When is life not worth living anymore?

It an interesting question OP,

But you know i have often thought what would be to much, But you know i think my own answer would be NOTHING!

You know why? I have been through a heck of a year, I have had to fight many battles and also face fears,

I have really put alot in to helping children dying of cancer in the last few months, and i tell you what it has made me realise that im so privileged to have my life, That i have my health, To end my own life would be cheating all those with terrible life ending illness's, They have no choice and they would happily swap with me even with all the baggage, problems i may carry around,

My father has an incurable cancer and i really feel that im blessed to be able to live,
This is my own personal opinion and in no way do i degrade those who have felt life has been to much,

But when you have a life, Yes you can hit the bottom hard as a stone, but you have the ability to also get back up,

And maybe im just a little naive but maybe those who feel like they cant take anymore could put just a little effort in to helping others in need, Be a role model and use there experience to help save others,

The other avenue we have to remember is that some that take there life have metal illness and are kinda left with nobody to help them intern ending up with them feeling its the only way,

reply to post by Romekje


Also.....just in case you have not read all of my posts....I too have seen three of my loved ones commit suicide.Two aunts and a boyfriend.... saw my boyfriends brains all over the place. Yeah.....sure did. I GET TO LIVE WITH THAT image and SO DO HIS PARENTS. That was real loving and courageous of him ( so most on this thread think).

There is no hypocrisy with love...

I have a friend who has MS and she is and has been confined to a wheel chair now for years. She is the courageous one IMO.. She shows all around her just how hard life can be and she shows us all just how she overcomes it by giving and helping others with the disease.

I have seen my step son in pain and dying for months before he actually took his last breath. It was and still is a nightmare. He didnt get the chance to experience A LOT.

I have seen a handful of others pass on....saw them take their last breath and although images come to me at night in my dreams.....its unbearable at times.....I keep on a going and I promote such.

If it is the end and you wanna help the end come by feeding the IV Morphine every chance you get .....go for it. Its the end and there is no turning back.

I have compassion for the depressed person...but I do not promote the act.

The young ones on this thread need someone on here who is promoting hope, love and LIFE.

I am taking that stand.

My son said he wanted to just die when this bully was picking on him years ago. Kids kill themselves over stuff like that and I find it just so sad that others are all over this thread promoting such a thing.

Again I say to anyone wanting to commit suicide....email me...I CARE enough to help in such a dire time in YOUR life.

I know what its like to feel depressed. I know what its like to be in pain every day. I have neck and back pain so bad It is hard for me to sleep ......and I do not take pills because they do not help ease the pain. I cant have surgery.....I have been DOWN...and life is as good as I make it.

So I again say....email me.....I have been there and can help you fight the fight!

I have really put alot in to helping children dying of cancer in the last few months, and i tell you what it has made me realise that im so privileged to have my life, That i have my health, To end my own life would be cheating all those with terrible life ending illness's, They have no choice and they would happily swap with me even with all the baggage, problems i may carry around,

reply to post by asala


This above is what I have seen ....children come from all over to go to Vanderbilt here in TN. I watched my step son go through one snowball effect after the other. It was a nightmare and it hurts me sooooo bad to think he never had the chance...other children never had the chance. Children fighting for their life every day to over come the pain and disease. The snowball effects leave them in the hospital for weeks at a time only to go back and suffer more. We didnt want to see Joshua in pain like that...listen to him moan and groan all through the night for 6 months. He didnt want the pain but he went through it to LIVE....to overcome the cancer that eventually ate him up.

I love so deeply and it hurts me so bad to think anyone would take their life, especially over reasons of depression. The children on this site should not think its ok. My heart breaks for the teens ......

I would have to say when I don't have anyone to love around me who love me back. As long as I have Loved ones around me there is always a reason to live no matter how bad things get in the world.

I am bi-Polar as well and have thought about this in my past several times. It wasn't till I got older that I found out what was really important in life.

The happy pills don't hurt either

The other avenue we have to remember is that some that take there life have metal illness and are kinda left with nobody to help them intern ending up with them feeling its the only way,

reply to post by asala


This too I can indeed not only understand but also sympathize with.

Also, we have become nations who are addicted to pills. You go to the DR. and he gives you a pill. I have many loved ones addicted to pills. Oxy's and tabs are two I hear a lot about. People who are addicted eventually end up with a mind that is distorted. It causes them to become mentally challenged within their own world and the world around them. There is still hope.....

