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Our Troops do NOT Protect Our Freedom and We Should Stop Thanking Them for Doing So

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posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 03:41 PM

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by blackrain17

if someone were to ask me her country is pretty damn good aint no threads like this one


Ha ha ha very true bro!

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 03:42 PM
reply to post by neo96

who learned you how to spoke?

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 03:43 PM

Cancelling War & Debt

July 30, 2011

Q. Can anyone explain in simple english why there are so many wars and so much debt in the world?

A. Because wars create debt and debt is desirable and profitable to the super-rich. The interest on your personal debt and on your nation's debt is what makes the super-rich super-rich.

Who do we owe "trillions" in debt money to? To the international bankster crime- families. They are the super-rich "shadow" government. They dictate US military and economic policy.

According to the Senate For Defense Information - 51% of your personal Federal Income Tax goes specifically to military spending. That military spending enriches the super-rich who own the corporations that manufacture the weapons of war that kill, burn, maim and loot for profit.

Alliant Techsystems
BAE Systems Inc.
Bushmaster Firearms International
Colt's Manufacturing Company
General Atomics
General Electric (primarily through GEAE)
General Dynamics
Northrop Grumman Corporation
Raytheon Corporation
THOR Global Defense Group
United Technologies (primarily through Pratt and Whitney, Smith and Wesson Sikorsky Aircraft Corporation)

As of June 29, 2011, America's outstanding total public debt was $14.46 trillion. That's approximately 98.6% of 2010's annual GDP of $14.66 trillion.

75% of the US national debt belongs to US citizens themselves. Contrary to public belief, only 4.5 trillion dollars of the US foreign debt is owned by foreign "banksters". China's Banksters are the biggest owner of US Treasury bonds worth USD 1.2 trillion. Taiwan and Hong Kong "Banksters" rank next, seeking an overall of USD 276 billion from the US government.

President Obama has added almost 4 trillion to the debt owed to the "bankster crime families" since he took office in 2009.


The idea of canceling the national debt is gaining support in direct proportion to the increase in the debt itself. The formula is simple. Cancel the wars-for-profit in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya. Arrest the loan sharking MAFIA crime families who bought the US Congress, privatized and stole the Federal Reserve and are printing money out of thin air. Arrest them for their crimes against humanity.

The ruling crime families are the FED. The money they print has no value because it has nothing to back it up. These loan sharks lend the money that they print to the government. They collect interest on it and suck the life blood out of the nation.

When are Americans going to say enough is enough and force the federal government to dissolve the Federal Reserve? When are they going to force the government to issue money backed by gold or silver or something with real value? When are citizens going to REFUSE to pay the national debt to the bankster crooks and force the government to CANCEL the national debt??? Don't wait for the politicans in Washington to do it for you. They have been bought and paid for by the ruling MAFIA families.

Cancelling the national debt would result in permanent tax cuts, a stable currency and stable financial markets. That's THE LAST THING the Rockefellers, Rothschilds, and Morgan crime families want.

Here is an updated summary of the blood-for-profit record of US foreign policy. Since the end of the Second World War, the United States has:

1. Attempted to overthrow more than 50 governments, most of which were democratically-elected. 7

2. Attempted to suppress a populist or nationalist movement in 20 countries. 8

3. Grossly interfered in democratic elections in at least 30 countries. 9

4. Dropped bombs on the people of more than 30 countries including 2 atomic bombs on Japan and depleted uranium weapons of mass destruction on Iraq. 10

5. Attempted to assassinate more than 50 foreign leaders. 11

In total: Since 1945, the United States has accumulated massive amounts of debt by carrying out one or more of the above actions, on one or more occasions, in the following 69 countries. These countries are more than one-third of the countries of the world.

British Guiana (now Guyana)
Congo (also as Zaire)
Costa Rica
Dominican Republic
East Timor
El Salvador
Germany (plus East Germany)
North Korea
South Africa
Soviet Union
Vietnam (plus North Vietnam)
Yemen (plus South Yemen)


When are the American people going to stop paying 51% of their tax money for the killing, maiming, burning and looting of other nation and people? The wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya are unjust, unprovoked and fueled by lies and propaganda.

