The Real power of the Vatican!

I've seen some disbelief, that independent country can give away it's wealth to Vatican for good relations. Yet it happen everyday, mostly in countries where catholic religion exceeds 90% of population.
It's called concordat, document detailing relationship between country and Vatican.

Poland would be good example how this can be twisted to enormous proportions.
Concordat signed in 1993 between rather fresh gov and Vatican (tho ratified in 1998) states for example:
(fragments)

The Holy See and the Republic of Poland
- recognising the considerable contribution of the Church to the development of humanity and to the strengthening of morality;
(..)
♦ guided by the above-mentioned values and by the general principles of international law and also by the principles respecting human rights and fundamental freedoms, as well as the elimination of all forms of intolerance and discrimination on religious grounds;

...further...
Article 5
Respecting the right to religious freedom, the State shall guarantee the Catholic Church, irrespective of rites, the free and public exercise of its mission, as well as the exercise of its jurisdiction, management and administration of its own affairs, in accordance with Canon Law.

control education of one and only religion:
Article 12
1. Recognising parental rights with regard to the religious education of their children, as well as the principles of tolerance, the State shall guarantee that public elementary and secondary schools, and also preschools, managed by civil administrative organisations or independent bodies, shall arrange, in conformity with the desire of interested parties, the teaching of religion within the framework of an appropriate school or preschool curriculum.
2. The curriculum for teaching the Catholic religion, as well as the textbooks used, shall be determined by ecclesiastical authority and shall be made known to the relevant civil authorities.
3. Teachers of religion must have authorisation (missio canonica) from their diocesan bishop. Withdrawal of this authorisation signifies the loss of the right to teach religion. The criteria for this educational training, as well as the form and means of completing the same, shall be the object of agreements made between the competent civil authorities and the Bishops’ Conference of Poland.
Article 14
1. The Catholic Church shall have the right to establish and run institutes for the education and bringing-up of children, including preschools and schools of every kind, in accordance with the provisions of Canon Law and according to the principles laid down by the respective civil laws.

own free of any charge media:

Article 20
1. The Catholic Church shall have the right to print, publish and freely disseminate any publication pertaining to its mission.
2. The Catholic Church shall have the right to possess and make use of all means appropriate for social communication, and also to broadcast programmes over public radio and television, in accordance with norms established by Polish law.


But that just a tip of an iceberg. Since 1989 there was special 'Wealth commision" created, sticked to polish Ministry of Domestic Affairs and Administration, which aim was to help Catholic Church to reclaim their properties taken by communist gov. Sounds justified, alright, but commision was actually membered only by church and gov officials. And you have to realize, that majority of church's wealth were never touched during 50 yrz of communism.
In effect polish gov gave freely away over 97.000 ha. of it's territory to the Vatican (which is 44 ha.), local communites had absolutely no say, they weren't even participants in commision works. Scam that church pulled on multiple occasions, was to lower down (waaay down) prices of land they were about to reclaim. Commision was using price estimations delivered by... experts hired by church. Also to higher up prices of land, already in possesion.

Eventually it went up all the way to Constitutional Tribunal, when major left-wing party proved that more wealth had been already repossesed than actually taken by commies, all was quickly hushed down, only one argument was found to be credible and it was just a technical detail.
In Feb. 2011 polish Central Anti-corruption Unit made analysis sent to all gov. officials, that work of Wealth Commision is unclear and harmful for country. They also launched own fruitless investigations in the matter, along with Domestic Security Agency which aimed at certain solicitor of many religious orders involved. No effect. Members of commision were also paid from public money for their work, even in 2010 where there was not a single meeting of it.

Also there is also special 'Church Fund' in polish annual budget, which is about 20mln$. Those money goes for social and medical insurances for priests, noons and restoration of sacral buildings.

That's a power of Vatican, in full scale!

Hmm I wonder if this happens in Britain even though were a protestant country and im sure we got rid of paying taxes to the vatican 500 years ago but maybe not... I do find how you have to pay 300 euros to a relgion you probaly don't even follow unfair.Imagine if your a relgion like muslim as well.You should have a choice to donate money...If your catholic.Which country do you live in anyway?

