What Does Abortion Have To Do With Pro-Choice?

nobody is saying you are ridiculous, please accept some heating up !! you have the right to say your opinion, we have the right to say what we think ! we all live on this stupid world, we have to make it better for everybody, the raped women, the women victim of incest, the women that are very poor, the pregnant women left alone by their macho stupid males ..... ok ? so, if you can help them it's fantastic, we do not speak here about your problems !!! but about the great ones of some other women, not the little ones of the wealthy dreaming people !!

reply to post by Sunlionspirit


SO you are saying it would be ok for me to start calling you out of your name and you will just accept the "Heat"?? That sounds like an invitation to me.

I don't need to talk about my problems....they are mine. I have my big girl panties on and can deal with mine.

This thread though is about abortion...not my problems, not the poor, not the needy, and not the raped. This thread is about the child being terminated. Has nothing to do with a man, or a macho man, or someone wanting you to "lay down". It has to do with the child and the rights or lack there of.

I have stated my opinion....

To clarify...

It is a choice as is everything since day one.

The one making the choice is the one living with said choice.

I have my own porch to keep clean so what someone else decides to do is not my business. Keep yours to yourself though if you do not want my opinion, otherwise you start asking for advice or an opinion, be open for what may come because I may not agree and I will not hold back. I am what people call BLUNT.

reply to post by marg6043


Well let's hope your 27 year old daughter wants kids... Otherwise your future granddaughter may just end up in the bottom of a medical waste dumpster...

The legal dumpster baby.. oh my..

If you have the freedom to choose whether or not to kill your child then I should have the freedom to choose whether or not to kill you (without fear of consequence)...

You've obviously never seen those pictures of an Abortion clinic trash can... What you call choice I call genocide.... Amen!

reply to post by Sunlionspirit

answer me please but very very honestly : do you think woman have an abortion for pleasure, I repeat for PLEASURE - for fun ????? do you really think this is all about a luxury decision ? some kind of cosmetic surgery or dental intervention ???
you do not understand a 0,0001 % of the despair of pregnant women not knowing what to do to get out of the despair !!! Shame !

In most cases no, I don't think women have abortions for pleasure. Then again, I can't judge every scenario, but that is my opinion. I think most women believe they are doing it for the right reasons, but that doesn't make it all better. Looking at this objectively, we all have times of "despair" and have to make hard decisions. Money, age, having hard times is no reason to kill off a child. There are too many EXCUSES and lack of accountability these days.

Just think of the mother who devotes her entire life to their disabled child..Do they kill it because it's "hard"?? Take a look at my post here. Tons of teenagers are put in similar situations every year, and it's not the end of the world. There are other options to consider first, you can't just go "oh well I can't do this, let's head to the clinic!"

ETA: sorry I added the wrong link, try now.

Originally posted by Wookiep
reply to post by MamaJ

 

I think you hit the nail on the head.

if some of the posters on here *ahem* are soooo pro the "right" for a woman to choose their child's' fate..then there really would be no argument when it comes to YOUR right to choose how to act in any given scenario. The plain and simple simple truth is, they don't agree with YOUR opinion on the subject and that's it.

My opinion? It's all "me, me, me, me" these days. Not a whole lot of respect for life or those who believe in restoring it. Personally, as I've stated before, unless rape or another extreme circumstance is involved...The abortion issue in most cases, tends to seem very selfishly motivated. Use the law to justify lack of personal responsibility and accountability for ones actions resulting in the termination of a child. That's the "empowering" turn in which humanity has taken, unfortunately.

edit on 6-9-2011 by Wookiep because: (no reason given)

I think there clearly needs to be some educating for women who do not have the resources at hand to make a sound choice. They are young, or raped, no money, no job, parents not around, and so on. Like I said....I wish I could take all the ones in who need help. If everyone was not so selfish we would definitely live in a better place and time. It is sad that we are all in for ourselves while our neighbor sits around starving and no money with no job.

We can all say hey it is not of my business and keep to our self or we can be active and help within our community. I choose to help.

When I needed help....there was no one around but my family and even then..it was hard for me to state that I need help. Once I did though it was hard to accept the help.

