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Keep your pearls . . .

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posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 09:14 AM
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QUESTION:

My grandfather is a mason. He is 85 yrs old and has been a mason since his thirties (I think). He never wants to talk about it though. I can't tell if he is embarrassed, ashamed, or just cannot tell me what he is really involved with. He is a great man. His entire life he has been the life of the party, the most popular person on the room, the one who anyone (whether you knew him or not) would gravitate to. Why not share his knowledge of the masons with me? It's obviously had a great affect on him.




posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 09:36 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
QUESTION:

My grandfather is a mason. He is 85 yrs old and has been a mason since his thirties (I think). He never wants to talk about it though. I can't tell if he is embarrassed, ashamed, or just cannot tell me what he is really involved with. He is a great man. His entire life he has been the life of the party, the most popular person on the room, the one who anyone (whether you knew him or not) would gravitate to. Why not share his knowledge of the masons with me? It's obviously had a great affect on him.


I would imagine If you showed a strong enough interest, he would help you to find the information you seek. The thing about Masons is they won't tell you anything unless you ask. They have a saying, 2B1 Ask1. Are you of age to join?

BTW that's sweet avatar. I love that movie.



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 10:00 AM
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Originally posted by The Axeman

Originally posted by mpeake
QUESTION:

My grandfather is a mason. He is 85 yrs old and has been a mason since his thirties (I think). He never wants to talk about it though. I can't tell if he is embarrassed, ashamed, or just cannot tell me what he is really involved with. He is a great man. His entire life he has been the life of the party, the most popular person on the room, the one who anyone (whether you knew him or not) would gravitate to. Why not share his knowledge of the masons with me? It's obviously had a great affect on him.


I would imagine If you showed a strong enough interest, he would help you to find the information you seek. The thing about Masons is they won't tell you anything unless you ask. They have a saying, 2B1 Ask1. Are you of age to join?

BTW that's sweet avatar. I love that movie.


I've asked but haven't been pushy. I'm 26 and haven't asked him since I was around 17 or 18. perhaps he'll be more inclined to talk about it now that I'm a bit more mature. We'll see...

Oh, ya! Boondock Saints is my favorite movie!!!



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 10:06 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
I've asked but haven't been pushy. I'm 26 and haven't asked him since I was around 17 or 18. perhaps he'll be more inclined to talk about it now that I'm a bit more mature. We'll see...

Oh, ya! Boondock Saints is my favorite movie!!!



Yes, I would imagine if you asked him now he would point you in the right direction. Are you considering joining or are you just trying to learn someting about them? If you are merely looking for information, this forum has an extraordinary amount of information if you just look around. Additionally, the Masons here on this board are good guys, I'm sure they will answer any of your questions to the best of their ability.



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 10:12 AM
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Originally posted by The Axeman

Originally posted by mpeake
I've asked but haven't been pushy. I'm 26 and haven't asked him since I was around 17 or 18. perhaps he'll be more inclined to talk about it now that I'm a bit more mature. We'll see...

Oh, ya! Boondock Saints is my favorite movie!!!



Yes, I would imagine if you asked him now he would point you in the right direction. Are you considering joining or are you just trying to learn someting about them? If you are merely looking for information, this forum has an extraordinary amount of information if you just look around. Additionally, the Masons here on this board are good guys, I'm sure they will answer any of your questions to the best of their ability.


I'm not necessarily looking to join. Just to get some info from a live person. He's the only mason I personally know. From what I gather, the mason's don't have alot of "youngblood" in them and I don't think I'd fit in too well with them. I still have a few oats to sew



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 10:22 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
I'm not necessarily looking to join. Just to get some info from a live person. He's the only mason I personally know. From what I gather, the mason's don't have alot of "youngblood" in them and I don't think I'd fit in too well with them. I still have a few oats to sew



That is a very common misconception. Not all Masons are old gummers, there are lots of younger men who are Masons. Just ask around. If you really are interested, you could contact your local lodge. Alot of times they will have open houses and whatnot, where you can go and meet some of the members and get a feel for the group. Chances are they will be very welcoming and forthcoming, as long as you are honest about your intentions.



