The Norway massacre and the question nobody cares to ask

reply to post by Veroniqueh


They are on summer working hours. They get out at 3pm.

reply to post by Aeons

I know. And it was even a friday, when massive amounts of them are off for weekend already. He could've chosen another time, but didn't. Oh, and the police boat that would've transported the cops to the Island didn't work. So it took them 1h40 min. to get to the island. It's a pretty long time.

Originally posted by Aeons

They are all in a white background, because that is how Breivik providing them. He dieted, put make up on, staged the photos and then prettied them up for use by media.

They are both staged, and photoshopped - by Breivik. So that the media would use spread an attractive image rather than a dough boy image of him.

Well, that's certainly a possibility. I can't, and won't dismiss it offhand. But, another possibility is that they have been altered by whichever Govt, agency, etc, orchestrated this whole massacre (using him as the programmed subject. And maybe there were more people involved, who knows.)

See, you're presenting your opinions as facts, while I am taking great pains to make sure I present my opinions as just that ... my opinions. Which are subject to change, at any time I should choose, upon garnering, and assimilating more info.

Right now, I'm not buying the official story. Let's see how this all unfolds, I may change my mind, I may not.

It isn't my opinion. Go read his manifesto. The pictures are on the last pages. He details how he made them.

Originally posted by Aeons
It isn't my opinion. Go read his manifesto. The pictures are on the last pages. He details how he made them.

Fine, but I'm not even convinced he wrote the manifesto himself, at the moment. As I wrote, I'm leaning towards *not* buying this story. We'll see what happens as the whole affair unfolds.

A mind is a dynamic thing, constantly shifting. My mind doesn't get stuck in the mud. I'm watching, learning, forming opinions all the time.

Build your alternative stories, and then disprove them.

Otherwise what you are doing is NOT anaylsis - it is narrowing inference. Where your nature tendencies mean that you automatically discount things that do not agree with your favoured story.

Originally posted by Aeons
Build your alternative stories, and then disprove them.

Otherwise what you are doing is NOT anaylsis - it is narrowing inference. Where your nature tendencies mean that you automatically discount things that do not agree with your favoured story.

I really do laugh when people say things like "you're not using critical thinking", or "you're not using scientifically analytic methods." It's akin to saying that creative-type thinking is a crime.

Look, if you want to buy the official line, go ahead! Why should it bother me? And why are you following me on different threads, trying to tie me to one opinion, when I've already told you that I am open to possibilities, but leaning towards skepticism? Why does what, and *how* I think bother you?

Originally posted by SevenStarrz

Originally posted by Aeons
It isn't my opinion. Go read his manifesto. The pictures are on the last pages. He details how he made them.

Fine, but I'm not even convinced he wrote the manifesto himself, at the moment.

I agree this is a possibility many seem to have not even considered.

I haven't used any "official" time line. I took all the given times, and ran them down myself.

Creative thinking isn't when you box yourself in. There is a difference between using your creative mind to generate ideas, and using your creative mind to develop a complete fantasy world that is impervious to logic and in which you refuse to challenge it.

Breivik didn't seem to understand that either - only he thought he was being logical. And he was - inside the confines of his predetermined limits of his fantasy world.

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds

Originally posted by SevenStarrz

Originally posted by Aeons
It isn't my opinion. Go read his manifesto. The pictures are on the last pages. He details how he made them.

Fine, but I'm not even convinced he wrote the manifesto himself, at the moment.

I agree this is a possibility many seem to have not even considered.

Thank you!

Originally posted by Aeons
I haven't used any "official" time line. I took all the given times, and ran them down myself.

Creative thinking isn't when you box yourself in. There is a difference between using your creative mind to generate ideas, and using your creative mind to develop a complete fantasy world that is impervious to logic and in which you refuse to challenge it.

Breivik didn't seem to understand that either - only he thought he was being logical. And he was - inside the confines of his predetermined limits of his fantasy world.

I'm growing tired of repeating myself. I am open to possibility, so in no way am I "boxing myself in", nor am I "refusing to challenge" my opinions, nor yours.

Please stop misrepresenting me now. I have said I am willing to change my opinion, should anything that challenges me come up. Are *you* willing to change yours, at all? Because it seems to me that *you* are the one who is "boxed in".

Originally posted by SevenStarrz

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds

Originally posted by SevenStarrz

Originally posted by Aeons
It isn't my opinion. Go read his manifesto. The pictures are on the last pages. He details how he made them.

Fine, but I'm not even convinced he wrote the manifesto himself, at the moment.

I agree this is a possibility many seem to have not even considered.

Thank you!

Good. Now prove it. Let me help get you started.

There were copies handed out prior. If you could obtain the 70(?) people from his Breivik Geofarm list you might find some of the people who had them. You could find his Facebook friends list, and fiind one of them. You could find one of the people who ever went to his farm.

