This Just In - Physicists Prove That Time Travel Is Impossible

reply to post by NorEaster


I am eternal and the mind is an appearance to me. All manisfestation is seen by me and i am always present. 'Things' come and go, appear and disappear but i am constant.
The materialist cannot see, it thinks 'things' and believes it's thoughts.

reply to post by NorEaster


Knowing where and when i am is very restful. Believing in time and living in an illusion is stressful, the mind will not let you rest.

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by NorEaster

 

I am eternal and the mind is an appearance to me. All manisfestation is seen by me and i am always present. 'Things' come and go, appear and disappear but i am constant.
The materialist cannot see, it thinks 'things' and believes it's thoughts.

edit on 20-3-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)

I see. You're quite something special then. I certainly don't see all that manifests, so I guess that only what YOU see is real. Good thing you see everything. By the way, what am I wearing right now?


How about now?

reply to post by NorEaster

um......yes it does.

No, It Doesn't.

That chain of causation will exist when you collide with it, and then there's your own causal chain that gets (somehow) logically connected from one ongoing trajectory to a collision with a whole series of trajectories that could never even exist if not for the continuation of the progressive causal trajectory that you artificially eliminated when you traveled forward.

Meaningless jargon.

You don't even have a point.

Time is a real thing.

Then show me a picture of this "Time"

It's been proven again and again with space missions (calculating the time it takes to get from point A to point B

Fine... what *IS* time, then?

Explain it.

They use it when planning literally everything that requires exact timing

So, you are saying that they use TIME when they require exact TIMING?

Kind of a pointless tautology, no?

Time is pretty obvious

If time is so obvious, then explain what it is.

Go ahead.... Just *DO* it.

Originally posted by ErtaiNaGia
reply to post by NorEaster

 

um......yes it does.

No, It Doesn't.

That chain of causation will exist when you collide with it, and then there's your own causal chain that gets (somehow) logically connected from one ongoing trajectory to a collision with a whole series of trajectories that could never even exist if not for the continuation of the progressive causal trajectory that you artificially eliminated when you traveled forward.

Meaningless jargon.

You don't even have a point.

Time is a real thing.

Then show me a picture of this "Time"

It's been proven again and again with space missions (calculating the time it takes to get from point A to point B

Fine... what *IS* time, then?

Explain it.

They use it when planning literally everything that requires exact timing

So, you are saying that they use TIME when they require exact TIMING?

Kind of a pointless tautology, no?

Time is pretty obvious

If time is so obvious, then explain what it is.

Go ahead.... Just *DO* it.

Your response here seems a bit frustrated. Oh well. Here's a link to a post I made concerning the physics nature of Time. www.abovetopsecret.com...

Here's a quick explanation of what time is.

According to Planck's Constant (it's a physics theory that caught on some time ago) Action can be taken down to the indivisible unit level and reliably quantified (not that we have the technology to do this just yet, but he did suggest that the velocity of the photon was a place to start). The specific inference here is that each unit of action is identical to the next and when one unit ends and the next replaces it, a chain of events (action progression) forms, which has a definite existential presence that, again, can be measured and quantified precisely (timing). The exact span of physical existence that each unit of action maintains before being replaced by the next unit of action's span of physical existence is the actual physical basis of time, and according to Planck's Constant, this basis is constant (hence the theory's name) and dependable. This theory sits at the foundation of literally everything that science, physics, manufacturing, trajectory plotting, process management and - well, pretty much everything the human being does other than daydream.

Basically, time - while not caused by action - can be perceived by the physical existence of the action unit as it collects within an event trajectory.

