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Anders Behring Breivik and the hidden hate of ATS.

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posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 11:05 AM
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Originally posted by woodwardjnr
Would you replace it with an American style system?

Yes! Myself and my loved ones have had nothing but bad experiences with the NHS.

Second line.




posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 11:05 AM
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Originally posted by Ozscot
reply to post by Melbourne_Militia
 


I'm going to break ranks with most of my left leaning friends and agree with you on one point, and one point only - Immigration is a MAJOR problem. And yes it has to be addressed because the point at which a nation is forced to address it usually signals that it is too late to do anything about it - except from that time on.

It has been ignored by the left for decades - though some of that I honestly believe relates to a 'guilt complex' particularly in Australia and the USA. Neither the USA or Australia is Governed by its indigenous people and arguments about 'excluding others' are always going to be weakened by that fact. Britain of course is more complex in that none of the component parts are governed by its indigenous people (though you could argue that is changing with devolution - except for England).

To address immigration is to address your origins - and most parties will simply not go there.

I agree though - it's putting off a ticking time bomb and the sooner we act the more time we have to defuse it.

Oz



I'm sorry, which component parts of Britain are not governed by their indigenous people? How far back are you going? As far as I'm aware, there is a level of devolution in each part of the UK, which parts are you referring to? And if I may ask, even if this wasn't the case, why would it make it more difficult than in Australia or America?



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 11:10 AM
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reply to post by Cythraul
 


Im sorry to hear that, I would be dead without it so you will understand why i defend it to the hills. I guess you always have the option of going private.



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 11:30 AM
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reply to post by The Revenant
 





I believe it is this resurgence which led Mr Breivik to feel his standpoint was threatened, and for him to go on a rampage. Lefties, Liberals and Atheists all like to argue and verbally attack on their views - apparently righties & fundy Christians like to shoot instead.

This is my fear, I desperately want to let go of my hatred, as it's beginning to get to me. But I can't - because what if one day another Breivik appears outside my door? I'm going to need every ounce of my hatred then. Where do we go from here?


Left, right, atheist, Christian, Muslims, all are capable of atrocities, so to single one group out over another doesn't make sense, be the voice of reason, you don't have to hate, Rev.

It makes you one in the same with those that hate, if you hate that vehemently you are radical.

Do you attribute fundamentalism with Christians only? Your a sensible guy surely you know that isn't the case?

A major problem on internet forums is we censure ourselves, so we never really get to the bottom of our deepest feelings and fears, out of fear of what others may think,

It is normal to have these feelings, we are not made of stone,



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 11:36 AM
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Originally posted by nunya13
I agree about what you say how everyone is so concerned with arguing about his affiliations, that they aren't taking the necessary actions or at least coming at it with the right frame of mind to push back against this kind of extremism.

In my opinion, and at the risk of sparking ire, there is no doubt the ideologies that fueled his actions are associated with the right-wing.

He hates Muslims
He hates Marxism/Cultural Marxism
He hates multiculturalism
He hates the left-wing
He desises that his country's media is controlled by liberals (according to himself)

This is all in his manifesto.

I'm not trying to force people to accept this. But it serves only to support what I believe could happen if this truth, as I see it, isn't addressed. This will happen again.

But what gets my goat is when they turn around try so hard to deny any affiliation with his ideology and then turn around and say, "but he was right about Muslims, liberals, Marxism, multiculturalism." You can't denounce someone and then say that you agree with their ideology behind their actions.

If they cannot at least acknowledge that he was an extremist within their own ideological camp then they can't fight back against this extremism with in their own ideology.



Anyone can write a manifesto that appears to be a "right-wing" or a "left-wing" and go on a spree, then everyone will blame it all on some "wing-nut" ideology. Obama supporters have already proven to be very actively engaged in pretending to be right wing so as to make conservatives look bad. It's such a simple tactic. Like the ones who went to Tea Parties holding signs of OBama with a HItler mustache.
Oh by the way, the Information Czar Cass Sunstein has a team of Internet bloggers who actively engage in Internet Psyops expressly to discredit anyone who is an opponent.

CASS SUNSTEIN FIRST TO PROPOSE AN INTERNET CREW OF OBOTS Cass Sunstein, radical information Czar of the Obama regime.He outlines the tactics which would be used by Obots for the next 3 years:
“We suggest a distinctive tactic for breaking up the hard core of extremists who supply conspiracy theories: cognitive infiltration of extremist groups, whereby government agents or their allies (acting either virtually or in real space, and either openly or anonymously) will undermine the crippled epistemology of believers by planting doubts about the theories and stylized facts that circulate within such groups, thereby introducing beneficial cognitive diversity.”





thesteadydrip.blogspot.com...



