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Originally posted by esdad71
reply to post by _BoneZ_
You are referring to a statement that Skilling made on a paper that was published in 1964, a three page white paper with no research, documentation or analysis that can be proven. There is NO supporting documentation. So, your one statement that says that cannot come down is an assumption and nothing more. Did you think I do not know the paper you are referring to or bring up?
Robertson has also said that it was designed to withstand a strike but that does not mean that would continue to remain standing. Again, it means it would survive the impact. Which it did so this is a moot point.
Originally posted by psikeyhackr
What if it is physically IMPOSSIBLE for any skyscraper that big to collapse that fast?
Originally posted by -PLB-
No corroboration with any other audio source
Originally posted by -PLB-
Edited by a truther
Originally posted by -PLB-
Plausible alternative explanations
Originally posted by -PLB-
Jets were accelerating, not possible when it came from an explosion.
Originally posted by -PLB-
One building collapsing similar as another building is not evidence of CD, that is a fallacy.
Originally posted by esdad71
You are referring to a statement that Skilling made on a paper that was published in 1964, a three page white paper
On the evening of May 20, 1946, a United States Army Air Forces C-45 Beechcraft airplane crashed into the north side of the building. The twin-engined plane was heading for Newark Airport on a flight originating at Lake Charles Army Air Field in Louisiana. It struck the 58th floor of the building at approximately 8:10 PM, creating a 20 by 10-foot (3.0 m) hole in the masonry, and killing all five aboard the plane, including a WAC officer. Fog and low visibility were identified as the main causes of the crash. At the time of the accident, LaGuardia Field reported a heavy fog that reduced the ceiling to 500 feet (150 m), obscuring the view of the ground for the pilot at the building's 58th story level. Upon impact, several parts of the aircraft, along with pieces of brick and mortar from the building, fell into the street below. However, there were no reported injuries of any of the estimated 2,000 workers in the building, nor anyone on the street
On the evening of May 20, 1946, a United States Army Air Forces C-45 Beechcraft airplane crashed into the north side of the building. The twin-engined plane was heading for Newark Airport on a flight originating at Lake Charles Army Air Field in Louisiana. It struck the 58th floor of the building at approximately 8:10 PM, creating a 20 by 10-foot (3.0 m) hole in the masonry, and killing all five aboard the plane, including a WAC officer. Fog and low visibility were identified as the main causes of the crash. At the time of the accident, LaGuardia Field reported a heavy fog that reduced the ceiling to 500 feet (150 m), obscuring the view of the ground for the pilot at the building's 58th story level. Upon impact, several parts of the aircraft, along with pieces of brick and mortar from the building, fell into the street below. However, there were no reported injuries of any of the estimated 2,000 workers in the building, nor anyone on the street
Originally posted by _BoneZ_
As has been stated numerous times, witness testimony is the number one form of evidence in a court of law. The explosions in "9/11 Eyewitness" are corroborated by first responders. First responders are used in court every single day as credible and reliable witnesses. For you to discount their testimony is somewhat disturbing.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Rick Siegel has publicly stated that he payed someone to edit the video and was not happy with the outcome of the editing, but he still publicized the video because people needed to see and hear what happened at the WTC. I also don't believe Siegel considers himself a "truther".
Originally posted by -PLB-
I think it's more like "plausible denial explanations". There are no plausible alternatives when you hear 9 or 10 loud explosions in a video before the collapse of a building. Then you read witness testimony to those same exact number of explosions before the collapse of a building. That is evidence beyond any reasonable doubt that those explosions occurred.
Originally posted by -PLB-
If by "jets" you mean the puffs or ejections of dust/debris, then that is your (or someone else's) unprovable opinion, nothing more.
What is not an opinion is that those "jets" have never been seen in any other building collapse in history except for controlled demolitions and there's no possible way you can prove otherwise. That is something that many of you need to accept.
