Elenin Coma Diameter Exceeds 200,000 km says Leonid Elenin

Originally posted by StalkingGoogle

It would be best not to say anything remotely like that.

Actually, yeah, it would.

Abjectly false.

Nope, it's true.

Again, false.

Again, it's actually true.

Also quite false.

Yeeaaahhh...it's true.

Hahaha yes of course the ridiculous "dynamo" hypothesis, universally discredited by all of known physics.

Yes, the Dynamo effect, which has been modeled and proven to accurately describe not only planetary geomagnetic fields but also the apparently ransom reversals of those fields. The physics, as it always is, is on my side.

Planetary magnetic fields are not generated by "liquid core", they are generated by electric fields, such as the radial electric field powering the sun, in the path of which are all known planets and bodies of the solar system, including comets and "KBO"'s.

That would be an induced magnetic field, such as what Venus has. The Earth has an internally-generated (geo)magnetic field.

See, I can play this game, too. If you want me to start taking you seriously, I suggest you show some sources to back your claims.

Originally posted by CLPrime
Actually, yeah, it would.

False.

Originally posted by CLPrime
Nope, it's true.

Also false.

Originally posted by CLPrime
Again, it's actually true.

And, once again, false.

Originally posted by CLPrime
Yeeaaahhh...it's true.

Faaaaaalse.

Originally posted by CLPrime
Yes, the Dynamo effect, which has been modeled and proven to accurately describe not only planetary geomagnetic fields but also the apparently ransom reversals of those fields.

Once more, no surprise, false. There is nothing "proven" about "dynamo". It is a riotously absurd hypothesis with utterly no empirical referent. The only way it's been "modeled" is in cartoons.

Originally posted by CLPrime
The physics, as it always is, is on my side.

You must be using a novel definition of the word "physics" with which I'm not familiar.

Originally posted by CLPrime
That would be an induced magnetic field, such as what Venus has. The Earth has an internally-generated (geo)magnetic field.

Simply not true, you can split hairs all you like and debate semantics all day long, it won't change the fact that the only known way to generate a magnetic field is with electric fields, not some imaginary "dynamo" inside "liquid core" planets. There is no known planet with a liquid core in the first place, so right off the bat you're straying into hallucinatory terrain.

Originally posted by CLPrime
See, I can play this game, too. If you want me to start taking you seriously, I suggest you show some sources to back your claims.

Personally I don't care if you take me seriously, I'm still going to be right and you're going to be wrong.

Originally posted by StalkingGoogle

There is no known way to generate a magnetic field except by using electric fields. Period. You can split all the hairs you like or play semantic games all day long, that fact is not going to ever change.

As you say, a magnetic field is induced by a changing electric field. But this fact does not negate internally induced geomagnetic field.
At the center of the Earth, the solid iron inner core rotates at a slightly different speed than the molten iron outer core. This interaction generates an electric field. The rotation of the Earth, then, means that this electric field is changing (rotating), and its this changing electric field at the core of the Earth which generates a roughly dipole magnetic field through and around the Earth.

Originally posted by StalkingGoogle

Once more, no surprise, false. There is nothing "proven" about "dynamo". It is a riotously absurd hypothesis with utterly no empirical referent. The only way it's been "modeled" is in cartoons.

Wrong.
Modelling the Earth's magnetic field.

Originally posted by AstroBuzz
Comet McNaught in 2007 was bigger and had a closer approach to Earth then Elenin will.

Nothing to worry about.

I agree, you should pay more attention to the ELITES robbing you blind while you stare at a comet of NO IMPORTANCE.

reply to post by StalkingGoogle

Simply not true, you can split hairs all you like and debate semantics all day long, it won't change the fact that the only known way to generate a magnetic field is with electric fields, not some imaginary "dynamo" inside "liquid core" planets. There is no known planet with a liquid core in the first place, so right off the bat you're straying into hallucinatory terrain.

Excuse me, but I have this really cool radio: you turn a crank and it powers up. How does that work, exactly?

So, when do we all get GASSED? The hydrogen CYANIDE that is. The E.T'S are GASSING US. i can hear it now, ssssssssss is something leaking. ALMONDS, nummy. sssssssssssssssss

reply to post by cloaked4u


Comet Elenin This is the founder of Comet Elenin web site. Read up on what it is out gassing.

