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US 'wasted $30bn on Afghanistan and Iraq' over decade

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posted on Aug, 30 2011 @ 09:55 AM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 


Fraud or Corruption? I say corruption, the article says fraud, B.S. The US governmental officials are all connected with major corporations, they make policies for those corporations. If this is not fraud, then I don't know what is, taking American wealth and giving it freely for political and economic benefits. This a disturbing trend in the Western world which has caused the current economic crisis.

The bail out exposed the corruption after decades of complete suppression. Over a billion went straight to the pockets of CEOs, exposing the disturbing trend, the disturbing theft and pocketing of wealth of the masses.




posted on Aug, 30 2011 @ 10:03 AM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 


Exactly is more than billions is about trillions been wasted by the US in those two countries the first thing that came to my mind when i read the post was that is not millions but trillions, like you say a lot of that money went to waste and abuse during the first few months after the invasion of Iraq along with the money that was confiscated from Saddam's coffers.



posted on Aug, 30 2011 @ 10:08 AM
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Originally posted by Aim64C
On a more serious note - Iraq and Afghanistan do not reflect those conditions. Not in areas we actually have influence over. I'm not going to sit here and tell you it's a field full of daisies - but they are both doing better than they were under previous systems. The problem is in how to get them to be self-sufficient.

It's better now?


Do a google search on your own and see for yourself

With all the gibberish you mentioned about me saying this and saying that and then you making an untrue statement when there is loads of refuting articles is



posted on Aug, 30 2011 @ 07:08 PM
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reply to post by brokedown
 



Really, the DOD is not known for good money management practices.

On September 10, 2001 Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld appeared before congress and personally admitted to the DOD losing 2.3 TRILLION dollars.


www.911myths.com...

Let's look a little closer at what Rumsfeld actually said.


The men and women of this department, civilian and military, are our allies, not our enemies. They too are fed up with bureaucracy, they too live with frustrations. I hear it every day. And I'll bet a dollar to a dime that they too want to fix it. In fact, I bet they even know how to fix it, and if asked, will get about the task of fixing it. And I'm asking.
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Waste drains resources from training and tanks, from infrastructure and intelligence, from helicopters and housing. Outdated systems crush ideas that could save a life. Redundant processes prevent us from adapting to evolving threats with the speed and agility that today's world demands.
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The technology revolution has transformed organizations across the private sector, but not ours, not fully, not yet. We are, as they say, tangled in our anchor chain. Our financial systems are decades old. According to some estimates, we cannot track $2.3 trillion in transactions. We cannot share information from floor to floor in this building because it's stored on dozens of technological systems that are inaccessible or incompatible.


That has improved, considerably, since then. The Navy leads the rest of the DoD component in that regard.

I've spoken about waste that I've seen, but the difference between how pay and records are handled these days is like night and day from what it was when I first enlisted. There are still considerable flaws - we're getting away from absolute reliance on NMCI and getting some techies to locally support commands (a good thing), a lot of sites are becoming more integrated and centered around the CAC technology (so I don't have a dozen passwords to twenty different sites that I have to 'update' after every two weeks - some really paranoid #s designed that crap). There are a lot of good things happening.

There's still a lot of the same-old that revolve around the military climate of "you can't fire me" and the age-old budge system that needs to be fundamentally revised (which will require legislation from Congress). Things that, lay well outside the DoD's hands. The reason politicians don't want to get into restructuring budget systems is because the idea will spread to other issues - like Social Security - which has been a time-bomb that no one wants to dick around with and set off (instead, we just play hot-potato and hope it blows up when someone else is holding it, then we can blame them).

The sad thing is that the public school system is worse, and Medicare/Medicaid is several orders of magnitude worse. Medicare loses some 60 billion to fraud every year (on the low end of the estimates). Add that up over a decade with general mismanagement and unnecessary screenings to see what kind of a mess it makes.



posted on Aug, 30 2011 @ 07:35 PM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 



It's better now?


It's worse?


Do a google search on your own and see for yourself


Google is this awesome tool of self-vindication. If I search for: "Conditions in Iraq worse" - I get countless pages of results with that conclusion in the title. There may be a few in there that challenge that, but for every one I come across that says what I don't like - there are about a dozen within a few clicks of a mouse that say exactly what I want.

I can also search for "Conditions in Iraq better" - and get similar topics.


With all the gibberish you mentioned about me saying this and saying that and then you making an untrue statement when there is loads of refuting articles is


With all due disrespect, you can show me the common decency of reading what I posted - or have anal intercourse with a donkey.

I have boots-on-ground contacts to those regions. It's not an issue that can be summed up with "we're winning" or "we're losing." To do so is the pinnacle of ignorance and displays a complete disregard for the problem at hand.

Really - trying to apply a "win/loss" title to it is simply attempting to use the endeavors of others for the purpose of ego-masturbation.

The problem is that you have a culture of people that has lived under a tyrannical system for well over a generation. Bribery was the primary form of representation - to get local authorities to leave you alone or shield you from the influence of policies you didn't approve of from said dictator. You also have various religious groups that were formerly suppressed by Saddam's regime, now taking advantage of 'freedom' to exact millennia-old revenge against each other that started over a stolen goat (or something - it's the #ing Hatfields and McCoys: Arabian Style).

Afghanistan is somewhat similar - although one of the big problems there is the agricultural sector, which long survived on the export of opium (then controlled by the Taliban). Farmers can make much more by growing poppies (for opium) than they can growing food and other things conducive to productive society - and do so without having to pay protection money to the Taliban. So that is a bit of a problem. You also have other competing groups trying to assert power... again - it's the friggin' Hatfields and McCoy's type of stuff.

The governments still have a lot of issues with corruption - they are used to systems of government that work based off of "I have big stick and whack you if you don't do as I say - unless you have money or young girls/boys to pay me with, of course." Breaking that modus operandi has not been easy, and many successes in that area are met by a failure some place else.

It's not like Japan or the Philippines.

Should we just up and leave? Honestly, nothing that happens there is going to convince people to change their opinion on it. I'm an engineer and management-type. Telling me it can't be done is a challenge and opportunity to prove I (or my team) am (is) better than you. It's how I operate. Other people function along different principles and will say "we shouldn't have ever gotten involved, we shouldn't be there, we should leave" - regardless of what is going on, they will find justification for it.

I look at it like this: We are there. What do we need to do to make things work? Everything else is meaningless philosophy that attempts to function on ideology, alone.

However, I can tell you what we will -not- do: pull out of iraq/afghanistan and transfer the funding to cover "lolbamacare" and entitlement programs. Those two objectives tend to correlate with each other quite strongly - to which I say "hell nay."



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