Originally posted by livitloveit
Hmm I wonder if this happens in Britain even though were a protestant country and im sure we got rid of paying taxes to the vatican 500 years ago but maybe not... I do find how you have to pay 300 euros to a relgion you probaly don't even follow unfair.Imagine if your a relgion like muslim as well.You should have a choice to donate money...If your catholic.Which country do you live in anyway?

Hi,

No, this doesn't happen in the UK (not unless it's by stealth anyway), and it's not specific to the Roman Catholic church so the OP is not strictly speaking correct, in fact in most countries where it is in place it seems to mainly be around whatever the National Church is. There's quite an interesting overview of this on Wikipedia if you are interested -

en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by Mividau
reply to post by TerryMcGuire

 

I heard someone once say we choose this by feeding the system.
A little harsh but a definit thought provoker. The only way I truely see to get
outta deal with the devil is dont play the game. Get off the grid, revelution.

But its really not that easy LOL

LOTZA LUV

True I say we all leave our jobs on mass and vist our goverments local benefit office and watch as the system goes into melt down.

The only solution to the current economic problem is simple.
1. Pay the bottom 60% earners more money thus in turn giving them more disposable income to pay bills or buy new goods and luxury items, the poor and working class dont save they consume.

2. Tax all major corporations 20%-30% depending on enviromental and social impact, and middle to large companys 10%-20% again depending on enviromental and social impact and contribution to the local areas and small to medium business 0%-10% on the same basis, this would encorage clean green and community effective buisness and local employment.

3. Seperate the current monetry system, if the need for money is so important to them this would mean all public intrest developments ie schools, hospitals, police,education,jobs and food supply is controled for the people by the people generating money for a capatalist economy in a private sector that would have the benifit of people with cash to consume. No intrest or charge on work for essential public project would create more than just new money it would create jobs and better infostucture in countrys who would then flourish and focus more towards a peaceful world were money is not an excuse for mankinds failings.

5 . Im just joe bloggs with a modest education. I ask for no flags no stars and no votes like our elected men and woman yet I and millions maybe billions others see the fraud that we call humanity play out our roles and dance to there tune even if it means that others will suffer including ourselfs.

6. Never let anyone say that were wrong we are not the ones who bomb rob and rape the planet we are only the ones who let them,

No Action Can Be Reaction. There is no sin in non participaction.

I want to throw a question that has yet to be answered.

Rothschild vs Vatican. Who trumps who in world power?

most ats members claim that Rothschild do, but i don't believe in that.

reply to post by Jordan River


I personally only care to defeat these heretics. Why does it really matter which one trumps power? Tells us why you don't believe in what the others claim about the Rothschild's being the one's trumping the power. God, Jesus Christ and the Holly Ghost Trump all Power....

Wake up before you send your soul to Hell....

reply to post by Jordan River


Neither im afraid its much more complicated i feel, but both of them are very big players, theres a guy on here who has alot of info on this and he leans towards Soros, my perception is that they like brothers will work & fight together, but their seems to be many factions to this prism or triangle who seem to have different ideologys on how the world should be but they pretty much all want to shaft you me and the rest of the majority but just in a diffrent manner.

Originally posted by relocator
reply to post by Jordan River

 

I personally only care to defeat these heretics. Why does it really matter which one trumps power? Tells us why you don't believe in what the others claim about the Rothschild's being the one's trumping the power. God, Jesus Christ and the Holly Ghost Trump all Power....

Wake up before you send your soul to Hell....

Lol, already know. Was talking about mankind's power over the world. Not bringing up God and JC yet

reply to post by Jordan River


Now my question ive never heard asked or even cosidered BEWARE CONTENT SENSATIVE

Q. Who would win in the ultimate fight JC OR GOD?

there I said it.




















I think God given he created all. but on points lol

Originally posted by Ariele
Hello everyone,
I raised some questions to authorities in the country I am currently residing (in Europe) about why out of every paycheck I get, 300 Euros are automatically taking out without my permission and God knows where this money goes. Recently I found out it goes to the church (catholic church). It's called "church taxes". Ok, but..what if I don't believe, and never go to the catholic church? I was given an answer, that when I have kids - my kids won't be able to attend just any kindergarten, school or university, because it all belongs to the catholic church, and if i die and want to be buried - I won't be able, because the cemetaries are also owned by Vatican. Wow. i had to investigate that!
Anyway, I don't have any choice about those 300 euros..they still go out of my account straight to catholic church every month..damn it.
Here is what I found in my resource. I am not quite sure if anyone has posted already the fallowing, so forgive me if it's posted twice.
Share your thoughts and experiences!
Peace and Love to all



I do not know if this is true.

