12-year-old boy jailed for 30 years

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reply to post by 2manyquestions

If I recall right, our intelligence (iq) doesn't get higher past 12 or 13 years of age.

There have been incidences where iq increases, but it's the exception.

Recent research I read (but cannot find a link) hinted that we can increase iq by using the right kind of training. It had something to do with patterns. Wish I had stored the link now.

Can't believe I didn't.

Anyway, historically, iq stops around 12/13 years of age.

reply to post by ladyinwaiting


I know you are an honest broker and that sometimes it's really easy to just jump right into a thread.... But it's really frustrating when people don't take the time to get the most important facts right.

(I don't want to be harsh. But...)

*sigh*

Originally posted by ladyinwaiting
The child wanted his parents to reunite, so he took a life in order to achieve that. He is not five. He is twelve.

Wrong child.

That boy was 15 years old and NOT the 12 year old boy who is the subject of this thread...

I'm done. Way too much wackyness for me in one day...

When i was young my 12yo neighbor shot and killed his mom.i was very upset that he only got 15yrs.The worse part they said he would be eligible for release when he turned 18.Before that day came he had taken more lives inside and he is still in there today.I can remember my plans to seek justice if he were released.One instance that comes to mind.Some of you may remember the dragging murder in jasper tx.Three men murdered another man.Two of the three had premeditated plans for the murder and the third got caught up in the mess.His failure to stop this along with racial factors during the trial is why he is still in.He has not killed anyone yet he stands alone for the rest of his life inside.These are very sad situations that leave me dumbfounded.

reply to post by loam


Oops. lol. I'm limping around with three broken bones in my foot, taking vicodin. Guess I'm done too.
Plus, I am becoming, apparently, as S-Dog would say "an ats-hole". Forgivez?

reply to post by ladyinwaiting

Originally posted by ladyinwaiting
Forgivez?

For you? Always.

ETA: Hope the foot gets better!

Police said Danner was shot multiple times: once in the eye, once in the wrist and twice in the chest. Police testimony said Lundy, Paul Gingerich, 12, and another 12-year-old had planned for weeks to kill Danner and go to Arizona to sell T-shirts to "drug people."

Lundy and Gingerich each fired two shots at Danner. Kosciusko County Detective Jonathan Tyler has testified Lundy talked about his plan to kill Danner with several boys on a playground in their neighborhood on April 20. Lundy then went back to his home and got Danner's revolver and semi-automatic handgun.

After Lundy gave a signal, Gingerich, and another 12-year-old boy came into the Lundy house. Tyler said Gingerich went into the home through Lundy's bedroom window and Lundy gave Gingerich the handgun. Tyler continued saying Lundy and Gingerich then went into the living room and sat on the couch and a chair waiting for Danner to come to the doorway between the kitchen and living room. When Danner did, Tyler said both boys fired two shots.

From wane.com (Fort Wayne IndianaTV)

Originally posted by chuckk
Police said Danner was shot multiple times: once in the eye, once in the wrist and twice in the chest. Police testimony said Lundy, Paul Gingerich, 12, and another 12-year-old had planned for weeks to kill Danner and go to Arizona to sell T-shirts to "drug people."

Lundy and Gingerich each fired two shots at Danner. Kosciusko County Detective Jonathan Tyler has testified Lundy talked about his plan to kill Danner with several boys on a playground in their neighborhood on April 20. Lundy then went back to his home and got Danner's revolver and semi-automatic handgun.

After Lundy gave a signal, Gingerich, and another 12-year-old boy came into the Lundy house. Tyler said Gingerich went into the home through Lundy's bedroom window and Lundy gave Gingerich the handgun. Tyler continued saying Lundy and Gingerich then went into the living room and sat on the couch and a chair waiting for Danner to come to the doorway between the kitchen and living room. When Danner did, Tyler said both boys fired two shots.

From wane.com (Fort Wayne IndianaTV)

So, not only did he actively plan to murder this man, he took an active part in his fall. He makes me sick, I hope he rots in that cell and never sees daylight again, little creep.

reply to post by Brokenbackrest


so you're implying they're fighting without a 'cause'.

they're just random rebels shooting random people?

NO, they target people.

you're point is moot.

reply to post by chuckk

Franco shed light on new statments Lundy had given to prosecutors after he had been sentenced. In those statements, Franco said Lundy said he had to kill his stepfather because he wanted his divorced parents to get back together again. That wouldn't be possible if Danner was involved. Franco added that Lundy said he had run away from home several times and Danner always brought him back. Lundy said in his statement that he didn't want Danner to bring him back again, Franco said in court.

"Paul didn't know Mr. Danner. This plan was initiated and carried forth by Colt," Franco said.

Franco argued that Gingerich and two other 12-year-old boys were bullied to be involved.

