Egypt was a Matriarchy according to American Men Soldiers: HUMAN FLESHY QUEENS mislabeled fictitious

Back when I was in college, there was a professor named Padilla. He had his masters degree and was less than a year away from getting his PhD in Sociology. He was at ASU, but I don't know where he's teaching now. Arizona has a bulk of desert-trained troops.

Padilla was an American soldier who had been stationed in Egypt for sometime around the first Gulf War. He was teaching sociology classes. After class, groups of soldiers would sit around talking about all the things that they had encountered in the Middle East. There were other soldiers also stationed in Egypt who would sit after class and talk. So sometimes I sat after class and just listened to them talk to see what they had to say.

One of the times, they were all talking about Egypt and the soldiers said, "Egypt was a matriarchy." And all these American soldiers stationed in Egypt and other areas of the Middle East kept talking about how Egypt's present government tries to hide and cover up the matriarchy that Egypt was in the past.

And I thought to myself....hmmmm... these are MEN saying that Egypt was a matriarchy. These are soldiers who were stationed in Egypt saying that Egypt's government tries to cover up the matriarchy of the past and lies about their past. If they were American soldiers stationed in Egypt, they would know what the Egyptian government and the Egyptian military was covering up. And I listened to what they said about Egypt and put it on the backburner for some time.

Months later I was doing a little research on Egypt, reading about alleged "brother-sister marriages". Something struck me as odd. Like a quirky feeling that something wasn't right about that assumption. And all I could think about was what soldier Padilla teaching the sociology class had said. He said something about the Egyptian military covering up the matriarchy of the past by lying about incest marriages.

THEN I FIGURED IT OUT...

A few years later, I was doing research on different Native American customs: gender structure, birthing practices, social strata and what the tribes were like before European customs were forced upon them. I went into a Native American library at the Indian hospital so that I could read what the tribes said about themselves rather than reading what other groups said about them. I found out that Native Americans collect all diaries and journals of any person, any missionary that had first contact with a tribe. And they do so because those people describe the original customs of each tribe BEFORE European customs were forced upon them. Each diary of each person who had first contact with different tribes is a reserve item-- you have to sit in their library to read and you can't check out the diaries.

And I noticed that Native Americans were different. Some tribes were matriarchies. Some tribes were oligarchies. Some tribes were patriarchies. Focusing on the matriarchy tribes, I came up with 4 different types of matriarchies. And one of the types of matriarchies was the same as Egypt.

Four Types of Matriarchies

Matriarchy Type #1: Most common. All property is owned by the women. The land, the hogan/house, the livestock and the crops are owned by the women. The property is passed from mother to daughter or grandmother to granddaughter. The men are usually weavers, caretakers of the children, they tend the crops owned by the women and they tend the livestock owned by the women (like sheep). There is no such thing as an illegitimate child. All children born to any woman by any man are legitimate. They don't really have traditional "marriages" even if some anthropologists mislabel it a "marriage." Essentially, if a man likes a woman he will do chores for her and her family until he gets approved to live with her and her family. There's really no marriage ceremony--it's just living together. Example tribes: Navajo (matriarchy until Roosevelt's Allotment Act) and Choctaws.

Matriarchy Type #2: They have either a clan system or caste system. All property is owned by women: crops, land, house, and livestock. Men are third class citizens. Women are first class citizens but children of the women are second class citizens. In some situations, a man doesn't even get to keep his own name. When a child is born and the mother names the child, the man loses his name given to him by his mother and is known by the name of the child-- the name the mother (who he impregnated) gives to the child. Example tribes: Chitimacha and Tonkawa.

Matriarchy Type #3: All property is owned by women: boats, houses, land, crops, livestock. Only women are allowed to vote and men are required to sit in the back of the meeting and be silent while women discuss community issues to vote. Men are weavers, caretakers of the children, caretakers of crops owned by the women, caretakers of livestock owned by women, men are depicted in artwork as dancing entertainment for the women or as gift-bearers to the women. ONLY WOMEN hold the weapons. Men are not allowed to bear arms. Weapons used by the women include daggers, knives, bows-n-arrows, and double axes. Example: Ancient Crete.

