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Regardless of your opinions of 9/11 , you need to read this.

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posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 08:47 PM
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Originally posted by spikey
reply to post by VitriolAndAngst
 


I'd like to give you more than one star for that post, but i can't.

If nothing else, for your passion and reason.



Thanks.

There isn't much consolation to being a "Truther."

>> Maybe one day once all the ice caps have melted, and we are all share-cropping on our "Owner's farm" -- maybe it will be called "Visa Plantation" -- while our children fight wars in Ethiopia for the last Lithium mine on earth -- one of the guys whipping us to keep working will say; "You know, you were right about that whole inside job thing. But hey, it worked out for me -- I'm in charge!" He will cackle and take a long drink of water while pouring the rest out on the ground. "Yeah, I've got it all; comfy chair, no backbreaking work, and I'm first in line for gruel."

All the paid bloggers will get the whips, you know -- it's in their contract.




posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 08:50 PM
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Originally posted by Yankee451
reply to post by DragonriderGal
 





And ya, will never be allowed to be 'explained' but that was a good catch. Why would a maryland 'collapse rescue team be close enough to help?? And really?? A collapse rescue team at all? Sounds like someone is planning to collapse a bunch o' stuff to me, if they've gone to all the trouble to create that team.


Yeah...but I think the word "collapse" was the operative word...that they wanted to plant the suggestion of collapse. I know it sounds simplistic, but I bet that was a carefully planned shot.

See how one photograph can keep us so busy? I have spent god knows how many hours counting rivets and looking at the backgrounds of blurry photographs, without ever questioning the source of the photos...or their veracity.

Don't take my word for it...it could be my power of suggestion at work here, but now when you see shots like this can you imagine how helpless the folks of Germany must have been?

I see this as an obviously staged shot, but I've had ten years of trial and error on the Internet to peel away the layers.


I'm here with you on this and totally agree.

I personally didn't come into the whole 9-11 thing thinking "ooo that stinkin' government killed 3000 of it's own people! It's a conspiracy!!!" I really had no idea.

But as I did research and explored both sides of the story, I saw some glaring problems with the 'official story' that were addressed quite adequately by the 'truthers' Plus when I was watching live as the buildings come down, I too immediately thought, "wow, That looks just like a planned demolition, (as I had recently seen them demolish Seattle's Kingdome). It absolutely never made sense to me that an airplane hitting a building could make it collapse just like it was a planned demolition.

So I think anyone who actually spends any time looking at what the 'truther's present, versus what the 'official story' presents is going to start to really wonder about the official version and then probably about the fact that the government supports that 'official' version, so what is that government really up to. And further it starts calling one to wonder.. hum... who really is in charge of 'our' government that such a horrible thing could be allowed to happen and then be covered up? Oh yah, 9-11 was a pretty big start to my awareness that things are NOT what the PTB running our government from the shadows wants us to believe.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 08:57 PM
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Originally posted by zerimar65

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by Scalded Frog
 



It's a well documented fact that Bush and Cheney gave their testimony together refusing to take an oath and in private... not a typical way to give testimony. Why?

They are the Executive Branch of a government that constitutionally recognizes that the three branches of government are equals. The Commission was an extension of the Legislative Branch. Hence no oath because it would set a precendent that the Executive could be rendered subervient to the Legislative. This is old stuff. Private because it was dealing with matters of national security.

The problem with any lie is you can't trust anything from that point forward.

Well, thats your take on it. Reason dictates otherwise. A person, out of vanity may lie about their age, that is no reason to reject their other testimony.


Where do you come up with this? Bush and Cheney's testimony regarding 9/11 had nothing to do with the three branches of government. If they were under oath, they would have sworn to tell the truth. It would not have set ANY precedent that would render the Executive branch subservient to the Legislative branch. Their testimony was not recorded and no news cameras were allowed in, but that had nothing to do with matters of national security. Besides, at that point, it was kind of late to be worried about national security. You're just making it up as you go along.

It is true about lies. Especially when an elected official lies about something important. Who knows and who cares if somebody lies about their age. That has nothing to do with this. That is a lame comparison.


