When is life not worth living anymore?

reply to post by gabby2011


Grow up ? Forget that every time I do I get these thoughts of suicide.

Originally posted by MamaJ
I believe in helping others and being here for others in need. I like for people to be support for me as well in my time of need. We are here with an instinct to survive. We love deeply and sob when a loved one passes.

Suicide is a selfish act.....totally against what I believe. To be selfish and kill yourself is a slap in the face to your loved ones. Its a cowardly act. For anyone to commit such an act is pathetic in my opinion.

sorry but i have to disagree with the "Suicide is a selfish act" statement. while i respect that may be your opinion, i balk because i have way too often seen this sentiment dragged out in suicide discussion threads.

it's reminds me of how some people parrot that the people you see crying at funerals are only feeling sorry for themselves, etcetera. just because someone repeats something they've heard someone else say doesn't make it factual. opinion yes, lack of original thought, perhaps. either way, serious topics deserve deeper examination IMHO.

i can't agree that suicide is a cowardly act either. it is the exact opposite, it is the ultimate act of aggression. to be able to make such a choice and then follow through with it takes strong will and determination. many speak of it for the sake of attention or as a cry for help. the truly brave step up to the plate and knock one right out of the ballpark.

in our lifetime there are a huge amount of things taking place around the clock, 24/7. we may be affected by many events each day, to differing degrees of severity. there are many things we may like to see changed or not take place at all. in our reality we are very limited to what and how many things we may impact upon. sadly, most things, even the very things that change and affect our daily living, we can do little or nothing to change. for many that is an incredible source of frustration and feeling of hopelessness.

one of the few things we (the able-bodied) can control is choosing when and where we may wish to end our personal life cycle. this is not cowardice, this is bravery. nor is it an immoral act, as one being true to one's self to the most pure form, it is honorable.

there are many reasons and thoughts toward suicide. almost every time i read of someone losing their self-control and killing or harming others and then killing themself i think "what a shame he didn't just start with himself. now people are dead, people are injured/scarred, people are traumatized. he should have just killed himself."

often when i read of a person who either chose to do a terrible act or lost their ability to restrain themselves from acting upon horrible impulses, these people who commit rape, torture, paedophilia etcetera i can't help but wish they had simply killed themselves instead of harming an innocent or ruining another persons life. on the big picture, it really would have been for the better.

if i woke tomorrow and read on ATS that there was mass suicide around the world and all the people that do the things which make reading newspapers makes one feel sick, those who mis-lead and make life hell, who are responsible for the sick twisted depraved acts that make living so hard for so many, if they all killed themselves while i slept, i would give thanks and praise to God that these bad people got conscious. i would have hope for a better world.

sound crazy? think of how much nicer life would have been for people if Adolf Hitler, Josef Stalin, Emperor Hirohito, Vlad the Impaler, Attila the Hun, Caligula, Pol Pot and Idi Amin Dada had suicided in their youth instead of living the lives they lead.

reply to post by caladonea


Thank you for posting that link... very informative,as well as compassionate.

Especially what is written on the end.

A suicidal action that manifests from intense, excruciating, unbearable pain associated with a serious mental illness has nothing to do with selfishness. Period.

reply to post by MamaJ


It’s all about me, me…me…me, how could they do this to ME. Who’s the selfish one?
What about the poor soul, what about them.

Originally posted by gabby2011
reply to post by caladonea

 

Thank you for posting that link... very informative,as well as compassionate.

Especially what is written on the end.

A suicidal action that manifests from intense, excruciating, unbearable pain associated with a serious mental illness has nothing to do with selfishness. Period.

edit on 5-8-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)

You are welcome....I have someone in my family...who is ill....and has attempted suicide...although I would miss her.....I understand that she is in pain.....thankfully...she is getting help...and wants to live now.

when you get caught red handed robbing the federal reserve after killing 2000 feds

sitting in a hotel room...in a very northern canadian city.....
responsible for a $ 2,000,000 construction project......
A wife who phones me who is 450 km's away complaining about bills., our 17yrs old daughter ..who is piercing and tattooing everything thing on her body..............
$ 50,000 owing on a line of credit.........
$1900 mortgage payment....
project behind 2 weeks and over-budget..............


ya I thought about it.......

is this normal??

most people will never know how life is for some people. they can not relate, and never will.

reply to post by wrathchild


I'd say in that case ? It's normal for it to cross you're mind. If you ever move toward it in the slightest way ? Do
the people who love you, a big favor and call someone. Sometimes it helps, if someone else just sees the crap you're going thru.

reply to post by davespanners


The way I see it, when someone believes in something that makes your life worthless, the the point of ending your own life. May it be something such as you lose your family and have no one else to turn to, or you commit an act so horrible, you feel you cannot ever repay it back and thus, end your life etc.

