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Some Christians need to change the way they communicate

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posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 05:25 PM
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reply to post by petrus4
 

It is semantics ... ancient people saw beings other than humans...
...and called them angels and demons and the same beings we call aliens.

They are the same beings with the same behaviours and origins...
...we just have a different world-view...
...and our circumstances with them will just work out as badly as it did ancient cultures...
...some of which sacrificed their own children to get rid of them from among them.

People looking forward to 'disclosure' is like looking forward to an executioner...
...because if ancient manuscripts can be believed it won't be good for humans.




posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 05:26 PM
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reply to post by randyvs
 


The WORD they refer to is the LOGOS.

Here is the short version of the meaning.

en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 05:31 PM
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reply to post by GmoS719
 


That is correct. Jesus, if he did actually grace this earth, was/is and ascended master. As in many before and after him. Buddha, Krishna...etc. Graced with the ability to go beyond the veil of existence and access information all others cannot.

If anything, Jesus wanted us to BE like him, not follow him and certainly not SAVE us! He was placed on a cross because we are idiots full of fear and contempt.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 05:43 PM
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Originally posted by blazenresearcher
reply to post by randyvs
 


The WORD they refer to is the LOGOS.

Here is the short version of the meaning.

en.wikipedia.org...


Seems like I should be telling you, from where I stand. But I havn't been asked and I don't want to be accused of, pushing what I believe on anyone. Although what I believe has been established thru some authority at least.

There's no telling what fanciful things we can find, when we are willing to overlook the truth.
edit on 25-8-2011 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 06:19 PM
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reply to post by SuperiorEd
 




However, in light of the fact that he is the sole interpreter of the Sumerian writings brings a great deal of argument against his image of the ancient cuneiform tablets.


See, this is where you, and others go wrong everytime. Attributing the entire translations to Zecharia Sitchin, He is only one of the men who decoded the ancient cuneiform tablets, there were many others who did it before him, and as I understand it, it is an ongoing project. I do not have their names handy, and supper is ready, so I am sure in a few minutes time you can find them for yourself.
I myself heard about the Anunaki and Nibiru years before I ever heard of
Zecharia Sitchin.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 06:58 PM
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OK, I'm back now with a full belly. Spent a whole 5 minutes, and came up with a list of authors who wrote books other than Sitchin.
www.virtualsecrets.com...

The cuneiform writing system was in use for more than 35 centuries, through several stages of evolution, from the 34th century BC down to the 1st century AD. It was completely replaced by alphabetic writing (in the general sense) in the course of the Roman era and there are no Cuneiform systems in current use. For this reason, it had to be deciphered from scratch in 19th century Assyriology. Successful completion of decipherment is dated to 1857.
en.wikipedia.org...


Knowledge of cuneiform was lost until 1835 when Henry Rawlinson, a British army officer, found some of the Behistun inscriptions on a cliff at Behistun in Persia. Carved in the reign of King Darius of Persia (522 BC­486 BC), they consisted of identical texts in the three official languages of the empire: Old Persian, Babylonian, and Elamite. The Behistun inscription was to the decipherment of cuneiform what the Rosetta Stone was to the decipherment of Egyptian hieroglyphs. Rawlinson correctly deduced that the Old Persian was a syllabic script and he successfully deciphered it. Working independently of him, the Irish Assyriologist Edward Hincks also contributed to the decipherment. After translating the Persian, Rawlinson and Hincks began to decipher the others. They were greatly helped by Paul Émile Botta's discovery of the city of Niniveh in 1842. Among the treasures uncovered by Botta were the remains of the great library of Assurbanipal, a royal archive containing tens of thousands of baked clay tablets covered with cuneiform inscriptions. By 1851, Hincks and Rawlinson could read 200 Babylonian signs. They were soon joined by two other decipherers: a young German-born scholar called Julius Oppert, and the versatile British Orientalist William Henry Fox Talbot. In 1857 the four men met in London and took part in a famous experiment to test the accuracy of their decipherments. Edwin Norris, the secretary of the Royal Asiatic Society, gave each of them a copy of a recently discovered inscription from the reign of the Assyrian emperor Tiglath-Pileser I. A jury of experts was empanelled to examine the resulting translations and assess their accuracy. In all essential points the translations produced by the four scholars were found to be in close agreement with one another. There were of course some slight discrepancies. The inexperienced Talbot had made a number of mistakes, and Oppert's translation contained a few doubtful passages due to his unfamiliarity with the English language. But Hincks' and Rawlinson's versions were virtually identical. The jury declared itself satisfied, and the decipherment of Akkadian cuneiform was adjudged a fait accompli.
www.crystalinks.com...



