @ 07:07 AM by abcddcba

you don't need to be a mason to act like one, which from what i have gathered so far is just being the best you you can be by helping others becomes better themselves and together becoming better as a whole society. whats so bad or evil about that? i been doing that my whole life, my parents taught me to do unto others as you would have done unto you. been working just fine so far, some people don't appreciate it, but just consider those people not ready. i feel good helping people who need it, don't you? maybe you should become a mason

reply posted on 8-10-2011 @ 10:13 AM by fakedirt

reply to post by JoshNorton

hello josh
i know this is out of the blue but here goes. twenty plus years ago i purchased a book in a second hand bookstore (The Architects' and Builders Pocket-Book) to further my studying in the field of architecture and building works. i carried it around europe, middle east and n.africa. recently i dug it out of storage and gave it a glance. all these years i didn't notice the original owners scribblings. the man david miller 32 degree is written down with his profession of engineer. the date of 1916 and various locations of employment are listed as well. west indies,miramar caguas and mayaguez. i am intrigued as to know a bit more about this fellow and wondered if you had any pointers/suggestions i may follow up on?
regards fakedirt.

reply posted on 8-10-2011 @ 01:50 PM by JoshNorton

Originally posted by fakedirt
reply to post by JoshNorton

hello josh
i know this is out of the blue but here goes. twenty plus years ago i purchased a book in a second hand bookstore (The Architects' and Builders Pocket-Book) to further my studying in the field of architecture and building works. i carried it around europe, middle east and n.africa. recently i dug it out of storage and gave it a glance. all these years i didn't notice the original owners scribblings. the man david miller 32 degree is written down with his profession of engineer. the date of 1916 and various locations of employment are listed as well. west indies,miramar caguas and mayaguez. i am intrigued as to know a bit more about this fellow and wondered if you had any pointers/suggestions i may follow up on?
regards fakedirt.

Kind of a longshot. If you knew what state he became a Mason in, their Grand Lodge would probably have records of him, but who knows how many of the records dating back to 1916 would be in an easily searchable format.

t would be even better if he'd mentioned what lodge/lodge # he was a member of, because they probably have records as well.

That, compounded with the fact that "David Miller" is probably a fairly common name, I don't think you're going to get too far without more specific info.

Good luck though, if you choose to pursue that quest. (Might be cool for you to give the book to one of his heirs if you ever tracked them down...)

edit on 2011.10.8 by JoshNorton because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 8-10-2011 @ 03:07 PM by dontreally

reply to post by network dude

Heres my moral take on the situation. Either action would have been justified. Withholding money would have been to prevent him from further destroying himself with drugs or alcohol.

At the same time, perhaps he has fallen so deep into an existential black hole that giving him some money to buy alcohol/drugs would be a much sought after relief, which even in his moral state would be a nice gesture, albeit, one that doesnt improve his general situation.

It really depends. We dont have any information about the person...all we really do when we pass by a homeless person and consider offerring him some money is guaging what would be best. Sometimes we rationalize "this would just be worse for him" so we withhold any monetary charity, and at other times, perhaps when were feeling more sympathetic to his current existential state, we give him the money think "he would atleast find relief from his misery in alcohol or drugs".

One response considers the immediate benefits ie; a brief relief from his misery through drugs/alchhol, the other is a more 'wise' approach, in that we consider the net result of what will happen when we give him the money.

Frankly, i think the best form of charity is not money, but clothing, food, or a means to reform himself (perhaps a apprenticeship type program, where the homeless person can be taught the basic skills for a particular job) ie; things whiich can be more or less controlled. But what i think a homeless person needs most is moral and spiritual support. We need to establish the means for this.

The way this culture we live in treats its homeless is abominable. Ghandi said "The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated"..Coming from a Hindu - its not suprising. I think if we replace "its poor" with "animals" we'd arrive at a more just and sound reasoning. A society which treats its poor like animals, is a very morally defunct society indeed. When the poor are treated well, then we can expect the animals to be treated with decency aswell.

The poor are more important and deserving of support than animals are.

edit on 8-10-2011 by dontreally because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 8-10-2011 @ 03:39 PM by dontreally

reply to post by DRAZIW

If you would be less stubborn and rigid in your opinions im sure we would get somewhere in this conversation.

But, then, the BIG question becomes..."Why on earth doesn't Freemasonry open its doors to everyone ?"

In the varities of religious experience, william james argues that "this world" is dominated by egotists, whereas in the future world, saints will be in power. I think theres a truth to this statement.

I was reading yesterday "why does God allow evil to exist"? and the author, Rabbi Adin Steinsaltz used a very apposite analogy. Evil is merely a necessary component in the process of "building". When someone builds a house, what he wants - the essential good - is to live in the house. But between the time that the house is built and the initial planning stages, he has to make a blueprint for the house, he has to setup scaffolding, etc. This is the neccesary component (ie evil) that leads to the completion of the house.