"The boys were afraid of Colt. Colt used to shoot the boys with BB guns," he said in court.

One 12-year-old boy was just a witness but didn't run away with the other three. The other 12-year-old stood watch outside the house and left with Lundy and Gingerich. He stayed in the juvenile system and has already finished serving six months in a juvenile facility.

Gingerich's parents had recently divorced and Franco said Gingerich also wanted to run away.

"All he wanted to do was run away. He made the biggest mistake of his life and he'll pay for it," Franco said.

Gingerich's other attorney, William Cohen, also argued that Lundy is more to blame than Gingerich.

"It was Colt's idea. Colt got the guns. Colt fired first. It was Colt's shot that killed Phillip Danner," Cohen said. "[Paul Gingerich] is a good boy at heart. This young man would not have formulated a plan to kill someone."
Cohen's arguments, however, focused on asking Judge Reed to recommend Gingerich be placed in a juvenile facility.

"I bet he's the youngest person in Indiana to go to an adult prison. It will be another tragedy to send a 12-year-old boy to adult prison where his safety would be in question," Cohen said. "He would come out so much worse than if he were to go to a juvenile facility."

A psychologist, Dr. Stephen Ross, did an evaluation on Gingerich. Cohen said those results found that Gingerich was a "normal young boy, not a sociopath."

Link.

You mean to tell me that NOBODY bothered to look up the original sources of this story?

I just scrolled through every page of this thread and see lots of floks quoting each other and the story from the OP but, nobody bothered to look up the original news story. Seriously?

2 Ind. boys accused of killing stepdad

Two young friends from a quiet, middle-class neighborhood in northern Indiana wanted to run away to Arizona so badly, prosecutors say, that they gunned down a stepfather who stood in the way of their plans.

At a nearly two hour waiver hearing in Kosciusko County Superior Court Thursday afternoon, Colt Lundy, 15, and Paul Gingerich, 12, learned they will face murder charges related to the shooting death of Phillip Danner in adult court.

"Obviously we're upset about the judge's decision. It's likely we'll appeal it, but we have to let the case proceed from here and live with the judge's decision for now," John Barrett, Lundy's attorney, said.

Danner, 49, was Lundy's stepfather. He was found dead in his home at 9219 E. Doswell Blvd. in Cromwell the morning of April 21. Police said he was shot multiple times: once in the eye, once in the wrist and twice in the chest. Police testimony said the boys had planned for weeks kill Danner and go to Arizona to sell T-shirts to "drug people."

New police testimony Thursday said Lundy and Gingerich each fired two shots at Danner. Kosciusko County Detective Jonathan Tyler testified Lundy talked about his plan to kill Danner with several boys on a playground in their neighborhood on April 20. Lundy then went back to his home and got Danner's revolver and semi-automatic handgun. After Lundy gave a signal, Gingerich, Chase Williams, 12, and another boy whose identity police are not releasing, came into Lundy house. Tyler said Gingerich went into the home through Lundy's bedroom window and Lundy gave Gingerich the handgun. Tyler continued saying Lundy and Gingerich then went into the living room and sat on the couch and a chair waiting for Danner to come to the doorway between the kitchen and living room. When Danner did, Tyler said both boys fired two shots.

After they fired the guns, Tyler said Lundy and Gingerich went to the front door where Williams was outside to show him what had happened. Lundy then packed clothes, food, ammunition and fire arms and later that night the three boys left in Danner's car to go to Arizona.

The police investigation stated that there is no evidence of abuse between Danner and Lundy.

WISHtv8


The two kids sat in wait of the stepfather to come home and BOTH shot him two times. All this because they wanted to run away and sell T-shirts to druggies.

I for one am glad the system is putting these two away for as long as possible. They seem to have no sense of the value of human life and I would be afraid to be walking the streets knowing there were people like this on the loose.

They'll both get out when they're in their early to mid 40's and have a good portion of their lives available to them at that time. Knowing our court system, they'll probably get out even earlier, when they're in their 20's or 30's; still plenty young.

I just hope they learn some humanity during their time behind bars.

reply to post by FortAnthem

Originally posted by FortAnthem
You mean to tell me that NOBODY bothered to look up the original sources of this story?

I did.

And to be clear, I've never said the boy was guiltless. I'm merely opposed to a system that thinks it's appropriate to incarcerate a 12 year old child with other adult criminals.

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by FortAnthem

 

I did.

And to be clear, I've never said the boy was guiltless. I'm merely opposed to a system that thinks it's appropriate to incarcerate a 12 year old child with other adult criminals.

I just saw your post above mine after I posted. (curse you for making me look bad while I was in the middle of typing )

What usually happens in these cases is that the juvenile serves his time in a juvenile facility until he turns 18, then he is turned over to the adult prison system.

