Defeating Smart-Meter Surveillance, page 2

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reply posted on 2-9-2011 @ 12:48 AM by RelentlessLurker

a software radio can also be configured communicate with them apparently.

software radio supplies
Simple Software Radio Peripheral
GNU Radio

reply posted on 2-9-2011 @ 01:38 AM by Sippy Cup

reply to post by RelentlessLurker

Some information here to think about , not as hip on all the tech details of wifi and interception of it. Now you mentioned it could monitor what device a user would be using ….”like a Nintendo” Now what if I plug that Nintendo into a receiver that has two 120v outputs on the back of it?

edit on 2-9-2011 by Sippy Cup because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 2-9-2011 @ 09:22 AM by RelentlessLurker

reply to post by Sippy Cup

well if by receiver, you mean one of these

then yes, they will see you using the receiver and not the nintendo.

its the same idea as a proxy server, but with power.

reply posted on 2-9-2011 @ 12:33 PM by hounddoghowlie

i was wondering if these meters use the same frequency as cell phones, if you could get a cell phone jammer and a timer.
connect the jammer to the timer and set timer to come on at different times, and then reset timer for a different times the following week and keep doing this so that it is always at different times, and then maybe set it to stay on all day off and on. this way they can't pin it down and pull the meter.

reply posted on 2-9-2011 @ 05:34 PM by Pilgrum

Sounds like we're attributing greater capabilities to the 'smart' meters than they can actually achieve. They simply monitor circuits eg normal tariff and off-peak with additional ability to 'know' when it's peak demand time potentially allowing you to limit your demand at that time. Problem is it's more for the distributors benefit than the consumer and people here with 'smart' and 'pay as you go' electronic meters find they do end up paying considerably more on average than those with older 'dumb' meters (disk types). The PAYG type meters I'm referring to are the ones you use a smart card to 'charge' up your credit meaning you're paying in advance, not after you use the power as with normal metering and they don't need to read those at all unless there's an anomaly in your usage pattern which causes them to investigate for possible tampering (yes they do closely monitor those accounts).

The meter has no idea of what's consuming the current it's measuring and no 'spying' facilities are hidden in there, just the ability to measure your consumption in kWh at different rates which would have required 2 meters of the old type eg 1 for general supply rate and 1 for off-peak hot water. Not having to enter the premises to read the meter saves distributors a lot of man hours in terms of meter readers but they definitely don't pass on those savings to customers (not here at least).

edit on 2/9/2011 by Pilgrum because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 3-9-2011 @ 10:12 AM by RelentlessLurker

reply to post by Pilgrum

and it sounds like you live in a place other than north america. and are talking about a different meter alltogether.

none of the meters we are discussing are "pay as you go"

and the power company has already stated that they can and are turning specific things on/off remotely.

i.e your on vacation and your fans or air conditioning are left running. they turn it off for you. this has already happened to me.

on top of that, where i live you can log onto the power companies website, access your account, and view specific usage. you can see how much Television your watching monthly, you can see if your leaving your lights onn too often, you can see if your refrigerator is running (haha sorry :lol

. they even have the commercials on tv where the dad is scolding the daughter for watching too much tv and hes says "now with these new smart meters i can be a power cop" or something equally lame.

this is allegedly how they "save you money"

the meter does nothing but report the information to the power company via new wireless infrastructure, instead of an employee physically going to the meter.

the thing most folks are afraid of is that because the wireless infrastructure is so insecure, not only the power company but hackers can control things remotely to. if you would just click a few of the links in the thread and read the articles you would already know this has been proven many times over. multiple security companies have proven this (in america)

the old meters had no input and therefore no security risk.(or health for that matter)

the new meters not only have input but they are constantly broadcasting an output. meaning not only the power company is monitoring specific usage but anybody with enough knowledge and free time can do the same. we can speculate as to who would do such a thing...corporations....criminals...vindictive ex-wives...reptilians...

one of the security companies that attacked these things in california said they were even able to make a "virus" that could spread to 35,000 meters in 1 day.

in a way your right, there is nothing smart about the meter. the term "smart" applies more to the human being monitoring the meter.

edit on 3-9-2011 by RelentlessLurker because: changed a word

reply posted on 3-9-2011 @ 10:23 AM by RelentlessLurker

reply to post by hounddoghowlie

they do not operate on cell phone frequencies but they do piggyback cell phone signals.

they can still be jammed, and you should still in turn disrupt cellular usage by jamming your meter, if you live in an area where cellular companies are doing this.

many popular Chinese websites that sell cell phone jammers will (if you ask) tweak them to jam any custom frequency you wish.

i believe a "wifi jammer" (2.4ghz) will jam many of the major functions of these meters, but if you listen to them they claim its in the 900mhz range.

check local laws to make sure this is allowed before doing so.

youll also probably need one 3 watts or higher. or it will just out-transmit you in power.

i would speculate that by jamming the receiver on the telephone pole you would disrupt the readings of an entire neighborhood....

reply posted on 3-9-2011 @ 11:38 AM by Pilgrum

reply to post by RelentlessLurker

You're quite correct in that I live about as far away from the US as you could get and I'm beginning to realise how fortunate I am

. 'They' can only control appliances that have the ability to be remotely controlled so you could foil their evil plans by simply using 'dumb' appliances. I have seen an internet enabled refrigerator and that almost had me falling over laughing - do you all have wifi fridges, aircon, lights, TV etc over there now? There are TVs on sale here now with broadband connectivity but you have to connect them to your communications wiring or router which, I guess, means features enabling remote control can be disabled if that possibility disturbs you.

