It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Those We Call Cavemen Were All That Remained Of Humanity After The Last Time We Destroyed Ourselves

page: 51
154
<< 48  49  50    52  53  54 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 01:31 PM
link   
reply to post by blocula
 



This reminds me of a short story by the great Asimov called “Nightfall”. (1941)




an archaeologist, finds evidence of multiple cyclical collapses of civilization regularly occurring approximately every two thousand years, and Beenay 25 is an astronomer who discovered irregularities in the orbit of Lagash around its primary sun Onos .

Wiki


Oh do I love the old school SF.

Read the story here

Just sidestepping on the topic, but hey.. if I can promote the best sf short story written prior to 1965 according to The Science Fiction Writers of America, I just can't resist.

It would be criminal not to.




posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 01:44 PM
link   
reply to post by D.Wolf
 


Its an excellent story, read it twice - of course in that fictional universe there IS evidence of prior civilizations!



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 04:02 PM
link   

Originally posted by Hanslune
reply to post by Jukiodone
 



Howdy Jukiodone

Welcome to the massively long thread of blocula denial!

Good recap of the points for detecting previous groups; but two points




same goes for cereals...obvious evidence of human intervention upto 12000 years ago with no explanation.


Explanation; other than the people were selecting those grains who characteristics they sought? ie bigger grain heads, retention of grain (not bursting), rapid growth, weather resistance. Not sure of your 12,000 year date either, 'upto'?




I think it's HIGHLY likely certain groups have gotten to the stage of middle ages complexity...maybe even to the industrial revoloution before but lets not understimate the achievements we've made getting so far without destroying oursleves


Why 'highly' if we have found no evidence of these dudes?
edit on 29/3/12 by Hanslune because: (no reason given)



Aye Aye....

I'm no expert on cereals but I read something recently that said there is no such thing as "wild corn" so that seems to exclude selective breeding.
If you dont have wild corn (or a wild precursor) it seems to ask the question of how do you selective breed a plant that didnt exist in a wild form in the first place...

My date of 12000 years ago comes from the approximation of corn first being consumed humans around 10000-5500 BC and more specifically; the strange case of Gobeleki Tepe which seemed to be some sort of early doors seed and plant laboratory that was back filled with hundreds of tonnes of sand for apparently no purpose except to hide it..1200 years ago.

Next point:

My point about "upto the middle ages or industrial revoloution" stems from the fact that if an advanced civilisation got to horse and cart technology and was then wiped out; most remnants would be indistinguishable from nature 15000 years later as there werent any man made components ; just handycraft based on natural resources.

Sea levels apparently can change 50 metres in 2000 years so given that 80% of the planets service is currently water; I suspect we have lost more evidence than we retained.

I also did a bit of research on early civilisations and it appears that the foundations of civilisation upto Rome were based on the occult ( or hidden ) knowledge which the minority used to controll the masses.

Based on the fact Homnid hand tools and the use of fires for cooking by homnids started around 2 million years ago that leaves a fliping massive big gap before our conventional first civilisation of Sumeria arises.

If Humans had the nounce to cook and make tools I suspect they also hasd the smarts to controll other humans and given the number of things that can happen in 2 million years; I find it highly likely technology upto the middle ages could easily be sat at the bottom of some sea somewhere with us none the wiser.

I wonder what the statistical chances of Humans brains being exactly the same for the last 60,000 at least and ciivilisation only occuring 6000 years ago???






edit on 29-3-2012 by Jukiodone because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 04:31 PM
link   

Originally posted by Jukiodone

Aye Aye....

I'm no expert on cereals but I read something recently that said there is no such thing as "wild corn" so that seems to exclude selective breeding.
If you dont have wild corn (or a wild precursor) it seems to ask the question of how do you selective breed a plant that didnt exist in a wild form in the first place...


The predessors for maize was

Teosinte



My date of 12000 years ago comes from the approximation of corn first being consumed humans around 10000-5500 BC and more specifically; the strange case of Gobeleki Tepe which seemed to be some sort of early doors seed and plant laboratory that was back filled with hundreds of tonnes of sand for apparently no purpose except to hide it..1200 years ago.


Yes I'm familar with GT, I've been doing a series on associated sites. That an interesting interpretation. I believe we'll have to wait a few years for more excavation to understand that site better



My point about "upto the middle ages or industrial revoloution" stems from the fact that if an advanced civilisation got to horse and cart technology and was then wiped out; most remnants would be indistinguishable from nature 15000 years later as there werent any man made components ; just handycraft based on natural resources.


