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Atheist Group Sues NYC, Bloomberg in Protest of WTC Memorial Cross

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posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 08:58 AM
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American Atheists, a nonprofit group, has filed a lawsuit protesting the inclusion of the World Trade Center Cross in the 9/11 memorial and museum.

The lawsuit claims that the presence of the cross is unconstitutional because it violates the separation of church and state and because it excludes other religions and belief systems.

Link


I am all for including other religious symbols. I do not care.

But in pushing for this, the Atheist will get bunches of symbols, or none at all.

What about the Atheists that died in the attacks? Aren't all the prospective symbols disrespecting them?

And if they take everything down, then the government is supporting Atheism, and denying other religions their "free exercise thereof."

So what to do?

Live and let live, I say.

edit on 7/28/2011 by Lemon.Fresh because: (no reason given)

edit on 7/28/2011 by Lemon.Fresh because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:05 AM
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I am seriously getting tired of these damn atheists, they're becoming the new NAACP, spouting off religious offence under every rock. What's next, they're going to ask them to remove all the headstones at Arlington National Cemetery? Seriously, get a freaking life. Does it really affect their lives THAT much, or do they just want the publicity? STFU!



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:12 AM
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I do not understand why they feel its approprate to put any religious symbols on the memorial.

If this world had no religion, the effin towers would still be standing!


Incidently, we atheists should come up with a proper symbol. I do like the atom symbol with the A in the middle overall, its pretty cool.



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:14 AM
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Originally posted by amaster
I am seriously getting tired of these damn atheists, they're becoming the new NAACP, spouting off religious offence under every rock. What's next, they're going to ask them to remove all the headstones at Arlington National Cemetery? Seriously, get a freaking life. Does it really affect their lives THAT much, or do they just want the publicity? STFU!


Hmm, does religious fanaticism effect our lives that much.

Lets see, you have a clamoring of religions trying to "own" the blood sacrifice site in new york, and being pushed by government...ya, sure, no philosophical issues there.

You know what...have it. I think I thought of the new symbol for atheists..

Just some words...no moons, no crosses, none of that...instead it will be just a small inscription stating:
"This happened because of:"

Make sure to put our symbol with the rest of the religious symbols...that way people will know...this happened because of: christianity, islam, judism, etc



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:17 AM
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Silly atheists. When you die there is nothing left anyhow, right? Why do you care?



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:19 AM
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reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 


Consumerism is the official true Religion of Americans. Put up a McDonald's, order a happy meal and be on your way. Atheist and true believers alike....


edit on 28-7-2011 by whaaa because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:19 AM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Wouldn't a symbol of atheisim solidify it's place as a religion? All you would need then is a spokesman and book of guidlines on how to be a better atheist. I suggest Richard Dawkins.
edit on 7/28/2011 by amaster because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:22 AM
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I do not understand why Atheists feel religious symbols are so offensive. The cross has been traditionally used as a symbol for remembrance of the dead for centuries. I do not think it should be removed just because some people find it offensive. It is not forcing them to believe in God or alter their lifestyle, it is not teaching creationism in a science classroom; it is just there, as a symbol of respect for those lost.

If the atheists are really outraged that only a christian symbol is being used, they should cough up the funding for a large golden Buddha, statue of Vishnu, statue of Anubis, moon and star, star of david, yin-yang, etc. until they're satisfied that every religion is represented.

Otherwise, keep up the intolerance Atheists, you're no better then them.


edit on 28-7-2011 by Glass because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:23 AM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


Then you would have people fighting over McDonalds vs Jack in the Box vs Burger King. lol It would be just as bad.


Mine would be Whataburger, though.



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:25 AM
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Originally posted by amaster
reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Wouldn't a symbol of atheisim solidify it's place as a religion? All you would need then is a spokesman and book of guidlines on how to be a better atheist. I suggest Richard Dawkins.
edit on 7/28/2011 by amaster because: (no reason given)


I have no problem with the state seeing atheism as a religion...get tax free status, I could even become a minister and get lots of governmental perks.
We could get all sorts of bennies off the taxpayer should it form into a proper religion...can even demand holidays and all sorts...demand our people can not work on saturdays, call it the day of hangoverance or some such.

Of course there is absolutely no belief required...actually, one requirement is that you don't simply believe in deitys unless proof is given



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:26 AM
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Originally posted by kalunom
Silly atheists. When you die there is nothing left anyhow, right? Why do you care?


Because we aren't dead yet.

And incidently, that is not a belief held by atheists.

Like me saying, silly theists, you know you will meet the 12 gods and be judged on olympus....do all theists believe in the olympian gods?



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
Mine would be Whataburger, though.


Heathen!



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:29 AM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Wait, I thought 9/11 was an inside job? What's this about a blood sacrifice?
I don't disagree with the "all or none" inclusion of religions symbols. Personally, I'd rather see none. My complaint is that these groups seem to pick and choose their religious targets, christianity in particular. Have any of these groups voiced opposition to the proposed Park 51 complex going up or is their only concern issues on the side of a political agenda?