We have really got to get to a point where we care for our neighbor or even unborn child as our self.

Originally posted by MamaJ

Originally posted by Sunlionspirit

Originally posted by MamaJ

I feel happy for you, ok ?? so let's speak now about the others that are NOT happy at al

reply to post by Sunlionspirit

 

We, or let me say I AM talking about the child. The right of the child. Once their is life growing inside you it is no longer about YOU, its now about WE. We because you now have another LIFE inside of you. When is the child old enough to be considered as a being to have a right to live? Just askin'.

and what about the right of the woman ?? doesn't she count in your eyes ?
thanks for your sympathy for the unborn, that is nice, but you also could have some sympathy with your sisters in despair no ?? oh I see, they are just woman ok ....

edit on 6-9-2011 by Sunlionspirit because: (no reason given)

The right of the woman? The subject is not the woman...she is fine. She is living....she is not the one being killed!

I have sympathy for my sisters....hell I am the one my friends call on because they know I CARE. They know I will be there.....

I have visited the grave of my niece who was only 10 weeks old. We buried her and believe she would have been something to really brag about but she was not able to come into this world. She died while in the womb. She was not terminated....she died. Had she been given the chance at life ....man....what would she have been like? I think about those babies who didn't have that chance. They were doomed by circumstances and killed. The choice is up to the mom...true enough. BUT....it still doesn't make it any prettier.

There comes a time when you have responsibility for others and put yourself aside for the brother/sister/child/uncle/nephew and so on. Once life begins to grow it is not about just the one life....there is now two.

We are talking about the unborn that has no rights. No one cares about the one they cannot see, hold, hear cry, because then it would be too hard to kill it.

come on, come on, you are comparing and mixing everything together
you compare the death of a poor little child, fruit of LOVE, with the rape of a woman, the incest of a girl ....
how can you compare the fruit of LOVE with the despair of a woman victim of evil actions ...
man man man, you mix it all up !!
of course everybody is sad about your story, but it isn't about that kind of story here .....
have peace and joy, have mercy with the others.

Originally posted by Wookiep
reply to post by Sunlionspirit

 

answer me please but very very honestly : do you think woman have an abortion for pleasure, I repeat for PLEASURE - for fun ????? do you really think this is all about a luxury decision ? some kind of cosmetic surgery or dental intervention ???
you do not understand a 0,0001 % of the despair of pregnant women not knowing what to do to get out of the despair !!! Shame !

In most cases no, I don't think women have abortions for pleasure. Then again, I can't judge every scenario, but that is my opinion. I think most women believe they are doing it for the right reasons, but that doesn't make it all better. Looking at this objectively, we all have times of "despair" and have to make hard decisions. Money, age, having hard times is no reason to kill off a child. There are too many EXCUSES and lack of accountability these days.

Just think of the mother who devotes her entire life to their disabled child..Do they kill it because it's "hard"?? I take a strong stance on this. Abortion should be a very last resort and only in extreme cases. Take a look at my post here. Tons of teenagers are put in similar situations every year, and it's not the end of the world. There are other options to consider first, you can't just go "oh well I can't do this, let's head to the clinic!"

edit on 6-9-2011 by Wookiep because: (no reason given)

you said it and you are right : very last resort !! very very last resort ! but not MY or YOUR decision anyway ...
but do not mix it all together, killing a living person is murder
having a abortion in despair situations is an act of self-defence, to protect your own woman body against psychological or physical self-destruction.
How could a raped woman bring a strong and healthy baby into this world and care for it if this embryo is the fruit of EVIL and if she herself is getting mad and sick about this happened ??
the mother must also love her baby, she must been wanting him, she must be happy and full of joy ! a baby without love, a not wanted baby, is a very very bad start in life for him and her.

reply to post by MamaJ


MamaJ...

What about the father? He has no rights.. He has no ability to choose to the affirmative or negative of the untimely execution (or termination if you prefer) of his unborn child...

He has no say in whether or not his blood line will continue in the miracle that he has helped create...

And on the subject of babies as a result of rape...

