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Stimulus Package 2.0: $300 Billion...

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posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 11:20 AM
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Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


The package includes billions to pay for future retirement and pension of US postal workers and to avoid them from running out of money by august next year.

Funny how this whole government spending is nothing but a scam, to manufacture and sugar coat GDP numbers and claim that is economic growth, the government has to use tax payer dollars to create jobs.

See, most of the jobs that this will create if any, will still no be enough to keep families from getting off welfare.


edit on 7-9-2011 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)


"We are not in a recession." President Barack Obama. This man knows nothing about the economy!!! Truth is I am only 22 and just started to learn about economics. Why do I side with the GOP on these issues? Because spending money will not get you out of debt no matter how much you say it does!!!! That's basic economics 101 for you liberals.
edit on 7-9-2011 by jjf3rd77 because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 11:27 AM
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reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


Sadly regardless of who is in power the problems will never go away, It was under Bush that the bailouts started and it was under him that he started the "economic stimulus" but neither his agenda or Obama's will work.

Because the problem in America is related to our production and industrial base, they are almost none existence, thanks to globalization, our nations industrial base was the reason we were prosperous once upon a time, they provided employment and created the middle working class that supported the economy.

Then we turned into a nation of spenders and consumers, that supported the economy for a while, now we are nothing but an indebted nation with unemployed citizens.



posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 11:42 AM
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where does the money come from?



this is obviously step 2 of his reelection campaign. step 1 was "killing" osama.
edit on 7-9-2011 by snarfbot because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 01:34 PM
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That would be an additional 300 billion down the drain.

They need to RAISE taxes on the richest 1% (despite what FOX News brainwashes people into believing) that's the way they will get jobs going again. By forcing the richest 1% to do what got them rich in the first place, (BUSINESS NOT TAX BREAKS).



posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by jjf3rd77

Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


The package includes billions to pay for future retirement and pension of US postal workers and to avoid them from running out of money by august next year.

Funny how this whole government spending is nothing but a scam, to manufacture and sugar coat GDP numbers and claim that is economic growth, the government has to use tax payer dollars to create jobs.

See, most of the jobs that this will create if any, will still no be enough to keep families from getting off welfare.


edit on 7-9-2011 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)


"We are not in a recession." President Barack Obama. This man knows nothing about the economy!!! Truth is I am only 22 and just started to learn about economics. Why do I side with the GOP on these issues? Because spending money will not get you out of debt no matter how much you say it does!!!! That's basic economics 101 for you liberals.
edit on 7-9-2011 by jjf3rd77 because: (no reason given)


Obama got just what he wanted.
He threw a wet blanket over free market capitalism and slowed growth to a crawl.
----------
The first stimulus failed and so will this one.
Obamanomics in action = Solyndra
It's not what you know it's who you know.



posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 03:29 PM
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reply to post by Eurisko2012
 


Yes it will fail, because no once any of our "political genius" has even taking into consideration the root problem of our economy woes.

What they are doing is sticking band aids on a wound that only keeps festering and growing bigger.

Adding more debt to the deficit is just feeding the cancer.

You can not create jobs when is not areas in the nation to create them, infrastructure jobs are not permanent jobs.

In my town alone since I been living here we have lost over 6 different production businesses and most local mama and papa stores.

The producing businesses were good pay jobs, now we got two majore job makers on minimum wage jobs with no benefits as they hired mostly par time, wal-mart two frickin wal-marts in the same town.

Still our unemployment is over 100% and welfare is leaching the reminding tax payers.



posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 05:16 PM
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reply to post by marg6043
 


But...but...working at walmart is a job lolz!!!! Yeah walmart!



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 01:38 AM
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reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


You should realize that the government is not a business and shouldn't be run like one. also, the government doesn't borrow as much money from foreign countries as it does from its own citizens. Who owns $9 trillion of the governments debt? The American public.

Foreigners own $4 trillion of our debt, China alone, owns roughly $1 trillion. Remember, we have a total of $14 trillion in debt.

The mainstream GOP plan is to cut everything with the exception of the DoD from the federal budget. Debate over a $12 million program could last three days whereas ending a multi-trillion dollar war is just a side note.



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 10:18 AM
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Originally posted by links234
reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


You should realize that the government is not a business and shouldn't be run like one. also, the government doesn't borrow as much money from foreign countries as it does from its own citizens. Who owns $9 trillion of the governments debt? The American public.

