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Space ethics

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posted on Sep, 6 2011 @ 05:30 PM
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Do humans have a moral duty to populate the universe? Or do we have a moral duty not to?




posted on Sep, 6 2011 @ 05:39 PM
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reply to post by s12345
 

Do we have moral duty to deforest massive areas and inhabit them?



posted on Sep, 6 2011 @ 06:06 PM
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You, sir,s12345, are an Alien, bent on infiltrating and subverting our world so that you can ENSLAVE US!

Proof:



You have started FIVE threads since hitting your post mark.
1. Spies and Immorality - In which you question the morality of intelligence-gathering. Tehcnically speaking, a National Geographic reporter/photographer team are spies, using their (and please note, I know the difference between 'there' and THEIR... re-read your post and please correct this.) skills to bring us intelligence on the wilder aspects of Earth. SO yes, there are good spies.

2. Knowledge and Power - In which you question the power of agencies utilizing spy networks. Technically, if you pick up a book on England and read it, you are gathering intelligence on that country. That, by some definition, would make you a spy. All knowledge can give you power, but the wisdom with which you WIELD that knowledge will yield you more or less power, depending. Spy networks are a way of concentrating specific intelligence.

3. The Intelligence Threat - In which you question the power and potential of intelligence gathering... again. Three posts all centered on the same thing. Intelligence gathering has no use unless a person or group utilizes it for a specific reason. The simple accumulation of data means nothing. Also, it is sometimes in the benefit of the people, the public, and the governments to install spies in certain places, such as work sites, to ensure that safety regulations are being followed. Spy networks are a tool. How a body of people USES that tool makes it good or bad.

4. Planet Ownership - In this post, you question whether a person will be able to own a planet in the future and, if so, how it would affect the population of that planet. The simple answer is: If multiple worlds were populated, those populations would be governed. Either by a village leader or a planet leader, possibly even a planetary alliance leader or government representing those people. The simple fact is, ALL authority is a manifestation of those governed. The people will always have the right and ability to cast off an unwanted body of government. Second, slavery isn't such a bad idea. It should never have been outlawed, but redefined. For a person to indenture themselves to another for a fee is reasonable. Let's say I wanted to move from one planet to the next. You can safely assume that the trip cost would be phenomenal. I should be allowed to indenture myself to the planet owner to get there. Be creative with that one. Slavery is involuntary servitude. Even if you are pressed into slavery, you can still volunteer not to be a slave.

5. Space Ethics - Asking if we, as humans, have the moral obligation to populate the heavens or the moral obligation not to. If we saw a reason for populating uninhabited worlds to be immoral, then we'd have the moral obligation not to populate that planet. If nothing were standing in our way, no ethical code violated, then we'd be able to choose without the burden of morality weighing in.

So, please kill three of your five threads as they can be summed up into two distinct threads. Then realize that you joined August 27'th, hit your minimum posts in a few short days, then created these five threads. An overview of the five questions together pose a bigger question than each of the five individually. Are you an alien researching Intelligence Gathering so that you can infiltrate us, become the proprietor of our planet and enslave us?



posted on Sep, 6 2011 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by Arrowmancer
You, sir,s12345, are an Alien, bent on infiltrating and subverting our world so that you can ENSLAVE US!

Proof:



You have started FIVE threads since hitting your post mark.
1. Spies and Immorality - In which you question the morality of intelligence-gathering. Tehcnically speaking, a National Geographic reporter/photographer team are spies, using their (and please note, I know the difference between 'there' and THEIR... re-read your post and please correct this.) skills to bring us intelligence on the wilder aspects of Earth. SO yes, there are good spies.

2. Knowledge and Power - In which you question the power of agencies utilizing spy networks. Technically, if you pick up a book on England and read it, you are gathering intelligence on that country. That, by some definition, would make you a spy. All knowledge can give you power, but the wisdom with which you WIELD that knowledge will yield you more or less power, depending. Spy networks are a way of concentrating specific intelligence.

3. The Intelligence Threat - In which you question the power and potential of intelligence gathering... again. Three posts all centered on the same thing. Intelligence gathering has no use unless a person or group utilizes it for a specific reason. The simple accumulation of data means nothing. Also, it is sometimes in the benefit of the people, the public, and the governments to install spies in certain places, such as work sites, to ensure that safety regulations are being followed. Spy networks are a tool. How a body of people USES that tool makes it good or bad.

4. Planet Ownership - In this post, you question whether a person will be able to own a planet in the future and, if so, how it would affect the population of that planet. The simple answer is: If multiple worlds were populated, those populations would be governed. Either by a village leader or a planet leader, possibly even a planetary alliance leader or government representing those people. The simple fact is, ALL authority is a manifestation of those governed. The people will always have the right and ability to cast off an unwanted body of government. Second, slavery isn't such a bad idea. It should never have been outlawed, but redefined. For a person to indenture themselves to another for a fee is reasonable. Let's say I wanted to move from one planet to the next. You can safely assume that the trip cost would be phenomenal. I should be allowed to indenture myself to the planet owner to get there. Be creative with that one. Slavery is involuntary servitude. Even if you are pressed into slavery, you can still volunteer not to be a slave.

