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Religion and thinking

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posted on Aug, 15 2011 @ 10:47 PM
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Religion like many other ideas are a prescription to close minded thinking and have no real merit once the idea is conveyed. It's bias because the thinker who is putting forth a view point drops it through a box, so to speak, of information that fits with his idea that isn't allowed to change. The idea of religion is a boxed idea like the great thinkers of Greece warned us about. The idea is set and not allowed to change which taints the believers thinking. A lateral thinker see's this when someone tries to convey an idea from any boxed idea's viewpoint and either uses it as a tool or dismisses the entire argument and enlightens the person about what folly the original argument had. They may also dismiss the argument altogether and move on because it's futile trying to explain to someone who does not want to know.

A good thinker doesn't label boxes of ideas into "Christianity" or "Atheism". There is no right viewpoint unless you had some radical experience under the influence of drugs that brought you into an understanding with your idea. In other cases it's really just a dance with reason that can be manipulated to push someone's thinking into a religious viewpoint. This is demonstrated all the time by lawyers. The job of the observer is to observe and acknowledge this is how one may see the prevalent insanity in the world especially in North America.

I put this thread here because the idea's presented from a religious stand point are so close minded thus attracting the angry atheist looking for a logic battle that is fruitless. Logic can be manipulated to the person who strongly believes in reason with a good grasp on the English language, grammar and wording. My religious grandmother told me when I was younger about Jesus and little did she understand about what it actually meant: "How can you notice the twig in your friends eye but cannot see the log in your own" or something to that extent. It's a quote that refers to ego. I brought this quote up because it was brought to my attention while I was meditating and when I would have intense discussions with family. We've all heard it at one time or another "You are such a hypocrite!".

The way these idea's affect everyday life like when a worker slots "Home time" and "Work time" into two different categories. Most workers have long boring sad days at work and when they get home the time seems to pass so suddenly. Yet we all sit back and wonder why?

So ideally one would have to acquire a real sense of present mindedness and neutralize all thought's that would taint this moment. It is a beautiful moment when you realize it and life becomes so much more better.

Imagine why Jackie Chan's Character told the boy in the new Karate Kid film to hang his jacket up with a better attitude. Life can be better once we learn to cultivate a better attitude by not being drawn into these intellectual traps that turn a fun Friday night into a gloomy Monday morning at work, so to speak.

(Note: this argument can be applied to any form of boxed thinking. I use it here because it seems like a big area for close-mindedness)




posted on Aug, 15 2011 @ 11:30 PM
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reply to post by PositivelyDetermined
 


I am stupid, I believe in God. Thank you so much for explaining as nobody else has been able to in 2,000 years. I am healed of my belief that we are more than simply mechanical things, I thought we had self-awareness. Thank you for showing me that we do not.



posted on Aug, 16 2011 @ 12:57 AM
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Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by PositivelyDetermined
 


I am stupid, I believe in God. Thank you so much for explaining as nobody else has been able to in 2,000 years. I am healed of my belief that we are more than simply mechanical things, I thought we had self-awareness. Thank you for showing me that we do not.


Erm, I think you read a completely different post to me
because nowhere did he say that people are stupid for believing in god persay, just that religion is a 'closed box' idea. If you were intending to argue against his point, you have failed because what you have actually done is demonstrated closed box thinking.

However, whilst I agree with what the OP says about closed box thinking as a concept, what I would argue with the OP is (great post S+F btw) is that having a belief in god or in a particular religion / deity does not mean that you are a closed box thinker (despite the evidence shown here) and in his first paragraph alone, demonstrates his own, closed boxed thinking.

