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Breaking:Obama endorses Senate Democratic plan on debt ceiling

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posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 09:45 PM
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Originally posted by origamiandurbanism

Originally posted by Fitch303
What about the bottom 40% who don't pay taxes but account for just about all of welfare spending?


I should cut and paste an automatic post to replies like this. I've heard this same exact incorrect and misleading response so many times I've lost count.

- Those "bottom 40%" still pay taxes.
- Those "bottom 40%" simply do not make enough money to qualify for INCOME taxes. How messed up is that? They have jobs that pay so little that they don't even qualify for income taxes.

Never called the rich evil. Our priorities are pretty messed up when we're talking about medicare and SS cuts but not ending what was supposed to be a temporary tax cut on the top 2%. A tax cut that hasn't helped anyone except a very small amount of people to accumulate even more wealth.



Herp derp nobody can avoid fuel tax, sales tax and what not and EVERYONE pays the same rate. I was specifically referring to Income tax and I don't care how much anyone makes or doesn't make if you get paid then you should pay income tax. We ALL enjoy the things we have in this country and we should ALL have to pay in.




posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:22 PM
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Quit drinking the koolaid!!!! The tax rates for the rich (or anyone else for that mater) isnt the problem. GE pays no tax because of deductions and you could raise their tax rate to 99% and they would still pay no taxes.
Limiting deductions to a percentage of income would solve this problem and could be done with 1 or 2 paragraphs inserted into the tax code.
Deductions are the reason 50% of individuals pay no taxes. Again this could be fixed by limiting deductions to a percentage of gross income.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:30 PM
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Originally posted by David9176
WTF is it that you people want?

YOU WANT TO SELL OUT THE ELDERLY???? THE SICK??? THE POOR????

For what? So a billionaire can add another damned zero to his bank account which does absolutely nothing...including creating NO JOBS????????

Everything they have put forth is in favor to billionaires and corporations over the middle class and poor....EVERY SINGLE THING.

And here you all are...begging and crying for it.

WE THE PEOPLE MY ASS!!!!!!!

It's I FOR ME in this frickin country.


Okay you realize when he talks about millionaires he is full of BS.

Most income for millionaires is CAPITAL GAINS and that is taxed at a different rate. He is proposing raising taxes on people our earning commissions, salary.

Raising the INCOME tax will only screw the people trying to build up enough capital to live off of capital gains at a lower tax rate.

Have you ever looked at the economic data or are you an emotional appeal type of social unit?

Both of their plans are aimed at oppressing the lower classes and making it difficult for them to rise up.
It is no different than the tax man that robinhood used to rob.

Oh did you forget that Robinhood was robbing the tax collectors? Or did you think it was the rich guy down the street?
edit on 25-7-2011 by MasterGemini because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:36 PM
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reply to post by David9176
 


I'm sure everyone would love to have an unlimited bank account to dole money out....however that's not the case. Just as an example, this August the monies the US government will take in will pay only about 45% of what we actually write in checks.....the rest is you guessed it.... tacked onto our deficit tab. You tell me if we can keep doing that indefinitely and not have a negative effect on everything. Cities and States are running into massive shortfalls and are having to drastically reduce the amount of money they spend, why can't our National Govt. do the same? Cuts across the board will have to be made, none of them will be welcomed. Some additional revenue will have to be taken as well, but we have to very substantial budget cuts as well as revenue increases.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:43 PM
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reply to post by pavil
 


The real problem is our trade deficit....until that is addressed disaster is certain. Free trade agreements need to end, tariffs need to be put on imports so working Americans can get jobs at decent wages.

It's a jobs problem, first and foremost. We are attacking the symptoms instead of the cause.

Does government need to get their S in order? Absolutely.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:44 PM
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Originally posted by Agent_USA_Supporter


This is very bad
this plan wont solve anything, it will just hurt the american public and the classes.
edit on 25-7-2011 by Agent_USA_Supporter because: (no reason given)


Goodness. That sounds terrible!

Can you elaborate how and why you think it will do those things?



