X2 flare. Earth directed

reply to post by TiM3LoRd


The scientists' theory is in the article. I have my doubts about it's validity but if it leads to the ability to predict earthquakes, great.

I don't know about "earthquake lights" changing the color of the sky but that's not the sort of thing the article is about.

reply to post by Phage


does this mean we have a chance of seeing the northern lights, if so when might we expect them...ty

Here's a link that might be of interest ...
pesn.com...

Very interesting thread.
Hi phage I trust all is well, long time no chat...(if you remember we have exchanged previously)

Here some FOOD FOR THOUGHT regarding the effects of solar activity (CME's) and earth which may nudge your opinion as to whether or not there is actually a correlation.

Pleas read the following articles defining the FACT that the sun ejects magnetic elements and the Earth, as you are aware, has a magnetic core and magnetic and electrically charged particles in the Atmosphere/Ionosphere.

I believe the earth is certainly impacted/influenced in terms of Electromagnetic and gravitational physics:

Source From the NASA Website:

"CMEs, travel through space -- sometimes toward Earth where they can damage satellites. Now NASA researchers have made use of old mathematical techniques and new insights on how CMEs travel to devise a fresh way to measure this magnetic environment in the sun's upper atmosphere, the corona."

"The magnetic field is the skeleton of the entire heliosphere, guiding how particles and CMEs move toward Earth," says solar physicist Nat Gopalswamy of NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Md. He says researchers routinely measure the fields near the sun's surface, but haven't been able to do as well further out in the sun's atmosphere. "Before, we've only been able to measure it in the upper corona with a technique that required exact conditions. Our new method can be used more consistently."

And further down the same page: (it's worth reading the whole page too)

This research was supported by NASA's Living With A Star Program, which provides missions to improve our understanding of how and why the Sun varies, how the Earth and Solar System respond, and how the variability and response affects humanity in Space and on Earth.


And relating to Earth: source: Nationalgeographic.com

"Rapid changes in the churning movement of Earth's liquid outer core are weakening the magnetic field in some regions of the planet's surface, a new study says."

"What is so surprising is that rapid, almost sudden, changes take place in the Earth's magnetic field," said study co-author Nils Olsen, a geophysicist at the Danish National Space Center in Copenhagen.
The findings suggest similarly quick changes are simultaneously occurring in the liquid metal, 1,900 miles (3,000 kilometers) below the surface, he said.

"The swirling flow of molten iron and nickel around Earth's solid center triggers an electrical current, which generates the planet's magnetic field."
The study, published recently in Nature Geoscience, modeled Earth's magnetic field using nine years of highly accurate satellite data.

Flip-Flop

"Fluctuations in the magnetic field have occurred in several far-flung regions of Earth, the researchers found.

In 2003 scientists found pronounced changes in the magnetic field in the Australasian region. In 2004, however, the changes were focused on Southern Africa.

The changes "may suggest the possibility of an upcoming reversal of the geomagnetic field," said study co-author Mioara Mandea, a scientist at the German Research Center for Geosciences in Potsdam.

"Earth's magnetic field has reversed hundreds of times over the past billion years, and the process could take thousands of years to complete."

FACT:

The above speaks for itself clearly indicating the both the Sun and Earth obviously "interact" at some level within the gravitational/magnetic environments thus, I believe it's highly possible that CME's eject so much magnetic and kinetic energy which must have an effect on the Earth's core and crust including other magnetic and gravitational elements!
It may not cause the pole to flip (if not strong enough) but definitely could cause movements of the tectonic plates and excite volcanic activity and effect weather patterns and oceanic movements......

Just a thought...

Originally posted by Blaine91555
reply to post by Phage

 

Grasping at straws to find a correlation it seems. ...and yet it does seem to be of more than a passing interest. I am frankly surprised to find this much. I see two others but I'd have to purchase them and my interest does not stretch that far.

well your contributions so far are appreciated.

Originally posted by KevinB
The goes x-ray readout is worrying me a bit, I don't know how to imbed the image but there has been a period of very low activity following this flare which leads me to believe a 3rd large flare may be coming today. Anyone else think so?

Guess I was right, X1.8 being reported right now. Beginners luck

reply to post by KevinB


Yeah it was about 2 hours ago. Me and someone else posted here about it, but it got no attention. Weird...

reply to post by iamhobo


Yea I noticed that, I was in class. My concern is the effect of 3 consecutive flares, but I'm not too worried. Now if the sun launches a X15-20 behind all of these in the next day it could sweep up the 3 smaller ones and form a giant wave of plasma, and that could get ugly, but chances are slim to none

CME's ? Earthquakes?

Sure it sounds cute to link the two together but the data does not support it ... Scientists would have a hayday if they could find any links . It would be a great discovery espically for earthquake prevention no?








This is just a small graph to illustrate the lack of correlation

astroblogger.blogspot.com...



You wanna know what causes earthquakes?


its...


its...


What really causes EARTHQUAKES .

reply to post by manalien

The above speaks for itself clearly indicating the both the Sun and Earth obviously "interact" at some level within the gravitational/magnetic environments

This is part of the problem. You have taken two separate phenomena, and because they have something in common (magnetism, I'm not sure where gravity comes into the discussion), come to a conclusion that one must influence the other. Neither article suggests that. The article about the changes in Earth's magnetic field actual says the opposite. Because the Earth's magnetic field is produced by the movement of the outer core it is affected by changes in that movement not vice versa.