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 07:33 PM
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I used to view Atheism as just as much of a potential threat to me as Christianity, to be honest. Atheism's most vocal spokespeople tend to be extremely aggressive individuals, in my experience. Recently, though, I've started encountering some atheists online who were not hostile, and seemed very calm and measured most of the time, so my opinion of them has shifted somewhat. It seems to be mainly their leaders who are a problem.

In terms of Christianity, I honestly feel that Jesus Christ himself has a lot less of a problem with me than most Christians I've known have.

I'm not sure why Atheism has come up in this thread, though. I've noticed that atheists *can* be a little expansionist at times. If any other religious group is being talked about, for some reason they feel a need to show up in the middle of it. It's almost as though they don't like anyone else being the centre of attention.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 07:37 PM
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Let me put it this way. I want to believe.I truly do... But I can't.... I just have so many questions. There are so many contradictions, hypocritical acts by " god".... It just doesn't make sense...

What I don't like... Is when I go looking for answers. Not all, but quite a few, take it so personal. Well, it's not meant to be personal. I am not questioning YOUR faith..... I am just...trying to find my own....

so.... Telling me " See you in hell" or what have you.... It just pushes me away even more... when all I am trying to do is get closer...



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 07:50 PM
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Originally posted by gimme_some_truth
Let me put it this way. I want to believe.I truly do... But I can't.... I just have so many questions. There are so many contradictions, hypocritical acts by " god".... It just doesn't make sense...


The Christians aren't going to like this; but to be brutally honest, for anyone seeking a path to God, Christianity isn't a religion I'd recommend. I left it myself for a reason; several reasons, in fact.

As an individual, Jesus Christ is exemplary. You can learn a lot from studying his message, and I'd heartily encourage anyone to do so. Christians themselves, however, are a very different story.

It's basically like Gandhi said. "I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ."



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 08:22 PM
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reply to post by Josonic
 
HI Josonic - I just wanted to provide a different perspective on this...granted, I'm likely considered heretical by the majority of christendom, aside from the SDAs and a few others.

If you read the bible itself, it will soon become apparent that the concept a generally-immortal soul for all, and eternal/unending punishment for the unsaved isn't biblical. I'm sure you've familiar with the famous verse John 3.16?


For God so loved the world that He gave His only-begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him shall not perish, but shall have eternal life.


You'll notice that the gift to those who believe is eternal life, and the result for those who don't is to "perish". Later, Paul teaches in Romans:


For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is life eternal in Christ Jesus our Lord.


Catching the theme yet? Sin/non-acceptance = death, belief/gift of God/whatnot = eternal life. As far as I can tell, the concept of an eternal hell and immortal torture for the unsaved was a romish catholic innovation devised as nothing less than a scare tactic...and a sad one, at that.

Elsewhere, the bible teaches that the saved (in revelation, and the new heaven/earth) will have access to the tree of life, and that prior to this all the dead will be raised and judged ACCORDING TO THEIR DEEDS, and not necessarily according to their acceptance of the christian/pre-christian message (Rev. 20, 11-15).

I sincerely believe there is a lot more grey area than most christians purport, and that even 'atheists' and other non-believers may better respond to the 'law of God in their minds and as written on their hearts' (conscience, justice, etc.) than some self-avowed 'christians'.

Even as the one called Jesus himself taught, a lot of 'christians' will be surprised to find out they didn't make the cut - and there are a LOT of 'christians' out there:

Matthew 7 -

13 “Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. 14 Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.



21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’


Just my thoughts, and I could be entirely wrong, I suppose...but from what I read in the book most of us claim to follow, I don't think I am. I believe I'm at least a lot less wrong than those more judgemental yet more war-minded and angry-seeming than myself seem to be.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 08:24 PM
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Toxicblud

You know the animals, might have a lot to say about that if they could speak.

