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Right-wing commentator: Poor people voting is ‘un-American’

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posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:16 PM
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reply to post by illuminatislave
 


You bring up a great point. If I had all of the answers I would be somewhere other than ATS. Here is a scenario for you... If you rent an apartment and I own a house, should you be allowed to vote on anything that has to do with how property taxes are collected and spent? I would argue no, because you don't pay property taxes, so why should you get a say in how they are spent. Now if I decide to sell my house and rent an apartment, then I should lose my "right" to vote on property taxes, and if you stop renting and buy a house then you should gain the "right" to vote on property taxes. Now back to your point, and again, it was a good one... Perhaps a 5 or 7 year tax history should be taken into account in order for someone to be eligible to vote. I do see your point, because as more and more people become unemployed and remain unemployed, then that is less and less voters that could vote out the very politicians that are responsible for the unemployment. It would take smarter people than you or I to figure all of the nuances out. I'm speaking of those people that are leeches on the system. I'm talking about those people that have no "skin in the game", and have never had any skin in the game. If someone is recently unemployed then they obviously had skin in the game and no longer do due to no fault of their own (in most cases), so they should be allowed to vote and one way to determine their eligibility would be IRS records. The first step that needs to be taken is amending the Constitution and rewording or repealing the 26th amendment.




posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:21 PM
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reply to post by MidnightTide
 


Congress should have allowed the banks to fail. Congress could then take the trillions given to the off-shore banks in 2008-10 and paid off every mortgage outstanding whether past due or not. Think how the economy would have been stimulated with all that consumer spending, when they have no more mortgage payments to make. Result would be new banks to replace the old and FULL employment..



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:25 PM
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reply to post by romanmel
 


As long as I get a free house as well.



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by romanmel
reply to post by MidnightTide
 


Congress should have allowed the banks to fail. Congress could then take the trillions given to the off-shore banks in 2008-10 and paid off every mortgage outstanding whether past due or not. Think how the economy would have been stimulated with all that consumer spending, when they have no more mortgage payments to make. Result would be new banks to replace the old and FULL employment..



That would have been a great solution to our economic problems; but it's much more fun to blame the poor on our current condition. What we need are more scapegoats to soothe our distorted ideologies.

I know...........the Jews!!

edit on 5-9-2011 by whaaa because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:29 PM
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reply to post by MidnightTide
 



Posting in a Democrat thread - hey guys.....so all us conservatives are evil buggers, what do you liberal folk suggest to solve this mess - how do you eliminate poverty? Please tell me something that doesn't involve taxing the wealthy, take all their money, your still not going to solve this mess.


well, first - this isn't a Demcrats thread - unless you choose to see it that way. It is prabably more of an American thread - though the ideas being tossed around in here apply to people the world over

This discussion is about denying people their right to vote. It's really about taking away the right to vote from citizens. It's about one group of people deciding that another does not deserve the right to vote

Voting privileges are denied to criminals. Is it a crime to be poor?

So, as an American - how do you feel about that?

As a human - how do you feel about that?

It's easy to see that these things take on a life of their own - it's really not about solving the problems that come out of poverty - solving this 'mess'

You evil Republicans :-)

poverty will likely always be with us. It's not going away - so forget about that for a minute

Before we can ever work on these problems, we have to agree that there is a problem, we have to understand the problem, and we have to decide that we want to fix the problem

But it would help if we could all agree - it's not a crime to be poor

And people are not better people people for having more - they are by and large just not as hungry or distressed

Money is not something people are comfortable talking about - not directly. The only reason we're even talking about it now is because there are people who actually believe that some people don't deserve to vote because they have none. They'll say it's not about money - it's about circumstances - and the type of people who are poor

Where is that line drawn? If it's about the intelligence or the quality of the people, then maybe we should apply those same standards to all people evenly

Only smart, nice, clean, hardworking people with no bad habits are allowed to vote

Now - that would be interesting - wouldn't it?

I promise you - the lines would really blur then



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:29 PM
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Originally posted by MidnightTide
reply to post by romanmel
 


As long as I get a free house as well.


With all the trillions that are gone with no accounting we could pay for a house for everyone. In stead we have banks fat with cash and refusing to make loans with the money they got for free.



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:31 PM
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Originally posted by OptimusSubprime
reply to post by illuminatislave
 


You bring up a great point. If I had all of the answers I would be somewhere other than ATS. Here is a scenario for you... If you rent an apartment and I own a house, should you be allowed to vote on anything that has to do with how property taxes are collected and spent? I would argue no, because you don't pay property taxes, so why should you get a say in how they are spent. Now if I decide to sell my house and rent an apartment, then I should lose my "right" to vote on property taxes, and if you stop renting and buy a house then you should gain the "right" to vote on property taxes. Now back to your point, and again, it was a good one... Perhaps a 5 or 7 year tax history should be taken into account in order for someone to be eligible to vote. I do see your point, because as more and more people become unemployed and remain unemployed, then that is less and less voters that could vote out the very politicians that are responsible for the unemployment. It would take smarter people than you or I to figure all of the nuances out. I'm speaking of those people that are leeches on the system. I'm talking about those people that have no "skin in the game", and have never had any skin in the game. If someone is recently unemployed then they obviously had skin in the game and no longer do due to no fault of their own (in most cases), so they should be allowed to vote and one way to determine their eligibility would be IRS records. The first step that needs to be taken is amending the Constitution and rewording or repealing the 26th amendment.


