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Unity in Christianity and Judaism?

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posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 11:26 AM
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I have studied world religions and I know some are not based so much on visual interpretations and som are based on more visual interpretations of ancient scriptures, remembrances, culture and ideas merging in one to explain spirituality. I think a lot of these beliefs can be grasped, not so much the visual ones that have become somewhat abstract. We had Moses come in to tell us not to worship animals as you would worship a god, like in Hinduism. Jesus was also a Jew, and came in to tell us many great things, and supposedly create wonders. Put aside all the culture related ideas and physical aspects of the religions like celebrations and remembering of events, shouldn't these two religions be one and the same? From what I know Muhammed was a warrior and took Moses teachings to spread to his people, so the whole middle east and much of far east seperating themselves from Moses and hiding their face doesn't impress me. A Christian cannot remember and celebrate a Jewish event, and a Jew cannot celebrate a Christian event. To me we are just childish over these things, and Moses along with Jesus are probably not proud of people still acting like spoiled children after thousands of years evolving, but still so ignorant. Surely all religions can live in harmony if we didn't have those minds.




posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 11:42 AM
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reply to post by greyer
 

. . .shouldn't these two religions be one and the same?
No.
Judaism and Christianity have different gods. One has Jesus and the other has YHWH as the administrative gods of their two very different covenants. There was a god who came to the aid of the Israelites in Egypt, and killed great numbers of Egyptians, then proceeded to kill great numbers of Canaanites to create not just a nation of people but a geographical nation in Palestine.
That particular god made a pact with the nation in order for him to remain their protector and the killer of the enemies.
Jesus created a New Covenant with all the people and without borders and without establishing a geographical kingdom apart from the rest of the world.
There remains people who want to maintain the pact with the old god who abandoned them and has left the planet. Bringing the two religions together can only create a false and evil religion.



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 11:51 AM
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reply to post by greyer
 


You still need to go back and study more; you lost the plot the moment you typed that post!



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 01:14 PM
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reply to post by bluemirage5
 


You can't elaborate with any truth or substance because you are wrong.



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 01:16 PM
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reply to post by jmdewey60
 


Jesus admitted that he had a god, and he never claimed to be our god, so I don't know why some Christians believe Jesus to be their god.



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 01:19 PM
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Originally posted by greyer
reply to post by jmdewey60
 

Jesus admitted that he had a god, and he never claimed to be our god, so I don't know why some Christians believe Jesus to be their god.
Make that all Christians.



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 01:54 PM
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reply to post by jmdewey60
 


Well, I believe in Jesus. I am a Christian. I study the written word of the New Testament, the living word. And the reason why I don't believe Jesus is God is because Jesus did not tell me he was his "father," which as you know is who he referred to as God. He told me and you that he is God's one and only chosen son.

I hope everybody hears that because it cannot be proven wrong by any scripture. The whole thing has gotten out of hand.



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 02:13 PM
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reply to post by greyer
 

. . .Jesus did not tell me he was his "father," . . .
No, he did not because while he was on Earth, he was a man.



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 06:42 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by greyer
 

. . .Jesus did not tell me he was his "father," . . .
No, he did not because while he was on Earth, he was a man.


Well he seemed to be more with the miracles, but in his teaching, his relation to what he was after he rose from the dead as to be filled with God his father, reunited in his presence, Jesus did not say that he would become God, but that he would be sitting at the right hand of God. His God was the Jewish god you mentioned. Therefore I am convincing myself the unity of Christianity and Judaism even more.


In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven." -Mtt. 26:64



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 08:24 PM
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reply to post by greyer
 
The God of Jesus was not the Jewish god.
The God of Jesus was the God of Abraham.
Two different things.
As I explained earlier.



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 08:39 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by greyer
 
The God of Jesus was not the Jewish god.
The God of Jesus was the God of Abraham.
Two different things.
As I explained earlier.



Originally posted by jmdewey60
One has Jesus and the other has YHWH as the administrative gods of their two very different covenants.


No you did not explain, stop playing with me man. You speak gibberish.



posted on Jul, 31 2011 @ 08:50 PM
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reply to post by greyer
 

I don't know how you think I am playing with you?
There is nothing to explain.
Abraham lived a long time before Moses,
Abraham met a god in Ur.
Moses met a god in Sinai.
Not the same god.
The NT never refers to the angel in Sinai as god, only as an angel.
The NT does refer to the God of Abraham as God.
The Jews, when returning from Babylon back to Jerusalem chose the angel of Sinai to be their god and had a big re-dedication ceremony in the attempt to revitalize the old covenant made by Moses.
Jesus rejected that angel as God in favor of the God of Abraham.
So, you have two religions, one worshipping a false god and one worshipping the real God.



posted on Aug, 1 2011 @ 10:59 AM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by greyer
 

There is nothing to explain.
Abraham lived a long time before Moses,
Abraham met a god in Ur.
Moses met a god in Sinai.
Not the same god.
The NT never refers to the angel in Sinai as god, only as an angel.
The NT does refer to the God of Abraham as God.
The Jews, when returning from Babylon back to Jerusalem chose the angel of Sinai to be their god and had a big re-dedication ceremony in the attempt to revitalize the old covenant made by Moses.
Jesus rejected that angel as God in favor of the God of Abraham.
So, you have two religions, one worshipping a false god and one worshipping the real God.