New York Times, June 27, 1963, p.12 ↩

USA Today, October 11, 1999, p.1 ↩

Washington Post, May 12, 2009; see a similar story November 5, 2009 ↩

Carolyn Eisenberg, Drawing the Line: The American Decision to Divide Germany, 1944-1949 (1996); or see a concise review of this book by Kai Bird in The Nation, December 16, 1996↩

See William Blum, Killing Hope: US Military and CIA Interventions Since World War II, p.400, note 8, for a list of sources for the details of the sabotage and subversion. ↩

The Guardian (London), March 7, 1985 ↩

See chapter 18 of Rogue State: A Guide to the World's Only Superpower – add Palestine, 2006 to the list ↩

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 03:44 PM
reply to post by blackrain17

have a problem with my english?

should have thrown a few more billion dollars at the endeavor the social programming didnt take either.

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 03:47 PM

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by blackrain17

if someone were to ask me her country is pretty damn good aint no threads like this one


Honestly, I have no idea what you are saying here. Not trying to be a dick but I really don't understand what you mean.

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 03:47 PM

Originally posted by blackrain17
How is her country now? It must be 100 times better than when the US got involved right?

I dunno you tell me....
A little historical refresher. Afghanistan after the Soviet Pullout...

Now women in Afghanistan can work and get an education again...

Kabul Broadcasting...

Nor have I seen anybody mention the reconstruction effort presently taking place...

US Soldier guarding School reconstruction

Australian Troops rebuilding bridge

Or modern Kabul 2011

Kabul Shopping Mall

A site near a famous shrine in Kandahar that is now beautifully constructed. Hundreds of people visit the shrine every day and then come here for a relaxation.

I remember what the Taliban did to another Shrine...

Football is being played at the Football stadium again instead of being used to execute women.

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 03:54 PM
I wonder why facebook won't let me link to this discussion. Damn facebook.

Great article. It should hit a few sheepy nerves!!

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 03:55 PM
I thought of this while I was reading these posts and had to share it.

Mirror Image of today Vs 1960's,
I just wish the music would reflect the times better.

Bottom line, if you do not want wars, stop electing people who support them. WE ALL are responsible for war, it is not the troops fault, it is ALL OF US who elect officials who support them.
To the troops,
Maybe some day we will open our eyes and stop putting our kids in harms way.
The blame is solely on the people who elect those in power.
edit on 9-8-2011 by Darkblade71 because: Added text

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:00 PM

Originally posted by Bucknet
I wonder why facebook won't let me link to this discussion. Damn facebook.

Great article. It should hit a few sheepy nerves!!

Lol @ sheepy nerves!

To funny.

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:01 PM
reply to post by kro32

Do you suggest that when the leaders ask for a military action that they let all the soldiers know the situation and take a vote to see if they should do it?

kro, you and I have had prickles between us before...but...
YES. If everyone involved -- from soldiers to KP scrubs to medics to citizens (whose kids are the soldiers and KP scrubs and medics) had the information....
ALL of the information,
and it was put to a ALL of the parties (the "stakeholders" in recent parlance)
and the majority said "Okay, I don't like it, but I guess we must...."

That would be entirely different than sending adolescents and warped adults (thanks to their training) out to kill civilians just 'cause someone above them "said so."

What happened to critical thinking?

And if the majority, who were able to keep a cool head and look at ALL SIDES, with information in hand, and say....
"Naaah...not worth it...."

Would that make a more peaceful world?
You betcha, IMO

If the PIC (performers in charge) would stop, look, listen, and then take a deep breath, hold it in for a few beats, then puff it out after THINKING.....and looking at their billfolds....(wallets)....and looking back over their shoulders at what messes lie behind them....
they might just say, "You know? Not this time.
No. Unh uh. We have other problems to worry about."

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:09 PM
reply to post by SLAYER69

Yeah it's so nice of us to encourage planting such beautiful flowers...

Life is so much better with the troops there...

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:17 PM
reply to post by SLAYER69

You forgot to include these:

in your pictures of Afghanistan today. Out of respect for ATS members who might be distressed, I won't embed them, .but I'm sure you'll be willing to click on the link to see how the war is helping these children. This is what our DU weapons are doing to Afghan babies - same in Iraq.

And Afghanistan is being bombarded with DU....their land, their rivers.

Do you think the Afghan peole want this US 'help'?

What do you think they would choose? Smarter buildings (constructed by US contractors for mega profits) or children who are not horrendously deformed by DU and an end to the invasion and the bombings?

edit on 9-8-2011 by wcitizen because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:20 PM

Originally posted by blackrain17
reply to post by SLAYER69

Yeah it's so nice of us to encourage planting such beautiful flowers...