"Subservient to the whatever???"
Where do these people get these talking points? I mean, when they hauled Bill Clinton in to ask about where his Willy was and when -- they prostrated him in front of the judge on national TV. I'm surprised they didn't have pay-per-view tickets.

Bush and Cheney get to limo ride in and everyone averts their gaze as they genuflect -- and the Democrat has to eat a box lunch and get sworn in to deny office sex.

>> And Laura Bush was not sleeping at the White House during Bush's last term in office -- she was at the Watergate Hotel. I'm sure Jeff Gannon or someone from the D.C. Madam's list did not leave stained blue dresses around for evidence -- as I'm also sure that President Bush was getting freaky.

The President works for the people -- and these anti-big-government types talk about "Subservient to some branch of government" -- that's called OVERSIGHT and yes -- the President is subservient to congress and the judicial system -- just like they are subservient to the other branches. It's called; checks and balances -- and once upon a time I heard a story that it worked.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 08:58 PM
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Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst

Originally posted by spikey
reply to post by VitriolAndAngst
 


I'd like to give you more than one star for that post, but i can't.

If nothing else, for your passion and reason.



Thanks.

There isn't much consolation to being a "Truther."

>> Maybe one day once all the ice caps have melted, and we are all share-cropping on our "Owner's farm" -- maybe it will be called "Visa Plantation" -- while our children fight wars in Ethiopia for the last Lithium mine on earth -- one of the guys whipping us to keep working will say; "You know, you were right about that whole inside job thing. But hey, it worked out for me -- I'm in charge!" He will cackle and take a long drink of water while pouring the rest out on the ground. "Yeah, I've got it all; comfy chair, no backbreaking work, and I'm first in line for gruel."

All the paid bloggers will get the whips, you know -- it's in their contract.


Actually the NWO bunch/Illuminati are not going to keep the dis-info agents around. They've proven they don't have any loyalty, not even to their own kind. They'll be some of the first killed, I suspect. The Illuminati hate traitors. But of course, that isn't what they tell them.. *lol*



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 09:16 PM
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I'm just going to say one more thing about the "structure" of the WTC -- because it annoys me so much that people think those simple Joist bolts are the issue;

The Curtain wall is rigid and self-standing. Like a metal fence -- it was designed to be hit by a large thing like a plane, and flex. Now, they are stacked on each other and have vertical integrity -- so yes, if the floors are gone or pulling inward, then they pull themselves down. Of course, for THAT to happen, they've got to go perhaps 5-10 degrees off axis -- and THAT would take time.

ALSO -- the floor has to NOT BE THERE. Not just sheering off the joist -- but when the wall pushes in -- so the floor has to crumble first.

In order for the FLOOR to crumble -- it has to overcome the vertical supports that are all over the place -- which are capable of holding more than a few floors.

A 1-2" metal pin holds lot's of structures like 100 million tons of box cars behind a train or the Golden Gate bridge. Even if they are covered with insulation or dust -- they should be good enough to hold floors that have NOT been damaged by fire.

>> The fire was NOT hot enough to weaken the metal sufficiently -- unfortunately, due to well-trained Pavlovian Responses in many people in America -- AFTER they say; "The Liberal Media is so bogus these days..." they go on to repeat what some PR rep on the Media just told them -- without even changing the big words.

We saw it after everyone said the Fukishima melt down was NO BIG DEAL. Unfortunately -- those explosions could have only been oxygen+hydrogen reactions that happen at a temperature a few hundred degrees past core containment failure. The NUCLEAR FUEL is not a problem right now -- because it's melting down to the bedrock.

In another week -- maybe a month, the groundwater may go radioactive -- or maybe I'm wrong.

>> But the point is -- everybody is a flipping expert on things they don't understand as LONG AS THEY AGREE with what "everybody knows."

Everybody knows JFK was killed by a single shooter -- except the Senate Investigation ... and almost any expert who has actually followed the events beyond what shows on the TV.

