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Ditch the U.S

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posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 02:41 AM
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Australia has for a long period of time remained loyal to the U.S and a strategic and economi partner. We have been members of a declining Western power, the U.S, U.K and Australia. For a long period of time I have advocated strengethening ties even further with China and joining an Asian power bloc where we will have more say and power. Our loyalities to the U.S have largely been cultural. While we have an agreement to come to America's aid in times of war and join them when called upon, they have no formal agreement to defend us. America suffered through the Global Financial Crisis and we averted it thanks to China and India buying our resources. This displays stronger economic ties in the Asian community than the declining Western world. While America did come to our rescue during world war 2, it is evident that this was for strategic purposes as aligning ourselves closer to China would be for strategic purposes today. We constantly block any vote in opposition to Israel because of stron lobying from the U.S and the U.S sells us out dated and largely irrelevant military equipment. While I am not suggesting we cut off ties with the U.S (not at all) I am suggesting it is time we play a far more predominant role in an Asian alliance as our economic needs are basically all met within in it. While the U.S has mismanaged their economy, a trade alliance with China and India has kept us from recession. We should maintain a strong strategic relationship with America, but strengthen our strategic relationship with China until it can replace America.

Get real Australia.
edit on 8-8-2011 by SpeachM1litant because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 03:00 AM
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reply to post by SpeachM1litant
 


LMAO, I'm sure when your unemployment rate reaches 20% and most of your products come from China, you'll have another interesting Thread to post on ATS.

One that speaks of how your job now has been sent to India or how a factory your brother used to work at has been relocated to China. Want to know what makes a 1st rate Country become a 3rd World Country.... doing what you just suggested.

What your country should do is the same thing mine should... bring the jobs back to our respective countries, and trade for actual resources so our countries can produce our own products... and if we cant, then we'll find an alternative.

Countries are made weak by weak minded politicians, and internationalist that care only about their own hierchy.



posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 03:30 AM
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reply to post by FoxStriker
 



Couldn't have said it better myself



posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 04:16 AM
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reply to post by FoxStriker
 




One that speaks of how your job now has been sent to India or how a factory your brother used to work at has been relocated to China.


It has already happened. We had a US CEO take over Telstra, our biggest telecommunication service and out source most of it to India, he made a packet but jobs and service quality declined. We have also had many good scientists in solar and other technologies move overseas to China and other countries because they just cannot get a break here. Manufacturing has a really hard time here due to the international currency competition.

I have no problem in coming to the defence of the US if it is under attack, but when it wants to lie about things and go on the assault I have no heart for it.



posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 04:38 AM
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reply to post by FoxStriker
 


It is pretty evident that you know little about the Australian economy. Of course most Americans know little about the outside world as we are according to many irrelevant. The fact is that we have China and India to thank for the increase in demand for labour in Australia. Their demand for our natural resources kept us safe during the recession and has allowed us to run a minimal budget defecit which should soon return to surplus unless external factors come into play again. As a trading partner China has been far more receptive and my fear of American decline atributes to my wish for Australia to develop a far more strategic relationship with China because in the event of American collapse or decline in world power we will need another strong freind.

The Chinese and Indians haven't been taking our jobs, they've been creating them. It is true that manafacturing in Australia does not make up a large chunk of our GDP and tariff cuts introduced in the 90's have added to its decline, however it was never so great. It is also important to note that the tariff cuts today have been praised. High tariffs caused major problems in Australia resulting in inefficiency and high prices as there was no competition. Australian manafacturers made garbage goods and garbage cars until foreign competition bit them in the but. Today we maintain an auto industry in Australia even if it suffered during the Global Financial Crisis. America's auto industry is almost all of shore, ours is not. The three largest contributors to our economy is finance and insurance, mining (thank China and India) and construction. The internet sector is also becoming a large player.

We have been for some time now developing a far more intimate relationship with China and for some time we have been becoming a major player in Asian politics and economics. Europe and America failure to responsibly run their own economies has caused greif for us, but as trading partners they are no where near as important as China. I could not imagine the difficult times Australia would be in were it not for Chinese and Indian economic growth.
edit on 8-8-2011 by SpeachM1litant because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 04:48 AM
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reply to post by SpeachM1litant
 


Sorry but no...

We should NOT be selling our natural resources, especially as cheaply as we are..