Revelations Take interest in Rev 8:10-11

Now I know this is a religious thing I just found it interesting that the herb Wormwood is harmless in small doses.
The taste of Wormwood is bitter. Taken in large doses it can kill. Why you might ask? Cause you die from Cyanide poisoning. Cyanide has the smell of almonds.

I'm not a believer of the bible. I just found this interesting.

As a side note I wonder if we went through the tail of the comet or if a nice size chunk entered our airspace and exploded either midair or ground impact. It could dump a crap load of Cyanide into our enviroment.

Just putting that out there for FYI.

Now back to my TV show Falling Skies (season finale)

reply to post by TimesEnd


This part jumped out and slapped me in the face...

"...and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon..."

...because if the coma size is indeed 200,000 km, then at the closest approach to Earth, the Angular Size will be a whopping 20 degrees. The Angular Size of both the Sun and the Moon are 30 degrees. That leaves one third. Oh wait, nevermind... one third will NOT be smitten. Two thirds will. My mistake.

This thing is going to appear in our skies as 2/3 the size of the Sun for chrissake. Do you wonder why this is not being talked about on TV? People will freak when this thing appears, larger than life in the sky and they had no warning!!! I will probably freak, and I HAVE had warning.

reply to post by new_here


But they say at the clostest approach it will be 34,000,000 km away. So put that into your figuring.

As I have said I don't know anything. I don't even guess if this is an E.L.E. I don't think it is..... I just thought the fact its gassing Cyanide and the bit about Wormwood interesting.

reply to post by new_here

No. No. And no.

At a distance of 34,000,000 km, an object of 200,000km has an angular diameter of 0.3º.
The Sun and Moon each have an angular diameter of 0.5º.

There is nothing unusual about Elenin. A coma of 200,000 km is rather typical. Hale-Bopp had a much larger nucleus and its coma was the size of the Sun. It's coma appeared the same size of the Sun and its tail was much longer than that. Of course there was that group of eunuch followers who killed themselves but other than that life went on just fine. Lets' hope this insignificant comet doesn't have the same effect. Of course the nonsense spouted here about it doesn't help. I won't be at all surprised if something similar happens. Nuts.

I can see Jupiter, it's 4 Galilea moons, and the red streak around Jupiter with a 36x spotting scope.

If Elenin is larger than Jupiter...closer to Earth.........how come nobody's seeing it?

Originally posted by StalkingGoogle
Orbits aren't calculated, they are observed.

Orbits can be calculated and observed.

reply to post by StalkingGoogle

All matter has intrinsic magnetic fields, despite your opinion to the contrary.

Not sure where your dysfunction is so let me make this clear.

This is NOT my opinion.

This is what was found from the different spacecraft that flew by Venus. Venus does not have a magnetic field like Earth's or, as CLPrime put it, planetary magnetic field. Earth creates its own magnetic field that protects us from the Sun's solar wind. Venus does not. The solar wind is reacting to Venus' atmosphere thus creating a magnetic field...i.e. intrinsic vs. induced. There was a reason I originally brought this up but it was lost long ago.

Planetary magnetic fields are not generated by "liquid core", they are generated by electric fields, such as the radial electric field powering the sun,

Earth's iron core creates an electric field that thus creates a magnetic field that is surrounded by an electrically charged solar wind that is inside a solar magnetic field which is surrounded by a galactic magnetic field...
These all interact with each other and there is more than one way to create a magnetic field. We could use a generator producing an electric current or we could stand inside of an electric field. This is the difference between an intrinsic and induced.

There is nothing "proven" about "dynamo". It is a riotously absurd hypothesis with utterly no empirical referent.

How about an electric generator?

Personally I don't care if you take me seriously, I'm still going to be right and you're going to be wrong.

The point here is to debate. That is why we all are here, at least I thought it was. If you would show sources to back up your claims then maybe we could discern what you're trying to say and move on here. The "no it isn't-yes it is...na uh-ya hu" BS is getting boring (sorry CLPrime).

Originally posted by StalkingGoogle
It isn't mass that causes earthquakes, it is electric discharge. Comets frequently short-circuit these electric fields that drive the motion of the planets around the sun and drive all systems on planets, weather, tectonic activity and so on.

Originally posted by StalkingGoogle
Storms, on Earth or on other planets, are not caused by "solar heating", all weather is driven by electric currents.

See, here are some interesting theories. Do you have something to back these up with or is this just your opinion?