You could run down the purchase of the camera, which apparently he purchased solely for the purpose of taking the photos in the manifesto. You could run down the specialty gun shops he must have bought his guns from. You could look into the suppliers of fertilizer, and farm supplies to interview them about him.

If you doubt his pre-existence to this event, you could track down the care facility / doctor that was treating his sick mother. Or his sister who lives in California.

People who knew him as an online gamer have already been interviewed, so clearly over the last several years someone has been pretending to play online MPORGS - that's quite the amount of time to put in to build a personnae that you then think is being CGI'ed. Some of his high school mates have also been interviewed - you could try and prove those people aren't real.

I have other leads you can follow up. This should be enough for now for you to start your proofs of his non-existence.

Originally posted by Aeons

....
I have other leads you can follow up. This should be enough for now for you to start your proofs of his non-existence.

edit on 2011/7/27 by Aeons because: (no reason given)

Ummmm, when did I saw the guy didn't 'exist'?

I just said I am not ready to blindly assume his 'manifesto' is legit.

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds

Originally posted by Aeons

....
I have other leads you can follow up. This should be enough for now for you to start your proofs of his non-existence.

edit on 2011/7/27 by Aeons because: (no reason given)

Ummmm, when did I saw the guy didn't 'exist'?

I just said I am not ready to blindly assume his 'manifesto' is legit.

So prove it. Personally, I'd start with the land purchase, the camera purchase, and his gun shop. Devil is in the details.

reply to post by Aeons


Excuse me? I have not once doubted his pre-existence! Please point to where I have stated that, in any of my posts.

I think you are confused, by the fact that I possted in the thread about media manipulation of images. I don't share the same "false flag" opinion as the OP of that thread. I even stated that, in that very thread. I was merely agreeing that the images the OP posted looked altered, to me. Another poster pointed out to me that it is common media practice to edit out too much gore, an explanation I accepted as certainly possible.

I *do* think this gunman existed. To me, the discrepancies in the whole stoly are what lead me to question whether he acted alone, and whether he is a subject of long-term mind control by an agency, or govt. I think it's possible this whole massacre was orchestrated in order to further some agenda. What agenda, and who orchestrated this, I have no clue. But, I believe it is a definite possibility.

He was handled by an agency. The one that he joined, and was mentored by. He discusses them in the manifesto, and talks about his mentor Richard. I suspect that Richard is an alias he has given to his mentor, and the alias is a reference to Richard the Lion Heart.

So, your perception is correct. He has been guided. The perception he has been is correct, and accounted for.

Originally posted by Aeons

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds

Originally posted by Aeons

....
I have other leads you can follow up. This should be enough for now for you to start your proofs of his non-existence.

edit on 2011/7/27 by Aeons because: (no reason given)

Ummmm, when did I saw the guy didn't 'exist'?

I just said I am not ready to blindly assume his 'manifesto' is legit.

So prove it. Personally, I'd start with the land purchase, the camera purchase, and his gun shop. Devil is in the details.

edit on 2011/7/27 by Aeons because: (no reason given)

Please elaborate, ma'am. How would any of that 'prove' his alleged manefesto was legit?

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds

Originally posted by Aeons

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds

Originally posted by Aeons

....
I have other leads you can follow up. This should be enough for now for you to start your proofs of his non-existence.

edit on 2011/7/27 by Aeons because: (no reason given)

Ummmm, when did I saw the guy didn't 'exist'?

I just said I am not ready to blindly assume his 'manifesto' is legit.

So prove it. Personally, I'd start with the land purchase, the camera purchase, and his gun shop. Devil is in the details.

edit on 2011/7/27 by Aeons because: (no reason given)

Please elaborate, ma'am. How would any of that 'prove' his alleged manefesto was legit?

It would prove it WASN'T - which is your contention.

See, I'm providing you with the beginning of how to make your case.

Originally posted by Aeons
He was handled by an agency. The one that he joined, and was mentored by. He discusses them in the manifesto, and talks about his mentor Richard. I suspect that Richard is an alias he has given to his mentor, and the alias is a reference to Richard the Lion Heart.

So, your perception is correct. He has been guided. The perception he has is correct, and accounted for.

This seems like more than just "handling" to me. It seems more like a form of long-term programming.

Again, I'm not sure about the manifesto being written by him, at all. Considering the fact that the Columbine "Basement Tapes" are not readily available to the public, in order to not encourage copycats (the official line,) why is *this* manifesto so available? Shouldn't there be a fear of it encouraging copycats? Unless whomever may be behind this *wanted* the info "out there," for all to read. Hmmm. It's interesting to ponder.

It WAS long term programming. He details his program of indoctrination for himself.

He wanted copy cats. Its the entire point of the manifesto.