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 10:26 AM
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Originally posted by The Axeman

Originally posted by mpeake
I'm not necessarily looking to join. Just to get some info from a live person. He's the only mason I personally know. From what I gather, the mason's don't have alot of "youngblood" in them and I don't think I'd fit in too well with them. I still have a few oats to sew



That is a very common misconception. Not all Masons are old gummers, there are lots of younger men who are Masons. Just ask around. If you really are interested, you could contact your local lodge. Alot of times they will have open houses and whatnot, where you can go and meet some of the members and get a feel for the group. Chances are they will be very welcoming and forthcoming, as long as you are honest about your intentions.


Ok, I am gonna assume (I know, I know...I shouldn't assume anything
) that you are a mason. Correct? If so, other than the gathering of friends together to share knowledge and spiritual enlightenment, what do you get out of it? I have a close group of friends that I can cut it up and have a great time with, and at the same time we can get really deep and share some serious stuff. What would the masons be able to offer that I don't already have?



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 10:30 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
[I'm not necessarily looking to join. Just to get some info from a live person. He's the only mason I personally know. From what I gather, the mason's don't have alot of "youngblood" in them and I don't think I'd fit in too well with them. I still have a few oats to sew


If you enjoy the fine art of needlecraft, so be it; but this Old Fart Mason would prefer to sow his oats, rather than being crafty with them
.

Dont underestimate the membership of the Craft, there are plenty of Lodges with young membership (I always recommend that Candidates that have no particular allegiance, such as family, or friends, seek a Lodge of suitable demographics), and us Old guys can hang in there too.

Wily Old Monkeys, not just for rocking chairs anymore



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 10:43 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
Ok, I am gonna assume (I know, I know...I shouldn't assume anything
) that you are a mason. Correct? If so, other than the gathering of friends together to share knowledge and spiritual enlightenment, what do you get out of it? I have a close group of friends that I can cut it up and have a great time with, and at the same time we can get really deep and share some serious stuff. What would the masons be able to offer that I don't already have?



Nope, not a Mason... yet. I am planning on petitioning within the next two months. As far as what Masonry can offer, I don't think Masonry "offers" anything as far as tangible benifit. It's about improving yourself in every way, every day, and striving to live an upright and moral life. Masonry is different for different people, yet it is generally the same. Confused? So was I. Maybe some of the guys can clarify a bit.

One thing I can say (and this is not one of my reasons for wanting to join, but is an undeniable benefit) is that wherever you go, all you have to do is find a lodge that is in amity with yours and you have friends and brothers. If you ever get in a bind while traveling, whatever... Masons are everywhere. Almost every town has a lodge. Imagine having loyal friends and brothers in almost every major city (and plenty of minor ones) in the world! That's good stuff. Masons stick together in that respect, they are all about helping their fellow man when they can.

I hope I have helped you out somewhat, sometimes it can seem clear as mud.


MM you crack me up as always...

*edit for spelling*

[edit on 8/24/04 by The Axeman]



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 10:54 AM
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I'll probably get flamed for saying so, but you just made it sound like a fraternity for old folks
I know it's alot more than that, just that's all I could think about when reading your response. No offense to our fellow masons here in ATSville



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 11:04 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
I'll probably get flamed for saying so, but you just made it sound like a fraternity for old folks


How so?

I'm 24, by the way...

[edit on 8/24/04 by The Axeman]



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 11:29 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
I've asked but haven't been pushy. I'm 26 and haven't asked him since I was around 17 or 18. perhaps he'll be more inclined to talk about it now that I'm a bit more mature. We'll see...


A lot of older Masons have follower the tradition of not speaking at all about Lodge. It's not how we tend to do things now a-days, but it was the way of things before. It may just be that he feels he wants to keep it private. You can find out a lot about Masonry from your local Grand Lodge web page, and similar sources. Or, if you have a question, why not ask it here? There are many Masons who frequent this forum, myself included, of course.