No if they had pottery, glass or stone tolls those would last for millions of years, if they disturbed the soil that can last forever. This has been discussed before. A list of how a civlization could remain hidden

List




Sea levels apparently can change 50 metres in 2000 years so given that 80% of the planets service is currently water; I suspect we have lost more evidence than we retained.


Evidence in the sea can be found and wave action often brings onto beaches


I also did a bit of research on early civilisations and it appears that the foundations of civilisation upto Rome were based on the occult ( or hidden ) knowledge which the minority used to controll the masses.


Religion certainly had a strong influence on the formation of civilization but 'hidden'? Can you give me an idea of what you mean for say, the Maya and the Minoans?


Based on the fact Homnid hand tools and the use of fires for cooking by homnids started around 2 million years ago that leaves a fliping massive big gap before our conventional first civilisation of Sumeria arises.


Yep it is a massive amount of time and I think that it is possible that a low tech society might have arisen - and we might find it, however I would suppose it would be on the same level as Catalhoyuck, etc


If Humans had the nounce to cook and make tools I suspect they also hasd the smarts to controll other humans and given the number of things that can happen in 2 million years; I find it highly likely technology upto the middle ages could easily be sat at the bottom of some sea somewhere with us none the wiser.


Well some aspiring Calvert, Bingham, Woolley will need to find it then


I wonder what the statistical chances of Humans brains being exactly the same for the last 60,000 at least and ciivilisation only occuring 6000 years ago???


You probably need luck, chance, agriculture/domestication to give you enough food to develop specialization - plus the odd genius to get a civilization






edit on 29-3-2012 by Jukiodone because: (no reason given)

edit on 29/3/12 by Hanslune because: Corrected woolley's name



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 05:15 PM
link   
Earth is 4,500,000,000 years old...

Modern humans are 200,000 years old...

So theres an astounding gap of 4,500,800,000 years that we know next to nothing about...

Which means that multiple,extremely ancient civilizations have had way more than enough time to have arisen to an advanced state and then were torn asunder and mostly wiped out,by self inflicted disasters, natural and cosmic cataclysms and perhaps even from invasions and interventions by malevolent space aliens...

And so the small bands of human survivors of natural and cosmic annihilations throughout the distant and forgotten past,were forced to pick up the pieces,while being thrown back to the starting line of their development,as they were being hurled back into a prehistoric way of life...
edit on 29-3-2012 by blocula because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 05:45 PM
link   
reply to post by blocula
 


Wow blocula just repeating your same failed schtick, what the 14th time you've said the same thing? lol - who knows it might magically work this time!

So I guess you have conceded all the points we were discussing?

Which leaves you with your personal opinion, unevidenced, unsupported and non-rational

Good luck



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 06:35 PM
link   

Originally posted by Jukiodone


I'm no expert on cereals but I read something recently that said there is no such thing as "wild corn" so that seems to exclude selective breeding.
If you dont have wild corn (or a wild precursor) it seems to ask the question of how do you selective breed a plant that didnt exist in a wild form in the first place...




Don't forget that palynology is a robust science and can tell us a lot more than what meets the eye.


Originally posted by blocula
Earth is 4,500,000,000 years old...

Modern humans are 200,000 years old...

So theres an astounding gap of 4,500,800,000 years that we know next to nothing about...


How much of that time did we not have an oxygen-rich atmosphere? Subtract that.

How much of that time were there only single-celled organisms? Subtract that.

How much of that time was spent in the oceans? Subtract that.

How much of that time are there no records whatsoever of humans, despite there being records of other creatures? Subtract that.

Hw much time before we have evidence of tool use by humans? Subtract that.

Etc etc. Rinse and repeat.

Your claims are no based in fact, but wishful thinking.


Originally posted by bloculaWhich means that multiple,extremely ancient civilizations have had way more than enough time to have arisen to an advanced state and then were torn asunder and mostly wiped out,by self inflicted disasters, natural and cosmic cataclysms and perhaps even from invasions and interventions by malevolent space aliens...


Except you have no evidence and your opinions (for that is what they are) fly in the face of observations.


Originally posted by bloculaAnd so the small bands of human survivors of natural and cosmic annihilations throughout the distant and forgotten past,were forced to pick up the pieces,while being thrown back to the starting line of their development,as they were being hurled back into a prehistoric way of life...
edit on 29-3-2012 by blocula because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-3-2012 by aorAki because: (no reason given)


Cool story. Not real, but meh, why do I bother?