Originally posted by -PLB-
If buildings could have all support columns across the entire building fail at the same time causing the building to fall straight down simply by fire:
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/a39ae149b0f6.gif[/atsimg]
...then controlled demolition companies would be using simple office fires to bring steel-structured buildings down at a fraction of the cost it takes them currently to set a building up with explosives and pay a team to do it.
Originally posted by _BoneZ_
Originally posted by -PLB-
Jets were accelerating, not possible when it came from an explosion.
If by "jets" you mean the puffs or ejections of dust/debris, then that is your (or someone else's) unprovable opinion, nothing more.
What is not an opinion is that those "jets" have never been seen in any other building collapse in history except for controlled demolitions and there's no possible way you can prove otherwise. That is something that many of you need to accept.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Witness testimonies are not reliable.
Originally posted by -PLB-
We have a large video and audio record. All these videos and audio tracks should corroborate those explosions at exactly the same time. They don't.
Originally posted by -PLB-
and wind.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Excluding those explanations shows bias.
Originally posted by -PLB-
I am willing to consider explosions as cause, but that theory needs to be corroborated with other audio tracks.
Originally posted by -PLB-
This is a baseless claim. You do not know what has been observed in history.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Buildings usually do not collapse without explosives
Originally posted by -PLB-
(note that buildings usually also do not suffer from plane impacts and uncontrolled fires)
Originally posted by -PLB-
This must have been told to you before, the penthouse of the building collapsed several seconds before the rest. Can you show me a controlled demolition video where something similar happened?
Originally posted by GenRadek
So why is it that when watching the jets, they actually accelerate and gain more and more dust and debris being ejected over time?
Originally posted by _BoneZ_
Originally posted by GenRadek
So why is it that when watching the jets, they actually accelerate and gain more and more dust and debris being ejected over time?
Someone wrote that on some website, and you guys just run with it because it gives you another aspect of controlled demolition to deny. Someone's opinion on some website is not a fact.
Originally posted by _BoneZ_
You're only partially correct on this point. A single witness trying to remember key elements of something can have questionable reliability. However, when more than one witness reports the same exact thing, the reliability becomes unimpeachable and their testimony becomes fact.
What you and many others fail to realize is the noise-pollution factor. Some microphones can handle more noise pollution than others. Most of the cameras near the WTC had noise pollution from city noise, loud sirens, sound blocked or distorted by buildings, etc. The camera in Hoboken had none of the city or siren noise pollution, and had an unobstructed view of the WTC.
Audio 101. Google it.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Gotta love it when someone pulls the "wind" disinformation card when it comes to that video. ... Can you not see the ignorance and denial with the "wind" disinformation?
Originally posted by -PLB-Those sounds, some to the exact number, are corroborated by witness testimony. That's corroboration enough unless one intends to remain in denial and ignorance to the facts. Once you do a little research on audio editing and sound pollution, maybe you won't be so hasty to demand every single video at the WTC to have similar sounds. That will never happen.
If we didn't know what has been observed in history, then we wouldn't have any history at all, would we?
Note that the damage from the impacts was minor and therefore irrelevant. This was documented by NIST and the analyses 30 years before 9/11.
Also note the fires have never caused a steel-structured highrise to collapse, totally and completely, so that point is irrelevant also. Buildings cannot collapse through themselves at or near free fall without assistance. There's no getting around this fact.
Originally posted by -PLB-There was an explosion that caused the penthouse to collapse through the roof, then additional explosions that caused the building to collapse.
When a building is wired for explosives, they can make that building come down any way they want. Including making the penthouse collapse first, then the rest of the building.
Don't forget, it is impossible for any building to collapse through itself at or near free-fall without assistance. Anything else you say is made-up strawmen based on denial and ignorance.
Flashes, ejections, pre-collapse and during-collapse explosions, timed booms, the speed that the buildings collapsed........ all indicative of controlled demolitions and none have ever been associated with fire-induced collapses. There is no getting around these facts, no matter what excuses you make up.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Originally posted by _BoneZ_Don't forget, it is impossible for any building to collapse through itself at or near free-fall without assistance. Anything else you say is made-up strawmen based on denial and ignorance.