Matriarchy Type #4: Egypt's type of matriarchy and others. All property is owned by women and passed down from mother to daughter, grandmother to granddaughter. All lineage is traced through the women. Male positions in society are appointed by women, usually according to their female bloodlines. (this includes the position of Pharoah, who is appointed by the bloodline Queen). In Native American tribes of a similar structuee, they appoint a male chief based on his bloodline on the female line. Queens have more power than the pharoah or chief, since their position is an appointment. Women and men don't have traditional "marriages". The women are allowed to have multiple partners or more than one father of their child as long as it is clan appropriate. Men are also allowed to have multiple partners. But the men do NOT father their own biological offspring. Instead, when the woman gets pregnant, she appoints a male relative to be a "godfather" or caretaker of her child. This appointed godfather is usually a brother or uncle in her maternal side of the family. The appointed "godfather" did NOT have sex with his sister or niece so there is no incest involved. Usually there is a ceremony associated with the appointment of a brother or uncle as a child's godfather. This ceremony is NOT a marriage between brother and sister.

From the man's point of view: his bloodline is traced through his mother and grandmother. A man gets to have sex with different women and NEVER fathers or raises his own biological offspring. If he impregnates a woman, then that woman appoints her brother or uncle as "godfather" to the child and the woman's brother or uncle cares for her child. A man instead takes care of his sister's children or his niece's children if one of his female sisters or nieces appoints him godfather. He does not have sex with his sister or niece to impregnate her. His sister or niece is impregnated by some other man of her own choosing. You have no biological rights over your own offspring. They belong to the woman you impregnated and her family. However, you do have biological rights over your sister/niece's kids if you are appointed as a godfather to them.

From the woman's point of view: You get to have sex with whomever you want as long as it is clan appropriate. All your children are legitimate because they belong to a woman and who the father is--that's irrelevant. The man who impregnates you-- he takes care of his sister's kids or his niece's kids. And you as a woman appoint a brother or uncle to take care of your kids-- a "godfather". You don't have sex with the brother or uncle you appoint as "godfather". And the ceremony to appoint brother/uncle as godfather isn't a marriage. All the children belong to you and the biological father has no rights. Your children belong to you and your maternal family-- your brother/uncles are caretakers.


HUMAN QUEENS OF EGYPT MISLABELED FICTITIOUS GODDESSES

Once I had figured out which type of matriarchy Egypt was, everything else started to make sense about the "cover up" that all those American soldiers had been talking about. All those soldiers kept saying that Egypt was lying about the lineage of the Pharoahs and Queens. Those soldiers were saying that Egypt was lying about DNA and the bloodlines because they needed to track the lineage down the female line and they kept lying and tracing it down the male line.

So I sat down with a "kings list" of Egypt and took a good look at it. Tossed it. And tried to come up with a lineage down the female line. After all, if the pharoah is appointed by the female bloodline then the lineage needed to be tracked down the Queens. Queen-mother to Queen-daughter.

And I noticed something... all these New "King"dom Queens from the 18th/19th dynasties through the Roman Empire... most of their artwork depicted them as either "Isis" or "Hathor". For example, in the Temple of Dendera there was an inscription of Queen Cleopatra that was translated as "Queen Cleopatra as Isis Herself".

An additional piece of art is a painted relief sculpture of Cleopatra as Isis from about 35 B.C., in the Temple of Denderah. The Temple of DeCleopatra as Isisnderah was built in Egypt as a place of worship in 125 B.C. It was dedicated to Hathor, the goddess of love and joy (online).

from Cleopatra in Literature and Art

Similar inscriptions with Queen Nefertari calling Nefertari "Isis" or calling Nefertari "Hathor." It seemed odd and felt like perhaps it was a mistranslation. Why would these Queens claim that they were a fictitious goddess in the sky? Didn't make sense. And then I noticed the pattern.

ALL HUMAN QUEENS IN EGYPT HAVE THE TITLE OF ASET/ISIS AND HET-HER/HATHOR!

Think of it like Queen Victoria or Queen Elizabeth. Queens have alternate titles. An alternate title would be "Her Majesty" or "Her Highness" Still titles belonging to a queen. So each time you see artwork, scrolls, sculpture, stela, or any other form of an Egyptian artifact that refers to a Queen "as Aset/Isis" or "as Het-Her/Hathor", that is simply another title of each Queen. If you see artwork, scroll or sculpture with a Queen and another woman with the title "Aset/Isis" or "Het-Her/Hathor", then the second woman depicted in the sculpture, stela or scroll is HER Queen mother.

Ever hear the saying "Isis of Ten Thousand Names"?? That is NOT referring to a fictitious goddess floating in the sky with 10,000 names. But rather the 10,000 names of HUMAN Egyptian Queens/Asets. So if a person wants to trace the bloodline of Egyptian royalty down the appropriate maternal side as it is supposed to be done--then you find the 10,000 names of Asets/Isis/Queens. Those lists of names of "Isis" are the lists of names of HUMAN Egyptian Queens.