1. The IRS is not a U.S. Government Agency. It is an Agency of the IMF. (Diversified Metal Products v. IRS et al. CV-93-405E-EJE U.S.D.C.D.I., Public Law 94-564, Senate Report 94-1148 pg. 5967, Reorganization Plan No. 26, Public Law 102-391.)

2. The IMF is an Agency of the UN. (Blacks Law Dictionary 6th Ed. Pg. 816)

3. The U.S. Has not had a Treasury since 1921. (41 Stat. Ch.214 pg. 654)

4. The U.S. Treasury is now the IMF. (Presidential Documents Volume 29-No.4 pg.113, 22 U.S.C. 285-288)

5. The United States does not have any employees because there is no longer a United States. No more reorganizations. After over 200 years of operating under bankruptcy its finally over. (Executive Order 12803) Do not personate one of the creditors or share holders or you will go to Prison.18 U.S.C. 914

6. The FCC, CIA, FBI, NASA and all of the other alphabet gangs were never part of the United States government. Even though the "US Government" held shares of stock in the various Agencies. (U.S. V. Strang , 254 US 491, Lewis v. US, 680 F.2d, 1239)

Source


here is some more interesting reads, please judge for yourselves:

www.irishcentral.com... l

secondpagemedia.com...

www.telegraph.co.uk...

www.bibliotecapleyades.net...


www.vatican.va...

edit on 22-8-2011 by Gemwolf because: Removed all caps title

 

Mod Note: Posting work written by others.– Please Review This Link.

edit on 23-8-2011 by GAOTU789 because: (no reason given)

.
.
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Church taxes! That's crazy and hard to believe so I googled "church+taxes+Europe" and came up with the following:

In Europe, `church taxes' not unusual

by John Allen

As the European Network's study of church finances unfolds, it will face a striking diversity in European church/state relations -- ranging from France's strict Enlightenment-era separation of church and state to Germany's generous "church tax."

All 20 Catholic dioceses in Germany benefit from the Kirchensteuer, or "church tax," which amounts to 8 or 9 percent of taxable income. Protestant, Orthodox and Jewish wage-earners also pay a church tax for their churches and synagogues.

In 1995, the latest figures available, the tax netted $4.7 billion for the German Catholic church. A similar church tax is also assessed in Austria and parts of Switzerland, though usually at lower rates.

Germany's constitution assigns the power to assess the church tax to the churches themselves. State governments actually collect the tax only because the churches contract with them to do so. Each of the 16 state governments gets a share of the total collected, usually 3 or 4 percent, as payment for administering the tax.

Germany's 28 million Catholics (out of a total population of 82 million) can avoid paying the tax only by formally leaving the church, a move that technically means they can no longer receive the sacraments.

The German government also allocates funds for schools, hospitals, day care centers and a wide variety of other social services delivered by the church. The government pays for the preservation of historic buildings, which includes many of the country's parishes and cathedrals. Some states also make other allocations to the church -- for example, Bavaria pays the salaries of its bishops and members of cathedral chapters (the priests and deacons who serve a cathedral) directly out of the public treasury.

source: source: In Europe 'church taxes' not unusual

That is just plain wrong !

Originally posted by GreatScot
reply to post by Jordan River

 

Neither im afraid its much more complicated i feel, but both of them are very big players, theres a guy on here who has alot of info on this and he leans towards Soros, my perception is that they like brothers will work & fight together, but their seems to be many factions to this prism or triangle who seem to have different ideologys on how the world should be but they pretty much all want to shaft you me and the rest of the majority but just in a diffrent manner.

Star. This is a logical conclusion, more abrupt than blaming Jews and catholics

Originally posted by w3nd1g0
Maybe the acronym USA was a play on words for "US ALL"?

Just a thought.

Seeing how its going tho.... its probably right!

Or maybe its United Slaves Anonymous
Check out the meaning of the name AmericaThe Naming Of America

Originally posted by GreatScot
reply to post by Jordan River

 

Now my question ive never heard asked or even cosidered BEWARE CONTENT SENSATIVE

Q. Who would win in the ultimate fight JC OR GOD?

there I said it.




















