Mathematics Is Wrong. Here's Why.

reply to post by CLPrime

If you are multiplying $100 by 0... you hold a $100 bill, and someone takes it from you (which is usually how the world works).

If you make a equation out of this problem. You get zero as the result. But zero is never multiplied by 100 dollars.

As you say your self: Someone takes it from you. That "someone" can not be 0.

Originally posted by spy66

But i said;
If you have a 100 dollar bill in your hand, and multiply it by 0. That is a different story than what you just displayed.

If you have a 100 dollar bill in your hand, where will you get your 0 from to multiply it with the 100 dollar bill?

Right, but what real-world process is the math modelling that a multiplication by zero arises? For example, $leftovers = $100 x p, where p is the percentage the judge allows me to put back in my pocket after paying a fine. The judge says I must pay a $100 dollar fine, or 100% of the money in my hand, thus the amount left in my hand after paying is $0. $100 x 0 = $0.

Originally posted by john_bmth
reply to post by MathiasAndrew

 

Any number multiplied by zero is zero, therefore $100 x 0 = $0. Where is the mistake in that?

Like I said you have overlooked the true mathematical solution for this equation

when you have 100 x 0 =

you must add the divide by 0 on the other side of the equals sign which then cancels each other and you are left with 100

Do you get it now?


EDIT:
Come on all you math wizards...this is 5th grade algebra..Are you smarter than a fifth grader?

reply to post by MathiasAndrew


Any number times zero is zero. Where are you getting x * 0 = x from?

Originally posted by john_bmth

Originally posted by spy66

But i said;
If you have a 100 dollar bill in your hand, and multiply it by 0. That is a different story than what you just displayed.

If you have a 100 dollar bill in your hand, where will you get your 0 from to multiply it with the 100 dollar bill?

Right, but what real-world process is the math modelling that a multiplication by zero arises? For example, $leftovers = $100 x p, where p is the percentage the judge allows me to put back in my pocket after paying a fine. The judge says I must pay a $100 dollar fine, or 100% of the money in my hand, thus the amount left in my hand after paying is $0. $100 x 0 = $0.

Right:

But you have created a different equation right now, than the one we discussed.

You are no longer talking about 100 X 0

Originally posted by spy66

If you make a equation out of this problem. You get zero as the result. But zero is never multiplied by 100 dollars.

As you say your self: Someone takes it from you. That "someone" can not be 0.

Of course that "someone" isn't 0... that "someone" has nothing to do with anything. It could be a monkey taking the money from you (or giving it to you). It could be the wind blowing the money out of your hand. The point is, all multiplication problems are actually just addition problems in disguise.

100 times 3 is 100 plus 100 plus 100 (100 added three times). 2 times 2 is 2 plus 2 (2 added two times). Multiplication is short-hand for addition... in the same way exponents are short-hand for multiplication, tetration is short-hand for exponentiation, and so on. Therefore, any multiplication problem (or any tetration problem, for that matter) can be written as an addition problem.

100 x 4 = 100+100+100+100.
100 x 1 = 100.
100 x 0 = a null set...which is 0.

Math doesn't bow to real-world examples. We must find real-world examples capable of modelling the math. If we can't, then it's just down to a lack of imagination on our part (or perhaps a lack of an actual real-world example, such as in the case of complex numbers).

reply to post by CLPrime

Math doesn't bow to real-world examples. We must find real-world examples capable of modelling the math. If we can't, then it's just down to a lack of imagination on our part (or perhaps a lack of an actual real-world example, such as in the case of complex numbers).

explained nice and easy

Originally posted by john_bmth
reply to post by MathiasAndrew

 

Any number times zero is zero. Where are you getting x * 0 = x from?

Pay close attention

- = +

* = x

now you can solve the problem correctly

100 x 0 = ... should look like this 100 x +0 = * -0

100 * 0 = .. should look like this 100 * +0 = x -0

the zeros cancel each other out and you're left with 100

Originally posted by spy66
Right:

But you have created a different equation right now, than the one we discussed.

You are no longer talking about 100 X 0

But what is the multiplication by zero representing? What real-world process are trying to describe with math where a multiplication by zero arises? I gave one example myself, if you just keep the money in your hand then my example (or any other example) does not arise. However, in the example I gave, a multiplication by zero does arise, leaving you with $0.

Maybe in all your deep thoughts of the Universe

you overlooked the true and simple 5th grade algebra solution to this problem

EDIT:

Watch this neat little trick which actually applies in real life

John owes Mathias 100 dollars. John has 100 dollars and Mathias has zero dollars. Before John pays Mathias he wants to wants to multiply his 100 dollars by zero and Mathias wants to divide his -100 dollars by 0. John then gives Mathias the 100 dollars he owes him.