"Rapid changes in the churning movement of Earth's liquid outer core are weakening the magnetic field in some regions of the planet's surface, a new study says."

news.nationalgeographic.com...

The magnetic fields carried by CMEs are not powerful. They are large but that magnet on your refrigerator is much more powerful. The same is true of the Earth's magnetic field. It just isn't strong enough to move much of anything except the needle of a compass (which itself probably has a field stronger than that of the Earth) and very small particles. During a geomagnetic storm we don't see pieces of iron moving around. Except during very strong storms even compasses are not perceptibly affected by the fluctuations of the magnetic field, it takes sensitive instruments to detect them.
en.wikipedia.org...

There's another problem though, since the outer core of the Earth is molten it is far above the curie point of iron and nickel. Not only is the magnetic field of a CME too weak to affect it, it is not magnetic at all. It would be unaffected by magnetism.

Thirdly, seismic activity does not originate in the outer core. It originates, at its deepest, in the mid portions of the mantle. So even if solar activity could influence the liquid outer core it is difficult to explain how that would lead to more seismic activity.

Originally posted by karen61057

Originally posted by Blaine91555
reply to post by Phage

 

Grasping at straws to find a correlation it seems. ...and yet it does seem to be of more than a passing interest. I am frankly surprised to find this much. I see two others but I'd have to purchase them and my interest does not stretch that far.

well your contributions so far are appreciated.

Please don't take that the wrong way. I've enjoyed this thread a great deal and learned something in the process. I do see now why the interest is there and freely admit I have no idea if this is a valid idea. The argument against it is stronger though.

If I were a little richer at the moment I'd likely buy the papers that go with the abstracts out of curiosity, but software upgrades are heavy on my wallet right now. I'll watch this topic now for more info. Thanks.

It would appear I have had to say this quite often lately on various threads to various people, so once again...

Stick to the topic and not each other, please.

After all, if you attack the person you tend to lose sight of the argument at hand and your other comments look ridiculous in comparison.

Originally posted by KevinB
Bear with my unintelligence in geology as I only have taken 1 college course on it, but follow me for this intellectual journey.

The solar flares affect the earths magnetic field. What makes the magnetic field?
Well we believe it is the fluid core dynamics at the center of the planet.

What sits atop said fluid core, and dense mantle?
The crust.

What causes earthquakes?
Pieces of the crust moving, sliding, colliding, and subducting

So is is POSSIBLE that the affect of solar flares on the magnetic field of the earth cause a slight change in the dynamics of the core due to it being made of Metals, which could cause stress on the mantle and them movement of the crust?

I would argue yes, it could. Also the impact on the magnetic field causes the field to weaken allowing more cosmic rays to hit the planet, these rays MIGHT have an effect on the plates given the extreme speed at which they travel.

My point here is that there may be many ways in which the sun could affect earthquakes, and just like the cosmic ray theory, we do not yet fully understand the processes involved between the sun and the earth. Also if the USGS is so good, why can't we predict earthquakes. I've always believed that if you can't predict the future outcomes of a subject, you do not fully understand it. And since last time I checked we can't predict earthquakes with any sort of accuracy, I think its safe to say that anything is possible as for what affects earthquakes and it is incredibly shallow minded to think that it is impossible, many things were thought to be impossible that are now accepted fact today, maybe improbable is a better word

edit on 7-9-2011 by KevinB because: (no reason given)

When I was reading this thread on my phone last night I had pretty much the exact same thoughts; stay outta my head - starred.

If solar flares & CMES affect the magnosphere could that not have an affect on the earths magnetic metalic inner core, in turn having a slight "tidal" affect on the molton outercore which could push up & down the mantle & crust in the areas the flare strikes. As magnetic energys push & pull towards or away from each other depending if positively or negatively charged. Its all hearsay really & I haven't been near a school in 12 years but that does seem plausible to me at least

reply to post by MamaJ


I think the article is exaggerating slightly.

A worse case scenario if you will.

Fortunately people aren't sitting on their hands and doing nothing, year by year we're becoming better prepared.

Why do you think we have all those satellites watching the suns every move?

It's not so nutjobs can find UFO's that's for sure!

Originally posted by Chadwickus
reply to post by MamaJ

 

I think the article is exaggerating slightly.

A worse case scenario if you will.

Fortunately people aren't sitting on their hands and doing nothing, year by year we're becoming better prepared.

Why do you think we have all those satellites watching the suns every move?

It's not so nutjobs can find UFO's that's for sure!

Ha! Yeah I totally agree and do understand why we keep a close eye on our Solar "System" because as we are well aware, change is inevitable. It makes sense to be aware of what the Sun is doing at all times especially when we have the capabilities of doing so.

With that change can come a worse case scenario which by the way is why I like the article because I am one who likes all possibilities thrown at me so I can be aware and not be totally surprised if I get caught up in a "worse case " situation. Why? Because it is possible.

Here is another link to a paper discussing the "electric currents streaming out of stressed igneous rocks –
A step towards understanding pre-earthquake low frequency EM emissions"

There are plenty of papers/theories floating around especially since the Japan Quake. It is as if they are trying harder to find links to predicting EQ's now more than ever. Lots of possibilities but still no smoking gun.

I enjoy reading and pondering the different scenarios. At the end of the day though....no one knows what influences an EQ.....all speculation.

These researchers have great minds in regards to the said subject and as they research and experiment they have yet to come up with that smoking gun. We (you and I and others) find our self on sites as this one...discussing their speculations.

You never know...we may just figure it all out on this thread.

Thanks for getting back with me!! xoxoxo

Jenn