There are ones who will fight the fight and others who will give up. Thats life. But if you ask me if it is ok to end your life I will say no. I will help fight the fight with you. I have enough strength to make the world go around for all of us.

Can you ever imagine a point where you would consider suicide as an option, or do you believe that it is never an option however bad life is?

It shouldn't be an option but unfortunately it is for many people for many a reason. The world isn't as sugar coated as it seemed as a child, it's a shame children have the wool pulled over their eyes. Only as you grow do you start to see the world as it is and why it shouldn't be this way and how easy it would be to change it. Unfortunately TPTB don't want it changed. End of story.

Have you ever been at the point of considering ending your life and if so what made you decide not to go through with it, fear if the unknown, thinking of the people you would leave behind?

I have and even started the process of slamming pills down my throat, what kept me from going through with it was my wife and children and not leaving them with scars that would maybe create a similar issue for them later in life. Fear also played a part I suppose.

Would religion play any part in you making a decision like that and if so, how?

I had a great belief in God, in fact I found God on my own and religion followed. I felt at the time that God totally understood why - probably better than I did and that he/she would accept it and still love me afterwards.

To finish, I have suffered from chronic pain for the past 11 years, I am on high doses of fentanyl and other fast acting painkillers as well as anti-depressants. I wasn't so much sick of the pain but more had lost hope. Going from a healthy, strong and positively minded person to someone who can't support his family or do much of anything physical was hard to deal with, in fact it's a constant battle. Over the years I have lost most of my muscles in my stomach and back and trying to exercise is painful and fruitless. Above all of this it is the way I have been treated by people and especially friends since my accident. This is who I have lost hope in, humankind.
I hope this answers some of your questions.

Peace

To all those spouting religious nonsense...

"God given gift of life...." ... please... Why would a so called loving God make so many people SUFFER in agonising painm heartache or misery?

And doesn't the Bible say to not judge others? So WHO ARE YOU to forgive someone for taking their life?
So many times these so called religious types don't practise what they preach unless it suits their cause.

If God gave them life, then it is up to God to decide if they are to be forgiven or not, not the self-righteous.

To those who think it's a coward's way out, seriously... go grab a knife and stab yourself now? No, you can't do it, it takes guts, lots of guts and lots of courage.

I don't think it's right that people should suffer or hurt so much, it upsets me a lot but I sympathize with their decision, it IS their decision and certainly not cowardly.

It's too easy to point and judge. It's not your place to do either, disaprove by all means but NEVER judge.

reply to post by Mister_Bit


Well....I do not think it is right that you promote such a thing when we have tons of young people on here suffering one bully after the other. People can be soooo vulnerable and when they are...others saying DO IT....is such a sad notion in my heart. This thread is not only depressing but there are waaaaaay tooo many people on here thinking its a good enough solution.

Be a cause for love and be a cause that leads one to love and not promote fear. Here is a thread I think you may want to be a part of. Learn about LOVE and who YOU are and WHO we are and how much power there is in LOVE and then maybe you will see light. Maybe others who promote fear will after reading this thread begin to open your heart to LOVE.

No RELIGION is needed to promote LOVE and NO RELIGION is needed to fight the fight. Its just the right thing to do. The right thing to do is to promote love with all you do and all you say no matter how hard it gets.

LOVE IS THE ANSWER!!!!!!!!!!!!


Promote Love...NOT FEAR ATS!!!!!!!!!!!!! Promote LIFE to our young ones...they are the innocent ones.

You want to dwell on lifes pains? Dwell on others who are experiencing it...help someone in need. Be of service to others .....this is where LOVE comes into play....not fear!

LOVE one another as yourself. KNOW WHO YOU ARE AND WHERE YOU COME FROM......KNOW you can contribute to this hateful and unjust world by shining your light of LOVE. DO not give into all the fear on this thread. YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE with YOUR PRECIOUS LIFE!!!!!

Read this thread....learn what it is like to love others and not promote such a thread or words of fear.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

This thread linked above is one that does not promote fear. Get over yourself and all your woes and go be of service to others in need. Maybe then you can get out of the "SELF" ego and get into shining your light on others in need! DO it....try it.....then if you still want to take a go at death....go for it but I will shine my light on you and help you until we win the fight! I believe in FIGHTING for love. DO you?