And Everybody knows that the steel pins got hot enough from "jet fuel" to collapse the WTC -- only it doesn't explain the vertical supports -- and that Jet Fuel doesn't get any hotter than a NORMAL office fire.

>> What we saw was the top of the building slump inward -- and the entire collapse was MIDDLE-First.
There was talk of an "implosion" -- somehow created by a magical vacuum that occurred in the WTC and NO OTHER BUILDINGS before or since. The curtain walls got pulled inward -- and the floors slumped downward -- which made the building fall in on itself straight down.

This MAGIC ACT, however, requires the CORE and support columns to GO FIRST -- which of course, makes some of us folks visualizing this think it was a demolition. Because it LOOKS exactly like every top-down demolition I've ever seen.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 09:33 PM
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Originally posted by DragonriderGal

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst

Originally posted by spikey
reply to post by VitriolAndAngst
 


I'd like to give you more than one star for that post, but i can't.

If nothing else, for your passion and reason.



Thanks.

There isn't much consolation to being a "Truther."

>> Maybe one day once all the ice caps have melted, and we are all share-cropping on our "Owner's farm" -- maybe it will be called "Visa Plantation" -- while our children fight wars in Ethiopia for the last Lithium mine on earth -- one of the guys whipping us to keep working will say; "You know, you were right about that whole inside job thing. But hey, it worked out for me -- I'm in charge!" He will cackle and take a long drink of water while pouring the rest out on the ground. "Yeah, I've got it all; comfy chair, no backbreaking work, and I'm first in line for gruel."

All the paid bloggers will get the whips, you know -- it's in their contract.


Actually the NWO bunch/Illuminati are not going to keep the dis-info agents around. They've proven they don't have any loyalty, not even to their own kind. They'll be some of the first killed, I suspect. The Illuminati hate traitors. But of course, that isn't what they tell them.. *lol*


>> I was really making a joke. I actually suspect a lot of these "Wealthy Elite" might funnel money to shills like Rush Limbaugh -- who do nothing but attack college professors and these "intellectual snobs", might USE the anti-intellectual rhetoric... I do figure that THEY kind of want the same world the Liberals want -- they just don't think we can get there without wiping out all the cowards, traitors, know-nothings and college drop-outs.

THEY NEED the religious and patriots -- but they don't like them. I see a need for all types of people in this world -- but the elite do not. They actually LOVE Hollywood, and the talented tree-huggers -- they are just cynics, however and do not think you can TRAIN the ignorant in this world.

However -- I believe you can never raise the bar unless you are willing to pull everyone up.

>> This world is getting over-crowded. My solution; women's rights, prosperity, education and birth control. Without immigration, the USA would have a negative growth rate (which is what Japan is experiencing). Wherever women get control of their destiny and education -- the birth rate falls. Wherever there is war, famine and ignorance -- you've got a population crisis.

The super wealthy elite are EITHER totally selfish -- which would make me think they would have NO AGENDA -- or they have a "mythos" -- wherein all their actions are justified because "they will save humanity!" That's why they lie, steel and molest little kids -- because of the stress of all the burdens of the future on their shoulders. Reading Ayn Rand -- you either think you are god's gift to the world -- or you are a cog in the wheel and should be ashamed.

I got laid off to find a cheaper employee -- so I'm a cog now.

>> There are automated manufacturing plants that require about 100 workers going into service -- rather than 10,000. Once the "singularity" gets here -- 99.9% of everyone is a "cog in the wheel" -- and only the OWNERS of the robotic factories will matter. If we don't have a different concept of "useful" or society by then -- it's going to be really, really a sad future for useless people.

I don't like the "Illuminati" stories - -not that they might not be true -- but you cannot "act" upon them. I prefer to say; "Goldman Sachs" -- because there is a name. An evil bank that has been in on every big financial collapse we've lived through. They don't represent some mythological symbol or an ethnic group -- it's a corporation that has names, dates and actions.


If 9/11 is unthinkable -- that it would be a false flag -- I think America suffers from both a lack of imagination and knowledge of history.



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 09:40 PM
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Originally posted by waypastvne
reply to post by DragonriderGal
 


That picture was taken days after Sept 11.

