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Hell Experiencer: The Stench of Hell Could Kill You, If You Smelled It In This Life

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posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 06:10 AM
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Originally posted by XplanetX

Originally posted by bogomil
reply to post by Mividau
 


Thanks for asking to my wellbeing. All well here in semi-nirvana, apart from the coffee.

Jesus was just around for a short visit to ask the flying spaghetti monster for a joined research-project. He (JC) wants to backtrack the history of 'hell', to see where and when and how that idea first popped up.




Blame the rich man and Lazarus.



LK 16:19 "There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

LK 16:22 "The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. So he called to him, `Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'

LK 16:25 "But Abraham replied, `Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'

LK 16:27 "He answered, `Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

LK 16:29 "Abraham replied, `They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'

LK 16:30 " `No, father Abraham,' he said, `but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'

LK 16:31 "He said to him, `If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "


It's not, as if I'm really on the 'inside', having the ears of JC and the flying spaghetti monster, but I believe it's possible, that I can turn their attention to this information, you've given here.

But to make sure, what was the name again of that book you seem to refer to. If it's relevant, it may be of interest to the higher powers.
edit on 1-9-2011 by bogomil because: wring pasting




posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 06:13 AM
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reply to post by bogomil
 




You mentioned Jesus.

Maybe you could enlighten us on your version of him?



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 06:56 AM
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Bible says that you don't go to hell when you die, you go to the grave and get resurrected by Jesus for the final judgement, THEN you are cast into the fire for eternity. There are also NON-Christians who experiences Near Death Experiences and seen heaven. So, even if this is true, it isn't biblical.



Also, take a look at this site if you desire.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:08 AM
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Originally posted by arpgme
Bible says that you don't go to hell when you die, you go to the grave and get resurrected by Jesus for the final judgement, THEN you are cast into the fire for eternity. There are also NON-Christians who experiences Near Death Experiences and seen heaven. So, even if this is true, it isn't biblical.



Also, take a look at this site if you desire.



These people that have these visons have not given up their spirit yet. Jesus is giving them a vision of either heaven or hell before they return back to consciousness.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:18 AM
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Originally posted by XplanetX
reply to post by bogomil
 




You mentioned Jesus.

Maybe you could enlighten us on your version of him?


Behind the pauline hijacked character, I can discern a possibly real human being, born and living like the rest of us....

.......who was a wise, religious maverick with some very sane ideas. E.g. agreeing with the present Dalia Lama on: "Be nice to your neighbours". The only pricetags on that being those sugarcoated ones, invented by doctrinal religion. The real thing is unconditional.

Because there's is no general existential debt to pay, apart from the circle-argumented one. Consequently there's no need for applying for the cosmic plastic-credit-card, as everybody can take care of their individual existential 'economy' themselves.

Furthermore, in this reasoning-chain, there's no need for a 'debt-prison' with an enormous heating-bill. Money and energy (wasted on that heating-bill) better used to help those now-living beings having a tough time.

A little anecdote relating to OP. Amongst the innumerable 'gurus' I've met in my life, there was one whose 'trademark' was, that his immaterial presence was supposed to be preceded by the smell of roses. I'm quite sure some of the seriously saved had their noses playing tricks on them and experiencing this.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:29 AM
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Originally posted by XplanetX

Originally posted by arpgme
Bible says that you don't go to hell when you die, you go to the grave and get resurrected by Jesus for the final judgement, THEN you are cast into the fire for eternity. There are also NON-Christians who experiences Near Death Experiences and seen heaven. So, even if this is true, it isn't biblical.



Also, take a look at this site if you desire.



These people that have these visons have not given up their spirit yet. Jesus is giving them a vision of either heaven or hell before they return back to consciousness.



It's somewhat confusing, that religionists having 'visions' don't come back with uniform descriptions.

But such unworthy scepsis can probably be ascribed to the satanic device 'rational reasoning', which has caused untold harm for all the app. 50.000 different religions/denominations on this planet.

Cynical bastards like me really deserve to end in the turkish bath of our rational master, with its smug-smell of deductive logic.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:33 AM
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Originally posted by bogomil

Originally posted by XplanetX
reply to post by bogomil
 




You mentioned Jesus.

Maybe you could enlighten us on your version of him?


Behind the pauline hijacked character, I can discern a possibly real human being, born and living like the rest of us....

.......who was a wise, religious maverick with some very sane ideas. E.g. agreeing with the present Dalia Lama on: "Be nice to your neighbours". The only pricetags on that being those sugarcoated ones, invented by doctrinal religion. The real thing is unconditional.

Because there's is no general existential debt to pay, apart from the circle-argumented one. Consequently there's no need for applying for the cosmic plastic-credit-card, as everybody can take care of their individual existential 'economy' themselves.

Furthermore, in this reasoning-chain, there's no need for a 'debt-prison' with an enormous heating-bill. Money and energy (wasted on that heating-bill) better used to help those now-living beings having a tough time.