Originally posted by MamaJ
reply to post by Mister_Bit

 

Well....I do not think it is right that you promote such a thing when we have tons of young people on here suffering one bully after the other. People can be soooo vulnerable and when they are...others saying DO IT....is such a sad notion in my heart. This thread is not only depressing but there are waaaaaay tooo many people on here thinking its a good enough solution.

Be a cause for love and be a cause that leads one to love and not promote fear. Here is a thread I think you may want to be a part of. Learn about LOVE and who YOU are and WHO we are and how much power there is in LOVE and then maybe you will see light. Maybe others who promote fear will after reading this thread begin to open your heart to LOVE.

No RELIGION is needed to promote LOVE and NO RELIGION is needed to fight the fight. Its just the right thing to do. The right thing to do is to promote love with all you do and all you say no matter how hard it gets.

LOVE IS THE ANSWER!!!!!!!!!!!!


Promote Love...NOT FEAR ATS!!!!!!!!!!!!! Promote LIFE to our young ones...they are the innocent ones.

You want to dwell on lifes pains? Dwell on others who are experiencing it...help someone in need. Be of service to others .....this is where LOVE comes into play....not fear!

LOVE one another as yourself. KNOW WHO YOU ARE AND WHERE YOU COME FROM......KNOW you can contribute to this hateful and unjust world by shining your light of LOVE. DO not give into all the fear on this thread. YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE with YOUR PRECIOUS LIFE!!!!!

Read this thread....learn what it is like to love others and not promote such a thread or words of fear.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

This thread linked above is one that does not promote fear. Get over yourself and all your woes and go be of service to others in need. Maybe then you can get out of the "SELF" ego and get into shining your light on others in need! DO it....try it.....then if you still want to take a go at death....go for it but I will shine my light on you and help you until we win the fight! I believe in FIGHTING for love. DO you?

Thanks for the reply.

I don't support suicide, I don't think it's the answer but for some it is, the pain they go through no one can know or understand.
I just don't judge their decision.
It's a terrible terrible thing that someone suffers so much that they feel this is their only path but I sympathise if they do.
It's not my place to forgive or be angry... ask why you are being angry? Angry because you wanted to extend their suffering? Angry because they left YOU? You should feel for their pain and hurting, not your own, that is the real selfishness.

I feel sorry for them, they hurt so bad they left...

It's a sad thing, but I refuse to see it as cowardly or the easy way out.

Above all of this it is the way I have been treated by people and especially friends since my accident. This is who I have lost hope in, humankind.

reply to post by Rellix


I understand.... expectations of others is a let down all too many times. We want people to accept us....even at our lows. When I became homeless I had to let my kids go stay with their dad those dreadful three months. I had so much against me as I always had. I just wanted a break. From the little girl, to now an adult life had treated me unfairly. I was sooooo down after all I had been through. I didn't think my kids needed me....what did I have to offer them? To love your family enough to not put them through the pain of losing you is imo commendable. It would have been easy to give up and go to the afterlife without pain. But....you show everyone around you just how much strength you have. You show them love of not self...but for them when you decide to go on with life. Thinking of others first is true love my friend. I wish I could give you a big hug right now. Its so sad when the ones we trust and love let us down. It makes us feel so alone. But....we are never alone in pain. There is always someone worse off we could be of service to.

Feel free to dump all your pain on me. Message me even if it is just a rant. Message me if you cant sleep. Message me to hear and feel love through my words. I am here for you and anyone else who wants to give up the fight ...I care....I love...and I am here to help.

Peace and love to you and yours!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! xoxoxox


Jenn

I don't support suicide, I don't think it's the answer but for some it is, the pain they go through no one can know or understand.

reply to post by Mister_Bit


I have known the pain....I DO know the pain every single breathe I take!!!!!. I have had my own experiences and still do. I CHOSE to not give up. I CHOSE to fight. I have lost many to suicide and disease. I do not think anyone should live in pain. Many experience it as I have.....for YEARS and still fight the fight. Promote love in your words. DO not promote fear. This is simple. Many on here are young...many on here need hope....many on here are alone and need YOU and I and everyone else to say...do NOT give up. You can do it. FIGHT the fight. Its hard...but you CAN DO IT. Change your way of thinking. Seek counseling, Get a hobby (and if you are confined...write, listen to music), find beauty in life instead of giving up on it. Grab a book that teaches you how to survive. BE a voice for the suicide mind but do not promote that its done out of love ...its fear based when the thought comes in. Replace your thoughts with LOVE.