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:32 AM
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Originally posted by Glass
I do not understand why Atheists feel religious symbols are so offensive. The cross has been traditionally used as a symbol for remembrance of the dead for centuries.

Why does the christian god require its symbol on the dead? is it some sort of marking for soul harvesting or something?
Sort of weird, don'tcha think? Did christ die there? no...a person died there...wouldn't a da'vinci's man model be a better fit? Why a crusifiction sign? is this rome? did these people somehow violate roman law?



If the atheists are really outraged that only a christian symbol is being used, they should cough up the funding for a large golden Buddha, statue of Vishnu, statue of Anubis, moon and star, star of david, yin-yang, etc. until they're satisfied that every religion is represented.

Otherwise, keep up the intolerance Atheists, you're no better then them.


edit on 28-7-2011 by Glass because: (no reason given)


If the government wasn't getting involved, there would be no issue...some church putting a cross on private land is one thing, a government putting a religious symbol down is another.
Just think, in 25 years or so, when islam becomes 51%, the cross will be ripped down and a crescent moon and star will be erected...you know...for rememberance.

I am sure you will have no problem with that, right?

Keep religion out of government is the moral of the story.



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:33 AM
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Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by kalunom
Silly atheists. When you die there is nothing left anyhow, right? Why do you care?


Because we aren't dead yet.

And incidently, that is not a belief held by atheists.

Like me saying, silly theists, you know you will meet the 12 gods and be judged on olympus....do all theists believe in the olympian gods?


If that is not a belief held by atheists (that there is nothing left after death), then I presume you simply give a different name to God, or gods, or some such, whichever terminology is preferred.

This is straying from the topic of the post, however. Live and let live as the OP says...these sort of lawsuits just reek of a bored group of people looking for something to do and get some attention.



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:35 AM
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The Atheists kind of have a point; a religious symbol as a national memorial implies that everyone in that country is a member of that religion, and not only that - considering 9/11 was supposedly an extremist attack from one religious group, putting up a symbol from another / opposing religion could possibly be seen as trolling.

I don't see why a non-religious memorial couldn't be commissioned; if its purpose is to commemorate, then the symbol doesn't matter, only the meaning placed in it by the people. You could just replace it with a pebble; it would still have the same meaning and serve the same purpose, and wouldn't risk offending anyone.



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:35 AM
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Originally posted by amaster
reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Wait, I thought 9/11 was an inside job? What's this about a blood sacrifice?

You should call CNN with your breaking discovery. And ya, blood sacrifice, thats what it was overall, a ritualistic religious murder..the hijackers were not screaming the pros and cons of capitalism and its effect on global inflation...they were screaming to god to accept the sacrifice and give them cookies in heaven.


I don't disagree with the "all or none" inclusion of religions symbols. Personally, I'd rather see none. My complaint is that these groups seem to pick and choose their religious targets, christianity in particular. Have any of these groups voiced opposition to the proposed Park 51 complex going up or is their only concern issues on the side of a political agenda?

Christianity is the super-duper uber majority...once the wiccans decide to erect a giant yule log with government support in the center of manhattan, I will chirp up for that also...
Christians get the most punches in america, because its typically them trying to cross the line.



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:37 AM
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Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
Mine would be Whataburger, though.


Heathen!


I know, it is a cult. Most people in a certain geographical location follow this belief, though. I am happen to be one of them.



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:37 AM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


So it’s not about promoting your beliefs (since yes, a belief in nothing is still a belief). It’s about gaining equal treatment from the state. In other words, “Cut us in, and we’ll shut up”. That’s a good strategy.

Just curious, if granted a status of religion, with your own holidays and such, would you still recognize other religious holidays like Christmas, Hanukkah, or Easter?



posted on Jul, 28 2011 @ 09:38 AM
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Originally posted by Peteos
The Atheists kind of have a point; a religious symbol as a national memorial implies that everyone in that country is a member of that religion, and not only that - considering 9/11 was supposedly an extremist attack from one religious group, putting up a symbol from another / opposing religion could possibly be seen as trolling.

I don't see why a non-religious memorial couldn't be commissioned; if its purpose is to commemorate, then the symbol doesn't matter, only the meaning placed in it by the people. You could just replace it with a pebble; it would still have the same meaning and serve the same purpose, and wouldn't risk offending anyone.


I think a good symbol would be 3 or 4 (or 5 to make a sort of star) hands holding each others wrists in a circular pattern would be a perfect symbol...each hand being made of a different material and color, silver, bronze, onyx, etc...
That is ultimately all that would be needed there...working together, multinational, united, etc etc etc...and give no religious message, rather, just a message to work together type thing...which is also what the buildings themselves represented.


Putting a cross up there is idiotic and oversteps the governments role.



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