Foreigners own $4 trillion of our debt, China alone, owns roughly $1 trillion. Remember, we have a total of $14 trillion in debt.

The mainstream GOP plan is to cut everything with the exception of the DoD from the federal budget. Debate over a $12 million program could last three days whereas ending a multi-trillion dollar war is just a side note.


OOPS! You left out the other half of the truth.
In addition to - reducing - the size of the U.S. government, the GOP thinks it might be a
great idea to let the - private sector - grow and reduce the unemployment rate to 4%.
That will send a tidal wave of payroll taxes into Washington D.C.
---------
Step 1: Remove the wet blanket Obama put on Free Market Capitalism.
Step 2: Repeal ObamaCare to remove - uncertainty
American corporations think 10 years ahead not 10 minutes ahead.

----------
Once we get the socialist out of the White House and replace him with a capitalist
this nation will take off.



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 11:57 AM
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reply to post by Eurisko2012
 


It just proves how wrong each party is and how they need to COMBINE, BI-Partisanship if there is any hope in saving the country/world. But that's never going to happen because of human ego and greed. It's simple as that. No Politician can fix this, and that's just common sense!



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 11:58 AM
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reply to post by Eurisko2012
 


That sounds like a good idea, but remember before Obama we did have a "capitalist" in the white house, the one that started the cycle of the downfall of the economy, no that it wasn't happening already but hell he did help speed it up.

When Reagan opened the door to corporate take over, they pushed freed trade, NAFTA and globalization buying the whores in congress, guess what we lost most of our industrial base and the jobs that supported the middle class, the class that keep the economy going.

Because the sold the idea that Americans were innovators, thinkers and inventors. Yeah, right.

Now is not way we can bring our industrial base back without that is not going to be any improvement in the nation.

Capitalism in America has turned into a corrupted notion to make profits at all cost without giving back anything, while screwing the consumer and job seekers, filling positions with foreign workers, because they also sold to the whores in congress that America was lacking skillful workers .

So the buy out congress give away grants to foreign nations like India to train workers so they can come to the US bring their families and take Tech jobs from the same companies that are outsourcing America as a rewards to allowing the US use the slave workers in their country.
edit on 8-9-2011 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 12:06 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by Eurisko2012
 

Because the sold the idea that Americans were innovators, thinkers and inventors. Yeah, right.

Capitalism in America has turned into a corrupted notion to make profits at all cost without giving back anything, while screwing the consumer and job seekers, filling positions with foreign workers, because they also sold to the whores in congress that America was lacking skillful workers .


edit on 8-9-2011 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)


How are we NOT innovators and inventors? Facebook, Apple, Google, GE, Microsoft etc.... All of these are American companies!!!! The tech boom happened in America, not anywhere else. Not anywhere else can you start a website in your dorm room and in a year's time become a Multi-Millionaire. It just doesn't happen in other countries. Well, maybe Europe. But they've only been around for a short time and are already collapsing.

American Innovation has been around for a LONG time. Your view about capitalism is wrong. Would you rather be under a Stalin or a Hitler. With no companies and no competition and no chance at improving the nation? They were the extreme socialists!!!! American society hasn't produced anything as bad.

Yes CEOs and business leaders to tend to be powerful and have big egos, but I bet you would too if you were Bill Gates.And he still does a lot for the world.

Don't blame Capitalism for the world's problems blame human greed because human greed has been around far longer than any political system.
edit on 8-9-2011 by jjf3rd77 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 12:20 PM
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reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


Sorry my friend, sadly our inovators, thinkers and inventors has been outsource to India, Pakistan and china.

Capitalism only works when it benefits the nation were is practice in America it only benefits the very few in top that makes all the profits while screwing the working class.

If our capitalism was so peachy, why do you think we have a market crisis and high unemployment, where do you thing all the industrial work that were the bread and butter of the nation went.

Were is the working prosperous class, why we have more of the nation population on welfare, why poverty keeps growing and why do you think our presidents needs to keep bailing out the nation.

Obama now wants 400 billions on another "stimulus", no 300.

You know, sadly in my 50 years of age, I have seen how our nation is deteriorating one decade at a time.

That is the truth. statistics do not lie, we have a proven record of how our nation has gone backwards in the last 40 years when it comes to income and standards of living.