Show me the evidence. Go on, I double dare you!
edit on 29-3-2012 by aorAki because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 09:43 PM
link   
reply to post by aorAki
 
No evidence?...What?...Theres about 30 links throughout this thread that are crammed with out of time, out of place artifacts that have been purposefully ridiculed and intentionally hushed up and supressed out of the limelight,because they dont fit into tptb's currently enforced belief structure...

The trenches of world war one are filled in and are mostly grown over already and that war ended not even one hundred years ago and there are already archaeological digs down into some of those trenches,just to try and figure out what was going on there back then...

The mainstream public has been hypnotized by greed and thoughtlessly left in the darkness of ignorance and denial by tptb...

And we cant even tell where the mayans came from,or where they went either and thats just a mere one or two thousand years ago...

Many hundreds of thousands and many millions of years have come and gone before us and there were advanced civilizations of humans who arose and fell mostly destroyed and erased by time,erosion and decay...

And tptb are well aware that we have done this all before and are about to face near extinction again,because they who rule and control us are the royal bloodline elites and they have passed down secret knowledge of humanities true history from elite generation to elite generation...

The 10 most amazing unexplained artifacts > www.zmescience.com...

Nuclear events in ancient india? > www.bibliotecapleyades.net...

A nuclear bomb in the ancient Hindu text,the Mahabharata? > mathildasweirdworldweblog.wordpress.com...


edit on 29-3-2012 by blocula because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 10:08 PM
link   

Originally posted by blocula
reply to post by aorAki
 
No evidence?...What?...Theres about 30 links throughout this thread that are crammed with out of time, out of place artifacts that have been purposefully ridiculed and intentionally hushed up and supressed out of the limelight,because they dont fit into tptb's currently enforced belief structure...


All of which have been debunked - for lurkers just read the thread you'll see that the OP just repeats himself, endlessly


The trenches of world war one are filled in and are mostly grown over already and that war ended not even one hundred years ago and there are already archaeological digs down into some of those trenches,just to try and figure out what was going on there back then...


but there isn't some clueless fool running around saying the war didn't happen - the evidence for it exists


The mainstream public has been hypnotized by greed and thoughtlessly left in the darkness of ignorance and denial by tptb...


blocula has been bambozzled by creationist propaganda - always something that makes me sad


And we cant even tell where the mayans came from,or where they went either and thats just a mere one or two thousand years ago...


They didn't go anywhere they are still there in the Yucatan and surrounding areas -why do you think blocula thinks they disappeared? That's right he cannot be bothered to research it...


[snip]Lurkers just a lot of nonsense already addressed before in this thread

Hey Aroaki tell him what they can learn from sedimentation - he won't read it, but do it for the lurkers which is who I address now days



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 10:43 PM
link   
reply to post by Hanslune
 
That link "against" the 500 million year old london hammer is a lie,to help ridicule and supress the truth about humanities true history,our true history that we are intentionally left in the dark about...



posted on Mar, 29 2012 @ 11:31 PM
link   
reply to post by D.Wolf
 


i dont agree.

science is going to prove that certain occurrences can mutate an existence and something like that happened to some existence with gods and caveman is the projection in time back or forward of that phenomenon.



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 12:43 AM
link   
If it were true (and I am not saying it is not possible) that humanity has played this tune before and has done so over and again, you would think that a little knowledge of history, archaeology, ecology, and what is known as "forest forensics" would make it all too obvious. We have some pretty dang old forests and landscapes on this green Earth and there is no such thing as a "society" without agriculture and roads or other methods of transportation that do not require "clearing" of the land. Trees may be only a few hundred years old, but soil which is moved tends to either stay put over an extended period of time or at least leave evidence of it having been moved at one time. Maybe the "big guys" know this, and that is why they are so interested in Antarctica? Maybe they are looking for evidence that some farmer dumped rocks at the edge of his field, down in Antarctica, or maybe they found it? A pile of rocks at the edge of an area of land is only one of many evidences left over to prove the land had been "worked" in the past. Imagine how many more one could think of if they put their mind to it, as I am certain the very intelligent have already done?

If you want evidence of past civilizations I suggest studying history, archaeology, and anthropology... taking notes, learning about forest growth and ecology and some geology, and then looking for what may be right in front of your face.