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:47 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Agent_USA_Supporter
 


are you freakin kidding me

cutting defense and leaving entitlement programs alone

of course obama would endorse reids program.


i am so peaved right now.

there are over 100 million people on the government dime this will solve nothing and increasing the debt limit by an addition 2,4 trillion


edit on 25-7-2011 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



So you think we should cut medicare and medicade and Social Security, but not military spending?

That's why no one takes the GOP seriously.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:49 PM
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Originally posted by Fitch303
Herp derp nobody can avoid fuel tax, sales tax and what not and EVERYONE pays the same rate. I was specifically referring to Income tax and I don't care how much anyone makes or doesn't make if you get paid then you should pay income tax. We ALL enjoy the things we have in this country and we should ALL have to pay in.


If you meant income taxes, fine but don't say they don't pay taxes because that is simply not true and it's a very disingenuous way to frame an argument. These people also pay payroll taxes.

If some of these people's wages were taxed on income it would mean they have literally no disposable income or very close to it in a lot of instances. That's a good thing for these people, the economy and the country? No.

Everyone may pay the same rate on most taxes, but proportionately people will lower incomes are hit much, much, much harder than someone in a higher income bracket. So in actuality those taxes are not fair to people that earn much less than someone that earns much more, which is why there is a progressive tax structure with income.

I'm continually amazed at how people come to the defense of the rich, like they even care. They probably don't give two craps about you. I have absolutely nothing against someone earning a lot of money, but I do have a problem when they are not paying their fair share and right now they most certainly are not. I'm not talking about going back to FDR or Kennedy tax rates, but they definitely need to be higher than they are for a number of reasons.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:50 PM
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reply to post by incrediblelousminds
 




Can you elaborate how and why you think it will do those things?

First off i told if you dont like my politics why are you replying again? secondly this is just more tax on the innocent public not on the wealthy rich.




And thrid GOP and democrats are all the same in one coin.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 10:53 PM
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reply to post by incrediblelousminds
 





So you think we should cut medicare and medicade and Social Security,


this is why i cant take you seriously cut the only people who are creating wealth in this country in favor of the destroyers of wealth.

blah.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 11:16 PM
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reply to post by neo96
 


You are spot on. Liberals create a climate of inaction. The welfare system cannot be buffed further, in fact Liberals have already gone too far. Why get a job when you make more sitting on your ass getting welfare and unemployment benefits than getting a minimum wage job.

I guess this is ok though because wealth is wrong /sarcasm. I know we've clashed on this issue regarding bilderberg but on a broader scale you are completely right, the wealthy are not committing evils to get where they are. They are becoming successful by creating jobs and working hard themselves and we are in no way entitled to their money. That mindset is dangerous and disgusting.



posted on Jul, 26 2011 @ 10:05 AM
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Originally posted by samcrow
The Reid bill is a joke. The bulk of the 'savings' are imaginary...winding down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan (projected costs are already factored into the existing deficit and any additional costs would need separate congressional approval) and saying that it completely capitulates to the Republicans, which it certainly does not. Reid's savings are a bit like me saying 'Hey look...I saved a hundred billion dollars over the next 10 years by not turning my house into a spaceship and flying to the moon."

Secondly, even at the $4 trillion mark, the highest amount proposed during this entire 'debate,' we would STILL run a significant deficit throughout the next decade. NONE of these plans accomplish much of anything. The Tea Party GOP isn't going to pass Reid's toilet paper bill, and the Dems aren't going to pass Cut, Cap, and Rape, so what we have here, folks, is a failure to communicate that will very likely lead to a default. Furthermore, Obama isn't going to sign anything that allows the debt ceiling to be a debate during the election cycle...for the simple fact that it alone would very likely cost him the election. He knows that. He's a climber...an opportunist (and I voted for the guy)....and people like him will go all in and damn the torpedoes on something like this. All three branches are living in completely different galaxies, and that's very, very bad for the American people.