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 11:32 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
I'm not necessarily looking to join. Just to get some info from a live person. He's the only mason I personally know. From what I gather, the mason's don't have alot of "youngblood" in them and I don't think I'd fit in too well with them. I still have a few oats to sew


This may have been true up to a few years ago, but not anymore. There has been a rising tide of very young men joining Masonry, and working hard within the Craft. Indeed, you'll find that many of the holders of administrative positions within the Craft are getting younger and younger.

Another advantage of being a Mason is that you interact with people of all ages. When you are united in brotherhood with the "oldblood" as it were, you'll discover that they not only have a lot to offer, they're also a lot of fun.



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 11:36 AM
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One thing you should understand about Masonry is that if you come to us and say "why should I join? Convince me!" you'll be disappointed. That's not how Freemasonry generally works. If you have an interest, great! We'll answer your questions as far as is reasonable. But it's not in the nature of Freemasonry to go out and try to "convince" people to join. We don't recruit in any way, you see.



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 11:43 AM
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I am goign to read the rest of this BLOG but first before I go and do that ... I want to say that I do nto now what Masonery is at all I am a 21 year old male whom just finished my Computer Science Degree now I sell insurance ... ???? Not sure why ... but any how just though ti woudl give you guys some background information just alittle ... I do not know anything about anything about Mason's or anything ... I have a friend his name is Mason .. ??? What is a Mason ... All that I have read is people arguing where stuff originated and stuff like that ... but in my world I think that it doesn't matter where you got what from or where it originated from because the people that it did originate from Had one use in mind when they were making there Quotes or what not I hope someone actually reads this and apply it to thier lives. But I am really really really interested in learning anything and everything that someone can teach me even if I do not believe it after I am all through .... with learning it ... but most things in life you cannot complete learning it even in school .... there is history being made everyday ... If you can't learn all of history in a life time how can you learn everything else /.// just kinda a parable ... anyways .. =-) ... have a great Day .... I will be reading .. . Thanks ...



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 11:46 AM
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Originally posted by AlexKennedy
One thing you should understand about Masonry is that if you come to us and say "why should I join? Convince me!" you'll be disappointed. That's not how Freemasonry generally works. If you have an interest, great! We'll answer your questions as far as is reasonable. But it's not in the nature of Freemasonry to go out and try to "convince" people to join. We don't recruit in any way, you see.



Ah, yes, I neglected to point that out... You definitely have to show the initiative.

It's difficult for me to explain it well, because I am still as yet an "outsider", but I do my best to present what I have learned and believe to be true. You guys just let me know if I am speaking out of turn, I am all about constructive criticism. I am so excited about it I want to share my excitement with others and help them to see Masonry in the light as it has been presented to me.



posted on Aug, 24 2004 @ 12:01 PM
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Originally posted by The Axeman
I am so excited about it I want to share my excitement with others and help them to see Masonry in the light as it has been presented to me.


Exactly. That's fine, and there's no problem with that.

What is Masonry? That traditional answer to that question is that Masonry is "A beautiful system of morality, veiled in allegory, and illustrated by symbols." Does that help at all? Here's what my Grand Lodge lists as the Principles of Masonry up here:



Declaration of
Principles of
The Grand Lodge of Alberta
Ancient, Free and Accepted Masons

Freemasonry as a Society is:

Charitable it is devoted to the welfare and happiness of mankind.

Benevolent teaching that the good of others is of primary concern.

Communal recognizing that Society is made up of individuals, it impresses upon its members the principles of personal righteousness and responsibility, enlightens them in those things which make for human welfare; and inspires those feelings of charity and goodwill toward all mankind leading to practical application of those cherished principles.

Educational its authorized ceremonials teach a system of morality and brotherhood based upon Sacred Law.