They are what has got us through the hard times but once they're gone that's it......

We should save them, re establish manufacturing and use them here to make value added products..

Why sell off our iron ore when we can build a car ????



posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 05:53 AM
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reply to post by kwakakev
 


I agree completely!!!

reply to post by SpeachM1litant
 


What in gods green earth are you talking about? Do you even hear what the F you are saying... we have India and China to thank for saving Australia, really?

So You have no problem that all profits are going to India and China as long as they use you as a work force, "Sounds like Slavery...

Once again, you sound like a defeatist, will you bend over backwards when they turn on you...

YOU ARE FROM A COUNTRY THAT HAS NATURAL RESOURCES AND THE CAPABILITY TO PRODUCE FROM THEM, YET YOUR OK With HANDING IT ALL TO CHINA AND INDIA...

It's people like you that read the news and never read between the lines. You want to have a triving stable economy? focus within, let the rest of the countries worry about their own.

reply to post by backinblack
 


Damn Straight!!!
edit on 8/8/2011 by FoxStriker because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 01:26 AM
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reply to post by backinblack
 


That is not what I disagree with. However, last time we had Australian manafactuered goods they were so expensive it was difficult to pay for them, the only difference was that high tariffs made it even more difficult to rely on imports.

I still don't see why we shouldn't join an Asian economic alliance?



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:26 AM
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Don't want to ally with America? Tell your government. ATS can't do anything about it. Personally I think America should ditch everyone else for a while and heal herself. We give over $50 billion a year in non-military foreign aid, and spend trillions militarily. We should pull out of the 120 or so countries we're not at war with (thus ceasing to artificially prop up their economies), pull out of the Middle East and let them eat each other. We kind of need domestic aid. If you don't want it, don't whine about it. Do something.

/TOA



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:35 AM
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reply to post by SpeachM1litant
 


You don't think this will fall on deaf ears?

China is by far the better future investment.

And since the US is drowning in debt issues, who would want to pump money into a dying economy? While China and India are still growing it would seem like a wasted investment.

Don't bother with the fearful replies. Or the "don't go offshore" crowd. I don't believe they have ever had a proper understanding of the world. When the borders are gone...what remains? Your Australia? Your America? Or your World?



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:38 AM
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Originally posted by backinblack
reply to post by SpeachM1litant
 


Sorry but no...

We should NOT be selling our natural resources, especially as cheaply as we are..

They are what has got us through the hard times but once they're gone that's it......

We should save them, re establish manufacturing and use them here to make value added products..

Why sell off our iron ore when we can build a car ????


ya! star!

and focus on your own internal stuff.

the world needs an aussie prius!!

just kidding, you guys could build a great roadster SUV!



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:42 AM
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Originally posted by Zamini
reply to post by SpeachM1litant
 


You don't think this will fall on deaf ears?

China is by far the better future investment.

And since the US is drowning in debt issues, who would want to pump money into a dying economy? While China and India are still growing it would seem like a wasted investment.

Don't bother with the fearful replies. Or the "don't go offshore" crowd. I don't believe they have ever had a proper understanding of the world. When the borders are gone...what remains? Your Australia? Your America? Or your World?



zami, india would be the better choice to back, don't ya think?

china is way anti islam.

you don't want that, right?



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:42 AM
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reply to post by The Old American
 


Well said my friend. I have to say that this thread has really made me see again the short term memory and fickle mindset of so many people



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 04:59 AM
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reply to post by fooks
 



zami, india would be the better choice to back, don't ya think?


Why not BOTH? More money.


china is way anti islam.


I don't think so. China has a very vast culture that goes back thousands of years. I think they want to keep their cultural heritage strong and I don't blame them, personally I love Chinese culture!


you don't want that, right?


I still don't adhere to any organized religion so sorry to burst your bubble YET AGAIN
Also, why are you following me around and posting ad homini all the time? Is that how you float your boat?



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 05:02 AM
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reply to post by CherubBaby
 


The short term memory would be the money Americans pump into their bank sector while their civilians and veterans are on streets.


What was it again? Over a trillion?