I think God given he created all. but on points lol

Kind of a strange question seeing as (if you believe in the Christian faith) they are one and the same so both would win, surely?

Originally posted by GreatScot
True I say we all leave our jobs on mass and vist our goverments local benefit office and watch as the system goes into melt down.

The only solution to the current economic problem is simple.
1. Pay the bottom 60% earners more money thus in turn giving them more disposable income to pay bills or buy new goods and luxury items, the poor and working class dont save they consume.

2. Tax all major corporations 20%-30% depending on enviromental and social impact, and middle to large companys 10%-20% again depending on enviromental and social impact and contribution to the local areas and small to medium business 0%-10% on the same basis, this would encorage clean green and community effective buisness and local employment.

3. Seperate the current monetry system, if the need for money is so important to them this would mean all public intrest developments ie schools, hospitals, police,education,jobs and food supply is controled for the people by the people generating money for a capatalist economy in a private sector that would have the benifit of people with cash to consume. No intrest or charge on work for essential public project would create more than just new money it would create jobs and better infostucture in countrys who would then flourish and focus more towards a peaceful world were money is not an excuse for mankinds failings.

5 . Im just joe bloggs with a modest education. I ask for no flags no stars and no votes like our elected men and woman yet I and millions maybe billions others see the fraud that we call humanity play out our roles and dance to there tune even if it means that others will suffer including ourselfs.

6. Never let anyone say that were wrong we are not the ones who bomb rob and rape the planet we are only the ones who let them,

No Action Can Be Reaction. There is no sin in non participaction.

I absolutely agree with you. But I think we choose not see it because the truth
is way to harsh. That we are just as evil by allowing those things to accure.
If we all relize that we have a choice then and only then will the changes begin.

Its not those in power's fault that choose everything for us. We allow it by ignoreing then
whinning its not fare. I truely dont see any change in this country untill we revolt. I choose
a non violent type of one. A country wide sit out. Were we all say we are totaly done following
their rules and game plans.

But most of us have famalies and mouths to feed. We cant afford to do such a thing.

LOTZA LUV

Big time wind up here...

First of all, here in Europe there's NO WAY you wouldn't notice something like a €300 short paycheck... In richer countries, no "taxation" like that would have gone unnoticed, and in poorer countries, a chunk that big would be a stick in the eye...

I call a hoax here, to a disappeared OP, to dumb claims with ZERO proof (or show us the scans...)... Like saying "I saw a huuuge metallic flying saucer on top of my paycheck... in Europe (makes it sound a bit more exotic...)" Again: show us the pics!

And then, just to keep the thread going, pepper it and re-sauteè with some nice and ooooold Vatican-conspiracy material...

Sheesh...

reply to post by something wicked


I believe in a God or gods but feel that over the years our true roots have been concealed if they were ever known by the originals,

When I cosider the creator though i see a more simple answer than science or religion has given me.

if the universe is a living ball or cell like structure of energy and it is growing or giving the perception of growing then i consider this could be god as all that we know and dont is contained in this.

1. It is said that God created man in our image. The nucleus of a cell will dictate the growth in the cell to a specific image that reflects the conditions required.

2. It is also said God created all we see in 7 days. Maybe this is the period that it took for our living universe to be born from the unification of TWO separate living universe conceving with the best of both and discarding the rest that isnt useful.

Just like the evolution we see in nature cells mutate , decay, divide, unite, and become more complex
but are dictated to by frequencies and all is in the image of the nucleus.

thats my take look around, were all living in Gods body

science v religion kinda like saying to me God v JC hence the sensitive question.

PS I respect all religion/belief, i feel it is essential to our development as a species but feel the power that it can weild is in the hands of a corrupt bunch of sociopaths

This is my opinion it may be right it maybe wrong but it is mine I hope others are like me , as im kinda normal

reply to post by Mividau


orgonize, save and prepare if 20% of the woking west planned this in advance you could still have food and power for about 4-8 months for a 2.4 kids family,

with good planning and community support you could survice on basic funds shop collective at discount wholsale and group in on commoditys and share the load between locals, family and friends.

simple peaceful revolutions cannot happen because no empire would cease power without a fight.
simple peaceful actions by the masses is the only action because if we fight to the front and fall dead trying others will turn and run back to the illusion because its easier to play happy than be happy.