Civilization is only supposed to have been around for a few thousand years, right? Well, look at the landscape... Landscapes don't change that quickly. For instance, the Appalachian Mountains are supposed to be some of the oldest mountains in the world and they are still here. The Susquehanna River which runs through the Appalachians is one of the oldest rivers in the world and it is still here. So.... Do you think if someone cut a significant chunk out of one of them or a similar area there would be no evidence left?

The Appalachian Mountain chain is estimated to be some 400 million years old. I believe the fossil of "Lucy" is only 3 million years old. Are you going to tell me that if an advanced civilization of humanity once flourished on this planet you will not find all sorts of stuff carved right into or out of the Appalachians or similar mountains? Now, I am not talking pyramids or structures, but simply evidence of leveling of the ground (in the very distant past) for agriculture or urbanization or even mining activity? Look at what we do and have done to them! We have tunnels through them, railroad grades, interstates, and whole cities dug into their sides. You may not find a building but you damn sure ought to find evidence of the ground being disturbed in some shape or form! It may be hard to detect, but it should still be there. Who knows, maybe old roads turned into new streams, or old cuts in the hillside got worn down over time, but they still bare distinct trademarks of having been initially disturbed by conscious beings?

All I am saying is, if the evidence is there, it should be easy to spot, once people know where and how to look.

I don't trust the elites any more than the next guy, so there is my two cents on it. Do with my comments and suggestions what you will.



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 12:54 AM
link   
reply to post by Hanslune
 
And think about this while falling asleep some night.The neanderthals and cromagnon people,with their brutish body structures and rugged,contorted facial features,may have once looked just like modern humans,but were mutated from massive exposures to radiation during fallout from ancient atomic war and then their offspring attained the look and appearance of neanderthals and cromagnon people...Wow...Damn...



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 01:03 AM
link   

Originally posted by blocula
reply to post by Hanslune
 
That link "against" the 500 million year old london hammer is a lie,to help ridicule and supress the truth about humanities true history,our true history that we are intentionally left in the dark about...


I know it hopeless to ask, but why don't you address the evidence about the hammer instead of just dismissing it?

You do realize of course that the evidence for the hammer being old is based solely on a creationist's opinion - why does any opinion override actual facts?

So who was around 500 million years ago? lol
edit on 30/3/12 by Hanslune because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 01:16 AM
link   

Originally posted by blocula
reply to post by Hanslune
 
And think about this while falling asleep some night.


Why don't you think about the way you ignore all evidence provide, your continual refusal to discuss the issues, your total ignorance of the sciences involved and your complete reliance on clearly bias pious fraud?


The neanderthals and cromagnon people,with their brutish body structures and rugged,contorted facial features,may have once looked just like modern humans,but were mutated from massive exposures to radiation during fallout from ancient atomic war and then their offspring attained the look and appearance of neanderthals and cromagnon people...Wow...Damn..


LOL, sure and all the genetic evidence is fake, they show no radiation damage,. Perhaps you can explain the failure to pick up any evidence of these atomic wars in the ice cores or sediments, a utter and complete lack of evidence for these civilizations - how do you explain that?

Oh wait you don't you just repost your 'spam; again, lol

Here is another question you can avoid thinking about or answering; if we have archaeological evidence for the Neanderthals (do you accept that we have evidence of Neanderthals?) why can't we find this mythical advanced civilizations

Another question for you avoid; when did this last 'great war' happen?

Here are some other questions you are avoiding:

Does anything survive for millions of years besides glass?

What does the Messel pit tell you about the effectiveness of your glaciers in destroying everything?

Why were those fossil trees you linked to there? there have been dozens of ice ages since they were fossilized - why are they there??

Aoraki asked some qood questions-why don't you answer them?


edit on 30/3/12 by Hanslune because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 02:15 AM
link   
reply to post by Hanslune
 
Surely many hundreds of thousands of neanderthal and cromagnon people existed,perhaps even millions and how many full skeletons of them have we actually found?...5 or 10 maybe?...And so thats certainly no accurate amount to be judging by.Especially when some of them,or most of them back then were exposed to radioactive fallout,not all of them and why would any state funded and government paid mainstream scientist or archaeologist test those few skeletons and bones they have found for radioactive mutations and radioactivity anyways? Most likely those types of procedures were never performed on them,intentionally not...


edit on 30-3-2012 by blocula because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 03:59 AM
link   

Originally posted by Hanslune


Hey Aroaki tell him what they can learn from sedimentation - he won't read it, but do it for the lurkers which is who I address now days



I might get something together...along with information about palynology and plant phytoliths, from which we can tell a great deal, but I'd actually rather spend my (precious these days, my wife is in hospital) time reviewing that paper for the thread where people actually are reasonable.