If you want to know about "Collapse rescue team Maryland" then type it in and click search.


Well, it does appear that FEMA had those collapse rescue teams created. Although there is no date for when the program was implemented.
And really.. the picture was taken days after 9-11. You know this how?



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 09:44 PM
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Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by ProphetOfZeal


Yeah, sure, that's why we sent in the SEALS to blow his sorry ass to hell - because he wasn't wanted for 9/11.



Verified by?, conclusive evidence available where?, I know, let`s ask the Seals who were on this mission....Oh wait.

What evidence are you basing this statement on?.
edit on 25-8-2011 by Seventh because: Typo



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 10:04 PM
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reply to post by VitriolAndAngst
 


This link will go into a little more detail about the truss seats failures.


Over 90% of floor truss connections at or below the impact floors of both buildings were either bent downward or completely sheared from the exterior wall suggesting progressive overloading of the floors below the impact zone following collapse initiation of the towers. Depending upon joint geometry, detachment of the main truss seats occurred either by fracture in the heat-affected zone of the base material, where the standoff plate detached from the spandrel, or through the weld metal, where the seat angle detached from the standoff plate. Failure in both cases was the result of a shear mechanism due to an overload condition.


Click it, read it.
Failure of Welded Floor Truss Connections from the Exterior Wall during Collapse of the World Trade Center Towers



posted on Aug, 25 2011 @ 10:20 PM
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Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst
>> I was really making a joke. I actually suspect a lot of these "Wealthy Elite" might funnel money to shills like Rush Limbaugh -- who do nothing but attack college professors and these "intellectual snobs", might USE the anti-intellectual rhetoric... I do figure that THEY kind of want the same world the Liberals want -- they just don't think we can get there without wiping out all the cowards, traitors, know-nothings and college drop-outs.

THEY NEED the religious and patriots -- but they don't like them. I see a need for all types of people in this world -- but the elite do not. They actually LOVE Hollywood, and the talented tree-huggers -- they are just cynics, however and do not think you can TRAIN the ignorant in this world.

However -- I believe you can never raise the bar unless you are willing to pull everyone up.

>> This world is getting over-crowded. My solution; women's rights, prosperity, education and birth control. Without immigration, the USA would have a negative growth rate (which is what Japan is experiencing). Wherever women get control of their destiny and education -- the birth rate falls. Wherever there is war, famine and ignorance -- you've got a population crisis.

The super wealthy elite are EITHER totally selfish -- which would make me think they would have NO AGENDA -- or they have a "mythos" -- wherein all their actions are justified because "they will save humanity!" That's why they lie, steel and molest little kids -- because of the stress of all the burdens of the future on their shoulders. Reading Ayn Rand -- you either think you are god's gift to the world -- or you are a cog in the wheel and should be ashamed.

I got laid off to find a cheaper employee -- so I'm a cog now.

>> There are automated manufacturing plants that require about 100 workers going into service -- rather than 10,000. Once the "singularity" gets here -- 99.9% of everyone is a "cog in the wheel" -- and only the OWNERS of the robotic factories will matter. If we don't have a different concept of "useful" or society by then -- it's going to be really, really a sad future for useless people.

I don't like the "Illuminati" stories - -not that they might not be true -- but you cannot "act" upon them. I prefer to say; "Goldman Sachs" -- because there is a name. An evil bank that has been in on every big financial collapse we've lived through. They don't represent some mythological symbol or an ethnic group -- it's a corporation that has names, dates and actions.


If 9/11 is unthinkable -- that it would be a false flag -- I think America suffers from both a lack of imagination and knowledge of history.


America has been the target for massive brainwashing and dumbing down for probably 50 years now.. maybe more.

That's part of what the 'no child left behind' thing was about. It also means no child gets ahead---they all have to accept the level of education given that the stupidest kid in the class can handle. And the new math and the undermining of the authority of the teachers and principles to appropriately give a kid a swat if they were getting out of hand. How many generations found that perfectly acceptable? But TPTB knew it would allow the kids to run wild with no consequences and learn nothing, especially if they could manipulate the parents into the same kind of limiting and limited beliefs about their parental authority.