I think Obama will ignore congress and sign an executive presidential order to raise the debt
limit by $2.4 Trillion. That way he will defy the evil Tea Party and be able to fund all of his
wonderful sacred cows in Washington DC. He will do what he does best.
Hide behind victims.

Can you just imagine $2.4 Trillion piled up in the backyard of the White House?

Spend - Baby - Spend !



posted on Jul, 26 2011 @ 11:06 AM
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Originally posted by Eurisko2012I think Obama will ignore congress and sign an executive presidential order to raise the debt limit by $2.4 Trillion. That way he will defy the evil Tea Party and be able to fund all of his wonderful sacred cows in Washington DC. He will do what he does best. Hide behind victims.

Can you just imagine $2.4 Trillion piled up in the backyard of the White House?

Spend - Baby - Spend !


I think there's a very real possibility that if we don't have something that'll work with his reelection bid by Friday he'll do just that. Then, he'll probably get slapped down by the SCOTUS and impeached by Congress and we'll have another 6 months of useless drama in in Nero's palace while Rome burns.



posted on Jul, 26 2011 @ 11:20 AM
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Originally posted by samcrow

Originally posted by Eurisko2012I think Obama will ignore congress and sign an executive presidential order to raise the debt limit by $2.4 Trillion. That way he will defy the evil Tea Party and be able to fund all of his wonderful sacred cows in Washington DC. He will do what he does best. Hide behind victims.

Can you just imagine $2.4 Trillion piled up in the backyard of the White House?

Spend - Baby - Spend !


I think there's a very real possibility that if we don't have something that'll work with his reelection bid by Friday he'll do just that. Then, he'll probably get slapped down by the SCOTUS and impeached by Congress and we'll have another 6 months of useless drama in in Nero's palace while Rome burns.


Obama will have to be impeached by the House and then removed from office by the Senate.
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BTW, Obamas own lawyers have told him that he cannot bypass the U.S. congress and
raise the debt limit by $2.4 Trillion.

One thing is for sure. If Obama caves in to the mighty Tea Party then he has - zero - chance
of being re-elected. His political base will disappear.


He is between a rock and a hard place.


Obama could just resign and hand this mess over to Joe Biden.

edit on 26-7-2011 by Eurisko2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 30 2011 @ 07:04 AM
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I'm sorry, but didn't we go through all this in April? Remember the Government shutdown scare?

articles.latimes.com...

What makes you think this will be any different?



posted on Jul, 30 2011 @ 07:20 AM
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reply to post by Agent_USA_Supporter
 

Reids plan has to go back to the House, THEn go back to the senate for a final vote before Obama can sign it.

If the GOP has any stones they will vote it down. (Likely)

That'll leave Obama (A Constitutional Scholar *cough*) using the 14th Ammendment as justification to further promote his spendspendspend policy, furthering us towards an even larger collapse later.


One term or two, Obama won't rest until our country is ruined.



posted on Jul, 30 2011 @ 07:25 AM
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Originally posted by David9176

It's I FOR ME in this frickin country.




That's how it seems.... It's very sad to see how selfish people in the states are.
If people can't afford to care for themselves and can't afford whatever service they require..... TOUGH.


Yeah, great attitude.



posted on Jul, 30 2011 @ 09:50 AM
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Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by Agent_USA_Supporter
 

Reids plan has to go back to the House, THEn go back to the senate for a final vote before Obama can sign it.

If the GOP has any stones they will vote it down. (Likely)

That'll leave Obama (A Constitutional Scholar *cough*) using the 14th Ammendment as justification to further promote his spendspendspend policy, furthering us towards an even larger collapse later.


One term or two, Obama won't rest until our country is ruined.



Senator Mitch McConnell threw Harry Reid a curve ball. - filibuster -
What now?
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S & P is going to downgrade the USA to AA regardless.
The only way to avoid the downgrade is to pass Cut, Cap and Balance.
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The cuts in the Reid plan have NO enforcement mechanism which means they go straight to
neverneverland with Peter Pan and Tinker Bell. That equals - kick the can down the road -
into financial ruin. Grow the U.S. government and build some high speed choo choo trains.



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