Somebody is making money in the US alright, but is not the working middle class or the working poor.




edit on 8-9-2011 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 12:33 PM
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reply to post by marg6043
 


While our system may not be perfect. It doesn't mean that we are not innovators and inventors. I have yet to see a communist or socialist or dictatorship invent half the stuff we do.

I don't know why we have high unemployment, maybe because the rich are not expanding their businesses because they lost confidence in the economy, maybe its because our government is handing out free money to people and they are not "stimulating" the economy and are just holding onto their money because they have lost confidence in the economy.

Maybe its high taxes, high health care, high price of food, cheap labor, "The Rent is too damn high," and w/e else people can think of.

I simply don't know so instead of blaming people, people should realize that we need to pay off our debts and we need to stop favoring big businesses and we need to stop delaying and start fixing.
edit on 8-9-2011 by jjf3rd77 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 12:44 PM
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reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


I am not debating socialist or comunist country, "we are after all a capitalitic country" but our capitalism has been hijacked to benefit only the few and they are not giving anything. This happens when an elite class take over the government that used to be by the people and for the people.

We used to have a great capitalistic system, I remember that our capitalistic system at one time put this nation on the top of the world, it created the middle class, the middle class supported the nations economy and was more that enough to support also the poor.

Nobody complained about the poor at that time, now we have deteriorated so much economically that our middle class is slowly turning into the working poor.

Yes, when our government has to borrow from the tax payer in order to "create jobs" that should be big a read flag of how bad, things are going in the nation". Very soon we will develop into a welfare state where we the citizens will be working to pay for government assistance, because most of the growing working poor class still needs some kind of governemnt assitance.

I will be honest with you, even I am getting scare of the way our nation is heading

edit on 8-9-2011 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)

edit on 8-9-2011 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 01:52 PM
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reply to post by marg6043
 


I think part of the problem is that the working/middle class is stuck in the past. They are still interested in finding factory type jobs that they can do but factory jobs are slowly disappearing as certain countries become a factory themselves (CHINA).

Where as in reality a lot of these jobs are being taken over by computers and computer systems. We NEED to invest in Technology. Not roads and bridges!!!! Technology will be around for much longer than those roads and bridges. I think it would be better to train these people in computers so they can use their knowledge for something instead of drilling holes in dirt. and reinforcing roads. And hence, technology will build roads and bridges for us in the future!



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 02:48 PM
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Originally posted by jjf3rd77We NEED to invest in Technology. Not roads and bridges!!!! Technology will be around for much longer than those roads and bridges.


You can't outsource construction jobs. You can damn sure outsource non-service/repair technology jobs. Where was your TV made? Your iPod? Your computer? Your watch? Your cell phone?

You'll likely also be singing a different tune about infrastructure spending in 10-20 years when the power grid can't support the demand and shipping gets exponentially higher because roads aren't properly maintained.



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 02:50 PM
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reply to post by CranialSponge
 


Didn't we just raise the maximum debt limit and voila, more borrowing. Ridiculous and outrageous.

US Bankruptcy coming to a theatre near you.



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 02:59 PM
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The $300 billion is about right to start the economy going.

First is the infrastructure. Improve the infrastructure TODAY, with current tech and not fantasy tech, with american workers and not foreign slaves or illegals, much of that money will circulate from the infrastructure companies to their workers, and then to others such as food, water, homes, schools, transportations,etc...issues that every human on Earth STILL NEEDS.

Those funds wont be spent on trinkets anymore for sure. One financial crisis is enough for the american worker.

Manufacturing can and MUST exist still. Mankind still has needs and so long as manufacturers FOCUS on such needs, using current tech as a productivity and QUALITY tool, it will ensure american products will be well received worldwide. Farmers and miners must raise their tech and management of resources level higher. The returns will be better wages for all, so long as bosses REMEMBERS to share wealth and never be greedily selfish again.

Schools to improve young minds, not necessarily only upon economics or training of the slave labourer. With IMPROVED minds, youths will improve further upon taught knowledge, expanding it further as previous generations had done to get us where we are today, and to take us further into a better and advance progressive future.

The focus now for the next 3 years is SELL, SELL and SELL. Only through selling will revenues flow in to reduce debt. No more AID, RESEARCH, SPEND. There will be times for such, BUT NOT NOW.

China is not to be feared, for despite its manufacturing ability, they had only be capable of churning useless shoddy junks and toxic foodstuff. Their credibility is gone, so much that even their own people would rather buy foreign than local. As long as USA keeps up on its quality and stringent and reputed safety measures, with an open and transparent corporate culture, it will remain on top as it had always been.