A little anecdote relating to OP. Amongst the innumerable 'gurus' I've met in my life, there was one whose 'trademark' was, that his immaterial presence was supposed to be preceded by the smell of roses. I'm quite sure some of the seriously saved had their noses playing tricks on them and experiencing this.




The only thing seperating our opinion of Jesus is this one claim:


MT 26:62 Then the high priest stood up and said to Jesus, "Are you not going to answer? What is this testimony that these men are bringing against you?" But Jesus remained silent.
The high priest said to him, "I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God."

MT 26:64 "Yes, it is as you say," Jesus replied. "But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."


MT 26:65 Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, "He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy. What do you think?"
"He is worthy of death," they answered.

MT 26:67 Then they spit in his face and struck him with their fists. Others slapped him and said, "Prophesy to us, Christ. Who hit you?"


If Jesus was real and the scriptures are accurate about what Jesus said and did then he is either a Liar, or the Son of God.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:44 AM
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reply to post by XplanetX
 


You wrote:

["If Jesus was real and the scriptures are accurate about what Jesus said and did ......."]

The moot-point being "If ........the scriptures are accurate"

Quote continued: [".......then he is either a Liar, or the Son of God."]

Maybe my mind is too elastic, but I can see another option. That Paulus (as is my opinion) is the top-scammer of all known history.

But that's ofcourse only because I suffer from individualism and don't accept your premises passively.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:49 AM
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Originally posted by XplanetX

Originally posted by arpgme
Bible says that you don't go to hell when you die, you go to the grave and get resurrected by Jesus for the final judgement, THEN you are cast into the fire for eternity. There are also NON-Christians who experiences Near Death Experiences and seen heaven. So, even if this is true, it isn't biblical.



Also, take a look at this site if you desire.



These people that have these visons have not given up their spirit yet. Jesus is giving them a vision of either heaven or hell before they return back to consciousness.



What do you think about other Near Death Experiences from other religions where they still get to heaven?



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:50 AM
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Originally posted by bogomil
reply to post by XplanetX
 


You wrote:

["If Jesus was real and the scriptures are accurate about what Jesus said and did ......."]

The moot-point being "If ........the scriptures are accurate"

Quote continued: [".......then he is either a Liar, or the Son of God."]

Maybe my mind is too elastic, but I can see another option. That Paulus (as is my opinion) is the top-scammer of all known history.

But that's ofcourse only because I suffer from individualism and don't accept your premises passively.





Yes, I did make the premises of the scriptures being accurate.

Although, I did precede the premises with an 'if'.

As a side note: I quoted the gospel according to Matthew (the tax collector). Paulus did not pen this one.

I am personally convinced of the accuracy of the scriptures, after reading many books on the subject of their authenticity.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:51 AM
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Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by XplanetX

Originally posted by arpgme
Bible says that you don't go to hell when you die, you go to the grave and get resurrected by Jesus for the final judgement, THEN you are cast into the fire for eternity. There are also NON-Christians who experiences Near Death Experiences and seen heaven. So, even if this is true, it isn't biblical.



Also, take a look at this site if you desire.



These people that have these visons have not given up their spirit yet. Jesus is giving them a vision of either heaven or hell before they return back to consciousness.



What do you think about other Near Death Experiences from other religions where they still get to heaven?




To be honest.

I have never looked into it.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:54 AM
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reply to post by XplanetX
 


Ah, I see. So these visions of heaven and hell may not be related to one particular religion, since all claim to see their gods or prophets when going to heaven in the near death experience...

EDIT:

Well not all, the majority. I heard that only about 10% sees hell (whether Christian or non-Christian), I admit, I'm not sure if this is true though.
edit on 1-9-2011 by arpgme because: For more information



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 07:56 AM
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I need some sleep, 10:55 pm here. I live in Australia.

I will continue the discussion tomorrow.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 08:22 AM
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There was a guy on another forum I used to go to who claimed he could do the out of body thing

He used to post that on his visit to the other side he would often find Christians wondering around weeping because they couldn’t find Jesus and he said this proved the bible was nothing but fiction

To complicate matters the Christians on the site said that since that OBE guy wasn’t a Christian, when he went to the other side he must go to some part of hell and the Christians he kept bumping in to just weren’t the right kind of Christians? (so probably Catholics or Jehovah Witless’s or Mormons)

the OBE guy/the different flavours of Christians used to get in to total flame wars over all this – tears of laughter just rolled down my cheeks reading those threads



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 08:52 AM
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reply to post by XplanetX
 


You wrote:

["I am personally convinced of the accuracy of the scriptures, after reading many books on the subject of their authenticity."]

And undoubtly there are many books claiming the opposite. Personally I prefer to do my own thinking and start from as basic facts, as I can find and understand. I don't need anyone to predigest or 'authorize' my conclusions.

(With basic facts I don't necessarily mean reductionist materialistic science. Sufficiently broad comparative analyses with a functional methodology of human observations will do also. Such procedures with rather exact criteria exist).

