Geoengineering Trials Get Under Way

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by whatsinaname

 

If climate change reaches the point where geoengineering becomes a necessary option, real world "testing" may become necessary. That point has not been reached and there is more international resistance to the idea than support. But real world "testing" would not really be testing at all. Of necessity it's an all or nothing proposition, a little bit of geoengineering would not demonstrate much of anything.

That is why it is important for this sort of modelling be done now, and that the models be validated as much as possible before even considered real world testing. There is not nearly enough known about the science.

edit on 9/13/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)

And it wont be reached since the AGW effect ONLY exist in their computer models. The global temperature we experience today can be fully explained by natural variation.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


It is all I can do from my little 5 acres which existence has shared with me to use and caretake. Not knowing you it is hard for me to understand your reply.

reply to post by juleol

Whether the cause of the warming and CO2 rise are natural or artificial, they are happening. If they continue they will lead to changes in environments.

If those changes are devastating. If those changes are sufficient to create multilateral agreement that action should be taken, then geoengineering may be deemed the lesser of two evils.

If not. Good.

Global warming should probably be attributed to depletion of the ozone and solar max. Carbon is good for the enviroment because it helps plants grow faster and bigger, which in turn produce more oxygen.

The whole concept of man made global warming IS A SHAM for the illuminati government to collect even more taxes from the unsuspecting populace. "Funny" the enviromentalists stopped talking about pollution and nuclear weapons lately, but that is what happens when satanists take over.

Originally posted by juleol

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by whatsinaname

 

And it wont be reached since the AGW effect ONLY exist in their computer models. The global temperature we experience today can be fully explained by natural variation.

Yes it can - which doesn't mean that it is of course!

But let's assume for hte sake of thsi post that there is no AGW - Why would we be happy that the global climate changes as much as it is believed to have done in the past for "natural" reasons? Is an ice age desireable? A hot earth?

And if it is at least acceptable (whether desirable or not) - why wouldn't it be a good idea to make plans for how humanity can continue to survive in the changed conditions?

Originally posted by burntheships
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul


A lot of things are being investigated to combat climate change of anthropomorphic global warming or whatever it is you want to call it.

I cant help ya there OTG, your a seasoned ATSer, either your studied up on Geoengineering or
your not. And by your own admission, you dont really give a hoot.

Where did I say anything of the sort?

I care quite a lot about atmospheric sulpur - I think spraying it would be a bad idea & it would take a pretty savage "climate cliff" to make me think it was the lesser of 2 evils.

So...I leave you with my sense of satisfaction. Very satisfied on a scale of 1 to 10

Ten being the most satisfied. 10

congratulations - I'm happy for you - your sense of self satisfaction is obviously importasnt to you even though it has nothign to do with anythign eral.

What if the ozone was depleted on purpose, by the secret government and aliens, by way of chemtrails in that funky jet fuel they use and/or all that aluminum barium cloud seeding various governments tried?

Maybe CFCs banned in air conditioning units and all other aerosols was a rouse just so they could take the blame off themselves while they appeared to acknowledge and care. I know for a fact the sun is much hotter in june and july the last 5 years and even sunbathing with lotion still causes sunburns to some degree, even 20spf or higher.

Yes the climate is heating up but the winters are also more severe as well meaning longer, colder temperatures to endure with more moisture and severe thunderstorms, tornadoes and hurricanes. Something is wrong with the climate and its not el nino.

Without a strong ozone layer we are also prone to cosmic radiation. I think the damage was deliberate and now they are trying to profit on their sins. How evil would that be? CO2 is not bad, CO could be only if inhaled but this has nothing to do with global warming.

Its all a #in sham, at least I think so!

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
What if the ozone was depleted on purpose, by the secret government and aliens, by way of chemtrails in that funky jet fuel they use and/or all that aluminum barium cloud seeding various governments tried?

what if it was depleted by the FLying Spaghetti Monster?

Its all a #in sham, at least I think so!

Seems pretty damned real to me!

Originally posted by burntheships

Geoengineering Trials Get Under Way

FIELD trials for experiments to engineer the climate have begun. Next month a team of UK researchers will hoist one end of a 1-kilometre-long hose aloft using a balloon, then attempt to pump water up it and spray it into the atmosphere (see diagram).

The water will not affect the climate. Rather, the experiment is a proof of principle to show that we can pump large quantities of material to great heights. If it succeeds, a larger-scale version could one day pump sulphate aerosols into the stratosphere, creating a sunshade that will offset the greenhouse effect.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Sounds like a new way to make snow.
pump water up one km in mid winter and spray it out and it would hit the ground as snow in the colder parts of the country.