COW GODDESSES - LION GODDESSES -- HUMAN QUEENS AND THEIR RULING ANIMAL CLANS

When looking at particularly the Old Kingdom, or rather Old Queendom of Egypt, Egypt's matriarchy clearly had an animal clan system. Each maternal clan had a clan animal which denoted status in society. There was Scorpion clan which tended to be educated. Scorpion Clan usually held jobs as doctors, nurses, scribes, or other educated positions. There was Hippopotamus Clan which was also educated and held jobs like nurses or birthing midwives. There was Alligator Clan, Dog Clan, Cheetah Clan (foreign), and various other matrilineal clans.

But the two main ruling clans of Egypt of the royal lines were either Lion Clan or Cow Clan. You can tell which clan they were by the crown upon the Old Queendom Queen. Did the Queen/Goddess wear a lion animal mask in statues? If so, she was a Lion Clan Queen. Did the Queen/Goddess wear cow horns on her crown? If so, she was a Cow Clan Queen.

Lion Clan Queens

Each "Lion Goddess" in fact turns out to be a HUMAN Queen in the Old Queendom. In some statues, stelas and scrolls, they will be depicted in their Lion Headdress. In other statues, stelas and scrolls they will be depicted in their Human Form.

So "Goddess Bastet" was actually human Queen Bastet at a point in the Old Queendom. Mahes was her son and her daughter was Sekhmet/Shemszetet. "Goddess Sekhmet/Sakhmet or Shemszetet" was a human queen and her appointed Pharoah was Ptah. Goddess Pakhet/Pakhit or Pahikhet was a human queen of the Lion Clan and her appointed Pharoah was her brother Nefertum. Goddess Tefnut was Queen Tefnut of the Lion Clan and her brother was appointed Pharoah Shu. Goddess Meshet/Mekhit/Mekjit/Mehet (or Shemet if you read the hieroglyph left to right) was a Queen of the Lion Clan and somehow ALSO Cow Clan. Her sister was Princess Weret/Uret. She is one of the few Queens that is depicted both as Lion Clan and Cow Clan. Usually you will see her depicted as Cow Clan or Lion Clan with her sister Mehet-Uret, Meshet-Weret.

If Bastet was once a human Queen (and she was), who was her mother? To that we go to Giza, where a stela was taken that is on display in the Fitzwilliam Museum.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c25f8e363137.jpg[/atsimg]

According to the RETRANSLATION of the stela, Bastet is the eldest daughter of Het-Her/Hathor/ Her Highness Queen Qinet of Sais. A lot of people mistranslate her name as Inet of Kawes or Inet of Ka'es. The "K" is actually an Old Queendom symbol for "S" and there's a "Q" sounding hieroglyph in front of the "I" hieroglyph.

Queen Qinet of Sais (Inet of Kawes) eldest daughter is Bastet (in human form). Bastet being the eldest daughter would take on the throne as the next Queen. Qinet's second eldest daughter is Princess Henutsen. Henutsen is Bastet's sister. This is very important because Henutsen is the satellite pyramid (G1-C) of Giza 1 or the Great Pyramid. And the stela is taken somewhere from Giza. Since Bastet's sister, Henutsen is very human and real (a princess)-- then Bastet was also once very human. It's one of the few Old Queendom stelas showing Bastet as a human, rather than with a lion head. By the New Kingdom, Bastet is reduced from Lion-Headed Queen to a mere cat. There was said to be many Bastet artifacts around Giza 1 and around the Henutsen pyramid. I sometimes wonder if the satellite pyramids G1-A, G1-B, and G1-D might have also been Bastet's sisters or Queen Qinet's other daughters. But that's just a theory.

Over at Meidum, there is a tomb who was a caretaker of tombs/pyramids belonging to a Queen Bastet, Queen Shemszetet and a Queen Pakhit/Pahikhet. His name was "Nefermaat" or Mastaba 16. I would actually retranslate his name as "NeferMeshet" or "NeferShemet" because the long-bar symbol was the "sh" sound and the hieroglyph doesn't really say "Ma'at" which would be two half-bars. But for the purposes of the tourists, it's called Nefermaat's mastaba. His stelas are on display at the Louvre in Paris.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/43d633a121ad.jpg[/atsimg]

What's unclear is if the three Queens had been turned into deities yet at this point in time. Technically, through ancestor worship of the dead, these human Queens would have been deity-ized at some point. During Nefermaat's (Nefershemet's) life, they still might have been viewed as human queens who had passed on into the afterlife, rather than floating fictitious deities.