Its easy to give up when the mountain is so steep. Its harder when you climb it in pain and when you make it to the top....you can sit, relax and dwell on the journey that took you to the top ....the will you had to stay strong and keep on climbing. Its real easy to say screw it....that mountain is too much. I think I will go have a stab at myself and forget all about that Big Mountain...its just too much for me. This way of thinking can be changed. Its starts within and the love from others can help sustain it. Be a cause for love ....not fear. Tell others the love you have for them and the love you have for them to help in their time of need. Its easy for u to sit around and say go for it. Its harder when we have to give some of ourselves in order to help others in need of OUR LOVE.

The love I have for others is not for myself. It is for you and everyone to have....I give it freely and without condition. I love my loved ones who committed the act. I forgive them for putting us through the daily images we bear for the rest of our life. I understand what they were going through. I chose to fight...they chose to end it. I get it. BUT....I will not promote it and I will fight the fight for others because as long as I am breathing I see a reason to help others in this fight. I CARE enough for THEM to say I LOVE YOU....lets look at this situation another way.

reply to post by Mister_Bit

I don't support suicide, I don't think it's the answer but for some it is, the pain they go through no one can know or understand. I just don't judge their decision.

I am happy you said those words ,because it is how I feel as well..I don't think anyone of us is "promoting" suicide,just merely saying we understand that it is a choice , and we would not judge someone as selfish and pathetic if they should be at such a point where they felt it was their only option to stop the pain.

My wish is that those who contemplate it, find the strength to carry on ...but for those who haven't or don't...I will not judge...there is far too much judgement in this world as is. May they find peace and love in another realm is my wish and hope for them.

reply to post by MamaJ

Thanks for your reply, it is greatly appreciated. The struggle I experienced was quite intense at the time but as with anything the wounds heal but also sometimes the scars remain. Since then I have tried to surround myself with love and real people - not those that drain me, although I tend not to make many friends as I am weary of the trappings that go along with some friendships.
I have had many friends in the past that count what has been given and received in the relationship, I saw this mentality in many work places as well when I was able to work. Early on after my injury I found that most people still expected me to be able to do things as I would have normally done them and totally forgot or dismissed the fact that I was unable to do what they wanted. That was rather frustrating and it was then that I started to avoid people through fear of not being able to please them I suppose.Also the people that felt I couldn't be of any value to them anymore stopped coming around. Most of all is I feel I'm a burden to my family which I know is not really true and it's been hard to readjust to my new life, the physical pain always comes second to the emotional pain.
I suppose that the best thing to say is that the seed for suicide is planted and nurtured over a period of time and that it can have many contributing factors to tip it over the edge of reasoning. Our minds and souls are so vulnerable sometimes that we can start to believe that ending it is the best solution. I thank God and my family everyday that I have been able to move away from that dark place, although the struggle continues it feels a little easier to be strong against it.

I am also reading though the link you posted, thankyou. It's a very interesting thread that I can relate to easily.

Peace

reply to post by Rellix


Oh how do I feel your pain and know it all to well. Its when I said to myself....It is ok to not have that friend around anymore...or that friend....that I was able to truly find my inner strength once more. The ones who drain you of your positive energy are the ones to stay away from...at least until your energy level is built back up to help them focus on the positive. The darkness surrounds us all....some people in the dark thrive off of others weakness.

I am so very proud of you and please know that I am only a click away. I will be the voice of care and love for your life. It is a precious one and I am so glad you have remained steadfast as hard and as painful as it is. You are a fighter....we fighters can fight the fight for others in need too.

Do not let others carelessness for your spirit sway you in the least.

I am also glad you took the time to read that thread. There is a lot of insight and wisdom lurking around ATS. Fear is nothing when it is up against LOVE my friend.

I love you and so glad you stayed around to read these words of love. I sure hope you feel them resonating in my words. They are real! They are not selfish....they are for YOU and everyone else who needs just a little bit of light to keep on going. Faith in you is faith in me that I can help sustain the life within your spirit. I will lift you up out of darkness and carry your burden. Unfortunately I have many of my own.....but I do have enough room for more. Give them to me anytime.


