.....and then there's High altitude Electromagnetic Pulse

Amongst all the theorizing on the potential dangers and conspiracies that could be going on, or that could fall upon us tomorrow, I am surprised at how little anyone mentions that potential for EMP attacks! It seems to me that when people start to conjecture on the possibility of the US being attacked by China, or terrorism groups, for example, or anyone else, they think of being bombed (nuclear or otherwise) in the old fashion, resulting in immediate deaths. The argument always comes up that, "they wouldn't dare because we'd blow them all up before they knew what hit them!"

I think that argument weakens in the face of High Altitude Electromagnetic Pulse attack.

In the CRS Report for Congress, High Altitude Electromagnetic Pulse (HEMP) and High Power Microwave (HPM) Devices: Threat Assessment
www.empcommission.org/docs/empc_exec_rpt.pdf

"The threat of an EMP attack against the United States is hard to assess, but some observers indicate that it is growing along with worldwide access to newer technologies and the proliferation of nuclear weapons. In the past, the threat of mutually assured destruction provided a lasting deterrent against the exchange of multiple high-yield nuclear warheads. However, now even a single, low-yield nuclear explosion high above the United States, or over a battlefield, can produce a large-scale EMP effect that could result in a widespread loss of electronics, but no direct fatalities, and may not necessarily evoke a large nuclear retaliatory strike by the U.S. military. This, coupled with published articles discussing the vulnerability of U.S. critical infrastructure control systems, and some U.S. military battlefield systems to the effects of EMP, may create a new incentive for other countries to rapidly develop or acquire a nuclear capability."

I'm not sure how easy it is to ascertain right away who is responsible and needs to be attacked right away, in such a scenario as HEMP! If anyone isn't familiar with what it is-

Electromagnetic Pulse (EMP) is an instantaneous, intense energy field that can overload or disrupt at a distance numerous electrical systems and high technology microcircuits, which are especially sensitive to power surges. A large scale EMP effect can be produced by a single nuclear explosion detonated high in the atmosphere. This method is referred to as High-Altitude EMP (HEMP). A similar, smaller-scale EMP effect can be created using non-nuclear devices with powerful batteries or reactive chemicals. This method is called High Power Microwave (HPM). Several nations, including reported sponsors of terrorism, may currently have a capability to use EMP as a weapon for cyber warfare or cyber terrorism to disrupt communications and other parts of the U.S. critical infrastructure. Also, some equipment and weapons used by the U.S. military may be vulnerable to the effects of EMP.

A nuclear explosion high in the atmosphere.... perhaps we could determine from whence it was shot up. But that would not necessarily be an indicator of whose responsible! One country could shoot if off from within another country. We'd bomb the wrong country then. And the perpetrators would be free to continue doing more. They could sneak into countries all over the globe, and have us bombing everyone everywhere like a blindfolded fool!

I will continue to research on that question.... or maybe there's people here that can fill me in more on this?

The Commission reported that the ubiquitous dependency of society on the electrical power system, coupled with the EMP’s particular damage mechanisms, creates the possibility of long-term, catastrophic consequences for national security. Comparison was made to hurricane Katrina in 2005, where the protracted power blackout exhausted the limited fuel supplies for emergency generators. However, in the case of an EMP attack, a widespread collapse of the electric power grid could lead to cascading effects on interdependent infrastructures, possibly lasting weeks or months. The Commission stated, “Should significant parts of the electrical power infrastructure be lost for any substantial period of time ... many people may ultimately die for lack of the basic elements necessary to sustain life in dense urban and suburban communities ... [and] the Federal Government does not today have sufficiently robust capabilities for reliably assessing and managing EMP threats.”2

So when we realize how many groups and governments have the capability, right now, to do this to us. Heck, Al Quaida might! I wonder why we bother worrying about car bombs blowing up bridges? Why do we feel so safe saying that no one would dare attacking us because they know what our capabilities are?