Do you think Afghanistan started heroin production when we got there ?

How do you think the Russians became the largest Heroin users? Remember they were in Afghanistan decades before the US got involved and have a huge porous border with Central Asia. The Taliban were using the Profits from Heroin sales to the Russian Mob to support their war against the West.

I'm surprised you overlooked that aspect?


Between 1993 and 1995, the annual amount of seized narcotic substances increased from thirty-five tons to ninety tons. At present approximately 5 million people use illicit drugs in Russia. Russia has the biggest heroin problem along with Iran and Estonia. Russia is a major consumer of opiates.

The trafficking routes have been laid out years/decades before NATO got into the picture.

Russia is one of the two major drug producers along with Morocco, and one of the five major drug trafficking entry points along with Iran, Turkey, Italy and Spain in the Mediterranean region. The drug trafficking also involves the supply of opium, heroin and marijuana from Central Asia and the Golden Crescent, comprising Pakistan, Afghanistan and Iran. Russian drug rings work with the Sicilian mafia and the Colombian drug traffickers to import and distribute.

Take a good hard look at the maps posted below. I'll let them speak for themselves.

Many local Russian distributors have connections with criminal organizations in Central Asia, the Caucasus, and Ukraine. According to the Moscow State Institute of International Relations, a regular trafficking route exists from Tajikistan to Rostov-on-Don via Turkmenistan, and from there to Western Europe

Life is so much better with the troops there...

I'd say so.
But I guess it's because I don't believe all the Internet Pop-Culture VooDoo BS like some...

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:22 PM

Originally posted by wcitizen
This is what our DU weapons are doing to Afghan babies - same in Iraq.


I've seen and heard all the "Claims about what Depleted Uranium" has supposedly done to them.

Now what part of "Depleted" do people seem not to understand?

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:34 PM

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by wcitizen
This is what our DU weapons are doing to Afghan babies - same in Iraq.


I've seen and heard all the "Claims about what Depleted Uranium" has supposedly done to them.

Now what part of "Depleted" do people seem not to understand?

I know right!

Second line....

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:38 PM

Originally posted by SLAYER69
I've seen and heard all the "Claims about what Depleted Uranium" has supposedly done to them.

Now what part of "Depleted" do people seem not to understand?

...i understand the following...

The behaviour of DU in the body is identical to that of natural uranium.

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:48 PM
OK, I only read through the first two pages, but I think I got the gist of it: War is evil.

I couldn't agree more.

Now I'd like to explain something, especially after watching a couple of those videos from IVAW. U.S. soldiers don't go around murdering people, it's just not done. In fact, many of the casualties we've taken have been because soldiers or Marines failed to take action quickly enough to protect themselves from a threat because there were civilians in the way, or they couldn't distinguish civilian from combatant and were afraid to fire for fear of hitting an innocent.

Nighttime raids where people are pulled out of their houses aren't done for no good reason. You have to remember what the enemy is, and what it isn't. They hide among the population, they don't wear uniforms, and most of them aren't even from Iraq. In the days, weeks, months, and years after the invasion, Islamic extremists from all over the Middle-east were drawn to the conflict in the hopes that by fighting American troops, they would die in a jihad and be guaranteed a place in paradise. How sick is that?

Nearly a million Iraqi civilians have died in the war, but who has been doing the killing? Not the US that's for sure. After Saddam fell and could no longer douse the fire that burned in their breasts with his totalitarian tactics, the Shia and Sunni began a campaign of slaughter against one another. There was a time after the invasion when Iraq was on the brink of an all out civil war between the two sects - they have hated each other since the day Mohammed died - and the only reason it didn't boil over is due to the presence of American troops. We were getting hit from both sides just because we were in the way of their sectarian strife.

Our troops are not trained to murder innocent people, nor are they trained to be a secret Gestapo that drags innocent people out of their homes in the middle of the night. They are an instrument of foreign policy true, but they are still human beings with a conscience. If these types of things were going on regularly (there's always the odd idiot,) I'd bet my left nut that there would be mutinies left and right, and you would see letters written to Congress in the tens of millions demanding an investigation; but the simple fact is, our men and women are, by and large, serving with honor and that demands our respect and our support.

What about the foreign policy that put these men and women in harms way? It BLOWS.