Now let's write this in algebra

John +100 = -100 Mathias

John 100 x +0 = Mathias -100 * -0

John 0 = Mathias 100

Originally posted by john_bmth

Originally posted by spy66
Right:

But you have created a different equation right now, than the one we discussed.

You are no longer talking about 100 X 0

But what is the multiplication by zero representing? What real-world process are trying to describe with math where a multiplication by zero arises? I gave one example myself, if you just keep the money in your hand then my example (or any other example) does not arise. However, in the example I gave, a multiplication by zero does arise, leaving you with $0.

Yes:
You described a process in court with the help of "p".
You had to use "p" because you couldn't use 0 to describe your court process to get rid of your 100 dollars. Because by using 0 you don't have a process that can take your 100 dollars away from you.

Zero = no process.

Thought i do like to think about this.
Do we humans have different math from alien life?
Do alien life operate on different math?
Hypothetical, lets say aliens, do divide and multiply etc etc by 0 etc etc.
Is that how they made their spacecraft?
How they can move through dimensions?

I mean is human math wrong?
What we are taught is wrong?

Or is our math, right...but has a bottleneck?
Where we reach that bottleneck we use different math?

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew

Originally posted by john_bmth
reply to post by MathiasAndrew

 

Any number times zero is zero. Where are you getting x * 0 = x from?

Pay close attention

- = +

* = x

now you can solve the problem correctly

100 x 0 = ... should look like this 100 x +0 = * -0

100 * 0 = .. should look like this 100 * +0 = x -0

the zeros cancel each other out and you're left with 100

Distributive property:
100(0) = 100(0 + 0) = 100(0) + 100(0)
Add -(100(0)) to both sides:
-(100(0)) + 100(0) = -(100(0)) + 100(0) + 100(0)
Which leaves us with:
0 = 100(0)
Therefore 100 x 0 = 0

Originally posted by spy66

Yes:
You described a process in court with the help of "p".
You had to use "p" because you couldn't use 0 to describe your court process to get rid of your 100 dollars. Because by using 0 you don't have a process that can take your 100 dollars away from you.

Zero = no process.

P merely represented the number of dollars in your hand. In this case, it was $100. You are using math to describe a real-world process, therefore you have to specify what real-world process allows a multiplication by zero. Otherwise, it does not arise. In the scenario I described, a real-world situation was described by math whereupon a multiplication by zero arose. The mathematical statement 100 x 0 does not exist in the real-world unless you are using math to describe a specific process, such as a judge fining you.

So, when you say "There is no way you can multiply your 100 dollars with Zero" you are incorrect, because you can certainly describe a real-world situation with math where a multiplication by zero arises. When you say "In realty 100 dollars X 0 = 100 dollars" you are incorrect, because you are using math to describe a real-world process, and as we have seen, any number times zero = zero. The mathematical statement 100 X 0 does not exist in the real-world because math is not the real world nor is the real world math. But math can model real world processes, if we so choose. Only then does math correlate with the real world, otherwise it's just an abstract concept.

Edit: sorry, p was the percentage.

reply to post by john_bmth

Distributive property: 100(0) = 100(0 + 0) = 100(0) + 100(0) Add -(100(0)) to both sides: -(100(0)) + 100(0) = -(100(0)) + 100(0) + 100(0) Which leaves us with: 0 = 100(0) Therefore 100 x 0 = 0

You are extremely confused and mistaken in your equations.

I wrote it out for you in simple form already.

Why are you trying to make it look more complicated than it really is ?

Who ever starred your post must have failed algebra and yourself included.

You really don't understand mathematics do you?

Give me an equation of any number multiplied or divided by zero

I will solve it for you. Here it is once again using 100.

First you must start the equation knowing that the process works the same backwards and forwards

thus * = x
+ = -


now add your numbers to that

100 * +0 = 100 x -0

next step is to simplify the equation

The positive zero cancels the negative zero

100 = 100

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew

Who ever starred your post must have failed algebra ...

On the contrary, I passed algebra no problem. Passed all other basic math courses, as well...got 100% on my Grade 12 Pre-Cal exam. That was 4 years ago...I'm currently delving into Tensor Calculus.
Good job with the profiling.

Let me ask you something. Can you define for me what a reciprocal is?

reply to post by CLPrime


the reciprocal of 1 half is 2

the reciprocal of 4 is 1 quarter


EDIT:
Go ahead and check my math in the post above and tell me if i'm wrong

reply to post by MathiasAndrew


That's not what I asked. Maybe I should first get you to define the word "define".

Define reciprocal - both for numbers and operators.

Originally posted by CLPrime
reply to post by MathiasAndrew

 

That's not what I asked. Maybe I should first get you to define the word "define".

Define reciprocal - both for numbers and operators.

Why don't you buy a dictionary.... I will answer your off topic question if you can disprove my results from the equation i solved in the previous post