At last! Evidence that Elenin is NO threat! From the man himself!

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


For what it's worth, there is no way NASA, or any of its affiliates, would post values that would show an impact event.

Now I'm not trying to jump on the Elenin-fearmongering bandwagon, as I don't for one second believe Elenin will cause any problems. I'm just trying to be realistic, publishing an impact event would cause chaos, not just in people's minds, but also economically.

Ofcourse the economy is up the creek anyways.

st.

reply to post by SatoriTheory

Oh I agree and in my research I came across where NASA all but said as much in talking about a very general, hypothetical event in the future. However..I figured last week I could either sit down and work this topic from start to finish with the best data I could find available to the public......or I could go on wondering just who is right, who is wrong and will we all live or die in less than 2 months?

NASA data may not be perfect..but it is about all we have until she comes out from around the sun and direct observation on it's final approach is possible for a planet full of Astronomers who'll be watching. So..Until mid-September, nothing is 100% but this sure beats wild speculation based on thin air..

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Ever considered that you may not actually need the figures to know what's going to happen?

If you can't provide the actual data that shows an impact, how would you go about warning of one?

st.

reply to post by SatoriTheory


As I don't personally believe we will be hit by anything more than debris and some possible energy/EM spikes, I'm satisfied with the hourly charting they've been doing. Of course, that statement comes with the disclaimer 'Unless things change' . It's limited how much playing they can do on the numbers since they are far from the only ones who've been watching and running their own numbers at the same time. Additionally, it's all there for anyone to see and more importantly, record. If they played with things too much, it would be noticed and lay astronomers would scream to high heaven on sites like this, assuming professional ones didn't beat them to it.

I should have put these in the last one, but here are the two databases I most directly relied upon for not only the raw data but a general sense of everything in relation to each other. With these, anyone can go pull the same data themselves and make their own decisions based on the best data available. Enjoy.

JPL Small-Body Database

I find this next one to be easiest to read the data and tweak the output to show the numbers I most want to see on any given run.

Horizons Database Web-Interface

I have an entire page of links similar that were used for the full article I put together, but after using these, the rest are more verification that all sources agree than any expectation of finding conflict. I saw very small variations (I'd worry if there hadn't been) but no difference in sources that rang bells for me...

Originally posted by wingsfan
he seem to dodge the REAL questions though.

1.how do you explain the vast fleet of alien ships traveling with elenin?
2.what about the cloaked brown dwarf traveling with elenin and the aforementioned ships?
3.how come the mayans know about it?
4.what about the magical and sacred alignments it forges with planets that have been scientifically proven to zap earth with earthquake rays?
5.teh poleshift?

Answers:

1. There is no fleet of alien ships travelling with the comet CX/2010 (Elenin). This BS was started by someone observing a time-exposure photograph that tracked with the comet. The stars in the background were elongated (short lines) due to their movement being different the comet, and it being a time exposure photo. The short lines were incorrectly interpreted as a "fleet of ships".

2. Our Sun is a white dwarf star. A brown dwarf star would be nearly as big and hot. It would throw all the solar system planets out of orbit, would be visible (without telescopes) coming for years. There is simply nothing that massive or hot within the solar system. Any comet or fleet of ships "travelling with" a "cloaked" brown dwarf star would either be in orbit around it (doing loop-the-loops in the sky) or would fall into it and be vaporised.

3. The Mayans knew noting about this comet. Some have proposed that the Mayan long-count calendar ends in 2012 and this has been mashed together with an interpretation of Sumerian legends that speak of something called Nibiru which may be carrying their Annunaki gods. It has been said that the Mayans believe that at each cycle of the long-count calendar, the universe is destroyed (in a flood) and recreated. This has nothing to do with a comet.

4. Alignments mean nothing (except in Astrology). A quick study of the statistics of alignments shows that they have no significant effect in the real world, even the "sacred" alignments (whatever that means). What are Earthquake rays, how are they generated, what is their amplitude, are they directional or did you just make that up?