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 11:40 AM
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reply to post by Stormdancer777
 





This is my fear, I desperately want to let go of my hatred, as it's beginning to get to me


I understand, it's a brutal world.



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 11:44 AM
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Originally posted by Cythraul

Originally posted by Zamini
Lets get this straight, you are here discussing politics in favor of right wing nut jobs but you have no idea of the Marshal plan?

Wowzers.

a) I'm not doing ANYTHING in favour of right wing nutjobs. Read the whole of my post.
b) You speak as though this 'Marshal plan' is common knowledge. I've researched conspiracies for a long time - forgive me if there's one area I've not stumbled across, but don't treat me like an imbecile. Notice I humbly asked for more information. Does not yet having that preclude me from debate? Do you know everything related to politics in the last century?


Hi there, the Marshall plan isn't a conspiracy, America loaned Britain and other countries money (as we'd spent all of ours fighting a world war for a lot longer than they had - sorry, couldn't resist that), and the overall act was known as the Marshall Plan. We finally paid it off relatively recently, when Gordon Brown was PM I think.



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 11:45 AM
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reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus
 


Scary stuff, TEH, as I said in the beginning, the truth will never be revealed, you can't trust what you read anymore or even your own eyes,



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 12:10 PM
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reply to post by The Revenant
 


Funny how Lefties in particular always want to stifle any opposing views, as in all dictatorships, whether Marxist, Nazi or Islamic.

I, for one, heartily CONGRATULATE ATS for standing up firmly for the FREEDOM OF SPEECH, THOUGHT AND EXPRESSION upon which our western democracies are founded.



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 12:15 PM
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Huffpo posted an editorial showing how Breivik used actual text from the Unabomber but substituted a few words such as "Cultural Marxism". Very interesting. Who would do that?
This blog suggests that Breivik's own facebook page was altered to make him look like a rite wing extremist and a Christian as well. This is a very interesting read, as I have just heard for the first time the expression "white moor" being used.


joshuapundit.blogspot.com...


Oddly enough, within minutes of his identity being made public, that page vanished and was replaced by a page in English with far more radical postings and the tag words 'Christian' and 'Conservative' inserted. That's what publications the New York Times and their political ilk are gleefully using to label Breivik as a 'far right, fundamentalist Christian'. The Facebook manipulation also proves that Breivik wasn't in this alone, It wasdone by someone else who had access to his account while he was in custody.



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 12:34 PM
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I'm tired of the labels being thrown about all the time.

In short, I feel ATS is rotten.

I'm very close to not posting anymore.



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 12:40 PM
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More indications of false flag ops, and I find it interesting that the guy wore uniforms with prominent maltese crosses, and there seems to be an Illuminati overlay to his character.



What are the chances that the very next day, a supposed white terrorist attacked a government building in Oslo, Norway? What are the chances that the alleged bomber used one of the two methods showed in the Homeland Security video? What are the chances that it was a white male with Christian Conservative beliefs?


As the Real Agenda warned on Thursday, the likelihood of a false-flag terror attack was ever more possible than in the last few years. In our article published on Thursday July 21, we focused attention on a new video put out by the Department of Homeland Security and FEMA in the United States which specifically pointed to white or caucasian males as potential threats for terrorism. In the video, both organizations portrayed white men dropping off car bombs in a federal building and activating explosives on a street somewhere.

real-agenda.com...



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 01:03 PM
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reply to post by The Revenant
 





I just wish the rest of ATS was as enlightened and positive as you lot are



Liberal Translation:All you here who are lefties like me are brilliant and wonderful caring people who redistribute the evil capitalists money because we care about the poor, and all those awful evil right wingers are hateful selfish murderers.

Your signature calling Tea Partiers fascist exposes your entire ideology in just one sentence. By the way, feel free to insult the "rest of ATS".



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 01:06 PM
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More oddities about the Breivik event. Police knew his name before he was arrested.



“He surrendered the moment police called his name 3 minutes after they arrived. What we don’t know is how the police knew the terrorist’s name before they arrested him,” said Snow, who is recognized as one of Britain’s most trusted news anchors, and cannot be dismissed as a “conspiracy theorist”.


www.sovereignindependent.com...