When you think of it, poorer countries would find this ideal, especially since they themselves would not be equally impacted- they are less vulnerable because they are less dependant on electronics.
The irony would be profound- our technological advancement, which we see as our "forte", actually is our Achille's Heel!

I don't especially want to fear monger, but this place is where we intend to deny ignorance, and in that way be aware, and less vulnerable. I have the sense that this possibility has been sort of ignored or denied, in favor of thigns like an imaginary giant planet arriving being piloted by aliens!
Perhaps there are more possible and likely threats we could be turning attention to??

A very real possibility. I saw on a recent TV show from curiosity about a alien invasion. They said its most likely aliens would use EMP to cripple us before invading. hint hint. I think a fake alien invasion is very really possibility. one of their last cards to play to get their new world order. Emp whether from "aliens" or war definitly worth taking note of. Good you point this out. S&F

Just FYI, I believe you inadvertently auto-corrected EMP into HEMP. I clicked on this thread expecting to be told that this harmless marijuana plant product could be turned into a weapon. I think this is a great thread and worthy of some attention, but you may want to change the title.

I'm sure most if not all military hardware is shielded (at least in the US).

So if it does happen it will only be the civilians who are affected. Hmm would be good for false flag, right? Disable the civilian hardware and blame another country then start another war.

And i thought this would be about hemp.



Misleading title on purpose?

Originally posted by MentalPriapism
Just FYI, I believe you inadvertently auto-corrected EMP into HEMP. I clicked on this thread expecting to be told that this harmless marijuana plant product could be turned into a weapon. I think this is a great thread and worthy of some attention, but you may want to change the title.

No, I was refering to High altitude ElectroMagnetic Pulse, which is refered to as H.E.M.P.

I guess I just thought that on a conspiracy site, in the Weaponry forum, it would be immediately understood!
How do I change the title, if people are that confused? I'll write it out in full instead.

-Voila. Changed it. sorry about the confusion.

Originally posted by kaleshchand
I'm sure most if not all military hardware is shielded (at least in the US).

So if it does happen it will only be the civilians who are affected. Hmm would be good for false flag, right? Disable the civilian hardware and blame another country then start another war.

The committee felt that not enough had been done to shield all the military installations.
But yeah, even if they DO come out okay, we'd have total chaos happening within the country.
Whether this comes as an attack from others, or a false flag, OUR concern should be- am I prepared, in case this happens, to survive?

EMP would not be used in a false flag.
The grid and electronics are critical for the bankers and corporations that the 'government' work with.
it would cripple the flow of money and more.

the real militants, dont have the sophisticated equipment for an EMP.

before and after 9/11, the only tool they have are bombs, and smalls arms attack (rifle,grenade,rpg)
(hi-jacking planes were more 70's 80's),

the 9/11 modus operandi sticks out like a sore thumb.
That needed Intelligence agencies to co-ordinate and fund.

It was Israel's 3rd attack on America to bring terror to the US.
Lavan Affair.
USS Liberty
9/11

The EMP technology known by the civilian is strong enough to take out a whole continent, per 1 emp shock.

That would be alot of spoiled refrigerated food.

Some quotes to consider, with the sources- use your discernment on the sources, I am not sure which are the most trustworthy, honestly:

What is different now is that some potential sources of EMP threats are difficult to deter—they can be terrorist groups that have no state identity, have only one or a few weapons, and are motivated to attack the US without regard for their own safety.

Rogue states, such as North Korea and Iran, may also be developing the capability to pose an EMP threat to the United States, and may also be unpredictable and difficult to deter. Certain types of relatively low-yield nuclear weapons can be employed to generate potentially catastrophic EMP effects over wide geographic areas, and designs for variants of such weapons may have been illicitly trafficked for a quarter-century.

China and Russia have considered limited nuclear attack options that, unlike their Cold War plans, employ EMP as the primary or sole means of attack. Indeed, as recently as May 1999, during the NATO bombing of the former Yugoslavia, high-ranking members of the Russian Duma, meeting with a US congressional delegation to discuss the Balkans conflict, raised the specter of a Russian EMP attack that would paralyze the United States.

articlesofinterest-kelley.blogspot.com...