Religion can play a part, but in reality religions in the world have come around from man's own beliefs and not of the Heavenly Father Yahuwah's, and contradicts the meaning of why we are here, and what the purpose of your life is.

I think the theory of evolution, or anyone believing in the big bang, or aliens made people etc, would make anyone feel completely worthless. What would be the point of living if you were an accident and have no purpose in life??? Or the true case of the matter, the WHOLE UNIVERSE WAS AN ACCIDENT of random occurances and selections based on moments of increasing complexity for no apparent reason to what we are now. And that species after species survived cause it was at the right place at the right time, and had the right sort of attributes, which in fact was just 'lucky'. And humans are just a mixture of complex molecules that collected together somehow, and for no reason we are here today.

Anyone believing in evolution as their 'god' or creator I believe would make life worth not living, cause when you die, you get sucked up in the gene code, food for some plant and THATS IT!! Doesnt that just make you feel so special?

Yes, life's everyday headaches can get overwhelming at times and consume us.

And while we're amidst the climax of these daily drudgeries sucking up the lifeblood from our veins:

It's important to always stop, take a deep long breath, and push yourself forward... Why you say ? Because of all the beautiful things this life brings us every now and then. It's those little joys that put a temporary smile on our face that make it all worth while.


- Our kids drive us nuts, but every now and then they say or do something that melts our heart and reminds us of how much we love them.
- Our spouse drives us nuts and we drive them nuts, but we struggle together side by side through the thick of the crap tagteaming the world together and this reminds us of how much we need each other.
- The bills pile up and the boss refuses to give us a raise, but we still manage to enjoy a bbq and cold beer with our loved ones and neighbours and that reminds us why we put up with the bills and the boss.


So for me, what would make life no longer worth living ?

When I'm unable to comprehend those little joys anymore, my mind is gone and I've become a drooling, dribbling vegetable... Somebody please promise me that if I ever reach that point, they will pull the plug and release me of my lifeless prison.

Thanks.

I think we have far more control of our bodies and when we pass than anyone realizes. My grandfather recently passed, for some time before then he could not move, could not potty on his own and suffered all kinds of humiliations along with pain. During this time my Grandmother told him to fight because she was not ready for him to pass.

This continued bad and got worse for him until finally she told him that it was ok, if he needed to go she was prepared. He died that same day shortly after she told him that. Would you consider that suicide because he gave up the fight?

I've also known of a person that was terminally ill for a while not expected to live for even a day. He was close to receiving a promotion though which would provide more benefits to his family. He checked with his Human Resources (HR) regularly to double check when it was due. Finally the day came and he checked with HR, the action hadn;t updated everywhere yet. Two days later he was informed that it went through and was completely official, he died that day. Would you consider that suicide considering he finally allowed himself to pass?

We in general understand nothing about life and death, it is impossible to judge someone elses motives unless we lived their lives. I don;t like to think I would commit suicide ever but someone earlier posted what I believe valid reasons that anyone would consider it as an option

"I would contemplate suicide if I was in pain, dying anyway, with no hope of relief.
I would contemplate suicide if it was to save me from dying a horrible death.
I would contemplate suicide I was the only person left on earth.
I might contemplate suicide if I killed someone, out of guilt." (this last one may make anyone with a consciense consider it anyways)

Hopefully it never comes to that point but there are some cases where someone staying in this life would offer no personal benefit to that person. Some cases where you deal with nothing but humiliating and painful situations on a regular basis.

One last comment, in the cases where someone's love for another causes them to fight and hold onto life beyond what is reasonable or expected who is the selfish person then. The person dying that would give anything for relief or the people convincing them to fight on?

It's not always a selfish act.
If you say that to somebody who threatens to do it, it will only cause more pain

I recently attempted suicide and harmed myself, I didn't die obviously.
My reason was I was terribly hurt by some of my family repeatedly telling me I had ruined their lives because I became disabled. Although I have worked very hard to be independant and do things for myself, some things I simply cannot do.