5. What pole shift are you talking about? It shifts all the time (by inches per year). No exceptions to this have been noted in the last 4 years. Our current GPS system relies on the stability of the Earth's magnetic poles, the movements of which are highly predictable. If you are talking about people who get odd readings on their iPhones, it is because there is no magnetic sensor (compass) in an iPhone. Directional and positional information is inferred from GPS or cell 'phone tower triangulation and this system is prone to amplifying slight errors.

reply to post by SatoriTheory


You have to remember though, for the most part the people at NASA are not the ones making the observations and doing the math to figure out the orbital mechanics. The JPL gets their data from the IAU, who in turn get their data from amateur astronomers. So, in order for such a conspiracy to work the government would have to rely on a lot of people who couldn't care less about what the government wants.

Elenin may be the warning shot. I'm more concerned with Yu55 to be honest. It's projected to fly by within the orbit of our moon (.8 LD). That's a little too close for comfort IMO. You can't state with certainty that Yu55 poses no risk. We're sitting on rocks hurling through space and it doesn't take much for a little nudge in the right direction.

damn, I never would have thought my post would of came across serious at all.

2nd

reply to post by wingsfan

he seem to dodge the REAL questions though. 1.how do you explain the vast fleet of alien ships traveling with elenin? 2.what about the cloaked brown dwarf traveling with elenin and the aforementioned ships? 3.how come the mayans know about it? 4.what about the magical and sacred alignments it forges with planets that have been scientifically proven to zap earth with earthquake rays? 5.teh poleshift?

I would dodge that cr@p also if I was in his position. He studies astronomy, not a ufo's. Could he make a ton of money writing about Elenin if he wanted too. I'm more curious as to why he hasn't? Maybe he doesn't like to exploit people?

Originally posted by mugger
I would dodge that cr@p also if I was in his position. He studies astronomy, not a ufo's. Could he make a ton of money writing about Elenin if he wanted too. I'm more curious as to why he hasn't? Maybe he doesn't like to exploit people?

Occam's Razor my friend. He isn't exploiting anybody because he knows money will be worthless in his underground bunker.

Originally posted by evolv
Honestly will this finally end the paranoia around this subject? Clearly this is about the strongest evidence you could present on the subject. Sadly I know people will still go on believing this pseudoscience and in no way will ever be convinced otherwise.

I'll be on the fence until it's passed because even though we can predict trajections and such, until it's safely gone who knows whether all or part of it will break off and come closer than we thought? I'm hesitant to say impact because I doubt it'll come close enough to enter our atmosphere and collide with a land or sea mass but just like with everything in science, it's all based on hypothesis with full and accurate facts after the event.

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by SatoriTheory

 

You have to remember though, for the most part the people at NASA are not the ones making the observations and doing the math to figure out the orbital mechanics. The JPL gets their data from the IAU, who in turn get their data from amateur astronomers. So, in order for such a conspiracy to work the government would have to rely on a lot of people who couldn't care less about what the government wants.

Granted, however, when you understand the enormity of an impact situation, then a 'conspiracy of silence' is not so hard to believe or understand.

Let's assume there was going to be a land based impact and you had an idea five years before the event that it was going to happen. When do you let the people know?

If you tell the people immediately, then there will be the inevitable panic, then lots of questions. Those who live in the immediate and surrounding areas of the impact zone will find the prices of their properties are worthless. They wouldn't be able to sell them, would insurance pay out? Or would they deem it an 'act of god'.
Businesses would most likely consider relocating, taking jobs with them, therefore people would have to move to where the jobs are. So the area would in effect become a ghost town, waiting for it's demise.
Who pays to help people relocate? Should they pay, it's not their fault after all?

Now let's assume the same scenario, but you don't let the people know immediately, you hold off as long as you can. You would have to start preparing the people for the inevitable, so you would have to keep dropping hints, or putting information 'out there' so that the people can see preparations are being made for 'something'.

Maybe you would make a large pre-order for 'ration-packs', or even order some body-bags, as some will not make it. Maybe you will even make preperations for 'tent cities' for all those who will be made homeless.
You would need to make preparations for marshall law to try and control the ensuing chaos.