I realize that you won't understand this, but other readers will probably gain some insight as a result of my bothering to answer your question, so it was worth the effort.

reply to post by NorEaster

According to Planck's Constant (it's a physics theory that caught on some time ago) Action can be taken down to the indivisible unit level and reliably quantified (not that we have the technology to do this just yet, but he did suggest that the velocity of the photon was a place to start). The specific inference here is that each unit of action is identical to the next and when one unit ends and the next replaces it, a chain of events (action progression) forms, which has a definite existential presence that, again, can be measured and quantified precisely (timing). The exact span of physical existence that each unit of action maintains before being replaced by the next unit of action's span of physical existence is the actual physical basis of time, and according to Planck's Constant, this basis is constant (hence the theory's name) and dependable. This theory sits at the foundation of literally everything that science, physics, manufacturing, trajectory plotting, process management and - well, pretty much everything the human being does other than daydream.

Thats all well and good, but you have not explained time, you have only explained motion, and distance.

I realize that you won't understand this

Oh,. I understand it perfectly, the problem is that you do not... so I'm going to attempt to explain it to you as simply as I can.

The presupposition that time is a dimension that can be manipulated is based upon its inclusion in dimensional vector analysis with the other 3 dimensions (length, height, width), and the premise that these 4 dimensions can be manipulated is based solely upon the presupposition that the speed of light in a vacuum is a constant, and because of this, any vector that does NOT agree with that presupposition is mathematically interpreted as altering these 4 spacio-temporal dimensions, to make sure that the speed of light is a constant.

Let me put it to you this way.

Let's say that we have a car... Let's say that we "Know" that the maximum speed of that car is 100 miles per hour (or kilometers per hour, if you prefer)

And lets presume that it is IMPOSSIBLE for that car to ever achieve a speed greater than that, and thus, we form a mathematical framework around our measurements of it's speed, that constrains the distance travelled, and the time interval of travel in relation to it's speed.

So, if the car was (In reality) traveling faster than the 100 miles per hour our mathematical framework was set up to ALLOW, the answer we would get for it's speed WITHIN this framework would always be less than or equal to 100 miles per hour, and in order to make the framework of the mathematical formulas not self destruct, we would have to manipulate the distance and time functions to make the math come out with a meaningful answer.

Thus, if we plot an object moving faster than c within minkowski spacetime in accordance with the rules of special relativity, we would see a NEGATIVE time interval simply BECAUSE of how the mathematics of the dimensional transformation was carried out.

The theory of FTL time travel is a quirk of the mathematical model we use within the framework of special relativity....

It's not reality.

Time is not a dimension that one can manipulate in such a fashion, because TIME is an abstract concept of motion that we perceive to occur as a function of distance and velocity.

The entire premise of Faster than Light travel VIOLATING causality is merely a flawed perspective of time as a function of a presumed constant SPEED, created through the gross violation the mathematical model of Special Relativity.

Take a look at your light cone vector plots again..... Take a REAL GOOD LOOK.

They are not mapping the simultaneity of events.... they are mapping the PERCEIVED simultaneity of events as mediated by photons.

There is a distinct difference between how long light takes to reach your eyes from an event.... and what TIME ACTUALLY *IS*.

Come back when you actually understand what Special Relativity actually implies, as opposed to quoting the "Gospels" of "St. Einstein"

reply to post by NorEaster


The seer is the only reality, everything else comes and goes, appears and disappears. The seer, the knower is always present, it has to be present prior to any appearance appearing.
What is 'seen' is fleeting. What 'sees' is eternal.

What is seeing is 'present'. It sees 'thoughts' about the past and future but it never sees the past or future. Only the present will ever be experienced. Experience can only happen now.

I offer you these two videos to clarify:
youtu.be...
youtu.be...

Originally posted by ErtaiNaGia
reply to post by NorEaster

 

Thats all well and good, but you have not explained time, you have only explained motion, and distance.

I assumed that you'd be able to associate what Planck's Constant proves with this debate concerning Time, but I was wrong. You can't. Here's the link between that theory and what Time is.