Well, you see how well that worked... they spun us like a top with their media they had gotten us to trust as the final authority on what we believe. And sadly the kids are definitely dumber today from what I can see---in fact, you can see it right here on ATS. How many of them can't even write a complete sentence? Or use grammer or can spell?? Even with a spell checker... How will these kids do anything like scientific research or think critically if they can't even do multiplication or understand the concept of logic??

And yah, the Illuminati have names, but it's a pain to have to write out each and every name every time I want to talk about them. They work for the Illuminati, is sufficient for me. And they are all in it together although of course the various arms do their part. And most of them have Jewish surnames, although your average Jewish person is about as clueless to this 'plan' as we are. It is the leadership of that group that is responsible. Just like not every Italian american was involved in their mafia, so too not that many Jewish folks are involved in what I've heard called the "Jewish Mafia".

And these power elite as you call them do have an agenda. They want a one world order that they are in charge of. And it won't be a democracy for sure. They intend to enslave humanity and get rid of what Henry Kissinger called the "useless eaters". Their world as per the New World Order's agenda will be far less populated. One of their ilk.. Prince Philip even said "In the event that I am reincarnated, I would like to return as a deadly virus, in order to contribute something to solve overpopulation."

If they succeed (and I don't think they will), expect a rapid decimation of the human race. That was part of what the Nazi death camps were about (and why there are rumors about what's being prepared in the FEMA camps). They wanted to figure out ways to get rid of massive amounts of dead bodies quickly and efficiently.

And I do agree about the way to control population. Research actually backs your observation that education is the best form of birth control. Any woman who is educated can see why having more babies will just make things worse. And perhaps some women don't even know how pregnancy happens until they are educated.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 01:12 AM
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reply to post by VitriolAndAngst
 





Where do these people get these talking points? I mean, when they hauled Bill Clinton in to ask about where his Willy was and when -- they prostrated him in front of the judge on national TV. I'm surprised they didn't have pay-per-view tickets.


I voted for Clinton twice, but I'm pretty sure Bill and the Georges were all working together.



It’s 1991 and George HW Bush is about to get replaced as president by Bill Clinton. My folks still miss Clinton; most democrats do, but that’s because they’ve never heard of his drug running with the Bush clan out of Mena Arkansas while he was Governor:



After the Iran-Contra scandal erupted, individuals began to come forward with stories that the same planes that ferried guns down to Nicaragua were ferrying back coc aine for sale in the United States. Cocaine whose profits were the real source of funding for the Contra's custom made (and numberless) M-16s. These individuals included military personnel such as Eugene Wheaton, and pilots such as Richard Brenneke, and Terry Reed, who claimed they were part of the guns and drugs operation itself. Some, like Chip Tatum, had documents proving their claims. Others were highly respected law enforcement officers and members of government, such as William Duncan, L.D. Brown, and others, who had stumbled on the drug running operation and tried to expose it. Some of those who had knowledge of Mena started to die.



"I have put thousands of Americans away for tens of thousands of years for less evidence for conspiracy with less evidence than is available against Ollie North and CIA people. . . . I personally was involved in a deep-cover case that went to the top of the drug world in three countries. The CIA killed it." Former DEA Agent Michael Levine CNBC-TV, October 8, 1996



"The connections piled up quickly. Contra planes flew north to the U.S., loaded with coc aine, then returned laden with cash. All under the protective umbrella of the United States Government. My informants were perfectly placed: one worked with the Contra pilots at their base, while another moved easily among the Salvadoran military officials who protected the resupply operation. They fed me the names of Contra pilots. Again and again, those names showed up in the DEA database as documented drug traffickers.

"When I pursued the case, my superiors quietly and firmly advised me to move on to other investigations."

Former DEA Agent Celerino Castillo Powder Burns, 1992



www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 01:48 AM
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Originally posted by waypastvne


OK Witch Hunter lets talk about propaganda for a while.