If we take religion as the example put forward by the OP, it is fair to say that all religions are ultimately based in faith or 'belief'. It is also fair to say that countless people of faith will be able to recount their own story of how they came to god or how and why they ultimately 'know' that their god exists. I am not one of these people and I can be pretty certain that the OP isn't either, but does that mean that we are wrong? No. Does it mean we are right? Definitely not. I do not have a religion or a deity based belief but I recognise that a significant percentage of the population do and I have had many discussions over the years with friends of different religions to understand that the strength of that belief is rarely swayed because logical argument, whilst often negates the probability of their particular religious view, does not have the weight or power to deter someones 'faith' despite what evidence the non-believer believes he is putting forward. Granted, I cannot say this is 100% the case in every debate regarding religion that has ever existed because that would assume that all peoples faith is unshakeable, but in truth, some people believe more than others. The fact of the matter is, that there is as much proof that god does not exist for non-believers as there is proof that god exists to those who do believe.

The OP wrote:


Religion like many other ideas are a prescription to close minded thinking and have no real merit once the idea is conveyed. It's bias because the thinker who is putting forth a view point drops it through a box, so to speak, of information that fits with his idea that isn't allowed to change


The idea that religion has 'no real merit' once the idea is conveyed, is a prime example of closed box thinking. The fact is, religion, as an idea has major merit. To teach people to 'be good to thy neighbour' and 'love rather than hate' are absolutely excellent ideas, the problem though, is that these things are not always practised and every religion throughout history will have left evidence of this (as well as evidence of bad things being done by non-believers).



The idea is set and not allowed to change which taints the believers thinking. A lateral thinker see's this when someone tries to convey an idea from any boxed idea's viewpoint and either uses it as a tool or dismisses the entire argument and enlightens the person about what folly the original argument had. They may also dismiss the argument altogether and move on because it's futile trying to explain to someone who does not want to know.


Well, I would agrue that you are displaying exactly what you are preaching; by choosing religion as your example for closed box thinking and then dismissing it. That's YOUR idea that is set and not allowed to change.



A good thinker doesn't label boxes of ideas into "Christianity" or "Atheism".


But indeed you did by labelling religion the way you did. I would actually arge that a good thinker, when having a theological argument , or perhaps arguing a personal moral stand point, will take into account that these types of subject are backed up by a certain amount of belief from the person and that whilst that person is not swayed by your argument from a different point of view, does not make that person wrong or indeed a boxed thinker, more that they share a diiferent point of view or belief to you. And a GREAT thinker would not enter into such an argument with the intention of dissuading someone of religious faith, because they are aware of this knowledge and would respect the other persons choice to believe.

But thats my opinion.



posted on Aug, 16 2011 @ 01:00 AM
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well unfortunately for me.... the brainwashing started from when I was a child.

Not necessarily from my Parents but from school and churches..... yanno...go to sunday school where they instill the fear of god into you and the brainwashing starts.




posted on Aug, 16 2011 @ 07:13 AM
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reply to post by PositivelyDetermined
 


Have you ever considered that followers of religion may be more "free thinking" than scientists and atheists...

At least a follower of religion believes that there may be truths in what we can't explain.

On the other hand, a scientist and atheist believe in the empirical method. Anything that cannot be explained by observations is discounted until such a time that they can. This rule is rigorously applied. Ironically, it is the atheist and scientist who admit that we understand only a tiny fraction of all that is, and yet it is they who will not even consider truths in metaphysical, religious and occult knowledge.

The followers of religion acknowledge that most of 'all that is' cannot be explained by observation, and therefore may come from another source. The scientist and atheist refuse to do so.

The logic and thinking of followers of religion is thus not limited to an empirical box, as are scientists and atheists, and as such, I contend that followers of religion may be a lot more free-thinking than many scientists and atheists.







edit on 16/8/2011 by Saurus because: Fixed typos.



posted on Aug, 16 2011 @ 08:22 AM
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reply to post by PositivelyDetermined
 


Good post, great thoughts. I can see it as you do friend. Why is it that some are so taken in my the Christian/Muslim dogma, while others see it as nothing but mind control? And further, why are some compelled to gather others into the cult, is it loneliness, or a tenet of the religion itself? And why, after becoming a member, does one suddenly have such a closed mind that all other things suddenly become demonic? These are questions that often play on my mind.



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