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Muslims Are Loyal to U.S. And Hopeful, Poll Finds

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posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 12:11 PM
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reply to post by sir_slide
 



I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.....seriously.


I think maybe I do
CAIR: www.cair.com...


What We Do


Of the 1,999 CAIR press releases reviewed for this document, 678 dealt with issues relating to civil rights. Anti-defamation releases accounted for 328 of the documents surveyed. These two categories alone account for 50 percent of the releases. Only 10 percent of CAIR releases dealt with international issues.

The core of CAIR’s work is, and always has been, ensuring that the rights guaranteed to everyone in this nation are enforced. If someone is discriminated against because of their Islamic faith that person can call CAIR and we will provide advocacy and sometimes legal services to help them obtain a satisfactory resolution to their concern. In the interfaith section of this document we also provide some of the numerous instances in which CAIR has defended members of other faith traditions. CAIR policy prohibits caseworkers from asking if the person is Sunni, Shi’a, Sufi or any other branch of Islam.

These services are provided free of charge.


I didn’t see the link to CAIR in the information you posted. Doesn’t mean it’s not there somewhere – just means I didn’t see it. But even if it were there – what’s his point?

Maybe he doesn’t believe anything honest, trustworthy or good can come from an Islamic civil rights group.

here’s something from a group that might be resented only slightly less :-)

"So long as we have enough people in this country willing to fight for their rights,
we'll be called a democracy."

-- ACLU Founder Roger Baldwin

The ACLU is our nation's guardian of liberty, working daily in courts, legislatures and communities to defend and preserve the individual rights and liberties that the Constitution and laws of the United States guarantee everyone in this country.
www.aclu.org...

Doesn’t seem like the Muslims should need a separate organization – but then, it doesn’t seem like a country where our rights are supposedly guaranteed should need a separate organization either. Which only goes to prove – our civil rights have to be fought for and protected over and over again. Nothing in life is guaranteed.

from the same site:


The anti-Sharia movement would have you believe that Islamic law is encroaching on our legal system and is a threat to an American way of life.

This is simply not true, and in fact the court cases cited by anti-Muslim groups as symptoms of some kind of “Muslim threat” actually show the opposite. Courts treat lawsuits that are brought by Muslims or that address the Islamic faith in the same way that they deal with similar claims brought by people of other faiths or that involve no religion at all. The cases show that protections already exist in our legal system to ensure that courts do not become wrongly entangled with religion or improperly consider, defer to, or apply religious law where it would violate basic principles of U.S. federal or state policy.

Prohibiting courts from considering Islamic law serves only one purpose: to bar Muslims from having the same rights and access to the courts as any other individuals. Attempts to prevent courts from considering international or foreign law suffer from constitutional flaws and undermine the ability of courts to interpret laws and treaties regarding global business, international human rights and family law issues such as international marriages and adoptions.

Daniel Mach, Director of the ACLU’s Program on Freedom of Religion and Belief, said today in a statement:

“The anti-Sharia law movement clearly seeks to ride the recent wave of anti-Muslim bias in this country, pushing laws that are rooted in the baseless idea that U.S. Muslims wish to impose Islamic law on American courts. Proponents of these misguided measures rely on the ugly implication that anything Islamic is inherently un-American, pressing for a legislative solution to a non-existent problem.”
www.aclu.org...

thank you for this thread sir_slide. Although this thread does show that many people don’t think a Muslim can also be a good American, it’s good to see that there are many that think they can.

as for the rest of his post – muzzie is a racial epithet that seems to slip under the radar unnoticed most of the time – maybe because it’s a newbie slur

and I believe he meant ‘groove’ on the muzzies, but I can’t be absolutely sure

:-)

edit on 8/4/2011 by Spiramirabilis because: so it kinda looks like I get how English works




posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 02:24 PM
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Originally posted by zcflint05
Unfortunately, your logical and fact driven argument will fall on deaf ears. White Americans and Europeans are so scared of "The other" (in this case, Muslims) that in their own minds, they justify the actions of people like Brevik. It doesn't matter than 95% of terrorist acts committed in the borders of the US are done by far right wing militia types. The response I have seen to the Brevik shootings has been by far and away the most disgusting reactions I've ever seen from ATS. It's sad to say that 50%+ of the posters on here most likely support his actions (although they would never dare say it to their face). I just hope one day that they will be alive to see the coming generation (my generation) embrace multiculturalism and treat the old guard's pathetic xenophobia as what it is: pathetic garbage from a toilet dump.


I hear what you are saying but when you spout things like "95% of terrorist acts committed in the borders of the US are done by far right wing militia types" without showing proof of the claim, I tend to tune out. As far as embracing multiculturalism, it's a two way street, not the one way one you seem to advocate. I'm all for respecting someone's religion, culture ect....as long as they do the same to me and other peoples religions and cultures. Mutual respect.......it's something many people seem to still need to learn.



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 06:13 PM
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Originally posted by sir_slide
reply to post by lestweforget
 


The New York Times deem it as credible.