Sedimentology is a great subset of Geology, and is primarily an observational science with well-established, tested, and reasonable Laws. To state otherwise is to go against the grain of the motto of this website.

You give me immense hope, Hanslune, along with some others, that there is intelligent human life on Earth. While I appreciate that there are people who think outside the box I also despair that they are (to quote Dawkins et.al.) "hoodwinked with faerie fancy".


What, specifically, would you like me to post? I have access to a great mine of information. The Law of Superposition? I can already hear the "lalalalala evil scientists with agendas covering up prior great civilisations", etc ad nauseum which does not take into account that if anything tangible and real was found any scientist worth his/her weight in salt would be champing at the bit to publish such a career-making paper. As someone who works in a 'mainstream research institution' I can categorically vouch for this.

I guess, despite the motto, ignorance still reigns supreme and we are in a new dark ages.

For shame.

edit on 30-3-2012 by aorAki because: (no reason given)

edit on 30-3-2012 by aorAki because: (no reason given)

edit on 30-3-2012 by aorAki because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 05:31 AM
link   
reply to post by Hanslune
 


Some interesting points but the fact that some cultures were indulging in a none essential processes such as selective breeding of crops whilst others were living in mud huts probably gives us an insight into the "knowledge enclaves" or inbalance of technological progression that still exist today.

Without world travel, communciations, reading etc it becomes very easy to loose knowledge through a catastrophic event as the scientific principles of peer review and sharing of evidence wouldnt exist until world population numbers required it.

Let me again state that I dont believe we've ever reached industrial revolution levels of sophistication before but I can easily imagine that, due to environmental factors, the founder of the systems we know today as civilisation took their inspiration from people who made it out of other previous civilsations that failed /were wiped out.

Those people (or more specifically the knowledge they carried with them) would have made great architechts for new socities and it would be EXACTLY compatable with human nature to use this knowledge to subjugate the citizens of these new socities as the feats acheived would; to someone who didnt have an equivalent education, look like some sort of divine intervention or support from a beneficial God.

If we look at the Western world today we still see the remnants of Sumeria, Egypt, Rome and the mediterranean civilisations in every facet of civilisation where a small number of people seem to make all the progress and everyone else just concentrates on survival or it's modern counterpart; paying billls.

Gotta agree with whoever said soemthing about OOPARTS as well ; I've looked into every single one I can find and I can;t find one that is unexplained..however if Egypt was based 50 miles of the Atlantic coast now buried under 200 metres of silt I doubt we'd find anything ..on beaches or when surveying the seabed.



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 06:04 AM
link   
reply to post by aorAki
 


This was an interesting post but the assumption that science; through an ever increasing devotion to complex mathematical formulae as proof can "explain" all of our reality is fundamentally flawed as it can only ever seemingly "explain" bits of the process.

I'm a Quantum Space Theory "believer" as it's basic idea is that a system with many small, simple parts (or parts that obey simple rules) will often exhibit very com­plex behavior when those parts interact in mul­ti­tudes is just an example of our emergant understanding of pieces of the puzzle rather than all inclusive answers.

if you just look at some of the theories...I 'll take Gravity as an example; our current approach to science is great for prediciting behaviour in our locale but seems to hinge upon an almost fairly magic belief in suppositional elements with little or no sceintific basis.

Gravitons, Dark Matter, Dark Energy, etc etc...are all examples of science presuming to apply "Laws" into systems where we only percieve small, discrete parts of what is really happening in the bigger picture ; ultimately causing more problems than they resolve.

I'm not saying science is bad but we should learn from the past and always expect some sort of seachange review or discovery that makes all earlier models obsolete.
edit on 30-3-2012 by Jukiodone because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 30 2012 @ 10:57 AM
link   
reply to post by aorAki
 
For one example of many,ever hear of a place called atlantis,wheres that now? It was erased and obliterated and driven down under the ocean by cyclic cataclysms and self induced disasters,just like whats going to happen to humanity,again,driven down and thrust to the brink of extinction,again and tptb are more than well aware...


edit on 30-3-2012 by blocula because: (no reason given)




top topics



 
154
<< 48  49  50    52  53  54 >>

log in

join