Set up a dozen of these in a area and pump water from a river all winter you could end up with a 100+ feet of snow.
This would take most of the summer to melt and act as a lake would when used for water storage.

A couple 100 around a valley and a cold enough winter for a few years and you could form a glacier.

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
What if the ozone was depleted on purpose, by the secret government and aliens, by way of chemtrails in that funky jet fuel they use and/or all that aluminum barium cloud seeding various governments tried?

what if it was depleted by the FLying Spaghetti Monster?

Nonsense answers like that illuminate the reason why I find your responses not to be taken seriously.
In fact, I dont think anyone could think of you seriously after that post.

reply to post by burntheships


My speculation is just as valid as that to which I was replying - both are based on nothing more than supposition, without a shred of verifiable evidence to support them.

The difference between you and me over them is that I recognise that BOTH are baseless - you think one is not because it suits your preconceptions.

I'm fairly sure the ozone was depleted official story, by cfc's and such things which we're utterly banned or my opinion, they blew a hole in the darned thing when they nuked the atmosphere waay back in the 60's, I forget exactly but youtube should leave you with a dropped jaw and the question, wtf mate?

its good to know their not going to use this widespread, but I noticed a fox news article on the google news feed today that seams to believe otherwise, but then its fox.

reply to post by whatsinaname


Given that the ozone hole isx actually over Antarctica, and mostly affects New Zealand and Australia, the nuclear test thing seems unlikely - www.theozonehole.com...

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

Its all a #in sham, at least I think so!

Seems pretty damned real to me!

Sorry I should have said it was a conspiracy. I did not realise I have to be 100% accurate in everything I say so that people like you do not get confused. But then when you say "it was the flying spagetti monster" it pretty much proves you have a pro-government bias!

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by burntheships

 

My speculation is just as valid as that to which I was replying - both are based on nothing more than supposition, without a shred of verifiable evidence to support them.

The difference between you and me over them is that I recognise that BOTH are baseless - you think one is not because it suits your preconceptions.

How long have you been researching conspiracy topics? I see you registered about a year ago, while I have been doing research for at least five years. It may come as a suprise to you down the road, lets say 2 years from now, that the world is not what you thought it was.

Originally posted by whatsinaname
I'm fairly sure the ozone was depleted official story, by cfc's and such things which we're utterly banned or my opinion, they blew a hole in the darned thing when they nuked the atmosphere waay back in the 60's, I forget exactly but youtube should leave you with a dropped jaw and the question, wtf mate?

its good to know their not going to use this widespread, but I noticed a fox news article on the google news feed today that seams to believe otherwise, but then its fox.

There have been hundreds of nuclear tests conducted by many nations the last 60 years or so, some fission and some fusion type bombs, and you can bet this has a lot of adverse affects on the enviroment. As to damaging the ozone layer I don't think it was done by accident since the government, to put it mildely, is uncapable of correctly diagnosing anything and providing the correct remedy.

We see this with the economy, enviromental pollution, failed justice system, poor quality schools, extinction of animal and plant species, taxation, etc. Instead of making things better they usually make things worse. At what point does it become a full bonafide conspiracy?

Thanks for the support!

reply to post by EarthCitizen07


Because the Government supports the flying spaghetti monster?? Or what? Tell me how does highlighting your silly suggestion by making another silly suggestion constitute proof of a pro-government bias??

Actually I have a bias for verifiable information, and a strong dislike of unsubstantiated assertions that are assumed to be fact jsut because they agree with some preconceived notion.

Of course I'm only human and get it wrong.....but I'm happy to be corrected - yuo will need evidence to do so tho, not jsut flim flam.

As for accuracy - no you dont' ahve to be 100% accurate - none of us are - but if you've said somethign that isnt' accurate and someone queastions it then AFAIK teh norm is to say "Oops - sorry - what I menat ewas..." or somethign similar.

not to attack someone for having read what you wrote - how are we supposed to know you made a mistake??

There have been hundreds of nuclear tests conducted by many nations the last 60 years or so, some fission and some fusion type bombs, and you can bet this has a lot of adverse affects on the enviroment.

there's no need to bet on it - there are measurements about how much damage has been done - the background radiation, pollutants released such as plutonium in hte environment - how come you do't actually know hat pollution has been caused??

wiki article on fallout - somewher you can start finding facts so you won't have to suppose!

As to damaging the ozone layer I don't think it was done by accident since the government, to put it mildely, is uncapable of correctly diagnosing anything and providing the correct remedy

huh? Diagnosing and remedying what??