Theres a very ancient doctrine, mostly connected with the Torah of Israel, that this world is destined to last 7000 years. Each 1000 years "builds" a component of the 7 divin sefiroth. Each thousand years corresponds to one of the days of creation where a particular set of powers (elucidated on each day, in Genesis 1) is established in human society. The 6 days are the '6000' years of "building". In this time period, a vritual 'scaffolding' is setup. Perhaps we could do without these things? I dont know. All i know is that God has willed it, otherwise it wouldnt be.

Why is Freemasonry so "exclusive" on membership?

Perhaps that would be premature? Maybe the collective enlightenment of mankind is destined for a future time, when "Elohim rests" ie; the name of creation, and the process of creation, is complete. Perhaps evil is necessary to bring about the advancements that mankind has made? But surely, this 'advancement' will reach an end, where evil will be nothing but a superfluous and idolatrous appendage to a reality that has outgrown it.

Dont get me wrong. I would love for all people to become 'enlightened'...but perhaps too much mannah at a time when man is still, technically speaking, under the spiritual energies of cosmic progression, would stifle progess and ultimately undermine mans divin prerogative?

reply posted on 9-10-2011 @ 07:51 AM by fakedirt

reply to post by JoshNorton

hello josh
my intention was to give the book back to any interested relative who could elaborate on information scribbled in the book. i thought it would be a good gesture. btw i am in the uk and sourced the book in the north of england. i just do not have a clue about contacting lodges etc..
thanks for the reply

regards fakedirt

reply posted on 9-10-2011 @ 11:30 AM by KSigMason

reply to post by fakedirt

The easiest way to get a hold of a Lodge is to contact the United Grand Lodge of England.

reply posted on 9-10-2011 @ 12:08 PM by fakedirt

reply to post by KSigMason

many thanks for the info. i will follow it up.
2nd
regards fakedirt.

reply posted on 11-10-2011 @ 10:58 AM by DRAZIW

Originally posted by dontreally

I was reading yesterday "why does God allow evil to exist"? and the author, Rabbi Adin Steinsaltz used a very apposite analogy. Evil is merely a necessary component in the process of "building". When someone builds a house, what he wants - the essential good - is to live in the house. But between the time that the house is built and the initial planning stages, he has to make a blueprint for the house, he has to setup scaffolding, etc. This is the neccesary component (ie evil) that leads to the completion of the house.

That would be a Jewish position. After all, to build the State of Israel, the necessary evil is the removal and subjugation of the Palestinians that occupy the land. The Israelis' must "justify" that action somehow to be able to live with their decisions. And since the Rabbi's govern behind the scenes, that view of evil is expected.

However, what really is evil?

Can a man alone on a desert island do any evil?

If that man gathers up the fallen branches from the dead trees around the land, and builds himself a hut, where is the evil in the process of building?

What is good for one man, is seen as evil by another. Because evil arises out of competition for the universal resources. Evil is not, by any means, "necessary". The State of Israel did not have to displace the Palestinians, they could have invited them to join in building the land. But, then they would have to "share" the finite resources.

So then, evil arises out of that desire to separate from others, and take what others have for oneself.

It is necessary to build oneself up, relative to others, and make oneself "fat". It's the "wisdom" of the "storehouse".

In my view, God created the possibility of evil only so that man could "choose" the alternative after he'd figured out the order in the design.

reply posted on 11-10-2011 @ 11:27 AM by JoshNorton

Originally posted by DRAZIW
In my view, God created the possibility of evil only so that man could "choose" the alternative after he'd figured out the order in the design.

This would be in line with Albert Pike's writings…

Of that Equilibrium between Good and Evil, and Light and Darkness in the world, which assures us that all is the work of the Infinite Wisdom and of an Infinite Love; and that there is no rebellious demon of Evil, or Principle of Darkness co-existent and in eternal controversy with God, or the Principle of Light and of Good: by attaining to the knowledge of which equilibrium we can, through Faith, see that the existence of Evil, Sin, Suffering, and Sorrow in the world, is consistent with the Infinite Goodness as well as with the Infinite Wisdom of the Almighty.

Sympathy and Antipathy, Attraction and Repulsion, each a Force of nature, are contraries, in the souls of men and in the Universe of spheres and worlds; and from the action and opposition of each against the other, result Harmony, and that movement which is the Life of the Universe and the Soul alike. They are not antagonists of each other. The force that repels a Planet from the Sun is no more an evil force, than that which attracts the Planet toward the central Luminary; for each is created and exerted by the Deity, and the result is the harmonious movement of the obedient Planets in their elliptic orbits, and the mathematical accuracy and unvarying regularity of their movements.

Morals & Dogma, pp 859-60