Originally posted by EartOccupant
I just wonder what would happen if a REAL people's party would win the elections in a democratic country like the US, Brittan or Another European one and they decide to cut loose from all the UN, Religious and other old power-structures.

War? Or would they just not let that happen on forehand by calling them terrorists and suppress them before the elections....

edit on 22-8-2011 by EartOccupant because: (no reason given)

Well going off past history the last country to try that was Germany just prior to WW2 and the army's of the world were sent against them (and them against it).

So assuming if a country had the balls to try becoming a true independent state they'd be classed as a 'rogue' nation.

It would be kinda cool to see something like that, but it's unlikely to happen while the current bunch of stooges are in charge in most places...

Originally posted by yaluk

Originally posted by Mividau

Originally posted by yaluk

I can go a step further and say I don't believe in money. why do i work for nothing but to enrich someone with ficticious money and give them power over me in the process.

BUt to make it a conversation I actually play along with the whole deal.

edit on 22-8-2011 by yaluk because: ..

edit on 22-8-2011 by yaluk because: .

Great point and I agree.
No where in our laws does it state we have to use american currency.
We give that currency its power by chooseing to use it.

We give the system its power by continueing to uphold it.
But for all of us the system is our lively hood so its not that simple.

LOTZA LUV

It's a perfect form of control. You can technically live without "currency" but life would cease to exist as it is today. As the lifestyle we have has been built around currency. The system is set up so you cannot even try . The simple fact that we cannot own land makes us trying to get out of the system impossible. And why can we not own land?? well if we could all own land we could do whatever we wanted which would take the power away from our oppressors.

We live in a form of slavery that allows us to live in a nice prison cell which we pick out for ourselves, along with a certain amount of freedom. You can do anything as long as you work for your task masters to make them wealthier.

It is not that bad of a system BUT once we are dependent and enslaved by it we are the mercy at those in charge.. which means if i don't think as they think they can put the hurt on me economically. They have absolute power.

The only free people are those living out in the jungles in south america or something. Now would you want to live that way?? is there an in between? i think not...

Two words:

Galts Gulch.

Originally posted by relocator
reply to post by Jordan River

 

You may find some answers here Source

The Apocalypse is the Vatican II Council that changed the Catholic Faith into paganism (1959-1969)

There has been a coordinated campaign to destroy the Catholic faith from within by forces of Anti-Christ since God embarrassed the Jews and thier control of the world with the Resurrection. This Judeo-Masonic force has sought revenge for the embarrassment some two thousand years ago by quietly infiltrating the seminaries, editing the books, destroying the Mass, changing the Sacraments, and changing the prayers- all in an effort to get the world to deny that Jesus Christ is God. This 2000 year process is called Apocalypse, and it is just about complete.

and here: CHURCH VS. STATE AND WHY THEY ARE INCOMPATIBLE

Source

It is not my intention to doubt that the doctrine of the Illuminati and the principles of Jacobinism had not spread in the United States. On the contrary, no one is more satisfied of this fact than I am.” – George washington

When one realizes that Roosevelt, Churchill and Stalin were Freemasons (sons of the Devil- Pope Leo XIII, 1884), and that Hitler was of the same ends, it is not difficult to understand what the objective of that war was. When one studies the Second Secret of Fatima, that another worse war will break out as a punishment for the sins of men (letting her Catholic Church fall), and that the war technically started on January 25, 1938, the same day as the promised sign from Heaven, the Aurora Borealis, the world starts to make more sense and the punishments become more understandable. It's almost as if the Devil was given the go ahead to start the war since nobody cared to listen to Our Lady's message.

I just found this site last week and it's full of video's and incredible info...I never new.

edit on 22-8-2011 by relocator because: damn I'm tired...I can't spell

The Vatican council II actually took the Catholic church even further away from paganism in my view.
They got rid of many of the pagan inspired saints, diminished the godess figure 'Mary' and became liberalist hand wringers preaching ultra-non-violence and encouraging apathy.

The Vatican agenda has been ongoing in Britain for example from the moment the Roman's arrived in the UK and never stopped stomping on our real ancestry and roots...