Personally, I'm guessing that they used satellite imaging to zero in on the guy's face then used facial recognition technology to track him on facebook or wherever pictures of him were posted. Once they had tracked him to his facebook acct, authorities could easily have altered it any way they liked, as accounts have already rolled in to suggest the fb page was altered within minutes.
edit on 27-7-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 01:23 PM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


What to do with all the hate?
Great question really, but I know avoiding it will not make it go away.
If you see anger here on ATS that's because ATS is simply of reflection of the membership.
ATS is just a microcosm of the real world around us.
On most websites I've seen the vitriol is much worse than here and I would like to think it's the general intelligence of our membership that makes it better than other sites.

I once had an argument with a fellow who was bemoaning the Ku klux Klan having a march in town. He thought they had no right to do so. My opinion was that it's probably better that they speak openly than be pushed underground. So long as they are not doing anything illegal they still have the right to free speech.
I know it may seem counter intuitive to have to put up with these kinds of people spreading their message in public, but their words ring hollow and ridiculous to those with any education. Let them expose themselves for the farce they are.
If we force them underground God only knows what they'll be doing with the persecution complex we've added to their feelings of intolerance already. We MUST be able to communicate freely, especially with those who hold opposing viewpoints or things will certainly degenerate into violence and chaos.

Freedom of speech exists to preserve the rights of all, to express their opinion regardless of it's merit, intelligence or popularity. This is why I oppose "hate speech" laws as it is very easy to go from censoring outright racism to eliminating unpopular topics or subjects. It's not a leap at all to go from outlawing Holocaust deniers to outlawing Climate change deniers and those who oppose globalism. Where will it end? It won't and that is why laws about "Hate speech" will do nothing but expand to exclude all dialogue the current regime sees fit to repress.

Finding common ground is the only solution to the extreme polarization that seemingly both governments and the media are leading the charge for. As people our common needs are many and differences few. Both governments and the media endlessly push stories that emphasize our differences in order to push their left/right agendas that do little but put the people at odds with each other.

As many in this thread have already stated Divide et Imperatum. Divide and conquer so that special interests get their way while the majority of the people get stiffed. We have been ruled by this dichotomy for too long and irreparable harm has been the result.

Either we can band together as people with human needs or fall for the bait of us vs them, hoping to get a "little extra" for our supporting it. Greed, as usual, is the culprit here if you follow the trail of breadcrumbs far enough.

Negative emotions will always be with us. The choice is left as to how those emotions will find expression.


As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

edit on 27-7-2011 by Asktheanimals because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 01:30 PM
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reply to post by The Revenant
 


It is unfortunate that your hatred of Dr. King has prevented you from trying to live his most important dream; of a day where people be judged not by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character. Replace "the color of their skin" with "their political beliefs" and see how it reads. Dr. King was a religious man with a dream. He was hated enough by people with no character. That single dream is profound and he was a leftist.


Peace..............yak055h



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 02:47 PM
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Originally posted by woodwardjnr
Im sorry to hear that, I would be dead without it so you will understand why i defend it to the hills. I guess you always have the option of going private.

I'm glad it has helped you. I'll go private the moment they stop using my tax money to fund the NHS. My gripes with the NHS are part and parcel of my wider gripes with the level of taxation we 'enjoy'. I believe about 99% of taxation is unjust.



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 03:01 PM
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reply to post by Cythraul
 


That's fair enough. But most civilised countries have some form of national health service apart from America. I don't think an American system is something we should aspire too. It's actually a lot more cost effective for our nation. America spends twice as much of a percentage of it's GDP on healthcare, yet they still dont have healthcare available for all free at the point of delivery.
edit on 27-7-2011 by woodwardjnr because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 03:05 PM
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reply to post by The Revenant
 


With news stories like that they pat u on the head and say "go argue to death about it"
cant be bothered with it , its done , over
totally ignored



posted on Jul, 27 2011 @ 03:13 PM
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From my point of view to talk about left wing or right wing in terms of ABB is pointless.

The man is sick and thus all that he says or believes must be taken in that light.

As for the "rage" here on ATS, I've learned to look past it a long time ago. State your point of view and move along is my take on most things I choose to reply to on ATS. Have I seen some posters that I thought were "unwell"? sure I have and the community here usually addresses that quickly should it be obvious. Otherwise I let people get up on their virtual soapboxes and say what they will, if I don't like it, I don't have to read it.



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