The audacity to claim others are short sighted while appointing America as the number one peering into a crystal ball to see the future...ignorance.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 05:25 AM
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reply to post by Zamini
 


I wrote this for a thread I started yesterday. I think it says it all on the subject of how I feel.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ -------------
It would be impossible to cover everything I want to say in one thread on this subject but I will cut to the chase with the basics. Look, when our leaders sent our jobs overseas, they knew what they were doing.. They knew they were trading the jobs of the "Average Jane and Joe" for cheap electronics etc and the corporate's "Bottom Line." Fast forward with me. In the late 1990's or there abouts, the "Capitol Gains Oppertunity" comes into play, allowing homeowners to make loads of money on sales of their homes, tax free.!! Move forward with me, In the early 2000's, Real Estate goes through the Roof !! and loans are given to almost anyone who ask's for one, knowing that there is a problem comming when it needs to be paid back! These "Loan Sharks" are not new to the game,they know whats a safe risk! So at this point, let me say, If you want to destroy a nation and its people, what is the best way to do it? Remember this also, this nation has a military. The members of which have family. ( Mothers, Fathers, Sisters, Brothers and children.) You can't overcome the population with brute force cause they own too many firearms and are not going to be sold without a fight, once they realize they have been betrayed.
So!! What do they do? They send our men and women in uniform to war. Making up false accusations and complete lies and fabrications to invade and destroy a foreign country. As a footnote, "The Enemy" in uniform was defeated quickly and yet we have stayed for a decade. If you add to that the deaths and mutilations of our beloved young men and women, our children, it's not a stretch to start to wonder, if maybe it's purpose is to destroy our military who should be here at home defending us from the lies and deceivers that have and continue to invade our privacey.
So where are we now? 14 trillion dollars+ in debt. As they planned it, unemployment through the roof!! The media controlled and owned by those who spout promises and false data of our predicament. Homeowners victimized by "The Bankers" etc.Foreclosed on while they crooks that positioned them for loss get bailouts and carry on with business as usual. Not to mention our produce and vegitables are rarely grown in the states anymore. The space program has been ended but not until we built the Space Station with tax payer dollars and play roommates to the very country that is communist and opposed us for decades. Lastly. Try to talk or have communication with your elected officials once they are in office. Try to find out what happened to the 2 trillion dollars that went missing at the Pentagon on 9/11 or the tens of billions that went to Iraq that dwindled away.
Remember one thing. If you dont provide a service of some kind, you dont have a job. The US is a consumer now and we flip hamburgers and live on crumbs unless your a lawyer, doctor, fireman, professional, etc.
There is a bright side though. Some of us have done well in all this mess. They are the ones that are supposed to be helping America and the American People. The Silent officials who we elected and the puppets they have retained to invade our privacey and police our lives while they re-write our forefathers dreams and promises with "New Money Making Laws" and pay for it with our childrens futures' and lives..

I invite your comments or insights. THIS IS SIMPLY MY TAKE ON THINGS!!!



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 05:32 AM
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reply to post by CherubBaby
 


That's nothing new to me. But explain then why eople in the middle-east are revolting. And Americans are not.

Short-term memory. The majority of Americans haven't gotten the slightest clue on what's going on. And if they did, they'd quickly forget it because Idols is on.

I bet the Libyans do. Egyptians. Syrians. Iranians. These people have a clue.

List goes on.

And America with the free-est people on the planet...is not revolting.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 05:34 AM
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Well...

The sad fact of the matter is that the landmass just can't support your civilization in the first place. Unless there's some sort of massive population reduction, Australia will always be importing goods at a net loss. The resources just aren't there to support a large population trying to live a "Western" lifestyle.

Australians are going to either have to seriously curb their consumption, perhaps even down to subsistence, or they'll have to content themselves with eventually being annexed by some other nation that has the resources to support them.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 05:49 AM
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reply to post by TheWalkingFox
 


Australia has already been annexed .

While the scum that pass as political leaders and guardians of our countries wealth future generations bicker and point score they way to the next election .. this is what happens

Not only have our mineral resources and our essential services been been sold for a pittance to foreign powers . They've also seen fit to allow countries who actually think ahead to grab valuable farmland .

www.crikey.com.au...


edit on 9-8-2011 by DevilsApprentice because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 05:56 AM
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reply to post by Zamini
 


i'm not "following" you.

u wish.


uyghur peoples in xinjiang are getting a smackdown and PC is not on the menu.

i just found it unusual you would back china.



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