Banks and corporations have NOTHING to fear, because ultimately, money circulates in the economy and will return into their hands. Only this time may they be responsible and let it circulate back again to the masses. One crisis is enough.

Failed banks are signs and symptoms of mismanagement, best let them toppled, assets liquidated, lenders freed, and from such burnings, the phoenix of more responsible and restructured form of banking 'by the People, for the People' arise.

America, a world leading and role model land ruled 'by the People, for the People', is on the threshold of gaining greatness and acendency. May both political parties understand where they stand today in time. Delay, disrupt or destroy this stimulus and it will not only be the end of USA, but the world as well.



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 03:04 PM
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Originally posted by Eurisko2012

Originally posted by links234
reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


You should realize that the government is not a business and shouldn't be run like one. also, the government doesn't borrow as much money from foreign countries as it does from its own citizens. Who owns $9 trillion of the governments debt? The American public.

Foreigners own $4 trillion of our debt, China alone, owns roughly $1 trillion. Remember, we have a total of $14 trillion in debt.

The mainstream GOP plan is to cut everything with the exception of the DoD from the federal budget. Debate over a $12 million program could last three days whereas ending a multi-trillion dollar war is just a side note.


OOPS! You left out the other half of the truth.
In addition to - reducing - the size of the U.S. government, the GOP thinks it might be a
great idea to let the - private sector - grow and reduce the unemployment rate to 4%.
That will send a tidal wave of payroll taxes into Washington D.C.
---------
Step 1: Remove the wet blanket Obama put on Free Market Capitalism.
Step 2: Repeal ObamaCare to remove - uncertainty
American corporations think 10 years ahead not 10 minutes ahead.

----------
Once we get the socialist out of the White House and replace him with a capitalist
this nation will take off.


OOPS! You're wrong about everything again.

The GOP doesn't give a rat's behind about unemployment in this country. If they did, these big businesses wouldn't have been shipping jobs overseas as fast as possible for the last three decades, and that includes under your precious Reagan. This is a fairy tale the ultra-rich in this country have sold the simple and uninformed in order to maintain their stranglehold on the middle class and the poor.

Obama governs to the right of GWB. Wet blanket....hilarious. He's done nothing but expand on Bush-era corporate welfare since he got elected. If American big business can't hire people and boost the market with the trillions in free money he's thrown at them, well, it's game over. You should really quit refreshing the Ayn Rand Wikipedia page and join reality.

The fact is that all these 'lost' jobs are just that....lost. All that manufacturing, blue-collar stuff that built this country is long gone. What's left in the US are companies that are forced to streamline and cut because the economy sucks. You think that, once they figure out how to do the same job with half the employees that they're just going to go back to the old ways once the economy comes back and take that cut in profits just out of altruism? That wouldn't be very capitalist, now would it? Those jobs are GONE. Unless some new, incredible invention/movement ala the tech revolution comes out along with a sudden ability for the US labor market to compete with emerging markets in Asia, we're going to be screwed for a very, very, very long time to come.

You guys can sit an bicker about stupid corporatist puppet politicians (and they ALL are, right, left, and center) and who has the best job 'plan,' but in reality no 'plan' other than strict isolationism and the very painful immediate after-effects are going to 'fix' this for America. Tariffs aren't going to do it, trade agreements aren't going to do it, and tax cuts/hikes aren't going to do it. You all are complaining about deck chair arrangement and the background music on the Titanic. America as we've known it for the last 75 years is over. This is how the ends of empires look.

As far as Obamacare.....the only 'uncertainty' is how much big business, big pharma, and the rest of the health care industry is going to make off the backs of working class people this time. That bill was designed and written by the industry lobbyists that created the mess in the first place. You can, again, continue your disgusting tirade against providing affordable health care while not allowing hospitals to charge $5000 for a band-aid (which, in your cloud of misinformation is what you think the bill does when, in reality, it's nothing more than a thinly veiled corporate give-away), but you're complaining about a system that necessitated legislation to keep it in check precisely because we let something as fundamental as basic health care become a for-profit, capitalist driven endeavor. We can't have a reasonable debate about ANYTHING in this country anymore because nobody can be arsed to move beyond what Hannity or Olbermann told them. Unbelievable.
edit on 8-9-2011 by samcrow because: (no reason given)




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