Cow Clan Queens

While Queen Shemet (aka Meshet, Mekhet, Mekhit, Mekhjt) and her sister Princess Uret/Weret are depicted as both Cow Clan and Lion Clan queens, most Cow Clan Human Queens have been lumped into the fictitious goddess Hathor. Even though each individual queen has their own name. The mistake is actually made by modern archeologists and modern Egyptologists and not a mistake of the past. When archeologists/Egyptologists see a woman wearing a cow-horned crown, they automatically label her as "Hathor" and don't even bother to read the name on the statue, the name on the stela, the name on the scroll or any other place that the Human Queen's name is. Therefore, many Cow Clan Queens don't get named in the books, even though their names are directly engraved on statues, stelas, and scrolls. Let me show you a prime example.

Link to site on Menkaure and His Queen

Giza Pyramid 3 called "Menkare's" pyramid has 4 statues associated with it. Three of the statues used to be at the Boston Museum (not sure if they are still there). In three of the statues, there is a woman sitting on the throne wearing a crown and "Menkaure" is standing next to her. And for some stupid reason, Egyptologists claim that the woman is the fictitious floating goddess Hathor with the human Pharoah/King Menkaure. That's just idiotic as can be. Does that make sense to anyone? That a HUMAN pharoah would have 4 statues of him with the same woman in each statue, but allegedly the human woman in 3 of the statues is supposedly a fictitious floating goddess and the same woman in the 4th statue as the other three is Menkaure's "wife". It doesn't make sense, does it? No. The human woman in all 4 statues is the Queen and not necessarily Menkaure's "wife" at all. As Queen, Menkaure might be a brother or uncle that she appointed as Pharoah. And appointing a brother or uncle as Pharoah isn't a "marriage." The woman in all 4 statues is not a fictitious floating goddess at all. In fact the name of the human Queen on the throne in those statues is engraved at the feet of 3 out of the 4 statues of her!

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/9111c876edc1.jpg[/atsimg]

There is also an alternate name for "Menkaure" at the base of the statues which is Pharoah Nenez-khet on 3 of the statues. Her name is Aset/Queen, Her Highness Tesenihet. She doesn't make it into most Egyptologists namebooks even though it states the woman's name and the fact that she is Queen at the base of 3 of the 4 statues. Her name is Queen Tesenihet.

It's sad and terrible that the jerkoff Egyptian gov't/military ignores the name of their own queen even though the dear woman's name is clearly marked in hieroglyphs at the base of 3 of her 4 statues. It rather kind of disgusting that the present Egyptian gov't/military would do this to many of their old historical queens. She is just one of many queens with their names on their own statues that get ignored.



I suppose that's why American soldiers-men- who were stationed in Egypt maintain that the Egyptian military and the Egyptian government lies about their past matriarchy... or plain out lies about their own queens, refusing to acknowledge the names their own ruling queens. (even if the queen's name is in plain view on a statue). It would be like if Brits 2000 years from now refused to acknowledge Queen Victoria or Queen Elizabeth. Instead if they saw a statue of Queen Victoria or Elizabeth, they would say... "Oh she was just a fictitious goddess Victoria or fictitous goddess Elizabeth, but the man next to her in the statue (or photo)...he was the King." You just don't disrespect your ancestors that way. But the men in Egypt, they do disrespect their female ancestors that way. It's just disgusting.

(I'll add to it later. This is probably a decent start for a first topic to get a discussion going.)

I want to agree and disagree with your assessment.

Yes the female counterparts did almost certainly go by the names of Goddesses, but they were not the only central power in Egypt.

It was the Royal Families that held power, male or female doesn't matter, they had control.

So technically it was both sexes that were in control, but it was always an elite royal family.
(And even sometimes high priests or other important members of the monarch's court would use their influence to gain power as well).

Intrigue and treachery were not uncommon either. Power can shift hands quickly in times of instability.

reply to post by MapMistress


Dr. Daniel Jackson? Is that you?

It has been widely accepted that in many societies, woman ruled over the clan. Without their birth giving abilities, the clan would die off.

But in conflict is where man ruled, not woman. There are tales of women warriors, but if they were so apt at combat, then we would still see to this day, women generals aplenty. But then again, maybe the circle is complete as we are now seeing just that more often. But not in the Arab world.

reply to post by MapMistress


great research..

I have also heard the oral history that in the land of Kemit the Sphinx nose was destroyed because it clearly was a woman..

