A lie told often enough becomes the truth!, page 4
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reply posted on 20-8-2004 @ 01:22 PM by AlexKennedy
Heh. The study of 18th and 19th century Templarism could fill a lifetime. As I said in a paper (which is posted somewhere on this forum), it's fairly likely that the Medieval Templars were exactly what they seemed -- illiterate monk-soldiers of surprising devoutness, but no special esoteric signification.

BUT...

that does not deny the "existence" in the "collective unconscious" (if you want to call it that... zeitgeist, perhaps?) Of the mythological Templars, who, of course, were wizards with a special knowledge from the East and power over all of history. The problem with this, though, is that (to speak Jungianly (is that a word?) for a moment) the mythological entity becomes "inflated," and we see its intrusion into the "real world" as an entity. Now, it's a non-historical entity, yes... but that doesn't change its influence on those who believe it to be a real entity.

As I said in the paper, what I'd infinitely prefer is if, for example, Freemasons decided to stop with the idolisation of the Mythical Templars and started to mythologise our own order -- or better yet, if we could outgrow the mindset that has to see mythological entities as historical if their stories are to have any currency. See, the problem with a non-historical entity like the mythical Templars is that everyone has possession of it. So, if you want to alter the myth of the Templars to say they were actually alien-worshipping lizards, you can do so... this wouldn't be such a big deal if they were accepted as a myth (just like Disney's "Hercules" doesn't diminish the traditional renditions of that myth), but it is a big deal when people get into the mindset that the mythical Templars were real people -- then you're arguing about something real... and that means that people try to apply rules of argument and consequence that work on physical entities to mythical archetypes. No wonder people get into such big arguments.


reply posted on 20-8-2004 @ 03:38 PM by NeonHelmet
Noise so far:


I have a big penis.
I have a big penis.
I have a big penis.
..........



See... any accurate and interesting points about Bilderberg, the world capital/power conspiracies you do make, you let down with basic.. Mega-flawed bullsh*t... I mean... The bread n butter stuff...

and then you try to downplay these flaws by going 'ohh you think I am a fruit loop right???’ I don’t think you're a fruit loop.. just too overtly simplistic.

Just to continue the little (but important) knit pick...
Ethnic Russians come from European Russia. Khazars from the steppes. One conquered the other... Than visa versa...

If you want to find credible theories for the harder to prove stuff (something I totally applaud) get the basic bullsh*t right... and leave out the ethnic slurring...

now I leave this thread for ever...

phew!



Now I have a plea for DF1 I did respect your first post but now you are trying to dictate what we should use this thread for please don’t do that.
LTD602 I have found out why I called you a mason it was because of the thread you started, about joining the masons; it must then have been in my subconscious mind, there for the claim that you were a mason.


StoneSkull:
I think we should just drop the Arthur tale as it really has nothing to do in here so agree with you there, I also like the remark about me being anti solar system that made me laugh big time.
I also agree on the ear/ mouth part, I don’t understand why people who don’t like what’s on this thread use their energy in saying it, you don’t find me on pro Masonic threads shouting how much I oppose them.
Sure post away, I thought about posting the picture myself but I thought it would be stealing from one of your earlier posts.

(A) I have some names of people who have attended the Bilderberg meetings, David Rockefeller, Henry Kissinger and of course not to forget our famous Rothschild’s I also think that Jim Tucker does a fantastic work in exposing the Bilderberg.
(B) Sure lets do a (B) [i.] and a (B) [ii.].
(B)[ii.] What happened in 1885? Well 3 of them died, they made the best wine that year or was it the first? But a lot of other things happened in 1885 like King Leopold creates he’s own personal state called Congo, the final act of the Berlin conference regulates trade and colonization of Africa, a rebellion in Canada, the statue of liberty arrives in New York, the Canadian Louis Riel is executed for treason, now I am not saying any of this has anything to do with the death of 3 Rothschild brothers just that they were events that happened in 1885.
(D) I don’t know about the worlds royal family, but one thing is for sure it is not what it seems, I still find it unbelievable that there are no more noise about this so-called crown/city, if something similar would happen in my country we would yell out as to why our Queen should ask anybody for permission to enter her own land, but our Kings and Queens are just a big a part of suppressing the population though I doubt they have any influence.
(E) Nice picture I like it, here is something I found on the net.


Documentary proof as to the existence of the "Committee of 300" is not forthcoming, and it may be no more than a convenient phrase to describe certain key players. Socialist politician and financial adviser to the Rothschild’s, Walter Rathenau, writing in the Wiener Press (24 December, 1921) said, "Only 300 men, each of whom knows all others govern the fate of Europe. They select their successors from their own entourage. These men have the means in their hands of putting an end to the form of State which they find unreasonable." Exactly six months after publication, Rathenau was assassinated.


Quote taken from: home.tiscali.de...

(F) Hmmm though I haven’t started on writing on this chapter yet, you shouldn’t think I concede with the masons it is just that for the time being I am trying to keep the noise down in here.
(G) Yes actually they have doctored these pictures both ways to hide true items or create fake ones like the face of mars which to my knowledge were made by NASA them selves to get more funding, but this is not a claim only a thought.

I also say lets ignore the naysayer‘s for now and focus on the task at hand.