Time isn't a dimension. It's not a thing. It exists due to the fact that concurrent and consecutive chains of events (created by one event unit following the last one, and all organized in service of the survival imperative as logic and the impact of contextual ramification leads the entire parade around by its little existential nose) occur and that there is a span of definite existence that they enjoy as they occur. When those chains of events are completed, the fact that they existed persists forever, and nothing can ever erase the fact that they existed with any argument to the contrary. There is a span of relative reality when a chain of events has yet to exist (1). Then there is a span of relative reality when that same chain of events exists (2). And then there is the span of relative reality after that chain of events had completed its span of existence (3). This is true, and is provable beyond any doubt, regardless of the lies and convolutions that exist to confuse people concerning such an extremely primitive and fundamental fact of reality.

In the above example, (1) precedes (2) and (2) precedes (3). We refer to this simple structure as (1) before - (2) during - (3) after. That's simple and immutable as reality, even if you have a hard time accepting something so simple and fundamental. The rate that exists (within a specific and defined full contextual environment) for the single, indivisible event unit (as suggested by Planck's Constant) to emerge, exist and then be replaced by the very next single, indivisible event unit, is called the Unit Rate of Change (URC). This very specific and very stable rate of activity, from one event unit to the next, exists and was suggested by Planck's Constant, and is always relied upon for all timing calculations, trajectory mapping, chemical processes - hell, everything that humans do depends on the consistency of this rate, and our ability to find our own means of taking advantage of its consistency.

They do use it to measure velocity and to measure distances, but it's a primordial association between all event trajectories (linear, redundant and matrixed) that - due only to that association - share the same full contextual environment (or reality confine) within the corporeal realm. All the residual information that results from all that activity (something occur = the fact that it occurred) by default emerges at the same URC, and therefore shares the same full contextual environment. Together (event and information) they are literally everything that exists as reality within that full contextual environment, with all of it associated by that common Unit Rate of Change.

And Time - as it exists within that full contextual environment - is that "common clock" created by that URC synchronization between everything that exists within that environment. If the URC of two event chains is even the tiniest bit different, they do not exist within the same full contextual environment. It's Time - that "common clock" that's based on the URC that determines what exists as real within a full contextual environment.

And frankly, I don't give a sh*t if you believe me or understand me on this. You can quote esoteric crap until your head explodes and it won't change the fundamental basis that I just described to you. Time is the before, during and after of progressive change, and all that junk talk about dimensions simply confuses people to the point where you can lie right to their faces about what's right in front of you both without their having the right words to prove that you're full of sh*t. Time is so foundational and is so firmly in control of you and everything you do and are and will ever be that it frosts my balls to even have to defend its existence to you. It's an insult. You're like a greasy sales weenie who thinks he's clever with a loophole he thinks he's found.

You're aging and you'll be aging until you die. It's not an illusion, pal. Time is eating you alive, one event unit at a time, and it will never stop.

Thank the lord, time travel is impossible, now I can stop obsessing about why I haven't came back and kicked my own ass for being so stupid. Last week.

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by NorEaster

 

The seer is the only reality, everything else comes and goes, appears and disappears. The seer, the knower is always present, it has to be present prior to any appearance appearing.
What is 'seen' is fleeting. What 'sees' is eternal.

What is seeing is 'present'. It sees 'thoughts' about the past and future but it never sees the past or future. Only the present will ever be experienced. Experience can only happen now.

I offer you these two videos to clarify:
youtu.be...
youtu.be...

edit on 21-3-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)

Don't bother. Seriously. There's so much that completely debunks what you're claiming here that it doesn't matter what some YouTube video says or doesn't say. At the bottom of the ocean, there's so much that exists that will never been seen by anyone or anything. Deep within the strata of earth's crust exists so much material existence that will never been seen by anyone or anything. Thousands of years of human existence that did happen and that set up what is happening right now and what will happen in the future. And you simply can't understand any of it as being real because some jerk produced a video that tells you it doesn't exist.

Christ, I don't know why I'm even bothering here with this. There just are some people who will never emerge from their delusions and that's their privilege when all is said and done. If you need to believe that nothing exists until you see it, then whatever makes you happy. If some idiot follows you down that rabbit hole, then screw him/her too. Anyone that can't keep a firm grip on the obvious tenets of reality will wander off in some other direction anyway, so what's the big deal with which way they wander off to? It actually doesn't matter, and their eternity will be whatever it is regardless of what anyone does or doesn't do on their behalf.