Baseless claim by a complete layman.
Originally posted by -PLB-
So what about all the witnesses who didn't hear explosions? Aren't those equally reliable, and their testimony fact? Or are you only taking the testimonies you like in consideration?
Originally posted by -PLB-
Any sound that loud should be recorded on any mic, especially when you are closer. You are actually claiming that mics further away are better at recording explosions than cameras close to it. This is pure fabricated truther nonsense.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Stuff that never happened before happens.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Your argument is that because it looks like controlled demolition, it must be controlled demolition.
Originally posted by -PLB-
Baseless claim by a complete layman.
Originally posted by -PLB-
All your "evidence" has rational explanations
Originally posted by -PLB-
Like I say, real evidence is missing
Originally posted by _BoneZ_
Anyone that was close to the WTC heard and felt the explosions. First responders, by-standers, survivors, news reporters.
It's only nonsense to the uneducated. If you've never been in an audio studio, or know how to operate an audio mixer, then you don't know that very loud sounds can overwhelm a microphone and cause those sounds to get distorted and not to pick up any more sounds because it is overwhelmed.
So, I'll post it one more time for you: Audio 101. Google it. Please learn about audio recording and mixing before you comment any further on this point.
Originally posted by -PLB-Along with audio editing and mixing, I guess mathematics is also not your strong suit. If that something that never happened before happened once on one day, I could accept that. But three times on one day and one day only? You haven't the slightest clue how astronomically high the odds are for that to happen.
And then to add on top of that, the ejections seen as both towers collapsed are also claimed to have been seen for the first time in history in two building collapses that are not controlled demolitions (according to official story supporters); on one day and one day only.
So we have astronomically high and astronomically high which = infinitely high odds that two events happen on one day and one day only. Never seen before or after. Sorry, but that just doesn't cut it in the real world.
Once is acceptable. Twice is coincidence. Three times is sabotage.
Originally posted by _BoneZ_
You're leaving key parts out which can be construed as deliberate deception on your part. The building collapses didn't just look like controlled demolition.
Several first responders, who all corroborate each other, reported flashes in both towers, which are seen only in controlled demolitions.
Numerous witnesses reported timed "booms" as both towers collapsed, which is only heard in controlled demolitions.
The towers exhibited ejections of dust/debris, which have only ever been seen in controlled demolitions.
The speed at which all three WTC buildings fell at or near free-fall, has only ever been achieved in controlled demolitions.
Every single aspect of the collapses of all three WTC buildings exhibited every sign of controlled demolition and no signs of fire-induced collapse. Many of us have begged for years for one of you to show a fire-induced collapse that exhibits the above.
That request still remains unanswered to this day.
If that's all you can come back with, we're doing pretty good.
No. All the evidence has made-up, fairy tale explanations to help people sleep at night because they don't want to accept the consequences of what the evidence really means: that 9/11 was an inside job.
The only "real" evidence you'll accept is the physical evidence and that has all been destroyed. Courts have proven time and time again that you don't need the physical evidence to prove something. So, while you sit in denial and ignorance and push aside all available evidence just because of the lack of physical evidence, the rest of us will press on with getting to the truth.
Originally posted by waypastvne
My first thought, the first time a Truther asked me to look at the "squibs" was, that doesn't look like an explosion. That looks more like someone pointed a jet engine at the window and cranked it up. The exhaust just keeps going and going and going until it disappears. Explosives just don't do that in the real world.
Originally posted by _BoneZ_
Someone wrote that on some website, and you guys just run with it because it gives you another aspect of controlled demolition to deny. Someone's opinion on some website is not a fact.
We're not debating this yet again. Those ejections have only ever been seen in controlled demolitions and no amount of peoples' opinions are going to make this point any less factual.
Either show a building collapse that exhibits these isolated ejections that is not a controlled demolition, or stop trying to debate this fact with someone's opinions.