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House panel approves bill forcing ISPs to log users' web history

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posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 08:50 AM
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It has been this way for years in the EU.

Seriously, why are you scared?

Use a VPN, freeopenVPN for example or freeopenPPTP

You also have the extra bonus of it being SSL between you and the VPN server.




posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 08:51 AM
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ISP's already keep all that information, how do you think they can BILL you for your internet access? This requires them to retain records for 12 months after terminating an account, but I would be really surprised if they weren't already doing that too. AFAIK this bill just formalizes something that's already being done, if not widely acknowledged. Compare it to a phone company, how long do they keep a record of a customer's name, credit card and the phone number assigned to them? Are they really shredding that info the day you stop your account? No business ditches that info, they'll keep it for future records, so they know when they have a repeat customer, to see how well they paid, and ultimately they collect all this customer info into databases which they sell to other businesses (minus credit card info of course).



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 08:54 AM
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reply to post by JennaDarling
 


It is not that people are scared, they are more to say mad that the rights of the citizens are so rampantly trampled upon for no better reason than “for the common good”.

Though it is my opinion that it has been happening for a while, this just make it all “legal” for them to do it.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 08:55 AM
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If you people think
that ISPS have not been
doing this TPTB have already won!!

This is just a law that gives TPTB an automatic
search warrant TO ALL YOUR INFO!!

THE ANSWER TO 1984 IS 1776!!



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 08:56 AM
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Originally posted by AlienCarnage
reply to post by JennaDarling
 


It is not that people are scared, they are more to say mad that the rights of the citizens are so rampantly trampled upon for no better reason than “for the common good”.

Though it is my opinion that it has been happening for a while, this just make it all “legal” for them to do it.


Only because you let them.

Your own fault.

If you don't like it, do something about it and no crying on a forum doesn't count.

I give you links to tools you can use, even better, get an overseas VPN.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 09:00 AM
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reply to post by JennaDarling
 


friendly much?

Your a fool to think these tools will help you, I give it a month and these tools will also be deemed " dangerous"
and thus banned or made illegal.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 09:00 AM
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Originally posted by Blackmarketeer
ISP's already keep all that information, how do you think they can BILL you for your internet access? This requires them to retain records for 12 months after terminating an account, but I would be really surprised if they weren't already doing that too. AFAIK this bill just formalizes something that's already being done, if not widely acknowledged. Compare it to a phone company, how long do they keep a record of a customer's name, credit card and the phone number assigned to them? Are they really shredding that info the day you stop your account? No business ditches that info, they'll keep it for future records, so they know when they have a repeat customer, to see how well they paid, and ultimately they collect all this customer info into databases which they sell to other businesses (minus credit card info of course).


They definitely do keep the billing records; at least AOL does for how long I do not know. My sister in law cancelled her AOL a while back and 5 years after was able to log on to her old account and picked up where she left off with her billing info intact. The browsing history am not positive on.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 09:01 AM
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Originally posted by AlienCarnage

Originally posted by Manhater

Originally posted by TXRabbit
Thanks to our troops for fighting for our right to pass this law!

(yeah - it goes both ways)


It's not the troops fault. I'm sure, they don't want this law passed. The "troops" hands are tied, they signed up for a job and have to follow orders.

It's the government and private securities firms. And why House of Judiciary Committee would pass it, is beyond me.
edit on 29-7-2011 by Manhater because: (no reason given)


Wouldn’t it be ironic if they were the first ones caught with questionable material on their computers, House of Judiciary Committee that is.

Just saying . . .
edit on 7/29/2011 by AlienCarnage because: (no reason given)


I bet they do
But of course it will go unnoticed.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 09:07 AM
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reply to post by JennaDarling
 


I personally am not crying, yelling or screaming. I am simply replying on a post about such government stupidity, and offering my beliefs and oppinions, if you take that as crying and complaining, so be it.

I do take action, I constantly write and complain to those in office, which seems to fall upon deaf ears, I make calls to media outlets, my voice is definitely out there, and whether it is being listened to is another story.
edit on 7/29/2011 by AlienCarnage because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 09:07 AM
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Originally posted by JennaDarling
You also have the extra bonus of it being SSL between you and the VPN server.

What does that have to do with web surfing?
That is not what VPNs are for



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 09:09 AM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 

Am I mistaken when I say this is like allowing phone companies to wiretap every phone line and store hte conversations for the past year? If a company can't wiretap our phone lines, how can they expect ISPs to do it? My only guess is that soon they will start wiretapping all phones in the country and recording them. I understand that the content of what we do on the internet isn't being recorded, only the addresses. But to see the content of the interchange all one has to do is go to the address. It would be like if all of our phone conversations were stored on a public database and phone companies recorded the link to the content of each phone call.

Addresses of where we have been ARE the content. People in phone conversations ARE the content, but you can't just get a phone conversation by speaking to the people involved. But on the internet you can. That's the difference between conversations between people and conversations between IP addresses. Content of IP addresses is public or can be demanded.

I don't like this because: a) I'm not a pedophile b) I don't harm children c) I don't ever plan to do these things. I don't like how I feel like I'm being treated as though I'm already guilty. I feel like the burden is on me, and not on the justice system. It just feels wrong.

Furthermore, this is just going to make the job of ISP's more difficult. We can't keep adding to the complications of different businesses. It costs them money to do all this.