No disrespect, but I find it strange that so many soldiers who were "stationed" in Egypt were all together in the states in the same place coincidentally at once. There are no US bases in Egypt. The US and Egyptian militaries do work together but it would be more along the lines of exercises and not any longterm tour of duty there (since there are no US bases). Did they work at the embassy or something? Something doesn't smell right.This report is from 8 years ago but well within the post 9/11 GWOT timeframe(almost at the very end, they discuss Egypt/US military relationship):
fpc.state.gov...
The only possibility I see is that they are all from the same National Guard unit that did training exercises or short term duty there (which would make sense bc they'd all be from the same area).
Anyway, I realize this is not the point of your post, but if 1 thing is questionable, it makes the whole thing questionable. Just need a clarification.

reply to post by MapMistress


I gave you a Star and one flag because of the effort and research.

First off, I'm not disagreeing with the fact there is somewhat of a conspiracy by the Modern Egyptian authorities. That goes without saying and there are plenty of "Modern day Religious/Political" contributing factors.

Second, I'd avoid attempting to go to the opposite extreme and claim they were strictly a Matriarchy alone when the overwhelming evidence indicates Egypt had a very long, diverse and immensely complex system of rule.

There is a large amount of evidence that suggests the early Early Dynastic Period were very much a matriarchal system then later during the Old Kingdom it switched over to a Patriarchal system. [For reasons unknown] From then on out if one were to read not only what the accepted written history tells us but also what the physical evidence indicates it can clearly be seen as a back and forth balancing act between Matriarchal and Patriarchal systems. Not all periods in Egyptian history were strictly one or the other.

Note: We are dealing with an extremely long period in history. [Over 6,000 Years in history] Going back thousands of years. All the way back earlier than both Protodynastic and Predynastic periods. I've read both sides of the Matriarchal vs Patriarchal arguments. Which runs parallel with the other Argument about whether the Egyptians were Black or White. The answer to both questions is YES!

Egypt had both Matriarchal and Patriarchal periods [Often swaying back and forth] and Yes there were Black Pharaohs and as well as White Pharaohs. We see statues and images which clearly show both in both regards. It all depends on which period we are looking at over their very long history. Again we cannot sum up over 6,000 years worth of history in a nutshell.

Keep in mind that there were also Upper and Lower Egypt. I'm not thoroughly convinced that they were 100% unified with regards to either religion or who the true rulers of Egypt were. That division in Egypt's history runs deeper than many realize [More so than what we are told IMO] Which is probably why during the First Intermediate Period tomb robbing was ramped. They didn't care for nor respected those who ruled under which house. [Male or Female lineage]

Following the mainly Matriarchal period [During the First Intermediate Period] it seems they went back to a Patriarchal system once again during the Middle Kingdom. It's at this point one should take notice that during each major change the predecessors images and accomplishments were often rewritten and or covered over or simply buried etc.

So we need to add this back into the equation which adds to the confusion further. This type of back and forth between royal lines and which system went on for another 2,000 years [Second Intermediate Period (Hyksos Invasion), New Kingdom (Egyptian Empire), Third Intermediate Period, First Persian Conquest, Late Period, Second Persian Conquest, Greco-Roman Period, ]

There is a lot of history. With plenty of back stabbing espionage and of course the ever popular especially among the Egyptian royals Rewriting history as the saw fit to suit their myopic needs. [Historically speaking]

Wow! You have certainly done a great deal of research.

I haven't studied too much on ancient Egypt yet, but I did read a fair bit on the ancient Greeks and of course came upon the 'myths' of the Amazon warriors. There was mention of them being associated with the Egyptian Queens, I forgot about that until I read your thread.

You may already know of the archeologist, Jeannine Davis-Kimball, who has excavated graves in the Eurasian Steppes and found evidence of female warriors. I bet she'd be interested in your findings.

We all know that so much history has been destroyed (Alexandria library), suppressed/hidden or re-written and it's very frustrating knowing the wealth of knowledge that's lost, but every now and then little snippets are found and pieced together like you have done here. Please keep up the good work.

reply to post by SLAYER69


During more recent History, Egypt was ruled by Cleopatra.

She was also a young, genius, military leader too (in answer to a previous poster that said that women were not leaders in conflict).

Originally posted by chr0naut
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

During more recent History, Egypt was ruled by Cleopatra.

Other female notables...

Nitocris may have ruled in the Sixth Dynasty.
Queen Nitocris (Neterkare or Nitikrty)2184 BC - 2183 BC

Queen Nitocris (Neterkare or Nitiqrty - "The Soul of Re is Divine") left no archaeological record. She is known to us only from the Turin Canon, Manetho and Herodotus (also refers to a Babylonian queen with the same name). If she did rule Ancient Egypt it was most likely at the end of the Old Kingdom and the beginning of the First Intermediate Period.