Religious it acknowledges a one and caring Deity. Neither secular nor theological, reverence for a Supreme Being is ever present in its ceremonials. The volume of the Sacred Law, appropriate to its members, is open upon its Altars whenever a Lodge is in session.

Social in so far as it encourages the meeting together of men for the purpose of its primary objectives: education, fellowship and charity.


To these several ends:

It Teaches and stands for, the individual's worship of a Supreme Being; truth and justice; fraternity and philanthropy; enlightenment and liberty-civil, religious and intellectual.

It Charges each of its members to be true and loyal to the government of the country to which he owes allegiance, and to be obedient to the laws of any state in which he may reside.

It Believes that the attainment of these objectives is best accomplished by laying a broad basis of principle upon which men of every race, country, sect and opinion may unite, rather than by setting up a restricted platform upon which only those of certain races, creeds and opinions can assemble. Holding these beliefs and in the knowledge that the true Freemason will act in civil life according to his individual judgments and the dictates of his conscience.


This Grand Lodge Affirms:

Its Continued Adherence - to that ancient and approved rule of Freemasonry which forbids the discussion in Masonic meetings of creeds, politics or other topics likely to excite personal animosities.

Its Dedication - to those basic Masonic principles of brotherly love, relief and truth; and by their consistent practice, the lessening of the aggregate of human suffering and the promotion of the true and lasting happiness of Mankind.

Its Conviction - that it is not only contrary to the fundamental principles of Freemasonry, but dangerous to its unit strength, usefulness and welfare, for Masonic bodies to take action or attempt to exercise pressure or influence for or against any legislation, or in any way attempt to procure the election or appointment of government officials, or to influence them, whether or not members of the Fraternity, in the performance of their official duties.


WHAT IS FREEMASONRY?

Freemasonry is a way of life. It is fraternal in organization, religious in character, based on the belief in the Fatherhood of God, Brotherhood of man and immortality of the soul.

Freemasonry is NOT a secret society as many surmise. It is a voluntary association wherein the interested one comes of his own free will and accord.

Freemasonry is NOT a religion as many claim it to be.

Freemasonry, in its every effort and purpose, strives to do charitable work within its membership and for society and, through its teachings, seeks to make good men better men. The lessons conveyed by our ritual are based on the Golden Rule.

Freemasonry is a band of men bound together in the bonds of brotherly love and affection that extends throughout the world.

Freemasonry is:

Kindness in the home -
honesty in business

Courtesy in society -
fairness in work

Resistance toward the wicked -
pity and concern for the unfortunate

Help for the weak -
trust in the strong

Forgiveness for the penitent -
and, above all,

Love for one another -
and reverence and love for God.

"Freemasonry is a way of life"



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 03:51 AM
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Over the past week or so, while on a whim deciding to look into the history and beliefs of freemasonry, I was fortunate enough to come across ATS. I had recently come to the conclusion that I was, after 20 years of being a Christian, in fact really an agnostic with deist tendencies. I decided to look into a few things that I had always been told were either undesirable, wrong, or just plain evil. Somehow, freemasonry had been on that list. As I read many hundreds of posts, I witnessed time and time again the leonine rapacity of those (mostly Christians) who attacked it. As entertaining as their tales of Satan worship and world domination were, rarely did an opponent exibit anything more than the hubris and vehemence of a Klansmen. AK, ML, and other masons whom have posted, you have done an excellent job of convincing me (and I'm sure any reasonable person who has read your responses) that you are an organization of honorable men with honorable causes. That being said, I have a few questions.

1. The requirement that one profess belief in a Supreme Being. I have read in a few of the other threads that one is able to form his own of opinion of what a Supreme Being consists of. I myself believe it to be extremely likely that our universe was a creation, yet would never claim that I know (or prove) this to be true. Can one of you elaborate on this requirement?

2. I've seen it stated in another thread that no masonic ritual begins without an open "sacred book of law" on the altar, which is usually the Bible. Is the identity of that book voted on by the members of the lodge, with the book with the most votes adopted?