The problem with waiting until the government comes for you and THEN getting mad and protesting is that they can USE IT AGAINST YOU. A person who is being wrongfully persecuted is just confirming the viewpoints of the madmen when they fight back. So the time to fight this bill, this type of legislation, is now, not later. Later will be too late. At least, this is how I feel.

When people are on power trips, they're not interested in what you have to say. Obviously, if you disagree then you must be a bad guy. You must be the opposite of what they're fighting for.

Disagree? Well I've disagreed about the Iraq war and I get a lot of heat for it. People automatically assume I'm anti-american because of my views. People are very passionate about stopping pedophiles before they commit their crimes. Just imagine for a moment that you're wrongfully prosecuted for this and the government comes up with all of its 'evidence'. Anytime you speak up for yourself all it does is reconfirm in the minds of the passionate that you're in fact exactly as they thought. You're a bad guy! If you're honest and admit that they're right, you're a good guy but still deserve punishment! People on a power trip just want to punish.

What does a pedophile have to do to go to jail? Download an image of a child in a sexual situation off the internet. Then go to a forum and post the same image so that others can see it or download it. BAM. That's all they have to do. This is enough to prosecute them. In fact, there was a guy in my state prosecuted because he had about 70 images in 10,000 on his computer that had children. He said he wasn't a pedophile, but hte presence of hte images and the fact that he posted them (along with others) on a image sharing site was enoguh to convict him.
edit on 29-7-2011 by jonnywhite because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 09:39 AM
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Originally posted by ModernAcademia

Originally posted by JennaDarling
You also have the extra bonus of it being SSL between you and the VPN server.

What does that have to do with web surfing?
That is not what VPNs are for


Plenty, the only address they log is your connection to a VPN, big deal.

They cannot see the traffic without decrypting it, they cannot do deep packet inspection or traffic shaping much.

VPNs are a tunnel that also allows distributed people on the internet to appear on their own local network, infact gamers and shareres use them often as do companies.

It basically renders their logs , useless.


There has sprung up a huge amount of companies supplying VPN services for free or cheap in any country around the world, also allows bypassing blocks to content restricted to specific regions.

edit on 29-7-2011 by JennaDarling because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 10:07 AM
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That is a lot of people who will be losing their personal information. Imagine just one ISP with a database that has been comprimised.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 10:18 AM
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It represents "a data bank of every digital act by every American" that would "let us find out where every single American visited Web sites," said Rep. Zoe Lofgren of California, who led Democratic opposition to the bill

Lofgren said the data retention requirements are easily avoided because they only apply to "commercial" providers. Criminals would simply go to libraries or Starbucks coffeehouses and use the Web anonymously, she said, while law-abiding Americans would have their activities recorded.

news.cnet.com...

What a useless Govt.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 10:46 AM
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Originally posted by Manhater


I bet they do
But of course it will go unnoticed.


Oh I'm sure that any bill would have provisions in it - similar to the rules regarding insider-trading, that exempt those in political offices from this scrutiny.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 10:47 AM
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It represents "a data bank of every digital act by every American" that would "let us find out where every single American visited Web sites," said Rep. Zoe Lofgren of California, who led Democratic opposition to the bill

Lofgren said the data retention requirements are easily avoided because they only apply to "commercial" providers. Criminals would simply go to libraries or Starbucks coffeehouses and use the Web anonymously, she said, while law-abiding Americans would have their activities recorded.


Or worse, they'll use innocent people's open wifi routers to surf their criminal web sites, landing those people in hot water or on some perpetual watch list when someone "borrows" their bandwidth.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 


We have ceased being citizens and are now mere subjects in the US. When you take a step back and review in total the nonsense of warrantless wire-taps, smart phones being considered public property not subject to 4th amendment protection, CCTV cameras on every corner, know your customer banking laws, insidious things like "see something, say something", training folks to do "behaviorial pattern recognition" to identify "potential" terrorists, government coersion placed on telcos and ISPs, iris scans being conducted by the police, new cameras that record every liscence plate and map the individual to locations, looking to enlist postal workers to assist in identifying "patterns" and now this, relatively simple conclusions can be drawn.

Take an honest step back and consider it all and what kind of society those measures imply. It ain't pretty, nor does it have any relationship what so ever to the country that was founded, where the presumption of innocence was deemed a vital component to the foundation of the country.

Most shocking is that there has been one ioata of public discussion on these matters, not their efficacy, not success stories, not wrongful prosecutions, nothing. Its all being done to "keep us safe". Ask folks if they think we were less safe in the 1970s when none of this rubbish could be implemented. We were not less safe. Its all a game.

The military industrial complex has moved into a new market segment and its the criminal justice world. The more of this stuff they can push, the more they sell, the more juice they can throw about.

This has nothing to do with our safety or stopping any crime what so ever. This is all about money and power.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 





Big Brother all the way This is a big loss, this just plains sucks

I so agree.


"If you aren't doing anything wrong you have nothing to worry about"

This is how people think when they live in a prison.

This is truly a dark day. Again.




Some members have suggested that we have a 'CyberWar' forum for all of this type of stuff. I think we are going to need one.



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 04:15 PM
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reply to post by JennaDarling
 


Yeah, it's true.

2600 magazine has a great article on SSH tunnels right now.

www.2600.com...



posted on Jul, 29 2011 @ 04:16 PM
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of course they would do this in the name of catching "pedophiles"...good god it gets worse every day






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