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I Am a Straight, Married Christian Male in Support of Gay Marriage

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posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 01:47 PM
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Originally posted by sdcigarpig
So the question you should be asking yourself, are you keeping up with all 613 laws in the bible?


No. I answered this already earlier. I repeat--I follow those laws that I can understand myself. My philosophy is, if God wanted me to follow the law, he would have granted me the wisdom to understand it. Wherever I'm blessed to understand, there I usually follow. But, even then, sometimes I disobey. But, what I won't do is redefine his definition of "evil" to be my "good". I simply say, I'm doing evil today, even though I know better, because that's my freedom, and I feel like it right now. I'm not going to try to get everybody around me to accept my behavior and to call it "good", against their own better judgment, especially when they and I happen to be referring to the same book for guidance; that would just be confusion. I hope my position is clear. That's the best I can expound on it.





The facts are we are a nation of laws,


ALL LAWS DISCRIMINATE.

Why do we need any law at all?

Every law on the books is designed to take away the rights from people who naturally have them and grant those rights to someone else who doesn't naturally have those same rights.

By the very nature of a law, somebody's inherent freedom is removed, and transferred by the state to somebody else to enjoy.

To say you're a nation of laws, is simply to say you're a nation of unjust discriminators.



have no room to allow for religious bias to enter into the determining of the governing of the country,


as soon as you write a law, you have introduced a bias.

It might not be a religious bias, but then it would be an anti-religious bias.



lest we discriminate against one group all on the groups of supposed religious morality.


the only way to avoid discrimination is to remove all laws created by man. And let the natural laws, and the laws introduced by God in his design, function freely to determine the order of things.

Burn all the law books.

Free mankind from the tyranny of law.



Some would argue that we should keep old quaint institutions in place, like marriage between a male and female, yet slavery and prostitution is also a quaint old institution as well, and yet we have neither slavery or prostitution.


Both slavery and prostitution continue to exist. They are supported by the laws on the books.

Banning prostitution makes it a scarce commodity, and increases the profit margins in the profession, hence encouraging the desperate women to take the leap into the art to earn their way in the world.

If prostitution was legal, it would become more widespread, and over time the profit margins would drop until it was no longer done simply because there would be no financial incentive anymore. It would wipe itself out naturally.

Prostitutes can only exist in a restrictive environment.

And in regard to slavery, many people don't even realize they are slaves, because they take home a paycheck. But, that paycheck just barely covers the rent and food necessary to keep them selves alive in order to go back the next day to work for their master. The slaves of yesteryear were better off, because they didn't even have to worry about the rent! There was no rent increase for a classic slave. But the modern slaves get the noose around their neck being tightened every day.




To just cherry pick the religious laws of some old religious texts is nothing more than an insult and hypocrisy against that religion.


I agree with you 100%, we insult all sorts of peoples and groups when we "pick" what laws men should live by.

The only law we should make up ourselves is the "law that there should be no additional laws above nature".




edit on 18-9-2011 by DRAZIW because: spelling

edit on 18-9-2011 by DRAZIW because: spelling




posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 01:57 PM
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Originally posted by DRAZIWBut, what I won't do is redefine his definition of "evil" to be my "good". I simply say, I'm doing evil today, even though I know better, because that's my freedom, and I feel like it right now.


Your blasphemy is the same caliber of that which you're demonizing. You have no moral high-ground to claim. Give up.
edit on 18-9-2011 by Partisanity because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 02:36 PM
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Originally posted by Partisanity

Originally posted by DRAZIWBut, what I won't do is redefine his definition of "evil" to be my "good". I simply say, I'm doing evil today, even though I know better, because that's my freedom, and I feel like it right now.


Your blasphemy is the same caliber of that which you're demonizing. You have no moral high-ground to claim. Give up.
edit on 18-9-2011 by Partisanity because: (no reason given)


Who is claiming moral high ground? I'm just stating my position that clearly avoids "confusion".

Why would I call a demon an angel, or visa versa?

Why would a demon want the title of "angel" anyway?

That's what is so confusing.


The whole point of the demon is to be anti-angelic.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 05:34 PM
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Originally posted by DRAZIW
But, even then, sometimes I disobey. But, what I won't do is redefine his definition of "evil" to be my "good".