Sorry to have to address it but you actually said I 'could not be more wrong' about Catholics being good at breeding, you have just contradicted yourself. 8 children is an obscene amount.


You lost any credibility when you quoted the NYT.



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 06:19 PM
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Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
Am i really hearing all this hate comments? Why not actually pick up the Quran and actually read! WHat you guys afraid it might bite you, or itll make you see life differently, or is it because itll erase those paranoid flys buzzing through ya heads


I don't put any more faith in the quran than i do the bible.



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 07:06 PM
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Originally posted by sir_slide
reply to post by Chance321
 


I'm sorry but after re reading your post I don't need to worry, you have doomed yourself already. Nice one
(in the most cynical way possible. )
edit on 4-8-2011 by sir_slide because: (no reason given)



Thanks. But if you mean dooming myself as in not bowing down to islam, with it's stone aged beliefs then so be it, my beliefs, morals and standards are too high to allow myself to do that. I know your trying to be serious but again, thanks for the laugh.
edit on 4-8-2011 by Chance321 because: (no reason given)

edit on 4-8-2011 by Chance321 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 09:39 PM
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Originally posted by pavil
. I'm all for respecting someone's religion, culture ect....as long as they do the same to me and other peoples religions and cultures. Mutual respect.......it's something many people seem to still need to learn.


Ditto - but it is a street that islam is pretty uniquely unfitted to be part of - unless you are perpared to be a x-ian or jew, and subject yourself to additional taxes and harrasment.

Following any non - "religon of the book" is a capital offense according to the koran!



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 10:27 PM
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reply to post by Chance321
 


Dude no one is trying to convert you. I bow down to no religion as I'm actually an atheist, so your argument is thoroughly flawed there. You shown that you are pretty ignorant and I do not need to defend myself against these accusations because they do not apply to me. Calling me a 'sad little person' also shows that you are a tool, a malicious one who personally attacks individuals who merely present them with a study. So YOU my friend need to take a step back and look at yourself, it may not be that pretty.

Good luck to you in the future....



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 10:29 PM
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reply to post by Chance321
 


I think Christianity is more of a threat to you than Islam.



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 10:34 PM
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reply to post by Spiramirabilis
 


Thanks a lot for the reply man, and thanks for clearing up those things. It seems his mind was already made up though.

My pleasure about posting it, I didn't think people were so closed minded though, I really didn't. I guess it just shows that they need to do more polls like this so people can see the reality, not the perceived reality.

Thanks again mate!



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 10:36 PM
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reply to post by Chance321
 


Oh and if I wanted flags I would have posted a 'the world is ending tommorow' thread, not one that challenges peoples perceptions about American muslims.



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 10:59 PM
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reply to post by sir_slide
 


Right???

To get flags you have to BASH Islam. lol



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 11:16 PM
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reply to post by My.mind.is.mine
 


My point exactly! Good to have you here man



posted on Aug, 4 2011 @ 11:31 PM
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reply to post by sir_slide
 


I'll be around til the thread is done for.



posted on Aug, 5 2011 @ 08:40 AM
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Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
reply to post by Chance321
 


I think Christianity is more of a threat to you than Islam.


I think you've got things mixed up a little, where Christianity has evolved some with the times, where islam is still pulling this garbage and hold onto stone aged beliefs thinking the world needs to adjust to them instead of them adjusting to the world: www.fortliberty.org...
www.dailymail.co.uk...
No, Christianity isn't perfect, but there not the problem either.



posted on Aug, 7 2011 @ 09:37 AM
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Unless you're gonna go to war with all of us religious folk, it does mean that we can't change it.


Thats not necessarily true,war isnt the answer to everything.
What if you guys actually realized the crap your being spoon fed?



People who talk of ridding the world of religion always speak of genocide, which is hilarious because the REASON they wanna get rid of religion is because they say it causes violence. The irony is killa.


Always? i never spoke of genocide once i dont think,ill re-check,but im pretty sure i didnt.
Your just assuming things...



posted on Aug, 7 2011 @ 03:20 PM
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Just read the entire thread and oh my god...

Seriously ATS?! REALLY?!

There is so much hatred and fear-mongering here, it's disgusting.

To those who are countering the trolls and bigots, please stop wasting your energy. They are not worth it, not by a long shot. They will fear Islam no matter what you tell them, they are just silly little people who don't know how to function without fear and hatred.

Move along people, nothing to see here. Just a bunch of idiots spreading their paranoid fears and fantasies.


IT--
edit on 7-8-2011 by edog11 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 7 2011 @ 06:27 PM
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reply to post by edog11
 


Sorry you choose to ignore the basic precepts of islam


But they are set in stone - the koran is the word of god, it is unalterable, it is literal, and it is not to be argued with. Mohammed was the last prophet - no more will ever come and so ther's no-one wil lever be qualified to gainsay anythign in the koran.


