Dangerous Toxins From Genetically Modified Plants Found in Women and Fetuses, page 3

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by haarvik

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Does it affect humans?

That's all that matters.

Here are a couple of studies on Bt.:National Pesticides Telecommunications Network
Endotoxins on the Pea Ahpid

After reading the first study you can at least gather that there is at least some harm caused to humans. Another poster asked the question why did they test women and children? I would have to say because, Bt. in it's non-altered form disrupts the reproduction cycle of female and/or hemaphrodite insects. Once ingested the female/hemaphrodite is no longer able to reproduce prior to death. In addition to that any larvae will be erradicated with 7-10 days of ingestion. It is a systemic/microbiological approach to some hard shelled insects that would otherwise be immune to most "Biological/Microbial" pesticides.

The difference in the original form of Bt.,(which is harmless to humans) and the now chemical form is 1000% to say the least. The form of Bt., that our buds over at Monsanto use has been chemically altered beyond belief. The only reason they are able to say that Bt., modified foods are not dangerous is because they started off with a biological pest control. But what they are doing now is beyond the scope of biological pest control of any sort as it has as all you know been genetically bred into the seed itself changing the DNA of specific plants.

The FDA should have their @$$'es handed to them for ever allowing such a food product on the market, because when the water boils down it's the FDA's fault. Excuse my lack of finding proper words to describe my anger for the Federal Death Authority/FDA, but they are nothing but crooks and the protector of any company with a "Great" idea, they could careless about you or me! Sorry, to go off topic about the FDA. Everyone should know they used to be called The Department of Chemistry, until they found out how much money they could make by masking themselves as the Food/Chemical (what a crock of pooh) protectors of the citizens of the United States of America, a.k.a. FDA.

Back to Bt., I also have years of experience working with this "biopesticide" (I earned my useless B.S.,lol in Biology from Temple University) in it's natural form and in it's unnatural form. Let's just say, I used to grow my own hydroponically produced "herbs". I would always get insects commonly refered to as ahpids, root aphids, spider mites, fungus gnats and thrips. At last, I thought I found the cure all to my insect problems Bt., in the form of Thuricide which is natural. It worked for a few years on all but the aphids and never worked on the root aphids (which are very hard to kill). So, I looked for something stronger and while I will not name this product for various reasons, worked incredibly well...too good to be true actually. I believed that this stronger product was harmless, however after over 7 years of handling this stuff, I now have an underactive thyroid...hypo-thyroidism. I have no idea if I can still have children as I already have two and care for no more. But, one should question the comparison of naturally occuring Bt. and Chemically altered Bt., as to wether or not it could possibly disrupt or sterlize a human female, since this is what it is designed to do in pest/insects. More specifically, female insects since they reproduce at an alarming rate and many of them need to male for reproduction.

Okay, now I'm all over the place, but before I go, here's another article published by Cornell University about Bt.:
Bacteria

I hope some of this information is helpful and believe you me when I tell you that although I have no scientific proof that the chemical version of Bt. I onced used for my special "herbs" damaged my thyroid, it's quite obvious when you deeply study the effects of this chemical form on the human thyroid, which has also been done.

Whatever you do, please stay away from those seeds, don't even chance it, it's not worth it. Pay attention to the kind of seeds you purchase, the label should specifically say NOT GENETICALLY MODIFIED. I have stored a huge collection of various food seeds and not one is modified. Pay attention the next time you're at your local nursery or one of the Big guys like Home Depot and the likes.......READ the LABEL!

Originally posted by jssaylor2007
reply to post by korathin

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You're right I have one hell of a financial interest in gmo crops, I am one of these evil people who grow your food and your fiber in an area of the country where it would be almost impossible without gmo crops.