I've never felt so pessimistic about the capacity for modern human beings to make sense of anything as I have become since showing up here and seeing the cheap garbage that passes for intellectualism on this forum. It's really depressing. Stuff like Time and whether an objective reality does exist (in spite of our capacity to accurately determine it), should be points of initiation into realms of examination that aren't as clear-cut and obvious. Hell, apparently no one can even get the easy, obvious stuff straight anymore. Forget ever discovering anything new if you can't even understand the proof that exists concerning the fundamentals.

Have it your way. Who cares what you think you know.

reply to post by NorEaster

And frankly, I don't give a sh*t if you believe me or understand me on this.

That's nice.

You can quote esoteric crap until your head explodes and it won't change the fundamental basis that I just described to you.

It doesn't change the fact that you still have not described Time, you have merely described motion.

Just deal with it.

Time is the before, during and after of progressive change

Are you trying to explain time, using time as an example?

You know that Before, During, and After are temporal measurements, right?

As in, you are trying to describe time, by using time as the explanation.

You must first describe time, before you can use Before, During, and After in a discussion about time.

as it stands, you are merely describing motion.

and all that junk talk about dimensions simply confuses people....

Are you confused?

Is that it?

....to the point where you can lie right to their faces about what's right in front of you both without their having the right words to prove that you're full of sh*t.

Hey, I never SAID that you were full of [snip], but if you want to claim that you are, I'm not going to offer a retort.

Time is so foundational and is so firmly in control of you and everything you do and are and will ever be that it frosts my balls to even have to defend its existence to you.

Your anger is not my problem, actually.

If you can't explain what time is, then maybe you should just stay away from this debate... as your incompetence is just going to infuriate you.

It's an insult.

Oh? is that so?

You're like a greasy sales weenie who thinks he's clever with a loophole he thinks he's found.

So, am I to assume that we are no longer having an argument or discussion about the topic at hand, but are now entering the point where we just hurl insults at eachother?

Because that's what your reply is implying.

You're aging and you'll be aging until you die. It's not an illusion, pal. Time is eating you alive, one event unit at a time, and it will never stop.

But you still have not described time.

and that's the sad part.

Try to stay away from the discussion about planck's constant.... because that doesn't explain time either.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


So....what has caused you to age? What has caused your mother to become old? What has caused your father to lose the physical capacity that he had when you were young. What caused you to finally leave grade school. middle school, high school, and (who knows?) finally become "old enough" to have your own adult life? What killed off your grandparents? What killed off their parents? TMB? (too many birthdays) It's fatal y'know. Seriously, it is.

No one survives TMB.

So, what exactly is it that has relentlessly taken every day that you've ever lived away from you and shunted it into memory? What is it that robbed you of your youth, your summer of 2011, your first love, your first car, and turned them all into fading memories that you'll never, ever, be able to touch again? What is it that is dragging you toward your own death is such a mindlessly determined manner. You can't stop it. You can't negotiate with it. It doesn't care if you believe in it, understand it, or accept its dominion over you. It will kill you in the end, and kill every single person you love. And you don't even know what it is, do you.

It owns you and it eats you up little by little, piece by piece, taking every second away from you as if emptying you right before your very eyes. You hate it, but it doesn't even notice your hatred. Why should it? You wouldn't even exist if it didn't exist, so by all rights, it's free to have its way with you.

So, what is it, genius boy? Do you have a name for it?

Me? I can guarantee you that it will kill you. I can guarantee that you'll lose everything you have right now to it. It will make the entire planet - and every person living on that planet - forget about you, and I can guarantee that it will. And I can guarantee that you are completely powerless to do anything at all about it.

So, what is it that has you right in its grip? Have you got a name for it?