Peace and love to you and yours!!!!!xoxoxoxoxo

Jenn

Some of you are just so pessimistic.

Why not look at the world with rose colored glasses? Why not half full?

I believe in the Judaic conception of God because of its personal intimacy. God is not some impersonal 'presence' which has no stake in your own individual destiny, as Pagans think (and as you can see throughout this thread is the more popular perspective) , God is God of all. The forces which create the world - Elohim - are one with God - the tetragrammaton. The former are objective forces, while the latter - YHVH - is the deepest, and most spiritual expression of Gods essence. Elohim is objective, while YHVH is subjective. But as the famous saying of the Hebraic expression of faith goes "Hear Israel, YHVH is Elohim, YHVH is one. Basically, Elohim is the Heh's of YHVH. Its purpose is to serve as a container for the Godly subjective experience of Gods truth.

Read William James "the varities of religious experience" for some tremendously useful examples for how for many saints and mystics, Gods truth becomes integrated and unififed within spacial and temporal reality.

reply to post by dontreally

Some of you are just so pessimistic. Why not look at the world with rose colored glasses? Why not half full?

I really think you are missing the point some are trying to make. Until you live with physical,and emotional pain on a daily basis with no way out, at a tremendous financial burden to loved ones... you really can't understand that putting on rose colored glasses does in no way help.

reply to post by davespanners


Wonderful topic OP. I believe that our lives are our own, so I am in total support if someone (who is rational) wants to commit suicide. Who are we to decide if someone must live? The real problem comes from deciding what constitutes rationality.

Most folks will say that there's absolutely nothing rational about suicide and, therefore, anyone who attempts it should be stopped and labeled mentally defective. But I beg to differ, I had a relative whom I was very close to that suffered from terminal lung cancer. He was a fighter and one of the bravest men that I've ever had the pleasure to meet. Towards the end he couldn't really get out of bed and had lost all sense of independence and dignity.On the last day of his life he managed to get the gun from his bedside nightstand, place the gun against his temple and pull the trigger.

How could someone stand to call him a selfish coward? The real selfish people are those that would have seen him lie in bed until he had absolutely no faculties left. And cowardice? He stood (figuratively) staring at the gaping maw of mortality and did not shy away. We should all be so brave.

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Want to get Whole, clean and optimistic have faith joy in the now and future and let go of the past,

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reply to post by MamaJ


I have to agree with Mister_Bit here. I don't think it is fair for you to say you've felt their pain and know what they went through yet you chose to continue "fighting", that doesn't sound very compassionate at all. I also don't think it is very compassionate or helpful to say you forgive them for putting you and your family through pain. This also sounds very selfish. It is your decision to hold onto images of someone who is no longer with you, who chose to end their life because they were unhappy with how it was. People who are suffering extremely like this don't want you to tell them how to live or how to be strong like you, in fact that may be the reason they are so depressed in the first place, they only want someone to understand them and not judge them for feeling the way they do. Maybe that is why psychotherapy has failed so many of these kids.

Peace.

I think sometimes it IS selfish and so people don't do it because they understand. Some people have lost their mind and so they're no longer able to know whether it's selfish or not. Some people do it because they have determined that they're a burden to others and that their loss would actually benefit people who love them as oppose to hurting them. Some people do it because they're too young to understand what it all means - the growing years can be hard.

It's not black and white; wrong or right. Each person who commits to it goes through years and years of experiences that lead them to that point on the precipice. Is it ever selfish? IMHO, people aren't given credit for understanding things. Just because somebody commits suicide does not mean that they do not understand. If they understand it to be selfish and do it anyway, then it can categorically be described as selfish, but only for them. It would not be the first time.

But it's my opinion that most people who do kill themselves are not knowingly selfish.

This discussion reminds me of an article I was just reading in Discovery magazine. It was about how in dire situations people tend to turn to instinct rather than reason. There was also another article about how our impressions of things can be irrational and subject to random influences from our environment. The article went on to conclude that reasoning our way through things is something our 'new brain' gifted us and it should be used a lot more often than we have seen it in clinical studies. All of this somehow seems to interconnect in some peculiar way.

Here is a post I made about this:
www.abovetopsecret.com...