Now if it was a sea impact, you would have to make plans for the Tsunami wave produced by the impact. How big would that be? How far inland would it reach? How many countries are going to be affected? Would you consider trying to simulate the event to see how much damage would be caused?

And then there is the effect on the economy, not just the country that will be hit, but the global economy also.
It's an event not witnessed by 'modern man', so how exactly would the world react?

Do you see?

st.

Honestly.....I am more concerned with our Planet than I am anything else. Right here at home we have noticeable changes. Why is what I am trying to figure out.....so many reasons are popping up though with no real direction....as far as I can tell.

Could it be the electrical charges that are not only Earth absorbed but emanating in the Interstellar Cloud we are going through? I have found evidence all over the internet to suggest so. Is this why the Sun is behaving strange?

Elenin or any other object for that matter may indeed be of a threat to us in the coming months/years. There is no doubt we will see and hear of many more objects near Earth than we have in recent past.

Of course....what do I know. This is my own opinion and no one has to agree.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I'm not into doom, I'm not into spreading fear and I really could care less what comes from the sky.

My (personal) bottom line is: Agencies, government, media, professionals... they can throw facts and figures at me all day long, I don't believe anything they tell me. Everything is made up to be a distraction from something else and these days I only believe my own intuition and gut feelings.

Anything is possible. Science, history and religion have contradicted themselves for years. What we know to be fact today will most likely change tomorrow.

“The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists”. (J Edgar Hoover, 1956)

Good discussion

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Sept 27 is when it does it's 2d alignment with Earth. Also Mercury and maybe even Uranus in the mix. Some documents, debunked of course, state we will enter Nibiru's magnetic shell on this date too.

reply to post by SatoriTheory


I see. I am glad you shared it. Very interesting perspective.

I especially like your suggestion of 'testing'.

I own a 10 inch telescope too............and like me,,leonid elenin is no scientist,,hes an amateur astronomer......cheers!

Hey all!

Some interesting replies!

I must admit though, I have trouble with any possible impact being covered up by tptb, NASA and astronomers. As an amature astronomer myself (albeit a pretty rubbish one so far!), I'm pretty sure I wouldn't keep any findings under my hat. Also, with Leonid being such an astronomer, wouldn't it have been easier to just silence the guy, keep the whole thing quite and then when it came out from behind the Sun, so even I could pick it up, say "Holy Asteroid Batman! It's coming straight for us!" and plead utter ignorance to prior knowledge? Lets face it, none of us would really care that they "hadn't picked it up", we would be running around like headless chickens, as one poster already commented.

Also, I am all for "trusting my gut", especially at the moment, with so much happening in the world and so many portents (too strong a word?) of change in the air. But we gotta admit, if we cannot trust scientific data from ANY source, then what the hell do we trust? No one? Surely some data has to be correct? On a planet of 6 billion+ humans, surely someone would know and get the word out? Unless they made the mistake of getting the word out on ATS and twits like me keep debunking them (sorry if this is the case, I'll shut up now).

Like I said in my OP, I love the spine tingle of the whole Elenin thing, but compared to Honda, its distant and compared to this little beauty:

ssd.jpl.nasa.gov...

Toutatis, which passes us closer than elenin on......12/12/12 *spooky*, I still no longer feel Elenin poses a threat.

Just my opinion.

CC

*EDIT* Oh my GOd, I just read that back, I do not mean to say that Toutatis will hit us either! Just that the date was spooky! Phew! Close one.

No pun intended.

While I'm skeptical about the Elenin fiasco, I'd hardly call this evidence when plenty of people question Leo Elenin's existence in the first place.

reply to post by DocEmrick


Hah! I know what you are saying! But, there are plenty of videos, journal articles, news articles and photos of Leo Elenin, but unless the entire ATS community pays the poor guy a visit, people will still claim he doesn't exist. Even if we did all drop in on him for a cuppa, half of ATS would still think he was a hologram. Hell, how do we know that anyone exists? How can anyone PROVE he exists?

If Elenin passes without incident, would that increase his chances of existence?

Poor Leo, his mom must be very startled.

CC