Sobeknefru Sobekkare 1806 BC - 1802 BC

This Queen's name is sometimes written as Nefrusobek. She was a Queen-Pharoah and the 8th ruler of the 12th Dynasty. Probably the daughter of Amenemhet III and the half sister of Amenemhet IV. Sobekneferu ruled at the end of the Twelfth Dynasty. Some have suggested that she ruled alongside Amenemhat III and/or Amenemhat IV. According to Egyptian tradition, she ruled independently. The Turin Canon gives almost 4 years of rule, as does Manetho.

good find.Also i beleieve lots of # is covered up.. gotta realize government only lets ppl hear what they want them to hear... im sure lots of stuff has been covered up and claimed its something diff.. also for all we know all we know all the ancient kings queens or govverment ppl are related...

reply to post by MapMistress


Makes sense from what I read. It was a woman who found Moses and made him leader of Egypt, after all.


I'll read into it more later I guess. Cool story bro, for now.


Ah, as slayer pointed out I think, and as I now recall, Egypt didn't have a single cultural history. It was switched at times to who ruled it. So yea, I see no reason to view it strictly Motherly, but that doesn't deny the fact that at certain times in its history it was. other times, the girl put on a fake beard to look like a dude. All depends on when. Egypt was ruled by many.

Awesome research and post. And you have perhaps named an until-now unnamed Queen? Very cool. Thanks for the post!

Originally posted by louieprima
No disrespect, but I find it strange that so many soldiers who were "stationed" in Egypt were all together in the states in the same place coincidentally at once. There are no US bases in Egypt. The US and Egyptian militaries do work together but it would be more along the lines of exercises and not any longterm tour of duty there (since there are no US bases). Did they work at the embassy or something? Something doesn't smell right.This report is from 8 years ago but well within the post 9/11 GWOT timeframe(almost at the very end, they discuss Egypt/US military relationship):
fpc.state.gov...
The only possibility I see is that they are all from the same National Guard unit that did training exercises or short term duty there (which would make sense bc they'd all be from the same area).
Anyway, I realize this is not the point of your post, but if 1 thing is questionable, it makes the whole thing questionable. Just need a clarification.

Well, it's not coincidental. It's Arizona. The bulk of the desert troops are trained in Arizona for some period of time. So there's all kinds of desert-trained troops in the universities all over Arizona.

I don't know all the ranks of the different men/soldiers who stayed after class each day. I actually had Padilla for 2 classes, not just one. One class he was teaching was called Racial & Ethnic Minorities: a sociology course. Not sure of the other class title as it was a summer school course at the university. It went by in a matter of weeks.

Some of the men would have been National Guard. On that you would be right. I believe the rest would be Army. It's not like Arizona has a big Navy or Marine group here. But there are still Marines and Naval officers that live in Arizona. And lots of Air Force soldiers. There used to be two airforce bases on each side of Phoenix and I think a 3rd in southern Arizona. One of the airforce bases was shut down though. The only rank I remember off the top of my head of one of the men who stayed after class each day was one Army Ranger (first Gulf War). I remember him because he was attending a class on Racial & Ethnic Minorities, but he was a misogynist. He, as a male soldier, was of the opinion that women should be banned from the military. And the irony was that even though the Army Ranger felt that women should be banned from the military-- even he agreed with Padilla that Egypt was a matriarchy and lying about it. But the rest of the ranks of the men or which branches of the military they were with...I'm not certain. It was years ago.

Originally posted by SLAYER69

There is a large amount of evidence that suggests the early Early Dynastic Period were very much a matriarchal system then later during the Old Kingdom it switched over to a Patriarchal system. [For reasons unknown] From then on out if one were to read not only what the accepted written history tells us but also what the physical evidence indicates it can clearly be seen as a back and forth balancing act between Matriarchal and Patriarchal systems. Not all periods in Egyptian history were strictly one or the other.

Note: We are dealing with an extremely long period in history. [Over 6,000 Years in history] Going back thousands of years. All the way back earlier than both Protodynastic and Predynastic periods. I've read both sides of the Matriarchal vs Patriarchal arguments. Which runs parallel with the other Argument about whether the Egyptians were Black or White. The answer to both questions is YES!

Well. I'm primarily focusing on the Old Queendom for this post. I did mention a little about the New Kingdom but for the most part I'm talking about between the years 2900-2400 BCE. Which is why these older Queens might have been deity-ized by the time of the New Kingdom. And at that, I'm not even certain that New Kingdom dynasties viewed the Old Queendom Queens as deities or if they realized that they were Queens. I seem to view it more as modern archeologists labeling Old Queendom Queens as deities: fictitional floating spirits. I know that Seti I of the 19th dynasty knew that they were Queens. Because the walls of Seti I's tomb show which pyramids and mastabas he visited and which sarcophagi he opened. Seti I was his own archeologist excavating the pyramids and tombs of the Old Queendom, but he did his archeology during the 19th dynasty.