I understand where you're coming from, but this will not work, nor should it. This is supposedly a free country with equal rights for all(even though that is false).

What about the voters that just turn 18 years old? They have no tax history to speak of. Should they, the kids that are old enough to die for this country, be disenfranchised because of this?

See, when you get into stuff about "these people should not be allowed to vote because....", you start heading down a slippery slope.

The system is already rigged and corrupt. Saying that so and so cannot vote because will not improve anything.

Kill the corruption and get the hand of oligarchy out of the pockets of politicos and judges and maybe we can revisit this kind of stuff, but I believe that everyone should be allowed to vote for whoever they'd like.



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:43 PM
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reply to post by illuminatislave
 


Good response...

Of course those who rent really do pay property taxes indirectly. The landlord will always figure in the property taxes he pays when setting rental fees.



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 12:55 PM
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Originally posted by OptimusSubprime
reply to post by illuminatislave
 


You bring up a great point. If I had all of the answers I would be somewhere other than ATS. Here is a scenario for you... If you rent an apartment and I own a house, should you be allowed to vote on anything that has to do with how property taxes are collected and spent? I would argue no, because you don't pay property taxes, so why should you get a say in how they are spent. Now if I decide to sell my house and rent an apartment, then I should lose my "right" to vote on property taxes, and if you stop renting and buy a house then you should gain the "right" to vote on property taxes.


I don't see this playing well in NYC...8 million plus and how many own their apartments? Interesting straw man though...
edit on 5-9-2011 by userid1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 01:01 PM
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Maybe the issue is citizenship

Maybe you should have to make enough money to acquire it?

Or maybe you should have to buy it every year...

We can also create government agencies to decide who gets to vote, or better yet
privatize it and have companies decide.



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 01:43 PM
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Originally posted by OptimusSubprime
reply to post by illuminatislave
 


You bring up a great point. If I had all of the answers I would be somewhere other than ATS. Here is a scenario for you... If you rent an apartment and I own a house, should you be allowed to vote on anything that has to do with how property taxes are collected and spent? I would argue no, because you don't pay property taxes, so why should you get a say in how they are spent. Now if I decide to sell my house and rent an apartment, then I should lose my "right" to vote on property taxes, and if you stop renting and buy a house then you should gain the "right" to vote on property taxes. Now back to your point, and again, it was a good one... Perhaps a 5 or 7 year tax history should be taken into account in order for someone to be eligible to vote.


And what money do you think the landlords are using to pay the property taxes on the rented property? Renters pay property taxes also, they just do so through a middle man... and to even propose 'land owner only' voting is verging on treason... You really need to bone up on what the word 'Democracy' means...



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 01:56 PM
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reply to post by beezzer
 


Sure you are.

So -- for the record -- you are strongly AGAINST corporate personhood, "free trade," NAFTA, CAFTA, and bailouts for any business in any form?

Because those 5 precursors, right there, have done more to destroy jobs in this county then all of the other forces combined.

You can't be against the dole, if you are FOR destroying liquidity at the bottom. My customers are main street Americans. The less money they have to spend, the less profit I make, and the fewer people I can employ.

Simple supply and demand.



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 01:59 PM
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First off, I would encourage all Americans to vote. If you take part in the society then you should have a voice in it.

This thread got more divergent and devisive and seems to be splintering and labelling the various types of Americans, though that seems counter to the premise of voting. Are there really just two types of people with varying degrees of extremity?

I might be a "liberal" or "progressive" because I like roads and infrastructure, schools and public libraries, and a number of things that take a collective effort to build. Yet I don't want a communist system nor a fully socialized system that takes away from individual choices to utilize those provisions or not. I like privacies and personal properties so I guess I am not a progressive as it seems to be defined here.

I might be a "conservative" because I don't favor high taxes nor imposing governmental regulation in all aspects of living. However I am not religious and don't care for christian values preferring to be a free-thinker, and also might consider my preferrence pro-choice as to reproductive decisions. I don't favor corporate welfare and free bail-outs, if we help large corporations stay afloat in hard times I favor them giving back to the system that helped them. I am registered Republican primarily because they traditionally provide more voter information but frequently vote for a Democratic candidate if the GOP choice is too hard-nosed. I don't favor hardline rule-of-law that watches for half-inch foot fouls when toeing the line and favor individual and personal expression, so I really am not a conservative.