I imagine something that would begin like:

WT did you just say? Not up in here ! You peddle that garbage on the otherside of the tracks Pal.
edit on 25-8-2011 by randyvs because: (no reason given)


and what tracks would those be randy? It never surprises me when christians lash out at another for not being like them. Sorry but National Socialism didnt work, just get over it Randy. Hitler youth=Christian youth?? uh oh...

p.s. werent you guys the ones responsible for all those innocent people being hanged and burned during the salem witch trials?? I was born in salem and I take great offense to any christian even speaking......or breathing... kidddinngggg. Im not like you lol.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 08:47 PM
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You are correct. Wikipedia gives a pretty good summary of the process to decode the original Akkadian and Hittite tablets. The key to understanding where Sitchin stands is to examine the transliteration of the language from original to English. This reveals the broad stroke of the brush that was used to fit the writings into a form of truth that does not follow the path and morphology of the language. These early languages were the roots of the phoenician pictographs. These pictographs in Eastern culture then moved to Ancient Hebrew and Aramaic. Along with this language came the growth of man's understanding of God. Is there some relation to the original? YES. What we know is the original. The point here is not the fact of origin in the text. The point is realizing that Sitchen transliterated the language to His own interpretation. What I say here is the excluded middle that unifies the paradox between.

To understand how to rightly divide truth, you must be familiar with Hillel's Seven Rules. This is better known as hermeneutics. Hillel was the Rabbi to Paul and Simeon. When Paul talks about rightly dividing truth, He is referring to rightly dividing the counterfeit truth form the actual truth. Hermeneutics originates with Hermes. Truth is hermetically sealed and passed on in symbol to the future of mankind. These truths are sealed for a reason.

All the minds that traversed the wilderness of God's earth from the Sumerian culture to the present day have traveled this path of sealed knowledge. We cannot allow ourselves to dismiss what came before for a Johnny-come-lately selling books of transliterated myth. Reason and logic need to be employed.

Now it becomes a matter of intent. What is the intent of any document you can read? This is the point of rightly dividing truth. Intent is clearly defined by the fruit it bears. Only one tree is worth climbing. The Bible accurately calls reality by the physics that it took to create it. No other book dares make the claims of this nature. The fruit is love. If love is not in the image, then the image is only a reflection of the original. The Living Word is Jesus. All other reflections start with Him and work their way out. The Bible is second on the list.


Originally posted by autowrench
reply to post by SuperiorEd
 




However, in light of the fact that he is the sole interpreter of the Sumerian writings brings a great deal of argument against his image of the ancient cuneiform tablets.


See, this is where you, and others go wrong everytime. Attributing the entire translations to Zecharia Sitchin, He is only one of the men who decoded the ancient cuneiform tablets, there were many others who did it before him, and as I understand it, it is an ongoing project. I do not have their names handy, and supper is ready, so I am sure in a few minutes time you can find them for yourself.
I myself heard about the Anunaki and Nibiru years before I ever heard of
Zecharia Sitchin.

edit on 25-8-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)

edit on 25-8-2011 by SuperiorEd because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 09:16 PM
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Originally posted by petrus4

Originally posted by gimme_some_truth
Let me put it this way. I want to believe.I truly do... But I can't.... I just have so many questions. There are so many contradictions, hypocritical acts by " god".... It just doesn't make sense...


The Christians aren't going to like this; but to be brutally honest, for anyone seeking a path to God, Christianity isn't a religion I'd recommend. I left it myself for a reason; several reasons, in fact.

As an individual, Jesus Christ is exemplary. You can learn a lot from studying his message, and I'd heartily encourage anyone to do so. Christians themselves, however, are a very different story.

It's basically like Gandhi said. "I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ."


Really, id love to have faith in.... ANY religion... I just can't find one that makes any sense to me.... Sure there are spiritual texts ( Not religious...spiritual) that make sense... Mostly far eastern...such as the tao.... but..


I just...lost my faith in any kind of God...I can't take the bible seriously. and.... I don't know. I wish I did know...But I don't.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 05:42 AM
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reply to post by GmoS719
 


A devastatingly superficial reduction of the matter.

Christianity isn't just a cultural tradition, or a way of life but a worldview that claims to describe reality as it is. Its foundation is much older and much much deeper than you realize.

Peace.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 05:49 AM
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Originally posted by GmoS719

Originally posted by Josonic

Originally posted by Ophiuchus 13
RELIGION IS A FORM OF SELF GOVERNING


Religion is the opposite of self-governing. It's being governed by an outside source(the Bible, the Qur'an, God). It literally is being governed by something else.

ATHEISM IS A FORM OF SELF GOVERNING


Atheism is a form of immaturity.
You need to grow up.
Look around you.
How could this earth, no not earth, This UNIVERSE.
How could the universe even exist with out God?
Impossible.


You're telling someone else to grow up and then you support a mythical being that popped into existence snapped his fingers and created the universe? How about humans if a god created us he didn't put much thought into it. Why do we breathe oxygen nitrogen makes up 78% of the atmosphere. Why is it some animals can regenerate their limbs but we can't? Also why are we susceptible to disease if you were creating a life form wouldn't you make it so it were immune to everything so it could live to the best of it's ability.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 05:55 AM
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reply to post by gimme_some_truth
 


What are some of your questions, if I may ask?



