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How I said 'no' to cops searching my car

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posted on Aug, 18 2011 @ 10:14 PM
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reply to post by GovtFlu
 


Govtflu.

You did a fine JOB.
As one in the field I will give you a S&F for your response. Damn I love folks that know their rights and are willing to stand up for them. Not only did you stand up for your rights, but added a wee bit of humor to make the officer think. Well done brother I only have 2 1/2 yrs to go. People such as you always get a pass from me when they know their rights.

I also left a post for hippo45 and hope that helped the rest of the community.

Very good topic you posted. One that is not understood by many.




posted on Aug, 18 2011 @ 10:19 PM
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reply to post by ohioriver
 


Ohiodriver.
For your answer read my response to Hippo45. Glad to see you asking that question.



posted on Aug, 18 2011 @ 10:21 PM
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reply to post by grubblesnert
 




I've heard that you should ask the officer what he is searching for. They must state what they are searching for. If during the search something is found in your vehicle that is not one of the items stated by the officer that item can not be use against you. Is that true?

Not necessarily. What many are not aware of is that during a CONSENT search, you can limit the scope of the officer's search to certain areas of the vehicle. You can say that the officer may only search under the seats, in the glove box or in the center console. If the officer searches an area out of the scope that you limited him or her to then the evidence would be inadmissable.

If you give the officer permission, or the officer asks permission to search your vehicle for a bomb and during that search he or she locates a gun or drugs the evidence would generally be allowed under plain view and now the officer has probable cause to search the entire vehicle.

Now if you limited the scope of a consent search to just in the glove box and while inside the vehicle, the officer smelled marijuana then the officer now has probable cause to search the entire vehicle.


Why does a law enforcement officer need to search you vehicle if you are pulled over for a common traffic offense AND your not tested or told you are suspected of drug or alchol impairment?

Maybe it is an area which is a high crime area or crime trend area. It is a common tactic used by police officers in high crime areas. If an officer stops someone in a high crime area or crime trend area they ask for consent. And although it is most commonly used for drugs, many officers have recovered stolen property and guns during consent searches.


I personally would be suspect of the officers intentions.

Its pretty clear. If the officer asks for consent to search your vehicle, he or she is intending on looking for illegal items in your vehicle.


Police officers are just humans being with all the quirks, prejudices and weaknesses of other people and we all have heard the stories. Who knows you might look like the guy who cheated with his wife, screwed around with his daughter or cut him off in traffic last week.

That is true. And if the officer is using these to influence who he or she chooses to ask for consent they are wrong. But you can always say no.


Or I'm my case he may find someone elses dope or half empty pint left in the crack of the seat before I bought the car. (i used to buy and sell alot of $100 specials)

Well sir, it is your vehicle and if you are presently operating it you are responsible for everything transported inside of it. Blaming it on the previous owner or passenger is a common tactic used by criminals. And when you use it it sounds like a cop out. When you bought the car you didnt look through it or clean it real well?



posted on Aug, 18 2011 @ 10:24 PM
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Originally posted by LargeFries

Originally posted by neonitus
so, a cop was tring to do his job, and you where a bit of a jerk?
cool story bro.


wow. someone piss in your cornflakes this morning?


no, i'm just a law abiding adult who doesnt mind if a cop wants to have a look at my car.

if you want to fight the sysstem, fine. but being an a$$hat for no reason is quite sad.



posted on Aug, 18 2011 @ 10:30 PM
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reply to post by areyouserious2010
 


Good to see someone talking the same language. Informative information and responses for the rest of the community.



posted on Aug, 18 2011 @ 11:12 PM
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Originally posted by Hippo45
The cops don't need search warrants to search a car. If you have already been pulled over for an infraction, then they can legally search your car if they think you are hiding something illegal.


Wrong. Maybe in China, Iraq, Russia, etc. but not here...yet.

If they want in my car, they have to have a properly sworn warrant.



posted on Aug, 18 2011 @ 11:19 PM
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Originally posted by neonitus

Originally posted by LargeFries

Originally posted by neonitus
so, a cop was tring to do his job, and you where a bit of a jerk?
cool story bro.


wow. someone piss in your cornflakes this morning?


no, i'm just a law abiding adult who doesnt mind if a cop wants to have a look at my car.

if you want to fight the sysstem, fine. but being an a$$hat for no reason is quite sad.


Is that what you cling to....you're a law abiding adult? Do you mind if I have a look at your car?

Do you care about freedom and privacy or do you just figure those are outdated topics that don't belong in the new world?

People like you scare the hell out of me. You remind me of dogs that have been beat to the point that they just sit there with their ears tucked back. Some of us dogs still bristle when our rights are being violated. Your best bet is to cower in your corner and stay out of our way if you believe being an a$$hat means we tell someone to piss off when they want to violate our privacy.

It isn't a matter of fighting the sysstem [sic] it's a matter of Constitutional law.
edit on 18-8-2011 by bozzchem because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 03:18 AM
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reply to post by Hippo45
 


I don't know where you live, but the police do not have the right to search your car just because they have a reason to stop you. At least not where I live. I always tell them no when they ask. It really pisses me off when people are ignorant of the law and just allow them to search. They need probable cause to do it without your permission. The only thing they can do is call out a drug-sniffing dog to run around your car. The cops here like to pull that crap whenever they are bored.