So now that I am retired and drawing a pension from the US, paying taxes on that pension and such, I still favor low taxes along with privacy and personal liberties. I like easy access to resonable-cost healthcare, medicines, vitamins, and healty foods. I like good infrastructure, highways, transportation, parks and recreational activities sponsored by local government, along with low cost-of-living. I like leading a tranquil, healthy, and happy life. To get all that I found it necessary to leave the US to live elsewhere. By birth and citizenship, upbringing and career I am a US citizen, but since I find no place in the cookie-cutter lifestyles of liberal or conservative I am not sure I am any longer American. However now more than ever before in my life I feel part of the human race above all.

Best wishes to all of you. Be a productive participant in whatever system of values best suits you. Enjoy life.


edit on 5-9-2011 by Erongaricuaro because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 03:00 PM
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reply to post by romanmel
 



edit on 5-9-2011 by Donkey_Dean because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 03:23 PM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


Well actually it's true. Originally you had to own land to vote. Then again, you also had to be a white male.


The truth sort of still stands though. Poor people, dumb people, etc etc, all are more easily able to corrupt the vote because they cannot think for themselves, but rather, are dependent.

Personally I'd favor a college education being required to vote. Covers everything quite well. At least some sort of intelligence test. Too often people quite literally farm votes.
edit on 5-9-2011 by Gorman91 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by romanmel

Originally posted by JohhnyBGood
Stopping poor people voting strikes me as very 'American' in a way.

Although not so much the 'poor' - but stopping those who are a drain or parasitical upon the system from voting themselves a free lunch, is only commonsense....


Oh, then if we are going to stop "...those who are a drain or parasitical upon the system from voting " we should include all banks, lawyers, politicians and corporate whores who are getting tax breaks and in many cases pay no taxes at all.

This is the very reason I no longer identify with the Republican party. It has become vindictive and elitist to the point that unless you are rich, you are nothing but "useless eaters" as Hitler refered to them. Both parties are dominated by facist elitists, IMO. To vote in US national elections is a waste of time. No choices.


True.

"The rich" benefit from and depend on "the government" much more than "poor people".



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 03:55 PM
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I'm sorry, I just have to


This guy is crazy...his statement is as crazy as not allowing women or blacks to vote just less than a hundred years ago.

Whatever! Thanks OP for the info


ETA: I'm not a dem or rep or tea partier or anything, I just think people like this commentator/writer/author are crazy for making statements like this...just my opinion and thoughts.
edit on 9/5/11 by ThePublicEnemyNo1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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So if the mods doesn’t delete this

WOW what a lot of closed minded people in here. Oh my how they carry their feeling on their sleeves. And so quick to attack, attack...call names... and for what... some dude… that some other dude afixed some political label too… And, omg, doing such an awful thing such as putting forth a theory about something that most Americans don’t even do…. Voting... bunch of nim rods.

‘What is it about "he wants to disenfranchise a segment of the citizenry" you don't understand?’
I want to disenfranchise a large segment of the citizenry... namely the liars, thieves, murderous, the cheaters. Yep I want to more than disenfranchise them. So I hope you understand. If not oh well.

But let me take you on a trip of your imagination… so… if you’re a politician, you might not feel as I do about this large segment of the citizenry. ‘If ’ you can figure out a way to get them to vote for you.
And I think the best way to do that, well one way would be to find a motivation for these voters to vote for you. Now this certain politication really is only focused on getting re-elected, not about the country, he is following his/hers on humanity, self interest is guiding him.

Well it doesn’t take much brain matter to take this to the next step. Which without further ado.. tada.. a feedback system. With votes feeding a politician and a politician feeding the voters. Put the ‘voter’ in there that you want. But I desire to put the poor in this feedback loop. Is that what we have now? I ask you, is it?

If so then no matter how much of a simple person you might be, you have to be able to see how a situation like this kills us.

So instead of acting like someone’s attack dog, how about thinking over and under and through that original hypothesis and really think it out. It’s not a knock on the poor, but I do believe it could be the authors thinking of mistrust.

But really, all this doesn’t make any difference. Our Gov has run over budget for so long, that it is screwing up everything. Open you eyes you political sheepole .

The first step:
Cut Spending as much as possible and still be able to stay alive…



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 04:21 PM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


Capital Research Center seems to want only white Rich land owning, home owners be able to vote like in the good ol days. They want non white votes to count .00000001 of a vote. While their vote will count 10000000000000x.


Capital Research Center Is code word for evil capitalism to take control of the government even more so then it already has. Greed must be destroyed and eradicated.



posted on Sep, 5 2011 @ 04:56 PM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


You really need to make this bigger in your signature line, whaaa darling:

When Fascism comes to America it will be

wrapped in the flag carrying a cross...


This thread is a blatant example of this occuring even as we speak... Is it too late? I hope not...



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