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 07:44 AM
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Well, considering this entire thread appears to be based on my one post in the referenced thread, let's see exactly what I posted:

"I am at odds here to most of the other posters. After years of following the UFO phenomena, I have come to the conclusion that they are bad spirits. Quite spooky how they repeat the message of occult channelers and the Satanic 'NWO' -
..."Gaia [Mother Earth] is not happy with you. She is going to go into great travail soon as she purges herself of the toxins you have poured out upon her."

"You will find that all your religions are false, based on a controlling, cold-hearted, patriarchal movement, when in actuality it is the mother goddess who is behind all things."

"Sin is an archaic concept developed by the patriarchal religious systems to place man in bondage and guilt."
www.jeffersonscott.com...

I'm sorry, but you are the parent here. Yes, children are innocent but they are also easy prey.

Nearly every religion on this planet - from Native American to Christianity - all know about these dimensional spirits.

Dark shadow people are not angels... "

That's all that I said. Fullstop. Is it short and to the point? Yes. So, you felt that the the way I communicated was so horrendous that you felt the need to create another Christian bashing thread? I rather hope that it was the rebuke in the message that I delivered than actually that a 'Christian' delivered it.

That entire other thread deals with parents of young children apparently hearing 'messages' from these aliens, and actually encouraging other mums to see what their children are hearing. Oh, and let's add in dark shadow people in their child's room. So, you will have to forgive me for thinking that this generation of children stands no hope whatsoever when their parents are supposed to be the adults. Is their a rebuke in my statement, absolutely. Do I hope to convince every one of you in my belief? Heck no because it's based on a belief that you feel is outdated. Do I rather hope to reach just one parent who might look at aliens in a different light? Absolutely.

Is my God a God of love? Absolutely. Is my God a God that occasionally rebukes people of no faith, and those who do not head his warning? Absolutely.

Does all of this make me sad that you take my original post and twist it to your own use? Yes. Do I pray everyday for every child around the world and ask God to protect them from any harm? Yes. Do I feel that the 'greatest deception' in the world is close to landing on our doorstep? Yes. So go ahead, spread more hatred in the world whilst some try to wake up people or to at least put another perspective in their consciousness.

So, there you go everyone - there were my original comments. Attack me if you must. Just as many of you have absolute faith that little extraterrestrials are here on Earth, I hold an equal Faith in our God Almighty to have left us record of the truth as to what "they" actually are. And a side note: you don't have to be a "Christian" to come to the same conclusion!

"But the UFO phenomenon simply does not behave like extraterrestrial visitors. It actually moulds itself in order to fit a given culture."-John Ankerberg, The Facts on UFOs and Other Supernatural Phenomena, p. 10
 
"Human beings are under the control of a strange force that bends them in absurd ways, forcing them to play a role in a bizarre game of deception."-Dr. Jacques Vallee, Messengers of Deception, p. 20
 
"We are dealing with a multidimensional paraphysical phenomenon which is largely indigenous to planet earth."-Brad Steiger, [cited in] Blue Book Files Released in Canadian UFO Report, Vol. 4, No. 4, 1977, p. 20
 
"We are part of a symbiotic relationship with something which disguises itself as an extra-terrestrial invasion so as not to alarm us."-Terrence McKenna [from a lecture]
 
"One theory which can no longer be taken very seriously is that UFOs are interstellar spaceships."-Arthur C. Clarke, New York Times Book Review, 07/27/75
 
"There seems to be no evidence yet that any of these craft or beings originate from outer space."-Gordon Creighton, Official 1992 Flying Saucer Review Policy Statement
 
"A large part of the available UFO literature is closely linked with mysticism and the metaphysical. It deals with subjects like mental telepathy, automatic writing and invisible entities as well as phenomena like poltergeist [ghost] manifestation and 'possession.' Many of the UFO reports now being published in the popular press recount alleged incidents that are strikingly similar to demonic possession and psychic phenomena."-Lynn E. Catoe, UFOs and Related Subjects: USGPO, 1969; prepared under AFOSR Project Order 67-0002 and 68-0003
 
"UFO behaviour is more akin to magic than to physics as we know it... the modern UFOnauts and the demons of past days are probably identical."-Dr. Pierre Guerin, FSR Vol. 25, No. 1, p. 13-14
 
"The UFO manifestations seem to be, by and large, merely minor variations of the age-old demonological phenomenon..."-John A. Keel, UFOs: Operation Trojan Horse, p. 299
 
"Studies of flying saucer cults repeatedly show that they are part of a larger occult social world."-Stupple & McNeece, 1979 MUFON UFO Symposium Proceedings, p.49
www.primeexample.com...