The power company's intentions aren't completely evil if they're using such features to reduce peak demand on the overall system which delays the need to strengthen the reticulation system (& keeps costs down). Whether the savings are reflected in your monthly bills is something else though.

If the communications are carried on a 2.4GHz signal, that just happens to be the frequency most disturbing to water molecules and, therefore, the frequency of a microwave oven's magnetron so running a microwave with the door open would totally wreck (or 'jam') the signal assuming it's wireless transmission but it's going to be expensive keeping the microwave going not to mention the health risks of doing that. If it's powerline carried, some extra reactance added to the circuit will kill it (inductance or capacitance). The drawback of 'jamming' is that you need to transmit a much stronger carrier than the one carrying data and for those worried about the health effect of the power company signal, it's simply not a wise option to go bathing in your own version of the radiation 24/7.

reply posted on 3-9-2011 @ 11:43 AM by ACTS 2:38

reply to post by RelentlessLurker

Do not use car batteries, as they are designed to be topped off all the time and not ran down and charged up.

Use golf cart batteries as they are designed to be drained to the bottom and recharged and will last longer.

reply posted on 7-9-2011 @ 07:22 AM by RelentlessLurker

reply to post by Pilgrum

thankfully the net-fridge never really took off...

and your right only certain newer things are able to be controlled. i think the compact flourescent lightbulb may be one of them. might be why they are pushing so hard to get them implemented.

an open microwave would jam your entire neighborhood!

and probably increase the cancer rate at least two-fold.

reply posted on 7-11-2011 @ 05:16 PM by margaretr

I found this thread when I did a search for 'smart meter'.
The European Union has directed that by 2020 every home in Britain will have one.
The use of tinfoil and copper mesh to block the radiation is intriguing - I want to know more.

I wish to reduce my exposure to EMF radiation.
I long ago binned my microwave oven.
I have abandoned my radio landline phone and plugged in the old style corded phone.
The internet is an essential lifeline for me because I am housebound for health reasons.
My PC is connected to my BT Homehub with an ethernet cable.

I have been told that the hub will still be transmitting wireless capability.

Will wrapping it in several layers of tinfoil protect me from its radiation?

I am an elderly disbled person, so if this question appears ludicrous to you please be aware that I am a novice to electronic gadgetry.

reply posted on 7-11-2011 @ 08:35 PM by pauljs75

The conspiracy here in Illinois is that ComEd (an Excelon Company) got the taxpayers here to foot the bill for it, thanks to the campaign contributions they gave to state representatives and despite the protests and complaints by state citizens. Oh, and never mind that the power company is actually profitable and could easily foot the bill for this upgrade themselves. They don't need taxpayer money to do this.

I'd advise that anyone here in the state of Illinois learn how to phone their state representatives, such that they know who to call whenever there are any issues with the local electricity. Afterall, by their actions they've taken some responsibility for the electrical service now.

Oh and those complaints by ComEd regarding how such a "smart grid" could fix reliability... Like that week long outage that happened this summer... How about doing the maintenance you were supposed to? Stuff like inspecting lines and trimming trees that interfere with them. The "smart grid" still isn't going to fix that problem.

It's not that much in way of surveillance other than keeping tighter tabs on usage such that they can leverage such info to jack up the rates. Not a paranoia category thing, but still a bad thing in my book.

reply posted on 24-11-2011 @ 04:50 AM by mwuhi

Originally posted by RelentlessLurker
there exists an inexpensive device Power Inverter. all this device does is change a current from AC to DC.

An inverter converts DC to AC, battery power to household current.

Originally posted by ACTS 2:38
Do not use car batteries, as they are designed to be topped off all the time and not ran down and charged up.

Use golf cart batteries as they are designed to be drained to the bottom and recharged and will last longer.

Car batteries can be used as long as the battery charger is always charging them so they are not deeply discharged. Car batteries are no good if you want to run off batteries alone for more than a few minutes for above reasons. Deep cycle or dual purpose batteries can be used for extended periods without the charger, they are the same size and shape as a car battery.

This set up is fine if your only going to run a few small things, a 1000 watt inverter is fairly cheap, but if you want to run 1000 watts continuously you will need a 100 amp battery charger. One deep cycle battery would be enough.

If you want to run the whole house continuously, including air conditioning, fridge, deep freeze and other power hungry things, and 220 volt things like hot water tank, electric heat, stove and things like that you gonna need a huge inverter like 5000 watts or more and it must have 110V and 220V outlets, those inverters cost a fortune. The battery charger would have to be 400 amps which costs a fortune. And you would need at least 5 deep cycle batteries which would be very expensive. Efficiency of inverter, battery charger, and batteries would be no better than 75% so you you would be paying significantly more for the electricity.

edit on 24-11-2011 by mwuhi because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 24-11-2011 @ 05:29 AM by mwuhi

Originally posted by Pilgrum
reply to post by RelentlessLurker

If it's powerline carried, some extra reactance added to the circuit will kill it (inductance or capacitance).

If you joined some electric motor starting capacitors together and plugged then into any wall socket that would provide the required capacitance.

reply posted on 16-1-2012 @ 06:08 PM by Hx3_1963

Wrong Thread...my bad...