Nuclear aspirant rogue states, like North Korea, Iran, and Syria, have a huge advantage over the United States’ Manhattan Project of World War II, which invented the first atomic bombs in three years relying on 1930s and 1940s era technology. Rogue states can draw upon huge quantities of unclassified and declassified literature—including the original Manhattan Project papers—for guidance on building their nuclear weapons.6 Rogue states can and do purchase on the international market all manner of commercial and dual-use technologies relevant to developing nuclear weapons, technologies 70 years more advanced than that available to the U.S. Manhattan Project. Rogue states can and do rely on international criminal organizations, like the A.Q. Khan network, to help them get the technology and know how they need for nuclear weapons. Rogue states help each others’ nuclear weapons programs, as North Korea was recently helping Syria, and is helping Iran.7 Rogue states can and do buy help from Russia and China.
The record does not support Dr. Butt’s assumption that rogue state nuclear weapons are likely to be primitive. Credible open source reporting, including from Mordecai Vanunu, who worked in Israel’s nuclear weapons program, indicates that Israel has developed an array of sophisticated nuclear weapons, including thermonuclear weapons and miniaturized warheads for its Jericho missile—without nuclear testing.8 There is no reason North Korea, Iran, and Syria cannot duplicate Israel’s feat, especially as they have even greater resources than Israel. Pakistan and India quickly leapt from a few nuclear tests to deployment of an array of nuclear weapons, including warheads miniaturized for delivery by ballistic missile. Pakistan claims to have tested a thermonuclear weapon. If true, it is less likely a high yield weapon, and more likely a specialized weapon, like a neutron bomb. Sam Cohen, “Father of the Neutron Bomb,” credited Israel and South Africa with developing such weapons.9 The United Nations nuclear watchdog, the IAEA, discovered that a criminal group proliferated blueprints for a miniaturized nuclear warhead that could be delivered by Iran’s Scud or Shahab-3 missiles.10

www.thespacereview.com...

Info on preparedness and protection-
www.futurescience.com...

Originally posted by CitizenNum287119327
EMP would not be used in a false flag.
The grid and electronics are critical for the bankers and corporations that the 'government' work with.
it would cripple the flow of money and more.

the real militants, dont have the sophisticated equipment for an EMP.

before and after 9/11, the only tool they have are bombs, and smalls arms attack (rifle,grenade,rpg)
(hi-jacking planes were more 70's 80's),

the 9/11 modus operandi sticks out like a sore thumb.
That needed Intelligence agencies to co-ordinate and fund.

It was Israel's 3rd attack on America to bring terror to the US.
Lavan Affair.
USS Liberty
9/11

Not true, my anti-semitic friend. It COULD be used as a false flag because those bankers and corporations you speak of keep copies of their data backed up in secure data storage vaults which are pretty much disaster proof.

You assume that any sort of false flag operation of this nature would pinpoint terrorists. But they could just as easily pin it on Iran, China or North Korea. All three of them have nuclear weapons. All three of them have ballistic missiles. All three of them are potential enemies.

With the Club-K Container Missile System entering the market, you would just need to place one on an inconspicuous cargo ship anchored offshore. Launch that missile toward the center of the country and detonate it at high altitude. Nobody is going to know who was responsible, especially when 90% of all communication across the country is simultaneously shut down.

With no tv, internet, radio or cell phones the civilian population is going to be completely in the dark. Some but not all military communication systems will be out of commission as well. That would give whatever shady group plenty of time to fabricate "evidence" and blame anybody they like.

It would be the whole "yellow cake uranium" angle all over again.

I heard North Korea was investigating EMPs, they just purchasing some new GPS jamming equipment from Russia, which extends the reach from their coast.

reply to post by Bluesma


Nice to find others who have a similar way of thinking as to what 2012 is - possibly - going to deliver to us. Nice to hear how one old 1960s prediction is still ringing in our doubtful ears;
By that i recall Barry McGuire - as he sang 'EVE OF DESTRUCTION'

www.youtube.com...