I hope this is what they do with these kids. They deserve to do hard time for what they have done but, that doesn't mean that they should be left open to abuse by adult offenders before they turn 18.

reply to post by FortAnthem

Originally posted by FortAnthem
I just saw your post above mine after I posted.

(curse you for making me look bad while I was in the middle of typing

)

I generally don't like making you look bad. Apologies.

Originally posted by FortAnthem
What usually happens in these cases is that the juvenile serves his time in a juvenile facility until he turns 18, then he is turned over to the adult prison system.

I hope this is what they do with these kids. They deserve to do hard time for what they have done but, that doesn't mean that they should be left open to abuse by adult offenders before they turn 18.

Then we agree.

Unfortunately, as I understand it, that is not the plan for these children. (End of video link.) He is going to the Wabash Valley Correctional Facility.

Originally posted by loam
For those who are interested... Here is a quick look at his new home and roommates.

Wabash Valley Correctional Facility

Does anyone here know the circumstances surrounding the shooting?
Was the friend's step-father abusive?

Lately it seems that White Youths are being portrayed as the new "terrorists".

reply to post by LooksLikeWeMadeIt


off topic...whatever you are drinking,would you
please pass it along,I could use a fill up!

reply to post by DeReK DaRkLy

Originally posted by DeReK DaRkLy


Does anyone here know the circumstances surrounding the shooting?
Was the friend's step-father abusive?

Lately it seems that White Youths are being portrayed as the new "terrorists".

"Lately" isn't really the case. Poke around in the thread found in my signature...

I think it documents a long standing condition.

Pray for this boy so he may repent before dying.

Many of the more conservative people believe in capital punishment, but I think if that's the case we should pray for them, because hell is too terrible a punishment for anybody.


I know this boy won't be executed, but I think both type of prisoners should be prayed for.

Originally posted by DeReK DaRkLy
Does anyone here know the circumstances surrounding the shooting?
Was the friend's step-father abusive?

Apparently he wasn't, see the last line here:

Details of the Crime:

Police said Danner was shot multiple times: once in the eye, once in the wrist and twice in the chest. Police testimony said Lundy, Paul Gingerich, 12, and another 12-year-old had planned for weeks to kill Danner and go to Arizona to sell T-shirts to "drug people."

Lundy and Gingerich each fired two shots at Danner. Kosciusko County Detective Jonathan Tyler has testified Lundy talked about his plan to kill Danner with several boys on a playground in their neighborhood on April 20. Lundy then went back to his home and got Danner's revolver and semi-automatic handgun.

After Lundy gave a signal, Gingerich, and another 12-year-old boy came into the Lundy house. Tyler said Gingerich went into the home through Lundy's bedroom window and Lundy gave Gingerich the handgun. Tyler continued saying Lundy and Gingerich then went into the living room and sat on the couch and a chair waiting for Danner to come to the doorway between the kitchen and living room. When Danner did, Tyler said both boys fired two shots.

After they fired the guns, Tyler said Lundy and Gingerich went to the front door where the other boy was outside to show him what had happened. Lundy then packed clothes, food, ammunition and fire arms and later that night the three boys left in Danner's car to go to Arizona.

The police investigation stated that there is no evidence of abuse between Danner and Lundy.

Source

I have teens and have been reading an interesting book called Yes, Your Teen is Crazy! I highly recommend it to anyone trying to raise teens, it explains a lot of their sometimes irrational behavior. The bottom line is during this time of their life sometimes neurons just do not fire properly and an otherwise well-behaved teen may sometimes do something completely out of character and even they don't know why they did it. They seem just as shocked afterwards as everyone else. Teens are not fully developed and while they should be held responsible for their actions, they DEFINITELY should not be punished as if they were adults. Often their error in judgment is a single event that never happens again, it might be taking their parents car on a joy ride and crashing it, or suddenly going on a wild drinking binge when they've never had a drink before, or spray-painting a house. Sadly this boy participated in a murder and he should be punished, but he should be punished for the child that he is, not as an adult.

From what I have been reading, the boys lawyer had 4 days to prepare.. that it had been a planned running away, not shooting, and that the 12yo climbed in the window to spare his friend. That the kid closed his eyes and just fired two shots randomly.. yes it was stupid.. but he didn't fire the killing shot.. he was bullied, and scared, and had some bigger older kid press a gun into his hand. The older kid was abused and damaged..

Even if the police are right about it all ( and I seriously doubt they are.) I think what happened probably falls in between, but sentencing a CHILD to an adult prison isnot right in any way. It's more than obvious this was a normal kid who got caught up in something beyond his control. Was he stupid.. yes.. Is this the right way to deal with it? No..

The reactions of some on here are appalling, and I have to assume they most likely don't have children.. and I agree, that to have it happen to my family.. would be awful.. but.. would I want a small child punished.. do you have a concept of what peer pressure does nowdays? Honestly.