Keep in mind that there were also Upper and Lower Egypt. I'm not thoroughly convinced that they were 100% unified with regards to either religion or who the true rulers of Egypt were. That division in Egypt's history runs deeper than many realize [More so than what we are told IMO] Which is probably why during the First Intermediate Period tomb robbing was ramped. They didn't care for nor respected those who ruled under which house. [Male or Female lineage]

Oh. You mean how people get odd trying to claim that Egypt was black or that Egypt was white. Which is more of a modern racial argument. Egypt was a melting pot of different ethnic groups of different origins. The division that I can figure on Upper (south) and Lower (north) Egypt with regards to religion seemed pretty simple to me. It has to do with the different groups that colonized Egypt between 7500-4000 BCE. Obviously the Upper (south) Egypt group worshipped the vulture goddess and they moved in around 7500 BCE and they were red heads from Cyprus, Levant and Palestine. Then they mixed with blacks who moved north from Africa into Egypt as Egypt gained more moisture. It was also the red heads who brought the dwarfs or Senetites.

Then when the delta became fertile (because at 7500 BCE the delta was uninhabitable by humans), that when a group worshipping the Serpent Goddess moved into the delta region. They had a primarily Aegean origin. Both vulture goddess group and serpent goddess group had boats. That much is for certain.

The civil war and unification occured when Osiris/Wesir was appointed Pharoah. The Queen or Aset/Isis would be the Queen that is considered both Lion Clan and Cow Clan. Queen Meshet (aka Mekhet, Mekhit, Mekjt, Mehet, or Shemet) and her sister would be Princess Uret/Weret. Seth, the red head of the south (Upper) Egypt wanted to be Pharoah, so he murdered Pharoah Osiris/Wesir. That plunged the country into civil war between north and south. Queen Meshet was said to have left the country to get a new Pharoah and she left her sister Princess Uret/Weret in charge. She came back with a foreign Pharoah, who was female-- Pharoah Neith. Queen Meshet's/Shemet's royal scribe who wrote down the history would be Seshat of the Scorpion clan. And the human physician or doctor that put together Pharoah Wesir/Osiris's body would be Dr. Serquet (also Scorpion clan). Try viewing the story that way--treating the "gods and goddesses" as living, breathing fleshy humans and see if it makes any more sense. If you are looking for Queen Meshet stuff, also look up Mehet-Weret which would be Queen and Princess grouping.

Following the mainly Matriarchal period [During the First Intermediate Period] it seems they went back to a Patriarchal system once again during the Middle Kingdom. It's at this point one should take notice that during each major change the predecessors images and accomplishments were often rewritten and or covered over or simply buried etc.

I noticed that about the First Intermediate Period and the Middle Kingdom. But I also view that time frame as possible foreign invasion of Egypt. It was during the 12th dynasty that the interpretation of the hieroglyphs changed--as if the foreigners didn't know how to read the Old Queendom hieroglyphs. The "S" hieroglyph which looks like a bowl of the Old Queendom became the "K" hieroglyph during the 12th dynasty. Just one of many examples.

Yet, by the 18th dynasty they seem to turn back to more of a matriarchy again. With several female Pharoahs. And I think Gorman91 also mentioned the female Pharoah thing. For the most part, it looks like Pharoahs were male relatives of the Queens appointed as Pharoah based off their maternal bloodlines. But in instances where no sons were born to a Queen, then a female would appoint either a sister as Pharoah or appoint a foreigner.

There used to be a letter up on the internet back sometime around 2004-2005, a letter from an Egyptian Queen that I think was a Queen during the Persian empire that was kept or wound up in a library during the Roman Empire. But I can't find it now. It mentioned about how a Queen of Egypt could appoint whomever she wanted as Pharoah. She could appoint her brother, her uncle, her sister, her lover, a Queen could even appoint a foreigner as Pharoah if she wanted to (which did happen). But alas, I can't find the source online now. Any idea which Queen's letter it might have been?

talking about egypt notable women and not talking about hatshepsut just shows how little people know about egypt but how everyone loves crazy theories but no one really bothers to actually study it.

Now we all know what happened to hatshepsut's statues, figures and images... calling ancient egypt a matriarchy is a new and almost absurd theory... and I graduated in history.

Btw... as long as Ra, Horus, Osiris, Set and Anubis are male, it cannot be a matriarchy. If you know the gods, you know why I say this... and dont bring Isis or Hathor into the conversation cause they're pretty much "wives, mothers and sisters"...