5. Space Ethics - Asking if we, as humans, have the moral obligation to populate the heavens or the moral obligation not to. If we saw a reason for populating uninhabited worlds to be immoral, then we'd have the moral obligation not to populate that planet. If nothing were standing in our way, no ethical code violated, then we'd be able to choose without the burden of morality weighing in.

So, please kill three of your five threads as they can be summed up into two distinct threads. Then realize that you joined August 27'th, hit your minimum posts in a few short days, then created these five threads. An overview of the five questions together pose a bigger question than each of the five individually. Are you an alien researching Intelligence Gathering so that you can infiltrate us, become the proprietor of our planet and enslave us?


Arrowmancer, you really had me laughing throughout this read because I actually noticed the same thing for some reason. Good stuff.



posted on Sep, 6 2011 @ 08:13 PM
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Good thing reading this. People start to awaken more and more in these days. Great job on this one I gave you a star for this speech. The following is to the powers that be so no worry.


To TPTB, I realized even all the things you did bad or good, it was meant to be this way because it had to happen this way so not regret. Although the reign of lies is coming to an end and I am not so unhappy of it
.


Thruthseek3r



posted on Sep, 6 2011 @ 09:22 PM
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I personally know of no moral duty as regards continuation of our species. I do hope that one day we will be in constant close touch with whatever natural systems are already in place that maintaining a healthy balance with those natural systems is of a very, very high priority. In other words, we actively understand our own role in the ecology of the planet(s) or the pressures of spiritual evolution such that the very idea of destabilizing that ecology by irresponsibly under -or overpopulating is unthinkable.
As it is now, I feel badly for many young families. There are good reasons why one may not even want to bring even one more new human to be born. There are other reasons why bringing another person to this life may be a good move, not just a selfish act or a man who wants to continue his family line or a woman who wishes to respond to her biological/maternal clock. I certainly do not think for a second that any religion has some divine duty to compel conception. (Some religions may lay claim to such a divine duty, but in truth none actually exists, imho.)

It would be marvelous if, in general, people put at least this sort of contemplation into the consideration of certain actions. Some do, but not enough.



posted on Sep, 6 2011 @ 09:27 PM
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reply to post by s12345
 




It is a question only the MOST HIGHEST the CREATOR* can answer w/ accuracy. 1 doesn't feel the overall intent of them in which you speak to be universal malice. Most are humble beings with families following rules embedded in the 3d social environment they are experiencing there Life phases of life and death phases within existence. Yes some may not follow this over all..... SOME. Most have no access to the 3d universe that other universal inhabitants may have access too, due to them being more then 3d beings their access travels may have other influences then 3d universal spawning/ traveling. Now what they Humans were designed for (their true higher energy selves forms) is again a answer only the CREATOR can provide. Once fully matured or ripened these LIGHTS may be given responsibilities related to their old 3d universal home just as "OTHER" non human w/ CREATOR ENERGY AS WELL who went thru their phases of life and death within existence may have and will be given responsibilities within their old 3d universal environment DEPENDING ON THEIR INDIVIDUAL ENERGY OUTPUTS IN THEIR LIFE/DEATH PHASES OF EXISTENCE. (hell does have the variety of energies not just...... ) Makes a better neg energy home -visualize it- This 1 feels is WHY MANY ARE being tested by NATAS to ensure his THE MOST HIGHEST ENERGIES ARE progressing well in ALL their spiritual development YOU TOO. SEE THE CONNECTION FAMILY? So my friend again ONLY the CREATOR of this lil universe can give you the proper data for this request.

NAMASTE*******

LOVE LIGHT ETERNIA


edit on 9/6/11 by Ophiuchus 13 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 05:40 AM
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If you notice in the post you mentioned I said,
"Is there then any such thing as a good spy?"
I did not say, "Their a good spy."
I''m afraid you need to read more carefully.

Your comments upon intelligence gathering I used the term intelligence agency as a short hand way so as not to mention all intelligence agencies which I do not know the names of anyway.I also do not think individuals gathering intelligence are a threat. I believe the threat comes in some agencies power to put it all together. I hope my endeavor to clarify my point has succeeded.