Then keep it at home and personal.

One who chooses faith laws - - should keep it to themselves. And not interfere with the rights of others who do not.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 06:11 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by DRAZIW
But, even then, sometimes I disobey. But, what I won't do is redefine his definition of "evil" to be my "good".


Then keep it at home and personal.

One who chooses faith laws - - should keep it to themselves. And not interfere with the rights of others who do not.



Why should we keep it to our-self? That's selfish. If we believe we have a truth, it's better to share that truth. Some may accept it, others may reject it, but at least they get to choose. If everybody kept silent, everyone would be ignorant, since no views nor opinions would be recorded for the descendant of man to chew on.

Let your light shine so others who see it may have their uncertain path lit up for them.

The others who follow a different light, won't bother with your light anyway. Still, as long as people are hanging their lanterns out there, for others to see, I'll hang mine as well.

Let's all throw our ideas into the pot, may the best truth win.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 06:45 PM
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Originally posted by DRAZIW

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by DRAZIW
But, even then, sometimes I disobey. But, what I won't do is redefine his definition of "evil" to be my "good".


Then keep it at home and personal.

One who chooses faith laws - - should keep it to themselves. And not interfere with the rights of others who do not.



Why should we keep it to our-self? That's selfish. If we believe we have a truth, it's better to share that truth. Some may accept it, others may reject it, but at least they get to choose. If everybody kept silent, everyone would be ignorant, since no views nor opinions would be recorded for the descendant of man to chew on.

Let your light shine so others who see it may have their uncertain path lit up for them.



Not when it infringes on others who do not share your belief.

Letting your light shine does not involve critical judgment resulting in prejudice of a minority.

I was raised Christian - - I know the whole dogma - - "share the wealth" mentality. It has limits - - or should.

Denying gays equal rights is one of those limits that should not be crossed. Their rights affect no one - - but themselves.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 07:09 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Not when it infringes on others who do not share your belief.

Letting your light shine does not involve critical judgment resulting in prejudice of a minority.

I was raised Christian - - I know the whole dogma - - "share the wealth" mentality. It has limits - - or should.

Denying gays equal rights is one of those limits that should not be crossed. Their rights affect no one - - but themselves.



This is simply not true !

NO MAN IS AN ISLAND !

The environment we live in is pervaded by ideas. Those ideas determine the attitude and conduct of and towards every expression of human action. The attitudes of others affect how we think and feel about our own actions. It determines whether we feel shame and guilt, or we feel blessed or cursed.

All of these positive and negative emotive responses we have define our world and occur in the atmosphere of ideas about right and wrong.

We do not speak language with our self.

Our mouth does not vocalize sound for our own ear.

We do not live in a vacuum of our own desires.

Even what we think we desire comes from many subliminal and overt influences emergent from the society we live in.

The question therefore becomes, "What kind of society would I like to live in?"

If I don't speak up for the type of world I like, who will do it for me?

If I see something wrong, should I not speak my mind?

Other people are speaking their mind. They seem to feel that something is wrong with the straight world.

Maybe it is, but I haven't yet seen the evidence. As far as I can see, it's a "rebel" belief system that is being arbitrarily imposed on the society. But, after the rebels have won, what will they rebel against then? After all is accepted as good. What will be called "bad" ? After all actions are become "shameless", who will feel "shame"? None.

Is that the goal? To destroy one side of the whole world of opposites? To make everything equal and the same?

The next "rebel" plan is to make man equal to the animal. For all life is precious. And no life is worth more than any other life. Once we accept the equality of man and beast, the next step is to accept marriage between these equals. And so it goes...until the divergences have become convergent, not by natural order, but by civil law.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 07:11 PM
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O.K

see first line



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:17 PM
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Originally posted by DRAZIW

Originally posted by sdcigarpig
So the question you should be asking yourself, are you keeping up with all 613 laws in the bible?