So until you have actually grown food at more than a personal scale I don't want to hear you attacking the ones who put food on yours and most of the nations dinner plates.

edit on 1-8-2011 by jssaylor2007 because: (no reason given)

That might be easier if pro-GMO folks didn't have lobbiests getting legislation written that makes the barrier-to-entry all but impossible to small-scale farmers. To think that it's not possible is ridiculous. There are people producing nearly a MILLION POUNDS of food on only a few acres. Sadly, because of regulations, they probably have to throw most of it out.

Originally posted by ThePublicEnemyNo1

But, one should question the comparison of naturally occuring Bt. and Chemically altered Bt., as to wether or not it could possibly disrupt or sterlize a human female, since this is what it is designed to do in pest/insects. More specifically, female insects since they reproduce at an alarming rate and many of them need to male for reproduction.

Okay, now I'm all over the place, but before I go, here's another article published by Cornell University about Bt.:
Bacteria

The article you link to shows that it does not actually affect the fertility of female insects at all - it attacks their gut, disolving it and allowing the gut bacteria to enter the rest of the body, killing the insect through septicemia.

Why is it that your statement and "evidence" do not actually match each other??

reply to post by Cuervo

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Buy land, buy seed, plant seed. The stories of people getting shut down for farming I have read have all been about people living in cities, or trying to sell as organic. The amount needed to be grown to become regulate worthy is pretty substantial, as in more than say 15 acres worth.

Originally posted by jssaylor2007
reply to post by korathin

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You're right I have one hell of a financial interest in gmo crops, I am one of these evil people who grow your food and your fiber in an area of the country where it would be almost impossible without gmo crops.

So until you have actually grown food at more than a personal scale I don't want to hear you attacking the ones who put food on yours and most of the nations dinner plates.

edit on 1-8-2011 by jssaylor2007 because: (no reason given)

Why have a farm in that type of area in the first place? Don't tell me it is due to the lack of farm land. There is plenty of farm land around, and too many small farmers being kicked off of their fertile land. If people would use the land like God intended it to be used, we wouldn't have problems with growing food. No, people try to farm in infertile soil, deplete the soil not taking care of it properly, and over fertilize it making it unsuitable for regular crops.

Also, I will state this no matter how many may disagree with it. Houses, commercial buildings, malls, and etc were built on fertile areas where there should be farms. No, we really can't change that now. It just shows what short-sightedness, greed, and power hungry mongers will do to destroy the environment and nature without a care in the world.

After our resources have been depleted, and our food destroyed what are even the elite going to do? I believe that is why God said in the Bible after the end days there would be a new heaven and new Earth. He know we would destroy everything in the end.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

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This is how the anti gmo attack works.

1. Study links gmo to human body.

2. Heavily biased anti blog writes editorial with small reference to actual study, but is filled with other assumptions.

3. Anti gmo people continue to blog and make reference to original article, although talking not even remotely about it.

reply to post by Mystery_Lady

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Why not? ?
Where do you live? Is it perfectly suited for human habitation, or did you have to build a house and alter the way God intended you to live?

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by ThePublicEnemyNo1

But, one should question the comparison of naturally occuring Bt. and Chemically altered Bt., as to wether or not it could possibly disrupt or sterlize a human female, since this is what it is designed to do in pest/insects. More specifically, female insects since they reproduce at an alarming rate and many of them need to male for reproduction.

Okay, now I'm all over the place, but before I go, here's another article published by Cornell University about Bt.:
Bacteria

The article you link to shows that it does not actually affect the fertility of female insects at all - it attacks their gut, disolving it and allowing the gut bacteria to enter the rest of the body, killing the insect through septicemia.

Why is it that your statement and "evidence" do not actually match each other??

Okay, well thank you for not being rude however, if you go here: Chemistry Explained and read the article in it's entirety, you will better understand. The article I included does state that. However, a little reading on your part will prove that it does affect the reproduction as well. Also, what's in or around the stomach? Read a little more then get back to me. I did not say that was the only way it was effective, I said it does affect reproduction. When Bt., enters the cells of said host, it is spread throughout the body...that means reproductive system as well.

I posted just a few articles for you to read, so do yourself a favor and read.... maybe conduct your own research into Bt.. I did not come here to lecture you, just educate.