posted on Sep, 7 2011 @ 06:09 AM
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I have already covered your lack of understanding of the english language so I will proceed.
1.( Don't you just hate when people number things to give a sense that they know what they're talking about. As however this is a reply I will follow the convention of the post to which I am replying .) If however there is a big difference between a reporter gathering information for public disclosure and a spy gathering it and hiding it.
2.Are you really saying that any intelligence network will automatically on gaining enough intelligence again enlightenment and wisdom and only have wishes to help humanity? I think this is a poor argument.
3Are you really saying intelligence agencies have no way to use their data: no statistician or analysts to make sense of it.
4.Your point of view that anyone can overthrow slavery, is perhaps forgetting how long it took the Jews to overthrow their status as slaves: they were the Ancient Egyptians slaves. Perhaps the fact that they were still being persecuted as late as world war 2.
5.My point is, is a planet with intelligent life more valuable than one without. If so are we obliged to spread it through out the galaxy?
Also your point that these threads should be shut down: should all threads on grey aliens be shut down, or all threads on new world order. Also as these threads all have posts from other people it would be arrogant and impolite to do so.
edit on 7-9-2011 by s12345 because: expand point



posted on Sep, 8 2011 @ 02:10 PM
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Originally posted by s12345
I have already covered your lack of understanding of the english language so I will proceed.

Sigh, why turn this into a mud slinging contest? I was simply saving my efforts and your time by replying to all of your posts at once. One of the great things about ATS is that a bunch of different ideas can all come together in a single thread and be looked at a as a whole. As for my lack of understanding of the English language, I offer you a few bits of advice, just as a friend. These are from YOUR posts.

Does spying and it's completely immorality create more immorality back at those they are working for?
and

If they work for another power there job is to do you harm.
'There...' That's was just a momentary look at your posts. Again, it wasn't meant to be unfriendly, but I, and others like me, take our language seriously enough that we will attempt to help people express their ideas more clearly through the use of proper grammar.


1.( Don't you just hate when people number things to give a sense that they know what they're talking about. As however this is a reply I will follow the convention of the post to which I am replying .) If however there is a big difference between a reporter gathering information for public disclosure and a spy gathering it and hiding it.
The numbering is simply a way of simplifying my response so that it can be understood with greater clarity. Separating my ideas with numbers or bullets is an effective way of showing the gap between thoughts. And a spy doesn't hide the intelligence he or she gathers. The spy is paid to gather information and to reveal it to someone. What good is a spy that keeps the information they acquire and does not use it?



2.Are you really saying that any intelligence network will automatically on gaining enough intelligence again enlightenment and wisdom and only have wishes to help humanity? I think this is a poor argument.
Of course not. That would be far too idealistic for this site. I'm saying that intelligence gathering can be used for the common good. If the end result is to help, then the spying might be a good thing. Let's say the FBI. installs a spy in a crime syndicate to investigate murder or other illegal activities. The intelligence gathered then leads to conviction and arrest of a mobster through proof of wrongdoing, information acquired by that spy. I would argue that the wisdom in which the FBI wielded their information garnered them more power in the legal system as opposed to an idiot who didn't know how to use it.



3Are you really saying intelligence agencies have no way to use their data: no statistician or analysts to make sense of it.

How would you arrive at that from my response?


4.Your point of view that anyone can overthrow slavery, is perhaps forgetting how long it took the Jews to overthrow their status as slaves: they were the Ancient Egyptians slaves. Perhaps the fact that they were still being persecuted as late as world war 2.
And are still being persecuted today. Keep in mind that persecution is not slavery. The key phrase from your first sentence in this point is 'how long it took'. It could have taken a month or several hundred years. The point is, that the shackles of slavery can be thrown off, without exception. Sometimes the price for that is death, but there is freedom in that, too. A person cannot be given freedom, or it would have no value. A person must earn it and maintain it.


5.My point is, is a planet with intelligent life more valuable than one without. If so are we obliged to spread it through out the galaxy?
Also your point that these threads should be shut down: should all threads on grey aliens be shut down, or all threads on new world order. Also as these threads all have posts from other people it would be arrogant and impolite to do so.
My answer to your question, here, would be 'no'. There is no obligation in the general sense. Our obligation is to the race of man. If the continued survival of our race depended on populating an uninhabited planet (which it will at some point), then we are obligated to do so. If populating another planet requires the annihilation of an indigenous life form, then we are morally obligated to withhold.

As far as asking you to delete your other threads... Fifty posts on grays from fifty different authors give us fifty different viewpoints. Three posts asking the same thing three different ways from the same person is a waste of ATS resources and no one will take you seriously. It's not enough to be informative. You must be concise and respect the resources of the site and it's users. It's your responsibility to save space. If you can combine three threads into one, then you should do so, out of respect for the users here.



posted on Sep, 12 2011 @ 11:47 AM
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If intelligent life is precious then the wanting to put more on other worlds would surely be a good thing so long as it did not harm other intelligent life or their evolution.



posted on Sep, 12 2011 @ 12:39 PM
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Originally posted by s12345
Do humans have a moral duty to populate the universe? Or do we have a moral duty not to?


As a species, we do have a moral duty to ourselves to populate the Universe. Even if this poses a potential threat to other life forms out there.

The Earth has had some well documented mass extinctions. There are too many variables in play to keep all of our eggs in one basket, so to speak.

Will we end up mining, polluting or otherwise defacing other planets, moons and asteroids by doing so? Absolutely. But it is a necessary evil.




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