I know a guy that I went to school with a long time ago that was the result of a rape.. He is an upstanding individual and very well liked... His mother decided that even though his father is a coward and the lowest form of life that her child should not be the one to pay for it...

I would say that woman is a billion times stronger than any woman that decided to abort their child... Especially pregnancies termination even though they were the result of a night of hot, steamy, wild, kinky and crazy willing participation...

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

You're making things up. I have never said or indicated anything of the sort.

You implied that fetuses should not be granted the right to life due to the fact that they rely on the mother for sustenance.

If a man wants to give his opinion to his pregnant lady and let his desires be known, that's fine, but he can't FORCE the woman to comply with his wishes.

Then surely you agree that a man can't be forced to provide and support a woman's choice....right?

Thanks for sharing your opinion. But why should the fetus' rights overrule the woman's rights?

As I've said, fetuses are helpless and made no choice to come into existence in the woman's body while women have options to ensure 100% that an 'unwanted' pregnancy will not occur.

You can put words in my mouth that I didn't say, but it's not making ME look silly.

You're saying that abortion should be legal because a woman's right to her body needs to be protected by law. Fetuses come into existence because of choices their mother (and father) made. You're basically saying women need to be protected from themselves and their own choices.

reply to post by Sunlionspirit


But there you go, you said it! "killing a living person is murder ". How can you say that, yet still advocate a woman's "right" to decide that or not? See, that's the problem right there. You think a woman should have a right to kill their child and I don't (unless one of the extreme circumstances is present), period.

Being pro choice just means that you support a womans right to choose for herself whether she wants an abortion or not.

come on, come on, you are comparing and mixing everything together you compare the death of a poor little child, fruit of LOVE, with the rape of a woman, the incest of a girl .... how can you compare the fruit of LOVE with the despair of a woman victim of evil actions ... man man man, you mix it all up !! of course everybody is sad about your story, but it isn't about that kind of story here ..... have peace and joy, have mercy with the others.

reply to post by Sunlionspirit


Death of a child? It was not born...just so we are clear. She had been in the womb for only ten weeks. We buried her because she was a child to US.

I think the one that has it all mixed up is YOU. You are running off at the "keyboard" with a reply before you comprehend what is being conveyed.

Lets be clear on another thing...we are NOT talking about the act, we are talking about the life that was created when the "act" occurred. Whether it was a good act or not....it created life. LIFE...not death. The woman now has to NOT think of herself and think of the LIFE that is growing inside of her. If she chooses to kill it....so be it. It is HER choice and not anyone elses. This is the law....so you have your way already.

Originally posted by DaMod
reply to post by MamaJ

 

MamaJ...

What about the father? He has no rights.. He has no ability to choose to the affirmative or negative of the untimely execution (or termination if you prefer) of his unborn child...

He has no say in whether or not his blood line will continue in the miracle that he has helped create...

And on the subject of babies as a result of rape...

I know a guy that I went to school with a long time ago that was the result of a rape.. He is an upstanding individual and very well liked... His mother decided that even though his father is a coward and the lowest form of life that her child should not be the one to pay for it...

I would say that woman is a billion times stronger than any woman that decided to abort their child... Especially pregnancies termination even though they were the result of a night of hot, steamy, wild, kinky and crazy willing participation...

edit on 6-9-2011 by DaMod because: (no reason given)

well that is a nice story, the better for him and her !!
what else ?
but here we speak about the others, the ones in trouble .....
the fathers have to take responsability for their wife and children, if so where is the problem ?

Originally posted by DaMod
reply to post by MamaJ

 

MamaJ...

What about the father? He has no rights.. He has no ability to choose to the affirmative or negative of the untimely execution (or termination if you prefer) of his unborn child...

He has no say in whether or not his blood line will continue in the miracle that he has helped create...

And on the subject of babies as a result of rape...

I know a guy that I went to school with a long time ago that was the result of a rape.. He is an upstanding individual and very well liked... His mother decided that even though his father is a coward and the lowest form of life that her child should not be the one to pay for it...