There was NO REASON whatsoever for this country to have invaded Iraq. Saddam Hussein was a loudmouth, a tyrant that abused his own people (his sons were no prizes either,) and I hated his guts. I've written about Iraq since I covered the first Gulf War for CBS Radio and the more I learned about his regime, the more I hated him. He was truly an a-hole and he deserved what he got.

I have to admit that in the early days of the war I was all Gung Ho for it. I believed the Bush administration when they told us Saddam had weapons of Mass destruction and that our national sovereignty, not to mention our safety, was at stake. But it wasn't was it? We were lied into that war, and the only reason I have supported staying there is because it is our mess and we should clean it up. A complete troops withdrawal before a stable, functioning government could be elected would have guaranteed a civil war between the Sunni and Shia; then we would have, indirectly, even more blood on our hands

But the fact remains that the men an women serving in the armed forces are NOT murderers, not even at the General Staff level. Orders were given, and followed, to minimize civilian casualties when attacking or bombing a target from the first days of the war. Most times, an order to fire on a target must be requested from higher headquarters; it may be 10-20 minutes before authorization to fire is given. What other army in the history of the world has gone through so much trouble to protect the lives of innocents in a war zone? Answer: None.

Our military is a powerful and awesome weapon. It's likes have never been seen in the history of the world, and it is universally feared, as it should be; but it must be used only in cases where the safety of the American homeland and its citizenry is in jeopardy. I don't mind if helicopters drop off supplies to famine or earthquake victims, and we provide search dogs or other teams of specialists that can help after a disaster, but to invade a foreign country (that did nothing to us) in order to interfere with their internal affairs is not its purpose.

ETA: I meant to stick this in here after I read a post earlier that listed quotes about war. I'd like to share my own thoughts on that subject with a video.

"The only way to win is not to play."

edit on 8/9/2011 by OldCorp because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:57 PM
so what i want to know is those that condemn iraq and afghanistan do you condemn libya.

the same argument that was made for libya works for the other 2.

but wait ones wrong the other is "justifiable"

so which is it? the cake and eat it to or the condemantion of all.

ultimately what was already said is the biggest truth that noone can argue with.

you got a problem take it up with the civilian commander and cheif and leave the men and women who serve alone.

last i heard aint noone in the military ever started a war but they sure and fight and die in them unlike the potus.

edit on 9-8-2011 by neo96 because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:59 PM
I know I am coming to this discussion late, but I just have to speak my piece.

Point 1- It isn't the military's job to protect your freedoms- THAT'S YOUR JOB! (Assuming you are a citizen of the USA)

Point 2- It isn't the military's job to determine foreign policy- THAT'S YOUR JOB! (Ensure you elect the right people.)

Point 3- If it wasn't for the military, you wouldn't live in the USA it would be called something else.

Originally posted by saabster5

I respectfully disagree with you. See in our history (America), we threw together a ragtag bunch of hillbilly farmers and pushed back the greatest military in the world at that time.

The main reason those farmers and hunters won was because the British Empire was at war with most of the western world at the time. Much like the US today, the vast majority of the British army was spread across the globe policing the other colonies and fighting wars on the Continent. (Any one paying attention, here?) If we had been the sole opponent, we would have been squashed like a fly.

And where in the good Lord's name do you get the idea that the soldiers in the American Revolution didn't follow orders? I'm sure Gen Washington would have felt differently! You are aware that it was the regular army that was able to win the war, don't you? You know- the one that spent the winter at Valley Forge training? The militias unfortunately rarely stood firm when faced by the British army. Irregulars rarely do. But it sure sounds good on Independence Day TV specials...

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 05:00 PM
reply to post by wcitizen

There's a few things that make me rage on the inside:
1) The absolutely moronic "U-S-A" chant initiated in the stupidest situations by the dumbest of the herd
2) "It looks like a u.f.o." - how the #### can something LOOK LIKE an unidentified flying object????!!!!
3) The deifying of all US soldiers... its disgusting. Its one thing to respect that they could die in their line of work but "heroic infallible gods" the majority are not. Less than 1% of soldiers would qualify as a hero.
4) The concept that soldiers throwing grenades into mud huts of families on the other side of the world are somehow "defending our freedoms"... smh no one on earth gives a #### about our freedoms. They don't hate us for our "freedom" - and i use that word loosely. They hate us cuz we're arrogant, nosey, bloodthirsty hypocrites that think we're the global police and own everything and can do whatever we want. That's why they hate us.

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