It rules you and me and everything that can be proven to exist. You can deny that, but you can't erase the fact of it. You can make up whatever arguments you wish, but it won't change anything. It certainly won't stop it from taking you from this world in the end, and really, what else is there - for you anyway - that is more concrete than the fact that it will literally take you and any memory of you from this world? Nothing is more concrete or more inevitable than that, and whether you have a name for it or not, it exists.

And I am done with this stupid exchange.

reply to post by NorEaster

So....what has caused you to age? What has caused your mother to become old?

"Age", and "Old" are words that have no meaning without an understanding of what time is... so, for the last "time", would you like to EXPLAIN what time is?

relentlessly taken every day that you've ever lived away from you

robbed you

you'll never, ever, be able to touch again?

dragging you toward your own death

You can't stop it.

It will kill you

kill every single person you love.

It owns you

taking every second away from you

free to have its way with you.

I can guarantee you that it will kill you.

I can guarantee that you'll lose everything you have right now

forget about you

you are completely powerless to do anything at all about it.

It certainly won't stop it from taking you

it will literally take you and any memory of you from this world?

ARE YOU *SNIP*ING THREATENING ME?

So, what is it, genius boy? Do you have a name for it?

I have names for all sorts of things.... Like, Synchronicity, and Perseverance, and Karma, and Humility, and Unbeatable.....

That doesn't mean that I can take those words, slap them onto a number line, and create a causal relationship between them and the dimensions of Space, and Gravity, and expect a meaningful answer.

I was asking you to explain what time *IS*, to prove a point.

You don't have any explanation for this "Time" at all, beyond anger, jargon, and very thinly veiled threats.

"Time" as we know it, is a perception of cyclic Motion.... and that is all that it is.

It's not a dimension, it's not a worldline, it's not a path, it's not a mathematically manipulable superposition of manifold hyperspaces intersecting with fractal like complexity that one can arbitrarily "Rewind", just because you have a mathematical formula that you BELIEVE gives you the ability to do so.

Claiming that you can go back in time, is like claiming that you can go "Backwards in the Motion of the entire universe"

I've seen your type before... you cling to the haughty theoretical explanations for "Words" that you do not understand, with an almost religious zeal, despite not having the slightest INKLING of a clue as to what any of it means, or stands for.

and for all of your self righteous talk, arrogance in your "supposed" knowledge, and classical "Education"....

You still cant even describe *WHAT* it is, that you are pretending that you can go "Back In"


The only reason that you are yelling and screaming at me... is because Einstein was WRONG, and you were taught what he "Knew"

And you cannot accept that you put effort into learning something that was Disgracefully incorrect.


Time is an Idea, not a manipulatable part of reality.

And I am done with this stupid exchange.

Oh! You were serious?

Let me laugh even harder...

reply to post by NorEaster


yes u r right about what time is

metaphysically i can confirm it,

time is what is spent to get back free again after realizing objective change

so like constancy is objectively reason of continuous change, then freedom become more free each time by realizing it till reaching to become existing else from those realisation facts then time become backwards in the sense of moving back out of urself existence

reply to post by absolutely


my guess, time is a lie bc always about evil freedom way

in truth, objective realisation is freedom fact value from truth freedom superiority so any is free and all, so no time since freedom is true

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by NorEaster

 

I just have to reply and say that I completely agree.
I have stumbled into exactly what you mention of through my journey.

reply to post by Jademonkey2k


What you stated has to do with relativity and little to do with time travel. The way science views time travel is where travel is defined as being able to move to and fro from a given destination. This makes logical sense in scientific parlance since even if you were to say move to the future then the consequences of such time travel would be negated all together since at that point of time this future would be the 'present' since there is no possible way that you can go back to the past.

Also time travel isn't a very tenable proposition since moving back to the past disrupts the times-pace continuum and if such a thing were possible then it would create a rather unfathomable situation wherein matter is brought into existence from nothingness - this would have universe altering implications and bring about unforeseeable consequences regardless of whether the time traveler in question were to stand as a mute spectator or not.