Thanks for explaining, it did spark my interest for a minute but what you are mentioning is more like a bickering situation between the world, through the many years religions have developed they have been though dirty hands of power, religions evolve just like generations and new ideas/principles are set. As for the Angel of Sinai, that was early propaganda in the christian religion to affirm that the law of Chirst was more important than the law of Moses. In reality this was pushed by Paul an apostle who never met Jesus in his crusade to create the christian religion. The teachings of Jesus (gospels) do not refer to the Lord I Am as being angels (Paul claimed there wer multiple) because he probably didn't say it. In this post I am suggesting the law of Christ was more "new and improved", both laws are from the same god but one has been refined.

There is no way the original creators of the OT would include Abraham if they did not think he had a genetic line to the original Jews. I am arguing with much of the world when I say unite. Moses materialized in front of Jesus, not Abraham, that just shows how close they were. I'm actually amazed at how Abraham lived to be 175 years old, and he knew about people living up to 800 way in the past. I wrote a post about that the other day. At the time when Abraham lived there was no one who believed in one god, he was so ignorant as to who this god was but he was faithful, and the story is amazing. I don't think I can make a devoted Jesus follower think that Jesus in not God and a muslim woman in the middle east show her pretty face and put makeup on, but I can have security in my heart because I know that I am taking them from children of the ego to children of God.



posted on Aug, 1 2011 @ 06:07 PM
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reply to post by greyer
 

Thanks for explaining, it did spark my interest for a minute but what you are mentioning is more like a bickering situation between the world, through the many years religions have developed they have been though dirty hands of power, religions evolve just like generations and new ideas/principles are set. As for the Angel of Sinai, that was early propaganda in the christian religion to affirm that the law of Chirst was more important than the law of Moses. In reality this was pushed by Paul an apostle who never met Jesus in his crusade to create the christian religion. The teachings of Jesus (gospels) do not refer to the Lord I Am as being angels (Paul claimed there wer multiple) because he probably didn't say it. In this post I am suggesting the law of Christ was more "new and improved", both laws are from the same god but one has been refined.

There is no way the original creators of the OT would include Abraham if they did not think he had a genetic line to the original Jews. I am arguing with much of the world when I say unite. Moses materialized in front of Jesus, not Abraham, that just shows how close they were. I'm actually amazed at how Abraham lived to be 175 years old, and he knew about people living up to 800 way in the past. I wrote a post about that the other day. At the time when Abraham lived there was no one who believed in one god, he was so ignorant as to who this god was but he was faithful, and the story is amazing. I don't think I can make a devoted Jesus follower think that Jesus in not God and a muslim woman in the middle east show her pretty face and put makeup on, but I can have security in my heart because I know that I am taking them from children of the ego to children of God.
OK, I found your post and I think along those lines that by the time we die, we are just becoming grownups.
Moses appeared with Jesus because he was alive and not in a netherworld as Abraham is imagined being.
The redeemed in heaven when the saints are gathered sing the songs of Moses and the song of the Lamb. Moses was respected by Jesus but Jesus understood the laws were created for a particular circumstance and a people whose hearts had been hardened.
I believe the position of Jesus is limited just like the angel of the Mosaic administration had his time limited. There is a God and Jesus is acting god, as YHWH was in his time. Once all evil is done away with, God will be all in all. He is the Lord placed on the throne by God for the purpose of placing the world under God's dominion, not by violence but by the Spirit.
Abraham knew God in a personal way but of course through an angel but he had, because like you say, the bloodlines, from father to eldest son, from Shem, who was given the birthright from Noah. So it was not just chance that brought God and Abraham together.
Anyway, I do not share in your little regard for Paul, and your overly exalted views of how accurately the words of Jesus were documented.
I already told you what the source of the problem was in my last post, and that is the stance taken by the returnees from Babylon, under Persian rule. They took the same sort of extreme attitude as would be gotten from having the militant and genocidal God of Moses and Joshua, to drive out the people who had taken over the land after being left desolate. Then they proceeded to make their own tribe, the Jews supreme over all the other people regardless of whether they were of Abraham or not. This is the same thing going on today where the Palestinians are more Jew by blood than the European people claiming to be Jews.
It goes right back to the former god that Jesus rejected and all Christians need to reject. We need to go back to the old God, the real God, the God of Jesus and the Apostles, the God of Abraham, not the acting god of Moses who was actually of at least as high a status as that angel, if not higher.



edit on 1-8-2011 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)




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