Cometary "tails" are actually electric discharges, the same discharge that lights up the comet and ablates the surface. As such they're not subject to newton's "laws of motion".

These ion tails are more interactions to an electrical charge rather than gravitational so are not subject to Newton's laws. I would agree with this. Be careful though, many here regard the electric Universe theory with contempt.

(2011 OD18)

Classification: Apollo [NEO] SPK-ID: 3574335

Title: Apollo

Description: Near-Earth asteroid orbits which cross the Earth's orbit similar to that of 1862 Apollo (a > 1.0 AU; q < 1.017 AU).



The Comet of 1861

An impression of the great comet of 1861 as seen from Kent on the evening of June 30th. The Earth is believed to have passed through the comet’s tail on this day. (see Dark Days) Painting © Chris Chatfield.

The twentieth century was almost devoid of great comets, thus disproving the notion that they are portents of war and disaster. The nineteenth century was, however, amply supplied. Victorian cometophiles could debate the relative spectacles provided by the visitors of 1843, 1858, 1861 and 1882, while sipping the last of the 'comet wine', a famous vintage from Portugal produced while the great comet of 1811 was visible.

The comet of 1861 was not the most spectacular of the nineteenth century (that probably being the comet of 1811) or the most beautiful, which was Donati's of 1858, but its appearance was dramatic, and it interacted with the Earth in an almost unprecedented way. For a while the Earth was actually within the comet's tail, and the inhabitants of this planet had a brief but giddy view of streams of cometary material converging towards the distant nucleus. By day also the Sun was dimmed as the Earth ploughed through the comet's gas and dust.

John Tebbutt, a sheep farmer and amateur astronomer of Windsor, New South Wales, Australia, discovered the comet of 1861 on May 13.
It was magnitude 4, visible to the naked eye,
and a month before perihelion (June 11).

Before news of the discovery could reach the northern hemisphere, the comet itself appeared in northern skies. The first person in England to see it may have been William C. Burder, of Clifton, Bristol, who dashed off a letter to the Times on Sunday,
June 30th. "Sir - At 2.40 a.m. today I detected a brilliant comet near the north-west horizon. It was visible till 3.20 a.m….it appeared as bright as Capella and was favourably situated for the comparison. It was surrounded by a nebulous haze, but I saw no tail…The daylight put out the both the comet and Capella nearly at the same time; your readers will therefore consider this a proof that it is a brilliant object."
(A resident of Hawkhurst, in Kent, claimed to have seen it on the evening of June 29, and to have mistaken it for the rising Moon).

As the long midsummer Sunday drew to a close, there was noticed a strange appearance in the sky. E. J. Lowe, at Beaston, said, "The sky had a yellow, auroral, glare-like look, and the sun, though shining, gave but a feeble light…in our parish church the vicar had the pulpit candles lighted at seven o'clock, a proof that a sensation of darkness was felt even with the sun shining." J. R. Hind, in London, told the Times; "there was a peculiar phosphorescence or illumination of the sky, which I attributed at the time to an auroral glare; it was remarked by other persons as something unusual".
Even before the sun set, the comet became visible.

E. J. Lowe saw it first at 7.49 p.m. (GMT), when it had no tail, and looked like "Jupiter in a fog, only much larger." By 9 p.m. the tail was visible, and by 10.30 it was 45° long, rising vertically and spreading out until it was three times the diameter of the Moon. John Hippisley, at Ston Easton in Wiltshire, saw the comet at 10 p.m., when it was conspicuous despite strong twilight. Midsummer nights are never quite dark even in southern England, but on the night of June 30th the comet was bright enough to cast a shadow on white paper, despite the fact that the nucleus was only a few degrees above the horizon. Hippisley said the tail was curvilinear, passing across the Pole Star, and sweeping deep into the constellation Lyra. It was at least 90° long. A drawing by the English observer G. Williams showed the comet with its nucleus near Capella and having an enormous fan-shaped tail reaching up to Polaris, with subsidiary jets streaming down from Ursa Major and Cassiopeia, like converging railway lines. Some disputed the accuracy of this picture, but on July 6, J. R. Hind told the Times, "Allow me to draw attention to a circumstance relating to the present comet…It appears not only possible,
but even probable, that in the course of Sunday last,

the earth passed through the tail at a distance of perhaps two-thirds of its length from the nucleus".