That you and the books you relate on have similar opinions, doesn't move the subject into an 'objective' category (which I don't 'accuse' you of trying to do either). As long as you present a faith, and as a faith only, it's quite legitimate from the perspective of a rational position of 'debate-ethics'.

There's nothing derogatory about 'subjective' positions. We all have them somewhere in parts of our lives.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 08:58 AM
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Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by XplanetX
 


Ah, I see. So these visions of heaven and hell may not be related to one particular religion, since all claim to see their gods or prophets when going to heaven in the near death experience...

EDIT:

Well not all, the majority. I heard that only about 10% sees hell (whether Christian or non-Christian), I admit, I'm not sure if this is true though.
edit on 1-9-2011 by arpgme because: For more information


There actually exist a very broad and many-perspectived amount of information on this. Unfortunately not compiled suffiently to make any even slightly trustworthy conclusions. Though some speculations seem to have higher value than others.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 09:07 AM
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It was Athenagorus, a Christian, but whose teachings, according to the Encyclopaedia Britannica, were strongly tinged with Platonism, who had introduced the teaching of an immortal soul into Christianity

From the third century the darkness of the infiltration of man-made beliefs into Christianity deepened until the Dark Ages had smothered almost all the light of God’s Word. At the beginning of this time, the first attempts were made to create a systematic set of beliefs. It is not surprising that an ever-burning hell and the immortality of the soul were prominently included.

It is at this time that such beliefs, held by most Christians today, had their origin. An ever-burning hell has remained a commonly taught doctrine of the Christian religion to this day. It was not based on the Bible but on philosophy. Bible verses were later sought to uphold the ancient philosophies of the Greeks, and added to the teaching.

www.truthaccordingtoscripture.com...


Jesus never taught this doctorine. I am sorry but he didnt.
What Jesus taught was love and peace. Carrying for all man kind.
And extending what we precieve is our own little bubble to take care of.
Then he told us to teach the ways of love.

By holding the fake doctorine's of christ. You inturn are teaching the same
fear and mania the church used to manipulate people during the dark ages.
I dont care what new pretty package its in. Thats the same fruitcake being regifted
every christmass. BTW, when did Jesus set someone on fire for oppossing beliefs.

LOTZA LUV
If you're on a thread Im on Bogo, of course I am going to say hi.
How'd the house painting go??



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 09:17 AM
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Originally posted by arpgme
Bible says that you don't go to hell when you die, you go to the grave and get resurrected by Jesus for the final judgement, THEN you are cast into the fire for eternity. There are also NON-Christians who experiences Near Death Experiences and seen heaven. So, even if this is true, it isn't biblical.



Also, take a look at this site if you desire.



Intersting topic to be sure.

The thief on the cross next to Jesus asked Jesus to forgive him, and remember him. Jesus said to him "and i say to you this day, you shall be in paradise with me".

I found this link that explains it in detail.

www.ebibleanswers.com...

Apparently our only hope is to believe in Jesus, for until the day of resurrection, we know nothing and we are dead. We go to "sleep" and our conciousness ceases to exist.

On the other hand you have people with NDE's who claim that their spirits have gone to heaven, but even if you were "clinically" dead you still have some lower brain function so you might hullucinate.

On one hand we have what people with NDE's have, on the other hand we have what scripture says. So whose the liar, Jesus or people with NDE's? I think its people with NDE's, they have some form of hallucination while they hover near death, a kind of dream that the Holy Spirit uses to comfort them so they will not be afraid to die. The Holy Spirit is reassuring them that they will be ressurected (my opinion on it).



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 09:29 AM
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reply to post by lonewolf19792000
 


You wrote:

["Apparently our only hope is to believe in Jesus,...."]

What do you mean "OUR"? And on top of that, it's probably YOUR Jesus-version, you're talking about.

Quote: ["On one hand we have what people with NDE's have, on the other hand we have what scripture says. So whose the liar, Jesus or people with NDE's?"]

Basically Paulus is the liar. But in the restricted Perry Mason choice you present* ( say "YES" or "NO"), the pauline Jesus would be the liar compared to NDEs.

* Don't you guys never learn, that you are not dictating the premises.



posted on Sep, 1 2011 @ 09:31 AM
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reply to post by Mividau
 


I saw the link you posted. I have to say this. That good and evil do not co-exist, there is a chasm between those in hell and those in heaven so that they may not intermingle or co-exist.

This is a highly controversial topic because all we have to go on are books written by men long dead, which in all likely hood have been mistranslated in certain places, either on accident or on purpose. We have nothing but speculation and conjecture to go on, and what we each personally believe from our repsective churches.

Do we exist after we die? The bible says no, in several places until the resurrection in which we are given bodies which cannot die, this is our only hope. Believe in Jesus and have hope to be resurrected into life, or refuse him and be resurrected into damnation and thrown into the lake of fire on judgement day to be consumed and cease existence.

So you see, when you are thrown into the lake of fire you cease to exist because you ARE consumed. Consume=destroyed for eternity, in the ancient times to be consumed meant it was destroyed. Good and evil cease to co-exist because evil will be destroyed in the ultimate judgement.



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