I would say that woman is a billion times stronger than any woman that decided to abort their child... Especially pregnancies termination even though they were the result of a night of hot, steamy, wild, kinky and crazy willing participation...

edit on 6-9-2011 by DaMod because: (no reason given)

My opinion is the right should go to the one who is in question to lose said life. My opinion is there needs to be rights for the child who cannot speak and say I WANT TO LIVE!

I agree with you in the latter.

Originally posted by gimme_some_truth
Being pro choice just means that you support a womans right to choose for herself whether she wants an abortion or not.

I cannot support being pro choice mostly because the fathers of those child have no rights, no choice and no say in whether or not their flesh and blood are doomed to the slaughter..

Perhaps (even with how anti-abortion I am) I would be more willing to listen to ludicrous arguments on the behalf of women if men were even remotely considered..

Originally posted by Wookiep
reply to post by Sunlionspirit

 

But there you go, you said it! "killing a living person is murder ". How can you say that, yet still advocate a woman's "right" to decide that or not? See, that's the problem right there. You think a woman should have a right to kill their child and I don't (unless one of the extreme circumstances is present), period.

edit on 6-9-2011 by Wookiep because: (no reason given)

So it is okay to kill..... Only in certain situations?

that makes as much since as those anti-abortionists who go and kill the abortion doctors....

Are you for or against it?

reply to post by Sunlionspirit


I have to respond to you again because you edited to include the RAPE thing again. Lol, stop bringing up the rape thing! How many times do I have to tell you I agree on that??? Sheesh!

Originally posted by MamaJ

come on, come on, you are comparing and mixing everything together you compare the death of a poor little child, fruit of LOVE, with the rape of a woman, the incest of a girl .... how can you compare the fruit of LOVE with the despair of a woman victim of evil actions ... man man man, you mix it all up !! of course everybody is sad about your story, but it isn't about that kind of story here ..... have peace and joy, have mercy with the others.

reply to post by Sunlionspirit

 

Death of a child? It was not born...just so we are clear. She had been in the womb for only ten weeks. We buried her because she was a child to US.

I think the one that has it all mixed up is YOU. You are running off at the "keyboard" with a reply before you comprehend what is being conveyed.

Lets be clear on another thing...we are NOT talking about the act, we are talking about the life that was created when the "act" occurred. Whether it was a good act or not....it created life. LIFE...not death. The woman now has to NOT think of herself and think of the LIFE that is growing inside of her. If she chooses to kill it....so be it. It is HER choice and not anyone elses. This is the law....so you have your way already.

okay okay, your idea !! nice to meet you !! Should I wish you some experience to feel reality or not ?
think you live in a dream world and all the others also !

Originally posted by DaMod

Originally posted by gimme_some_truth
Being pro choice just means that you support a womans right to choose for herself whether she wants an abortion or not.

I cannot support being pro choice mostly because the fathers of those child have no rights, no choice and no say in whether or not their flesh and blood are doomed to the slaughter..

Perhaps (even with how anti-abortion I am) I would be more willing to listen to ludicrous arguments on the behalf of women if men were even remotely considered..

You don't think a lot of women talk it over with the man that knocked them up?

Sure it happens that they don't and go get an abortion... But be fair... Lot's of women will talk it over with the man in their life before doing it.

reply to post by Sunlionspirit


The problem is that the mother has the right to choose whether or not to kill his child anyway.. She doesn't even have to consult him.. He has no say in whether or not his child is to be executed (terminated)...

Perhaps she doesn't want to be a mother but he wants to be a father...

It doesn't matter she can kill him/her anyway without so much of batting an eyelash if that's the kind of person she is......

Since we are talking about the right to choose perhaps we should start discussing the right to choose for all parties involved.. not just the mother with a human tape worm inside her (as many pro-choice advocates all but call an unborn baby)

reply to post by gimme_some_truth


Are you referring to the case of rape? If my GF/wife was raped, I would leave it up to her in that case. RAPE is an extreme case in which the mother did NOT choose to have sex, therefore the accountability does not belong to her. Should it be early in the pregnancy? IMO, Definately. Do I believe it should be up to her in this extreme case, yes. Sorry if you don't like the answer but you asked. I also think if a woman's life is in danger, that is another scenario where it would be pretty much a given.