My personal opnion of foods we eat that have been genetically modified is that...we should not eat them. If crops are being modified for other purposes other than human consumption, that's okay, but then who's gonna clean up the mess if the crops were grown in soil? That crap has to go somewhere

reply to post by Mystery_Lady

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Also for clarification the land here is incredibly fertile, but the region is prone to drought. The Arizona valley is one of the most fertile places in the country, but it is also prone to periods of drought.

reply to post by ThePublicEnemyNo1

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Your "chemistry explained" link does not work - and there is nothing at all in the original one about effects on reproduction, no matter what you say about it.

The other 2 at the top of that post also do nto say that htere is any effect on reproduction of either humans or animals.

To imply that it affects reproduction because the reproductive organs are around the gut is just silly - with the gut burst open and septicemia and starvation sure to kill the bug it is not going to be able to reproduce every anyway - it's going to be dead!

The Bt bacteria causes death by starvation and infection - and what's more infected bugs have to be at the right stage of their development to actually be affected by it in the first place, and have to consume enough of it for it to do its damage - it doesn't kill all bugs - only those that are susceptible to it, and I see no references anywhere to it affecting reproduction in those that it does not kill - by all means point to information that does support that tho - I'm happy to learn.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

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If you are commenting to me in hopes of disproving me then go ahead, you could not possibly have read all the information I provided you unless you have some super human powers, in that case may I have some ? Seriously though, you can't possibly believe what you're saying. Read man read! BTW you might need a dictionary to understand some of those big ol' words. Here you go:

Chemistry Dictionary
Biology Dictionary
Oxford Dictionary

reply to post by ThePublicEnemyNo1

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That's very condescending of you - but I had little trouble reading the 3 papers you posted links to - the conclusions were fairly straightforward and there was noting at all, in any of them, saying that there was a problem with fertility from the Bt bacteria.

Only 1 of them has a specific section on reproductive defects - the one here - npic.orst.edu... - and the section says that no tests are required so none have been carried out.

If it is somethign in them perhaps you could point out exactly the passage that mentions it, rather than being condescending and obtuse?

reply to post by jssaylor2007

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If you farm in a non-suitable place, the expect crop failure. No, GMO is not the answer either. If anything it will be our death.

Where I live is a hilly area that has a lot of rocks mixed in with the soil. At least on my particular small portion of land. I live in a pre-built house that was built in the 1920's I believe, which is right across from a school. No, I do not live on land that could be used for farming. My sister, who lives a few miles from me does. She rents most of her land out to a farmer.

It is farm land out there, and most of it is used. I was glad to hear that there was an ordinance where only a small portion could be residental, and most of the land had to be farms. It is good to have farms around.

I can't do the same, since I have less than a a quarter of an acre, more likely less than an eighth. Put it this way, my neighbor has enough to plant a small garden, but I don't. I live in the smallest house on the street with the smallest yard.

reply to post by ThePublicEnemyNo1

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why thank you.

Personally I foresee Monsanto being a lovely company burning to the ground in the upcoming problems. I for one favor martial law, because to be honest, it's only well trained and funded military men whom will burn bad crops down and steal the good crops, as they will need good food.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

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Chemistry Explained


Hopefully this link works. How about you prove that genetically modified foods produced for human consumption are harmless? You seem to be a believer of the FDA, and if this is the case then that's your right. However, the FDA is not here for you and I. Why do you think the next best drugs so to speak get pulled from the markets and this is after they were approved by the FDA. But, you go ahead and eat that crap, afterall it's your choice. Hopefully, you would not make the choice to eat their crap.

I'm not running from your question one bit, but for one to think that the studies that have been conducted are inconclusive or biased is just plain ridiculous. We are all entitled to our own opinions, I respect yours and we'll leave at that. But research isn't based on opinion now is it? So, you'll get no argument from me.

I could provide you with 1000 studies and you would still yell...show me the proof!

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