What ever happened with this?



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 03:10 AM
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reply to post by Yankee451
 


You didn't answer the 2 questions I was interested in:

Where did you get that information from ?
What made you believe it ?

If you can't see you are swallowing and repeating Truther propaganda then, you are not aware of your own susceptibility to propaganda. Did you believe "six steel reinforced concrete walls" without questioning it. When I heard it I went and looked at the pictures for my self. I could see there were no signs of interior walls in any of the inside pictures. I could see the punch out hole was just 2 layers of brick, I even understood how the punch out hole was made. At that point I knew "six steel reinforced concrete walls" was propaganda.

My introduction to the existence of truthers happened on youtube around 2006 when I stumbled on a video that stated "a 757 did not crash in Shanksville" it directed me to killtowns website. I went there read it looked at the pictures and I saw this gif:



After seeing what is coming out of that hole (it's not smoke) I had 0 doubt that Flt 93 crashed there. And after that I knew that every thing the truth movement was telling me was propaganda. I do look at all of the evidence the truthers ask me to, if I didn't it would be like a joke without the punchline.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 03:56 AM
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Originally posted by waypastvne
reply to post by Yankee451
 


You didn't answer the 2 questions I was interested in:

Where did you get that information from ?
What made you believe it ?

If you can't see you are swallowing and repeating Truther propaganda then, you are not aware of your own susceptibility to propaganda. Did you believe "six steel reinforced concrete walls" without questioning it. When I heard it I went and looked at the pictures for my self. I could see there were no signs of interior walls in any of the inside pictures. I could see the punch out hole was just 2 layers of brick, I even understood how the punch out hole was made. At that point I knew "six steel reinforced concrete walls" was propaganda.

My introduction to the existence of truthers happened on youtube around 2006 when I stumbled on a video that stated "a 757 did not crash in Shanksville" it directed me to killtowns website. I went there read it looked at the pictures and I saw this gif:



After seeing what is coming out of that hole (it's not smoke) I had 0 doubt that Flt 93 crashed there. And after that I knew that every thing the truth movement was telling me was propaganda. I do look at all of the evidence the truthers ask me to, if I didn't it would be like a joke without the punchline.




Sorry but it looks like smoke to me. And I have seen an overview of the 'crash' site and it honestly looked like a hole someone dug with a bulldozer and then dumped a bunch of junk into it. Again not one single recognizable piece of airplane, not a tail piece or wing piece, not even a fuselage piece as I recall, and again not nearly as much airplane wreckage as should have been. It was so fakey!

That was the easiest one for me to see as having been staged of all the '9-11' crashes. The site should have been strewn for square miles with bodies, tangled aircraft parts and pieces, lugguage, and all the other things you see lying around a typical crash site. This one didn't have any reason to be different.. it didn't run into anything but the ground. And I've seen plenty of pictures over the years of those kinds of crashes. Not one single one ever looked like someone dug a long hole in the ground and then shoveled in a bunch of regular old garbage.

Oh and you never answered me as to how you know that picture of the collapse rescue crew was taken days after 9-11.
edit on 26-8-2011 by DragonriderGal because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 09:13 AM
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reply to post by waypastvne
 





Where did you get that information from ?

What made you believe it ?


I did answer, but it must not have been what you wanted to read.

As I responded, I am still not sure what you're talking about.

If you're referring to my reinforced concrete of the pentagon thread, that has already served its purpose, and the links to my sources are included on the thread. What I learned from that thread was that when the opposition is able to, they will formulate an argument that will prove me wrong. An honest person, when proven wrong, will correct the record and withdraw their point of contention, which I have done.

Why did I believe it? Are you sure I did?

False information can be planted purposefully, but nothing I posted was false. It was just my interpretation of factual information that was incorrect.

This thread is about working together to reach an understanding, so do you understand?




If you can't see you are swallowing and repeating Truther propaganda then, you are not aware of your own susceptibility to propaganda. Did you believe "six steel reinforced concrete walls" without questioning it. When I heard it I went and looked at the pictures for my self. I could see there were no signs of interior walls in any of the inside pictures. I could see the punch out hole was just 2 layers of brick, I even understood how the punch out hole was made. At that point I knew "six steel reinforced concrete walls" was propaganda.