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 08:23 AM
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I agree with you on pretty much all of what you're saying, petrus4. Guilt and fear is so strong among Christians, but I suppose that shouldn't be surprising when their God is so jealous, vengeful, and wrathful in the Old Testement.

I prefer the testament where one should be kind to one another. Treat your neighbor how you would like to be treated. That sort of thing. And I think it's important to point out to Christians that the scriptures teach us not to judge other people, although it seems like many Christians spend most of their time judging others for their sins. Here is the verse:

"Brothers and sisters, do not slander one another. Anyone who speaks against a brother or sister or judges them speaks against the law and judges it. When you judge the law, you are not keeping it, but sitting in judgment on it. There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you—who are you to judge your neighbor?" [James 4:11-12]
edit on 26-8-2011 by Xaberz because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 08:35 AM
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Originally posted by petrus4
So I was just reading the thread, "Conversation with a six year old," in the dreams and prophecies forum, where a woman was talking about how her child had started spontaneously talking to her about extraterrestrials. Other people were saying various different things, but then a Christian randomly shows up, and among other things posts the link to a web article asserting that it wasn't possible for extraterrestrials to be anything other than Satanic.

Before I continue, here, I'm going to say that I think the author of that article did have one valid point. The idea of an extraterrestrial race coming down and saying, "Do what we say and we'll save you," genuinely *is* dangerous, even if not for the reasons he might think. An ET group that did that, would genuinely be giving us warning signs not to listen to them at all; but I don't think most people would have the discernment to figure that out, sadly.

My main point, though, is that I can honestly hardly remember the last communication that I've had with a Christian, that didn't consist almost entirely of appeals to guilt and fear, or accusations that I was a demoniac; or that just about anything they didn't understand was automatically Satanic by default. The fact that I no longer wanted a belief system that had a basis of guilt and fear, was actually what prompted me to leave Christianity; and I don't appreciate hearing it from them now, any more than I did back then.

I'm not saying that *all* Christians are like this, hence my use of the word "some" in the thread title. I do think, however, that there unfortunately is a sizeable number of contemporary Christians who need to read their Bible a little more thoroughly. Jesus Christ did *not* continually make appeals to guilt and fear. Some, yes; but there was also a considerable amount of grace and love in there as well.

If you are not prepared to at least periodically emphasise the more positive aspects of Christ's message, then as far as I am concerned, you do not deserve to call yourselves Christians at all.

Understand this; if you claim to represent Yahweh, or His son, then He will judge you for how many of you, in my lifetime, have treated me; and it is written that he is not deaf to cries for justice.


It is what it is. I know for a fact that the ET bull is satanic. You go ahead and take the mark. I know I know: All that Jesus/Bible/creation stuff is crazy...said some dude with fake klingon head ridges as he headed off to a ufo convention to give a lecture on how aliens seeded the earth with life.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 09:08 AM
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Originally posted by Xaberz
I agree with you on pretty much all of what you're saying, petrus4. Guilt and fear is so strong among Christians, but I suppose that shouldn't be surprising when their God is so jealous, vengeful, and wrathful in the Old Testement.

I prefer the testament where one should be kind to one another. Treat your neighbor how you would like to be treated. That sort of thing. And I think it's important to point out to Christians that the scriptures teach us not to judge other people, although it seems like many Christians spend most of their time judging others for their sins. Here is the verse:

"Brothers and sisters, do not slander one another. Anyone who speaks against a brother or sister or judges them speaks against the law and judges it. When you judge the law, you are not keeping it, but sitting in judgment on it. There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you—who are you to judge your neighbor?" [James 4:11-12]
edit on 26-8-2011 by Xaberz because: (no reason given)


And how does your scripture relate to my comment which is the basis for the OPs thread? Nobody judged or interpreted God's law- I certainly didn't slander anybody nor judge God's laws. I merely pointed out my belief in the other thread that parents are unknowingly exposing their children to potential harm - to evil.

However, there is one very important scripture that does apply. If we don't warn someone in error to turn from evil, we are partly responsible. "Ezekiel 33:8 When I say unto the wicked, O wicked man, thou shalt surely die; if thou dost not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand."



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