It seems that there has been a plot afoot for some time to down play the role of women leaders, heros and priestesses. We see remnants of the matriarchy in Helenistic Greece, Gnostic virgins, and the demonization of Mary Magdalene and Eve.

There are the autrocities that occured in the history of Scottland, Ireland and England to the rich tradition of the matriarch of the Celts, resulting in the murder of women and the burning of witches. China is not without it's infamous women as well. I hear the Emperess Dowinger really was a witch.

What I find interesting to add, as a curiousity, are the Jewish traditions. The Jews were led out of Egypt by Moses, who, as it was pointed out earlier in this thread, was rescued by a woman. The Jewish people, to this day, identify their lineage through the blood line of the mother. My grandmother and grandfather were Jewish immigrants from Poland. Out of fear, they foisted off their Jewish roots and attended Catholic services in Chicago. My father married a Christain/shiska, So, because of my mother's lineage, I'm not considered Jewish.

Do you think this is a carry over from the influence of an Egyptian matriarch?

Originally posted by FraternitasSaturni
talking about egypt notable women and not talking about hatshepsut just shows how little people know about egypt but how everyone loves crazy theories but no one really bothers to actually study it.

Regurgitating the already well known aspects isn't a demonstration of any higher understanding or knowledge of Egyptian history.

However, discussing the more obscure and lesser known aspects does. But, As always there are a few who still cling hopelessly to the outdated version of events even when confronted with overwhelming evidence to the contrary...


ETA: I'm enjoying the OPs theory.
There is no harm in conjecture!

Interesting perspective...

Originally posted by jest3r
Wow! You have certainly done a great deal of research.

I haven't studied too much on ancient Egypt yet, but I did read a fair bit on the ancient Greeks and of course came upon the 'myths' of the Amazon warriors. There was mention of them being associated with the Egyptian Queens, I forgot about that until I read your thread.

The tie between the Greeks and Egypt goes back thousands of years. There's two major ties.

The Red Heads or group that worshipped the Vulture Goddess who moved into Egypt c. 7500 BCE they seem to originate in the North Aegean. The entire coast from Kavala-Thassos over into North East Turkey (Troas/Catal Hoyuk) also worshipped the Vulture Goddess for thousands of years. At some point they got boats/ships and moved into Cyprus, Levant, Palestine and South Egypt. Then a second group by boat/ship from the Kavala/Thassos coast moved into Algeria, Morocco, Spain, France, England, Scotland and Ireland by 7000 BCE. Since they worshipped the Vulture Goddess and originally excarnated their dead-- they imported their holy vultures which denotes origin of different groups. It was the Black Vulture of Thassos that was imported into Spain thousands of miles away from the origin of the vulture. Yet the Cyprus Vulture (from an island) was imported into Egypt. After thousands of years, all their burial practices began to change and I'm sure their religion changed as different groups lived in different regions of the world. That's the tie between North Aegean Greeks and Upper (South) Egyptians.

The problem on the Serpent Goddess group who colonized the delta Nile region or Lower (north) Egypt is pinpointing which island or islands or coastline they came from. Could be any number of regions. Crete, Milos, Naxos/Paros, various Dodecanese islands, certain coastal cities in Greece, Eastern Sicily to Naples, and Cyprus all worshipped the Serpent Goddess at some point in the past. I've never quite been able to figure out which precise group colonized the delta of Egypt. Could be any of them.

On Crete, the Serpent Goddess was called Titan Rhea who gets reduced from fierce serpent qualities to her mere motherly qualities as Zeus's mom by Classical Greece times. In Egypt, the Serpent Goddess is usually called "Wa-djet". But sometimes I look at that translation and wonder if it pronounced wrong. Perhaps the "W" is supposed to have the "Rh" sound and maybe it should be pronounced "Rhea-djet".

To further complicate things, I notice that Sky God "Ra" and the hieroglyph for Ra might sometimes be "Rhea" also. When there's two feathers, it should have the "ea" sound rather than the singular short "i" or singular "a" sound.

The concept is the same. Rhea the Serpent goddess took the Sky God as her husband. Both in Egypt and Greek islands. Just in Greece, the Sky God is called "Cronus". In Egypt, they are calling the Sky God "Ra". And still, sometimes they mix up Rhea with Ra. Understandable mistake.

Then they mixed with blacks who moved north from Africa into Egypt as Egypt gained more moisture.

reply to post by MapMistress


You lost me there. Egypt is located in the North-East corner of Africa. Otherwise, a fascinating story.

reply to post by MapMistress


Ofcourse they are going to cover up their matriarchal past. Egypt has been a Muslim country for centuries, what do you seriously expect?