On June 28, at 6 pm, the nucleus of the comet was in the ecliptic,
about 13 million miles from the Earth.

Had the tail streamed directly behind the comet, the Earth would have encountered it soon after 10 p.m. on June 30th. But tails always lag behind the nucleus, and Hind, judging by the amount of tail curvature and the comet's direction of motion,

estimated that the Earth would have entered the tail in the early morning of
June 30; "or, at any rate, it was certainly in a region which had been swept over by cometary matter a short time previously."


On July 1,

the comet was not visible until 8.45 p.m., an hour later than on the previous night. The nucleus was also much less hazy, no longer being seen through a screen of tail material.

Between July 2 and

July 19,
telescopic observations of the head of the comet showed
a total of 11 luminous envelopes rising successively from the nucleus.
A new one was emitted every two days.
The comet was withdrawing from the Earth at the rate of about 6 million miles a day;

on July 12th

it was 37,800,000 miles away, on July 28th 78,900,000 miles.

As it did so, the full length of its vast tail could be seen.
Secchi claimed that on July 1 and 2 it was 118° long.

By the middle of August the comet was no longer visible to the naked eye,

but it was visible in telescopes until May 1862.




An elliptical orbit with a period of about 400 years was calculated,

which would indicate a previous appearance about the middle of the 15th century, and a return in the 23rd century.
--------------------------->22622262

Originally posted by Devino

The "no it isn't-yes it is...na uh-ya hu" BS is getting boring (sorry CLPrime).

That's alright, I agree with you... you probably noticed, I wasn't seriously continuing the "no it isn't, yes it is" bit. I was just hoping to drag him out enough to get him to give sources.

See, here are some interesting theories. Do you have something to back these up with or is this just your opinion?

Unfortunately, he appears to be banned. Or, perhaps, not so unfortunately. What we need around here are people who can back up their claims...not just walking egos who baselessly declare their infallibility.

reply to post by CLPrime

Unfortunately, he appears to be banned.

WOW, I didn't even notice. LOL Could have saved myself some time there. Well at least I won't now wait for a reply from him.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by new_here

 

No. No. And no.

At a distance of 34,000,000 km, an object of 200,000km has an angular diameter of 0.3º.
The Sun and Moon each have an angular diameter of 0.5º.

There is nothing unusual about Elenin. A coma of 200,000 km is rather typical. Hale-Bopp had a much larger nucleus and its coma was the size of the Sun. It's coma appeared the same size of the Sun and its tail was much longer than that. Of course there was that group of eunuch followers who killed themselves but other than that life went on just fine. Lets' hope this insignificant comet doesn't have the same effect. Of course the nonsense spouted here about it doesn't help. I won't be at all surprised if something similar happens. Nuts.

edit on 8/8/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)

Minutes, of course I meant minutes... geez. At closest approach, the angular size will be 20.222 Minutes, whereas the angular size of the Sun and Moon are both 30 minutes, as I'm sure you well know. Elenin will appear (albeit faint, supposedly) two-thirds the size of the sun, as viewed from Earth. The numbers don't lie.

Source of calculation: Angular Size Calculator

reply to post by new_here

Yes, I gave you the correct numbers with the units you used.

The coma is now larger than Jupiter and the comet is far closer to Earth than Jupiter is. You can see Jupiter with the naked eye. It is very bright. You cannot see Elenin with the naked eye. It is very dim.

Elenin is very dim. Elenin's coma is very dim. It is questionable that Elenin will even be visible to the naked eye when it is at closest approach (but we can hope). The Sun is not huge in the sky (0.5º). The Moon is not huge in the sky (0.5º). Hale-bopp had just as much of an apparent size. No one is going to freak out, no one is going to die...well not any one with any sense.

reply to post by Phage
Supposed to get to -7 I believe. We should be able to see it eventually. I hope I get to see it, don't you? I don't expect anyone to die. Did I say that? I did say I wonder why the TV news doesn't even MENTION it. At least not in my neck of the woods. It's a lot more newsworthy than most of the crap they talk about.

reply to post by new_here

I was distracted by "smitten".
But you did say this:

People will freak when this thing appears, larger than life in the sky and they had no warning!!! I will probably freak, and I HAVE had warning.

One third the diameter of the Sun is not huge or larger than life. The news isn't covering it because it is unlikely that it will be visible to the naked eye and if it is, it won't be for months. It is a most unremarkable comet.