I was never one to ask for help, so it was difficult to take on this new role of would you mind doing this or that for me please and thankyou. Because this is a new me, I am labelled bossy and other names.

I have fallen many times or burnt myself in the kitchen from trying to do something I didn't dare ask one of them to do, because I don't want to add another chore. Coming back home from hospital into the real world was a tough adjustment of which I wasn't prepared for, that's when reality sets in at exactly what happened to you and what you have lost. After I came home I started stuttering and making stupid sounds and they would mimmick me and call me mongo. I would laugh at the humour in that, but at same time it wasnt very funny.

I was not depressed about my condition. Frustrated yes but not suicidal over it.
I was hurt by the constant verbal abuse of my caregivers, mostly by my husband. I'm also missing a few screws in my brain now, so that may play a part in not thinking clearly.

The way I saw it is I was doing them a favour by getting rid of me. I was a burden. They said so.

reply to post by davespanners
Ho, friend.

Grant, I'm slightly buzzed and haven't read through the thread yet, but I will say: never.

Life sucks. And life is hard. I'll not contest either point. But life is also amazing, vibrant, and fantastic, and all too often we get caught up in our own little traps - which empowers the world of men entirely too much - without realizing that we live in a mysterious and masterful universe of wonder and amazement and tend to focus on the microscopic entirely too much.

Additionally, and I know it's way too easy to do so, our focus on the world of men strangles and limits us as we tend to focus on the self in such. It seems that entirely too few of us realize that - details aside - all of us deal with the same things, and all of us end up the same way.

The best we can do in this life is to try to improve things for everyone else - a 'communist' idea for sure, and one that definitely cannot be accomplished by force. All we can do rationally is our small bit, and to live in love and kindness and extending to all what we wish we ourselves could have - unconditional love, education, and improvement - upon all others.

Life is never not worth living, as the only alternative is nothing...and this is never preferable as it is exactly that - nothing. Life is only worth improving, or striving to do so...even if we fail (on occasion).

You can only move up - or down - from something. You can never move either direction from nothing. Nothing is the absence of anything, and the absence of anything is definitely less valuable than the presence of something.

Be well, and let all know that the opportunity to improve and grow upon something is always preferable to the alternative. God bless, and I love you...and that's not something weird.

Originally posted by MamaJ
I believe in helping others and being here for others in need. I like for people to be support for me as well in my time of need. We are here with an instinct to survive. We love deeply and sob when a loved one passes.

Suicide is a selfish act.....totally against what I believe. To be selfish and kill yourself is a slap in the face to your loved ones. Its a cowardly act. For anyone to commit such an act is pathetic in my opinion.

I believe it is selfish of "loved ones" to encourage or insist that you live a life you do not wish to live. If you have non adult children then wait until they can take care of themselves, if you can. But if they are grown or you don't have children..then BANG BANG if you choose.

Never understood the cowadly argument either..if I am a school guard instead of a fireman..Am I also a coward? Or am I just following MY will..with MY life.

Peace

Absolutely no "right" is guaranteed in this life..Not a one..Now you have to take the death of my choice too?

Peace

Suicide is a God´s invention like everything else so... maybe it´s not that bad after all.

just thought I would share.

"Suicide is Painless" by Johnny Mandel..made popular by the movie MASH

Through early morning fog I see
visions of the things to be
the pains that are withheld for me
I realize and I can see...

That suicide is painless
It brings on many changes
and I can take or leave it if I please.

I try to find a way to make
all our little joys relate
without that ever-present hate
but now I know that it's too late, and...

The game of life is hard to play
I'm gonna lose it anyway
The losing card I'll someday lay
so this is all I have to say.

The only way to win is cheat
And lay it down before I'm beat
and to another give my seat
for that's the only painless feat.

The sword of time will pierce our skins
It doesn't hurt when it begins
But as it works its way on in
The pain grows stronger...watch it grin, but...

A brave man once requested me
to answer questions that are key
'is it to be or not to be'
and I replied 'oh why ask me?'

'Cause suicide is painless
it brings on many changes
and I can take or leave it if I please.
...and you can do the same thing if you choose.

I really can't stand when people say suicide is a selfish act. To the ones who say that, do you know anyone close to you that did commit suicide? If you do then you would know that their pain is so unbearable that their not thinking clearly. Someone in my family died this way and i know he loved us very much and I am sure he didn't want to hurt us. I would never say he was selfish, just sick from deep depression.

Life isnt worth living when you are too stupid to live and consider taking your own life.