2:23 And if ye are in doubt concerning that which We reveal unto Our slave (Muhammad), then produce a surah of the like thereof, and call your witness beside Allah if ye are truthful.
2:24 And if ye do it not - and ye can never do it - then guard yourselves against the Fire prepared for disbelievers, whose fuel is of men and stones.
(ie if you think you can do better - try - and you will find that you can't, and that yuo will be attacked by "the Fire prepared for disbelievers")

-www.skepticsannotatedbible.com...

And from that flows pretty much everything else.



2:193 And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrong-doers.

- fight until they are all moslem....or they give in at least.....

Now to be fair the section above this say do not be an agressor -


2:190 Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors


but the extreists have already decided that "the wwest" in one or more of its forms, is the agressor, so it's no holds barred until "the west" becomes moslem, or desists in its "persecution" - which means allow islam to do anything that "it" wants without check.

And that is the line the extremists take, and when moderates say no you don't take it literally (in some cases) the extremists say that htey moderates are not following het word of god.....and according to the koran they are right!

Yes it's circular....yes it is medieval......but if you are a moslem how do you actually argue against it??
edit on 7-8-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 7 2011 @ 11:00 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by edog11
 


Sorry you choose to ignore the basic precepts of islam


But they are set in stone - the koran is the word of god, it is unalterable, it is literal, and it is not to be argued with. Mohammed was the last prophet - no more will ever come and so ther's no-one wil lever be qualified to gainsay anythign in the koran.


2:23 And if ye are in doubt concerning that which We reveal unto Our slave (Muhammad), then produce a surah of the like thereof, and call your witness beside Allah if ye are truthful.
2:24 And if ye do it not - and ye can never do it - then guard yourselves against the Fire prepared for disbelievers, whose fuel is of men and stones.
(ie if you think you can do better - try - and you will find that you can't, and that yuo will be attacked by "the Fire prepared for disbelievers")

-www.skepticsannotatedbible.com...

And from that flows pretty much everything else.



2:193 And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrong-doers.

- fight until they are all moslem....or they give in at least.....

Now to be fair the section above this say do not be an agressor -


2:190 Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors


but the extreists have already decided that "the wwest" in one or more of its forms, is the agressor, so it's no holds barred until "the west" becomes moslem, or desists in its "persecution" - which means allow islam to do anything that "it" wants without check.

And that is the line the extremists take, and when moderates say no you don't take it literally (in some cases) the extremists say that htey moderates are not following het word of god.....and according to the koran they are right!

Yes it's circular....yes it is medieval......but if you are a moslem how do you actually argue against it??
edit on 7-8-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)


I'm about to refute your post piece by piece but I'll start off with this. I HAVE NEVER seen anybody spin details and post SNIPPETS to support their messed up stance in so hard in my LIFE!!! you FAIL hard!!!

1. "2:23 And if ye are in doubt concerning that which We reveal unto Our slave (Muhammad), then produce a surah of the like thereof, and call your witness beside Allah if ye are truthful.
2:24 And if ye do it not - and ye can never do it - then guard yourselves against the Fire prepared for disbelievers, whose fuel is of men and stones."

Common sense would say, that just like other religions, this verse is speaking of hell, not an "attacking fire".


edit on 7-8-2011 by My.mind.is.mine because: (no reason given)


2. "2:190 Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not the hostilities. Verily Allah does not love the aggresors.
2:191 And slay them wherever you find them, and drive them out of the places from which they drove you, for persecution is worse than slaughter. Fight not with them at the inviolable place of worship (the ka’bah) unless they first attack you there. If they attack you there, then slay them. Such is the reward of the disbelievers.
2:192 But if they desist then verily, Allah is forgiving, and merciful.
2:193 And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah’s sake. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrong-doers."

The verses are in ORDER for a reason. This doesn't detail the declaration of war, this is about self defense. We are forbidden to be the aggressors in Islam. Also, in multiple places throughout the Qur'an it is stated that we are to retaliate only in a like manner, so if so called extremist muslims think that the west is the aggressor through psychological warfare, and propaganda, then all they're allowed to do back, is the same thing. As for those who are doing whatever goes on overseas in OCCUPIED LANDS, well, a war is a war right? If somebody kicks in your door, scares the mess out of your kids, and threatens you in front of the people who rely on you, I believe you'd retaliate too. I also believe that is considered defense, because according to the meaning of intrusion and invasion, somebody coming into your house without permission, is subjecting themselves to any method of ejection. It's just like Texas..
edit on 7-8-2011 by My.mind.is.mine because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 12:07 PM
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reply to post by edog11
 


I gave you a star - for acknowledging the truth of this situation


To those who are countering the trolls and bigots, please stop wasting your energy. They are not worth it, not by a long shot. They will fear Islam no matter what you tell them, they are just silly little people who don't know how to function without fear and hatred.


To this I say - no dice. It doesn't go away if we choose to ignore it. Like it or not, ATS is mainstream now. The demographics are pretty much the same as in 'the real world'.

So, this is our world. The problem doesn't disappear because we choose to ignore it.

Ultimately, the only way they can win is by default.
edit on 8/8/2011 by Spiramirabilis because: (no reason given)



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