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 04:44 AM
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Great response OP.
But it did make me wonder why someone who was once 'in the force' would react this way.
Was it to test the cops?
How would you have responded if you were given the same response in your time on the beat?
Do you have faith in the law enforcers, or are you as jaded as the rest of us?
I just would have thought you would have a different take on it all, after having been on that side too.
Cheers



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 05:09 AM
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If you have nothing to hide just let the officer do his thing. No need to get 'smart ass' on him.
edit on 19/8/11 by Blue Goblin because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 05:25 AM
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Unfortunately there have been cases of police officers (I hope a very small minority) who have lied, planted evidence / framed innocent people.

In a perfect World, where the cops are always the good guys and justice is not measured by the amount of money you can afford to pay for quality legal representation then voluntary surrender of one's rights might not be such a bad idea.

Prisons are full of people who thought cooperating with the police would help them in some way. Unless you are a first time offender caught for a minor offense, you can confess, consent to search, etc and it will not help you one bit. The system will still prosecute for every possible offense and for the maximum penalty.

I had a relative get arrested while driving my car for possession once. For the entire time I continued to drive that vehicle every police stop turned into the maximum amount of hassle, roadside searches, interrogations, etc. In my state, like most others, any prior offense related to my license plate number shows up when a police officer enters it into their computer prior to or during a traffic stop.

Because someone else was caught with drugs in my car once, I was treated like a convicted drug offender by every officer I was stopped by (and was often stopped just because they ran my plate).

If you are perfectly innocent of any wrongdoing or are indeed doing something you shouldn't be your best bet is to follow standard legal advice. Do not consent to search, do not volunteer any information, do not talk to police without an attorney present, period.

When the police interact with you they will follow a process meant to capture criminals. If you actually are one or not does not matter. That's how they do things. Knowing this, you should always take the maximum defense possible no matter what your status is in regards to the law.

They play their games, we play ours.



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 05:58 AM
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reply to post by Hippo45
 


IF you say no and mean it then before they search your car the have to either call in a dog, or have already seen something like drugs.

Reasonable suspicion, but you can make em bring in the dogs.

Anyway.. Funny story OP. If more people would just assert their Rights with more pride then they'll start coming back!



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 06:59 AM
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Originally posted by neonitus
so, a cop was tring to do his job, and you where a bit of a jerk?
cool story bro.


If it was as written, the op was in no way being a jerk. He was politely (and creatively) saying "no".

Youre free to do as you wish in a similar situation, or not.



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 07:00 AM
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Originally posted by Hippo45
The cops don't need search warrants to search a car. If you have already been pulled over for an infraction, then they can legally search your car if they think you are hiding something illegal.


That's not even close. If they pull you over but do not arrest you, they may NOT search without a warrant. They may look in the windows to see if there is anything in plain sight but that's it. If they lawfully arrest you they may search you incident to that arrest. And since you're arrested they will need to tow the car and they may do an "inventory search." But being pulled over for an infraction, which might be something like a broken taillight lens, does not provide the probable cause or exigent circumstances sufficient to justify a warrantless search. The 4th Amendment to the Constitution does not contain the words, "unless you're stopped for a traffic ticket."



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 07:56 AM
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I would have asked the officer if I could search his police cruiser while he stood a safe distance away. If he had nothing to hide, he shouldn't have objected to the search.



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 08:25 AM
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reply to post by Kevinquisitor
 


Although I try not to put myself in a position to get pulled over as it is, but in the rare occasions that I do get pulled over I start putting up all my windows as I am slowing down. Then in the event I am asked to step out I shut the engine off and drop the keys on the floor board. As I step out of the car I lock the doors with the keys still in it. That way they will have to possibly do damage to my car if they want in bad enough. It has never been an issue but after they let me go I use the keyless entry system to let me back in.

In my area, they cannot just search and they must have probable cause(we all know how easy that is to get though), but, if they arrest you, searching your car can be done without permission.


edit on 19-8-2011 by Skewed because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 08:35 AM
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reply to post by areyouserious2010
 
Well said, friend. So many people don't understand their rights here, and it drives me nuts that police are allowed to lie or otherwise impose themselves to gain consent.

Not really too applicable here, but I'd also like to add that they can search indicental to arrest (I believe is proper term), so if there's something else they're arresting you for, I believe they are also legally allowed to search your vehicle at that point.

Lemme know if I'm remembering wrong on this one.



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 08:44 AM
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LMAO I wish it was this easy with my police. The police in my town in Georgia are said to be the biggest police force in any city of Georgia. Our cops are some real dbags



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 08:44 AM
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A police officer asked you for consent to search your vehicle, you said no and he didnt search your vehicle and allowed you to leave?


Or it came up at some point that you were retired from the force.....


Funny, I've been pulled over a few times, and NEVER been asked if he could search. Then again, I've got nothing to hide, and of course I'd declare if I was carrying any registered weapons, etc.

I've always found cooperation to be the best policy when dealing with law enforcement....less tickets, lesser fines, etc. if not getting out of the ticket completely...which has happened a couple of times.



posted on Aug, 19 2011 @ 09:04 AM
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reply to post by Praetorius
 




Not really too applicable here, but I'd also like to add that they can search indicental to arrest (I believe is proper term), so if there's something else they're arresting you for, I believe they are also legally allowed to search your vehicle at that point.

That used to be the case as it was generally accepted by the courts. Arizona v. Gant changed that. Blanket search incident to arrest is no longer accepted by the courts. Now the officer either has to have reason to believe there is evidence contained in the vehicle that is relevant to a crime or must develop probable cause by some other observation first.

There is also something called an "inventory search." An inventory search is only applicable if the vehicle is being towed and it is to inventory valuable items to prevent theft and ensure the vehicle does not contain any dangerous items such as guns, bombs or hazardous chemicals. Drugs that are found during inventory search have been admissable in court but as they say, "bad cases make bad case law." It is only a matter of time before this is challenged in court.



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