3. Speaking of the "sacred book of law", one would assume that many masons, the ones posting on ATS in particular, do not consider any text to be the definative law, and seek knowledge in less traditional areas as well, such as western mystery schools (B.O.T.A., A.E.O). I assume that I would be correct in stating that most mainstream Christians would not encourage this pursuit. The fact that masonry does encourage members to seek truth as they (the members) see fit is probably a very large reason why there is so much hate and fear of masons out there.

4. I have read that part of the masonic moral code is to respect and obey all laws of one's country. Is this an unconditional rule? Surely there must be exceptions if under an extremely oppressive or fascist rule? This country would obviously not exist if it wasn't for our forefathers (some of whom I've learned to be masons) rising up against their opressive, yet legitimate government.

5. Finally, a few of you that I have grown to respect are members of B.O.T.A. This organization seems to place a higher focus on the Qabalah than most rosicrucian orders I have researched recently. I'm interested to know if you believe B.O.T.A. to be more legitimate or intellectual than other mystery schools, or if perhaps it just seemed right to you. I would assume that you would agree with Dr. Case when he states that no school can claim to be the true rosicrucian order.

I've had a lot of fun and learned even more with the secret society board. I'm looking forward to your answers.

[edit on 25-8-2004 by JonestownRed]

[edit on 25-8-2004 by JonestownRed]

[edit on 25-8-2004 by JonestownRed]



posted on Aug, 25 2004 @ 04:28 AM
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Originally posted by JonestownRed
That being said, I have a few questions.

1. The requirement that one profess belief in a Supreme Being. I have read in a few of the other threads that one able to form his own of opinion of what a Supreme Being consists of. I myself believe it to be extremely likely that our universe was a creation, yet would never claim that I know (or prove) this to be true. Can one of you elaborate on this requirement?


It's quite simple really and you've answered your own question with the words "Belief in a Supreme Being". Freemasons come from all religions - the only people who are not accepted are atheists. I believe that spiritualism plays a part in Freemasonry and therefore one must have a belief. Freemasonry does not claim proof of God - it's up to each individual to find Him for themselves.


I've seen it stated in another thread that no masonic ritual begins without an open "sacred book of law" on the altar, which is usually the Bible. Is the identity of that book voted on by the members of the lodge, with the book with the most votes adopted?


Normally, no vote is needed. Most people in Western Lodges are Christians. Those in Eastern Lodges are either Hindus or Muslim. They therefore naturally adopt the book that is pertinent to their religion. There are Lodges which contain men of different religions - i.e Israel, where they will have both the Koran and the Torah open in the Lodge together. The same goes for quite a lot of the Lodges which were set up in the days of the British Empire - ex-pats attend along with the local population and two or three books are open.
I'm quite sure that if any brother differed in belief from the rest of his Lodge and wanted his religious scriptures open in the Lodge, all he would have to do is ask at a GP meeting.


I have read that part of the masonic moral code is to respect and obey all laws of one's country. Is this an unconditional rule? Surely there must be exceptions if under an extremely oppressive or fascist rule? This country would obviously not exist if it wasn't for our forefathers (some of whom I've learned to be masons) rising up against their opressive, yet legitimate government.


Freemasonry calls on it's followers to obey the law, but it does not force one to follow the immoral. If such a regime were to take control, Freemasonry itself would not be able to act - it is a non-political body. It's followers though, are individuals who could act. To all Freemasons, freedom is one of the most important aspects of mankind - it is something that we have fought long and hard for throughout history and often been persecuted for. Freemasonry teaches freedom for all mankind and it is seen as a threat by those who wish to subjugate populations.
The example of Freemasons in the USA rising up against the British Crown is not an isolated one where involvement in politics of the individual comes into play - many Freemasons have been politicians, generals and rulers of countries.
It should also remembered that the first thing that a fascist dictatorship or an oppressive regime does when it comes into power is to try and destroy Freemasonry - as happened in Italy and Germany prior to WW2 and as is happening in the Middle East today.



[edit on 25-8-2004 by Leveller]



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