I think you're being purposefully obtuse. I posted two articles and my interpretation of them, and have since corrected the record. Does this make me weak in your eyes?




My introduction to the existence of truthers happened on youtube around 2006 when I stumbled on a video that stated "a 757 did not crash in Shanksville" it directed me to killtowns website. I went there read it looked at the pictures and I saw this gif:

After seeing what is coming out of that hole (it's not smoke) I had 0 doubt that Flt 93 crashed there. And after that I knew that every thing the truth movement was telling me was propaganda. I do look at all of the evidence the truthers ask me to, if I didn't it would be like a joke without the punchline.


My point on THIS thread is that everything should be considered propaganda. Truthers are just as susceptible as the next guy for peddling false information, hence my contention that the truthers and the OSers are deliberately fed false information, which some repeat out of ignorance, and some repeat knowingly.

Those who are able to accept new and contradictory information will change their positions many times over the years, whereas those who are lying to themselves, or have other reasons, will keep their convictions, unmoved like you, since 2005.

You can read through my threads to find many examples of my being wrong, correcting the record, and processing the new information into a new hypothesis. This is commonly referred to as learning.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 10:30 AM
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reply to post by hdutton
 


I saw parts of this a while back but I spent the time necessary to watch the whole thing though while reading this newest thread. Additionally, I took a lot longer than the actual film because I stopped it several times and did several searches on the various subjects in this film.

I most strongly recommend that the readers and posters take the time to go through this if you want to see the deception created by our government.


Between this film and Griffin's detailed reports, It's very apparent that some of the posters on this forum are in fact attempting to deflect the facts about 9/11 where as the truth of the United States government's intent is apparent that there is a cover up.

Any one that uses the 9/11 commission report as the final authority, is not paying attention or is a shill.

I'm not sure what is worse, the very apparent effort by the Bush White house to spin this or the posters here that are using the 9/11 commission report as the authority on this.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by DragonriderGal

This one didn't have any reason to be different.. i


It was inverted.That means the lift vector was inverted. You probably don't understand what difference that makes. But thats one of the reasons why you'r a Truther.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by waypastvne
 


So you know its smoke, because you were there? Gotta love bold claims...
Sad story is, poor lil kiddo, cant even decide what to believe anymore. And it took you 5 yreas to find "truthers"? Talk about slow...
As has been pointed out, anyone that has seen a few plane crashes will tell you 1 or 2 things about shanks.



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 11:03 AM
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I've spent many, many hours reading about 911 over the past 10 years but have never heard the following theory mentioned. Please forgive me if it has been discussed before........

It seems that there are two basic opinions about Flight 93 that crashed in Shanksville:

  1. The passengers fought with the hijackers and then intentionally crashed it (or it crashed in the struggle)
  2. It was shot down by a fighter jet

I was thinking that, maybe, it was a mixture of both. What do people think of the following scenario that I've outlined in bullet points below:

  1. Building 7 was the intended target of Flight 93
  2. The passengers did overpower the hijackers on Flight 93
  3. Flight 93 was then shot down because the passengers overpowered the hijackers. The hijackers could not be allowed to live and endanger the success of the plan by talking
  4. The decision then had to be made to detonate the already planted explosives in building 7 - even though the plane was not going to hit it
  5. The cover-up then had to include building 7 collapsing after no plane hit it and a story whereby the passengers crashed the plane rather than trying to land it safely

Not sure if anyone agrees with my thinking but it makes sense to me................



posted on Aug, 26 2011 @ 11:06 AM
link   

Originally posted by Yankee451

and the links to my sources are included on the thread.



Structure Magazine ? Thats were you first got the idea that AA 77 had to crash through "six steel reinforced concrete walls". ? Thats were that thought was planted in your head ? Are you being honest with me.

We are talking about propaganda here, so the original source of that misinformation that was planted so firmly in your truther brain is kinda important.




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