There's stack's of info still available referring to a 1960s High Nuke explosion that delivered H.E.M.P effects etc.

Not living in an area prone to earthquakes, hurricanes, tsunami or tornado's over F-2, H.E.M.P is my number two concern right behind economic collapse as a cause for a SHTF situation.

Two very good books dealing with aftermath of HEMP are One Second After and Lightsout.

The loss of internet and cell phone pales when you consider that all and I mean all of your personal goods and services are delivered by rail and truck service which would immediately stop that moment.

All employment and professional services likewise will come to a halt for lack of basic supplies due to loss of transportation and "just in time" inventory systems.

All financial transactions will come to a halt as ATM's, store register's and electronic banking cease's to exist.

Imagine right now this moment that what you physically possess is it! No re-supply of med's, no more food, no information, no communications.

Now imagine that it not take a few weeks or month's but years to replace all the systems currently in place that we take for granted.

It will be like going back to the 1880's except the food industry now is mechanized to such an extent that this years crop will rot in the fields due to lack of ability to harvest and transport much less market. Next years crop will likewise not get planted for the same reasons.

If you are a city dweller and HEMP occurs just consider yourself toast because you really will not have the ability to leave before it becomes chaos - like in an hour or two of the event - there is no way out but on foot and don't expect relief even if you do manage to get out because everyone else will be in desperate straights far beyond your ability to walk.

Mass starvation and rampant disease along with murdering gangs is the direct and near immediate result of a continental HEMP event.

Think I'd rather have the slow burn of an economic collapse after-all!

Simple truth of the matter is that launched off of a freighter somewhere within 200 miles of the coast we would as a country no longer possess the means to identify our attacker much less retaliate against the true perpetrator after an event of this magnitude with the domestic situation as it would be. What could politicians do - attack everyone?

No, overseas soldiers would have to be pulled back from all the base's and hot spots to attempt control within CONUS - our adversary's know this and that is a reason this possibility is high on my list.

This scenario is too easy to do with today's spread of fanaticism coupled with known technical means to ignore.

If I myself was bent on taking down this country and had national means or sophisticated non-governmental means then this would be the best and easiest path to do so - I would unceasingly move towards that goal because it offers the least chance of a massive and devastating response.

This would be Pearl Harbor times a million!

Originally posted by steaming
reply to post by Bluesma

 

Nice to find others who have a similar way of thinking as to what 2012 is - possibly - going to deliver to us.

At what point did anybody mention 2012 in this thread?

Has there been a study as to how much area is affected by a certain size of HEMP weapon. I mean every weapon has a ceratin effective area.

Is it possible to build such a large weapon that can affect a very large (say continental size) area by a single weapon.

reply to post by Bluesma


The US doesnt need high altitude for EMP anymore..That said if someone did it to us, we would still blow them up.

Originally posted by ShogunAssassins
reply to post by Bluesma

 

The US doesnt need high altitude for EMP anymore..That said if someone did it to us, we would still blow them up.

Is it because US has space based microwave weapons?

I'd LOVE to see one set off over NYC. Show guys just how silly they are about NYC not mattering any! It'd wreck the entire US economy, and if nuked NYC, it'd do so a lot faster, too. Nobody'd go within 20 miles of NYC, for decades. No access from sea to Great lakes, all the companies not knowing what their stock was worth, or what to order or build, total chaos, nationwide, man. The $100 bill would be toilet tissue within 2 weeks, and maybe overnight.

Faraday cages my friends. Even a galvanized trash can and snug lid will be an effective shield. On the other hand, If 1 hemp was detonated over omaha or kansas city, lights out for NA. From there pretty much every one here would have 3 hours to 3 days before you started hearing gunfire near your house. For those of you buffs who haven't heard of it there is what looks like a good B movie coming out some time soon about it; Remnants. Check out the trailer.

www.youtube.com...