It seesm to me you are saying the Govt isn't capable of doing anything properly, but deliberately damaged the ozone layer with nuclear tests at a time when they didn't know squat about the ozone layer.....which is self contradictory.

I'm pretty sure you actually don't know what you are talking about & are just making up links because you thik they sound cool!

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Actually I have a bias for verifiable information, and a strong dislike of unsubstantiated assertions that are assumed to be fact jsut because they agree with some preconceived notion.

Of course I'm only human and get it wrong.....but I'm happy to be corrected - yuo will need evidence to do so tho, not jsut flim flam.

If we had plenty of evidence then conspiracy theories would become conspiracy facts. People who partake in a conspiracy normally do not openly brag about it. You have to add the dots and develop a pattern yourself or take someone else's word on it.

As for accuracy - no you dont' ahve to be 100% accurate - none of us are - but if you've said somethign that isnt' accurate and someone queastions it then AFAIK teh norm is to say "Oops - sorry - what I menat ewas..." or somethign similar.

not to attack someone for having read what you wrote - how are we supposed to know you made a mistake??

People who have a weak arguement result to nit-picking a few details here and there in a pathetic attempt to discredit other posters. I did not attack you..........I simply responded to YOUR attack of "the flying spaghetti monster".

There have been hundreds of nuclear tests conducted by many nations the last 60 years or so, some fission and some fusion type bombs, and you can bet this has a lot of adverse affects on the enviroment.

there's no need to bet on it - there are measurements about how much damage has been done - the background radiation, pollutants released such as plutonium in hte environment - how come you do't actually know hat pollution has been caused??

And you believe whatever the government tells you to believe? Thats naive for an alternative site such as ATS!

As to damaging the ozone layer I don't think it was done by accident since the government, to put it mildely, is uncapable of correctly diagnosing anything and providing the correct remedy

huh?

Diagnosing and remedying what??

It seesm to me you are saying the Govt isn't capable of doing anything properly, but deliberately damaged the ozone layer with nuclear tests at a time when they didn't know squat about the ozone layer.....which is self contradictory.

I was being sarcastic.......

I'm pretty sure you actually don't know what you are talking about & are just making up links because you thik they sound cool!

edit on 15-9-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)

I may not know everything, but at least I have a little common sense and imagination. Those two attributes are better than being a naive sheep who doesn't know the difference between conspiracy theory and government disinfo.

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
]People who have a weak arguement result to nit-picking a few details here and there in a pathetic attempt to discredit other posters. I did not attack you..........I simply responded to YOUR attack of "the flying spaghetti monster".

You then called me a believer of government disinformation - clearly a personal attack.

Do you often forget what you wrote so quickly??

Certainly I attacked your idea - you said "what if...(it were caused by soemthing)..."...I said "What if (it were caused by something else)....." precisely to show that "what if..." is not actually a ratinoal argument to support hte existence of something!

Conspiracy theories should have some credible evidence to be based upon - so far there is not 1 jot of such evidence for geo-engineering actually existing - whether from chemtrails or balloons or anything else..

Everythihg that has ever been punted up as "evidence" has been shown to be false - either through ignorance (people not knowing what they are measuring), or occasionally apparently as deliberate falsehood - such as the supposed German admission of spraying "chemtrails" that was a case of mistranslation when the correct translation was always obvious.

Face it - if there WERE something along the lines of geo-enginerring (by chemtrailsor any otehr means) that actually existed there would be MOUNTAINS of evidence - there would be chemicals, there would be whistle blowers, there would be strange trucks on airport ramps and aprons that could not be connected to "normal" aircraft servicing, there would be manuals and bills of sale, there would be measureable effects of some sort - if we were being poisoned then there would be health effects, if it was for geo-engineering then there would be geo-engineering effects.

NONE OF THESE HAVE EVER BEEN FOUND!

Not from chemtrails, not from nuclear bombs "maybe" deliberately destroying the ozone layer decades before anyone actually understood it for a reason you haven't bothered to identify.

You say I am a sheep for beleiving official information - which has been gathered by thousands of milloins of people all over the world using techniques that can be challenged if they are wrong?

Well I think that is better than believing someone who makes pronouncements based upong, as you say, their imagination, and who's purpose seems to be making money from preying on people's insecurities by inventing or supporting non-existant nefarious activites so he/she/they can sell speaking engagements, books, vitamins, dietry supplements, etc.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


So what are you doing on ATS then? Isn't it terribly boring for your ilk? Are you a sadist or just a bored, honest good man trying to save the world? If I didn't believe in any conspiracy theory I would be on another forumn that was of interest to me..........

Just saying your motives sound suspicious!