Quick remark to the pyramids well I have for once always thought they were older than they say and what’s up with the Egyptian tourist police or what they call it and how about the underground rooms the Japanese scientist found under the sphinx and the pyramid?

Now this is a long post and more will come, now some more questions!

DF1 so you doubt me well I think that is a very big progress for you, I take it as a complement, thank you.
Now I don’t want to discuss the wardens with you I have only put them in this thread because I feel they have a big part in this, I cant prove anything to you about them it is only what my higher self are saying to me, I happen to trust my 4th chakra and I listen to it.
About the Masons well good for you I really already knew were you stand on this I am not stupid you have said this about 20 times in the past few days.
And for the record it is the illuminated free masons we are talking about, not normal free masons, now you said.


The Wardens, as you call them, are described by you as being from a completely different plain of existence from mortal man. Presuming that the Wardens exist at all, me and you live in the physical world and are unable to even fathom the stuff of spirits and legends that rule their plain of existence. While perhaps worthy of examination by themselves, I do not believe the Wardens belong as part of the organizations you have itemized as major players in the NWO.


How do you know what I can fathom I think that word means something like understand / grasp right?
You don’t know what I know, especially when talking the 4th, 5th 6th and 7th density, so you accusation really just falls to the ground; I know you don’t know anything about this because then you wouldn’t be saying what you just said.
The wardens aren’t key players on this earth as I don’t think they can manifest themselves here in the 3rd, but they are more like routers who control what and how much information that passes through the 4th, but still I am not sure what there role is, I just feel the play a part.
I think the reason you don’t want me to talk about the masons are obvious now I can understand about the wardens as it clearly weakens my position, but I cant express this enough I FEEL THEY BELONG HERE.
Now I have to say this again stop dictating what is put in this thread if anybody have something to say on that it is me or the moderators.
DF1 you want documentation not all the evidence can be found on the internet you are not acting very patiently in my eyes.

Now this is only comments on posts made in here I will shortly bring my own post on facts and evidence I have found on the internet, hopefully it will make this whole subject clearer and not more blurry.


Baron Bilbo Baggins
Bilbo's Empire of the Neutral Zone

[edit on 20-8-2004 by NeonHelmet]


reply posted on 20-8-2004 @ 04:12 PM by NeonHelmet

It seems to me that with the illustrations you provided, that have expanded NeonHelmet's investigation to include every grain of sand on the planet. In the ultimate sense everything is related in some manner, but that does mean everything is part of the NWO conspiracy.

Do you think that connecting the dots is meaningful when you provide so many dots that the dots touch without drawing any connecting lines?



It seems to me that the challenge should be to provide facts connecting the handful of dots in NeonHelmet's first group of dots before you go adding more dots. The lines on your charts do not establish a connection between NeonHelmet's dots or even between your new dots with facts, without facts they are just arbitrary graphic lines. Perhaps others will be more satisfied with your pictures of new dots, but I for one am not satisfied. If some reasonable limits are not put on this bucket of dots, I will quickly lose interest in this thread and leave it to those that prefer counting dots rather than connecting dots.



StoneSkull: Apparently you didn't read my post concerning the legitimacy of Freemasons being on NeonHelmet's list at all or you have dismissed my comments, because you have already decided that you want discuss Freemasons. Everything you are posting has been brought up one thousand and one times on ATS and you are just regurgitating the same old stuff. Yawn...


DF1 it was those remarks that made me feel like you were dictating what should be put in this thread, however I do like your criticism, and it helps me a lot to sort out some of the disinformation I would like you to stay on this thread just don't dictate what we should put on this page perhaps I was wrong from the start and you didn’t do it, I just felt you did it.


Have it your way, however it will be without my further participation or comment.


Well I for once will be saddened by this but it is your choice I will however like to say thank you for adding constructive criticism to this thread and hope you will keep on doing so, off course this is not good bye as we will bump in to each other on other occasions but I beg you to reconsider.

Baron Bilbo Baggins
Bilbo's Empire of the Neutral Zone

[edit on 20-8-2004 by NeonHelmet]


reply posted on 21-8-2004 @ 01:31 PM by AlexKennedy
Originally posted by stalkingwolf
Alex you said

Of the mythological Templars, who, of course, were wizards with a special knowledge from the East
in reference to the KT, do you think that given the context of the time
period, that there might be some basis in fact to these statements? my point being that during that time period most people with any knowledge of healing,
herbs, or other knowledge not sanctioned by the church were considered, especially by the church , as witches etc..


This is a complicated issue. I would never suggest that there were not people in those years who had possession of what might now be called "occult secrets." However, I very much doubt that the Templars were such people. Well-researched history on the subject (such as Piers Paul reid's "The Templars") seems to contradict the idea... and believe you me, if you read the Templars, you'll come to realise how meticulous Reid was with his analysis. One thing that appears to be known for sure is that the vast majority of Templars were illiterate. This does not preclude the supposition that the Templars knew something special, but it's indicative. We should also remember that the idea of the Templars being special mystics is directly traceable back to the Templarism of the 18th century, and that Templarism was a product of the Enlightenment.

What I think happened is that a mythological "blank" was needed on which the occult "flip side" of the Enlightenment could be grafted. The Templars won out.
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