No. I answered this already earlier. I repeat--I follow those laws that I can understand myself. My philosophy is, if God wanted me to follow the law, he would have granted me the wisdom to understand it. Wherever I'm blessed to understand, there I usually follow. But, even then, sometimes I disobey. But, what I won't do is redefine his definition of "evil" to be my "good". I simply say, I'm doing evil today, even though I know better, because that's my freedom, and I feel like it right now. I'm not going to try to get everybody around me to accept my behavior and to call it "good", against their own better judgment, especially when they and I happen to be referring to the same book for guidance; that would just be confusion. I hope my position is clear. That's the best I can expound on it.




edit on 18-9-2011 by DRAZIW because: spelling

edit on 18-9-2011 by DRAZIW because: spelling


DING DING DING WE HAVE A WINNER!
Guess what? You know why I dont find homosexuality a sin? Because I dont understand why it should be. . I highly doubt you can argue this without sounding like a hypocrite. End of conversation



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:21 PM
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Originally posted by DRAZIW


Maybe it is, but I haven't yet seen the evidence. As far as I can see, it's a "rebel" belief system that is being arbitrarily imposed on the society. But, after the rebels have won, what will they rebel against then? After all is accepted as good. What will be called "bad" ? After all actions are become "shameless", who will feel "shame"? None.

Is that the goal? To destroy one side of the whole world of opposites? To make everything equal and the same?

The next "rebel" plan is to make man equal to the animal. For all life is precious. And no life is worth more than any other life. Once we accept the equality of man and beast, the next step is to accept marriage between these equals. And so it goes...until the divergences have become convergent, not by natural order, but by civil law.






Guess what? I dont know about you, but i just cant see how a 15 year old boy who has feelings for other 15 year old boys but is too scared to show it and sees hate for what he feels all around him and ends up hanging himself is "Rebelling" Or the man who is 42 and has been having under the table affairs with other men because he is too scared to come out, and can't now that he has a wife and kid is "Rebelling."

And for you to suggest that as soon as the 15 year old boy sets the rope down and says enough is enough and comes out, that he is "Rebelling" is arrogant, Ignorant, and plain old bigotry.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:27 PM
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Originally posted by DRAZIW
NO MAN IS AN ISLAND !


That is so cliche'

Being 65 - - - I am more then aware of society control.

Thankfully - - we are progressing past that.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:32 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by DRAZIW
NO MAN IS AN ISLAND !


That is so cliche'

Being 65 - - - I am more then aware of society control.

Thankfully - - we are progressing past that.

:O a 65 year old in support of gay rights? *dies of shock*



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:42 PM
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reply to post by DRAZIW
 


Right now, this minute, there are thousands of gays living together, watching TV, eating dinner, playing with their kids, working in the yard, making love. You have yet to explain how this is affecting you directly, or adversely affecting society as a whole. All I can get from you is that "God doesn't like it".

/TOA



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:48 PM
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Originally posted by The Old American
reply to post by DRAZIW
 


Right now, this minute, there are thousands of gays living together, watching TV, eating dinner, playing with their kids, working in the yard, making love. You have yet to explain how this is affecting you directly, or adversely affecting society as a whole. All I can get from you is that "God doesn't like it".

/TOA


www.polyp.org.uk...

This can sum this up I think...



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:49 PM
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Originally posted by The Old American
Right now, this minute, there are thousands of gays living together, watching TV, eating dinner, playing with their kids, working in the yard, making love.


Yes there is. And the State needs to BTFO of personal affairs and start getting the economy put back together, you know where it's focus SHOULD be...



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:49 PM
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Originally posted by spw184

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by DRAZIW
NO MAN IS AN ISLAND !


That is so cliche'

Being 65 - - - I am more then aware of society control.

Thankfully - - we are progressing past that.

:O a 65 year old in support of gay rights? *dies of shock*


I've never been a "crowd" follower.

Always been an independent thinker - - - even during times I wished I was a sheep It would be so much easier.

Integrity and human rights always wins over its easier to be a sheep.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 08:53 PM
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reply to post by rschmfem
 


BTFO? whats that lol



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 09:20 PM
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Originally posted by spw184
reply to post by rschmfem
 


BTFO? whats that lol


Back the [expletive deleted] out, or off. And I agree 100%. The government, and people in general, need to get out of other people's bedrooms, and homes altogether.

/TOA



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 09:32 PM
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reply to post by The Old American
 


Goverment should not have anypart in my sexual relations.



posted on Sep, 18 2011 @ 09:35 PM
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Originally posted by spw184
reply to post by The Old American
 


Goverment should not have anypart in my sexual relations.



But that is not really the point.

The point is Equal Rights.



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