Why God's Word The Bible IS Infallible!

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by edmc^2

 

Daniel is obviously "post exile", and . . so what?
How does that (Daniel's authenticity) prove the rest is not also post-exile?

edit on 10-10-2011 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

I'm not sure if you wanna include this in the discussion but you're welcome to.

Fair warning - the Book of Daniel is one of the strongest book that establishes the authenticity of the Bible and it's writer. That is, Daniel lived through the things he wrote about. He wrote what he was told to write, wrote what he saw and experienced throughout his lifetime.

And like I said - critics were forced to admit it's authenticity and accuracy.

reply to post by edmc^2

Since you're very familiar with the writings of your favorite Bible Critic Mr. Bart Ehrman - what convinced you that what he said is true?

I already thought so and he is just good at making the argument, so as to be a good place to direct people.

reply to post by edmc^2

I'ts really annoying when the only way I can reply to a post is to repeat myself.
How about looking at my earlier post and think of another way to understand it, other than apparently the way you did?

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by edmc^2

 

Since you're very familiar with the writings of your favorite Bible Critic Mr. Bart Ehrman - what convinced you that what he said is true?

I already thought so and he is just good at making the argument, so as to be a good place to direct people.

great, just because you said so - ok got it and "he is just good at making the argument" - that's why you believe him. got it.

n i thought you were going to offer facts.

thanks.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by edmc^2

 

I'ts really annoying when the only way I can reply to a post is to repeat myself.
How about looking at my earlier post and think of another way to understand it, other than apparently the way you did?

my apologies - didn't mean to annoy you - just looking for some facts.

if you have anything to offer that is.

reply to post by edmc^2
I'm not going to sit here and plagiarize Ehrman. You can buy the book.
If you don't want to do that, then you can read Wikipedia articles on the various books of the bible, and do some searches on Google.
I look at the books and I read some and they just look like forgeries to me, and then I find out a lot of Bible scholars think the same thing.
What originally got this line of conversation going on this thread was me saying I would not be so foolish as to base a whole theology on a single verse from a book where the authorship is disputed.
Facts are what is going on in your head. Your thought is a fact.
If you feel apprehension and loathing from reading a verse that sounds contrary to the spirit which is inside you, then pay heed! Or perish!
Don't listen to the lies and foolishness of people of the likes of the KJV only people.

Originally posted by KJV1611
reply to post by Akragon

 

Your not a hippy are you...? And what good is love if there is not hate? And to top that off, tell me madcat...

WHY SHOULD GOD LOVE YOU? What makes you think He does? Would God love you even if you didn't believe in Him? (Jesus being God).

Im not sure exactly what a hippy is, and i don't see how that is relevant to this discussion. Must you label everyone?

Love binds us all, it heals, it nurtures... love shows you truth in all things. Hate does nothing but seperate us as a species, and promote fear. Something you and those like you seem to enjoy preaching because of this book.

Its a shame you don't understand who you think God is though. Jesus would love me because i love others... i don't promote hate or fear... i serve those that need it most. And i love doing it.

I couldn't care less if YOUR god loved me, because he is not God... but if he was God i know he would still love me... simply because i walk his path. The path you do not understand, as of yet... Perhaps one day.

This is me... and how i live my life... As far as i've seen, you can not say the same...


27 But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,

28 Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you.

29 And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloak forbid not to take thy coat also.

30 Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again.

31 And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise.

32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them.

33 And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same.

34 And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.

35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.

36 Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.

37 Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:

38 Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.


Any more questions?

reply to post by edmc^2

- just looking for some facts.

if you have anything to offer that is.

This post by you should be a warning to yourself and I ask you to take heed of this warning that is in your own words that you are possessed by an evil, trickster spirit and you need to seek the Lord to be cleansed of it. Your soul is infected and is not suitable for heaven.

Originally posted by KJV1611
no, not so much. We (Christians) are not God's living words....

THIS is what I have been saying all along!!!!!!!!!

This is your own judgement straight from your own blasphemous tongue. You do not speak for God. Thus your words are unclean. Why should ANYONE listen to you?

I did not judge you. I merely said I take a different path. This brought out your own confession and judgement.

Doctor, heal thyself.

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by edmc^2

 

- just looking for some facts.

if you have anything to offer that is.

This post by you should be a warning to yourself and I ask you to take heed of this warning that is in your own words that you are possessed by an evil, trickster spirit and you need to seek the Lord to be cleansed of it. Your soul is infected and is not suitable for heaven.

edit on 11-10-2011 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

And yet by your admission you deem God's word the Bible a forgery.

You promote publications by people who deem God's Word worthless - a forgery and you go against the words of the Lord Christ Jesus when he said:

Jhn 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth: thy word is truth. (ASV)

Originally posted by edmc^2

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by edmc^2

 

- just looking for some facts.

if you have anything to offer that is.

This post by you should be a warning to yourself and I ask you to take heed of this warning that is in your own words that you are possessed by an evil, trickster spirit and you need to seek the Lord to be cleansed of it. Your soul is infected and is not suitable for heaven.

edit on 11-10-2011 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

And yet by your admission you deem God's word the Bible a forgery.

You promote publications by people who deem God's Word worthless - a forgery and you go against the words of the Lord Christ Jesus when he said:

Jhn 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth: thy word is truth. (ASV)

My friend you would have to understand the truth before you sanctify anyone with it... What you preach is not truth...

Learn the truth, then sanctify all you meet with it...

Originally posted by Akragon

Originally posted by edmc^2

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by edmc^2

 

- just looking for some facts.

if you have anything to offer that is.

This post by you should be a warning to yourself and I ask you to take heed of this warning that is in your own words that you are possessed by an evil, trickster spirit and you need to seek the Lord to be cleansed of it. Your soul is infected and is not suitable for heaven.

edit on 11-10-2011 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

And yet by your admission you deem God's word the Bible a forgery.

You promote publications by people who deem God's Word worthless - a forgery and you go against the words of the Lord Christ Jesus when he said:

Jhn 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth: thy word is truth. (ASV)

My friend you would have to understand the truth before you sanctify anyone with it... What you preach is not truth...

Learn the truth, then sanctify all you meet with it...

I do indeed KNOW the truth - it's the truth that Jesus spoke of. That is, the Bible, God's written word IS the truth (Jhn 17:17)

By learning and applying God's Infallible Word we are sanctified. But you though hold God's written Word the Bible in contempt thus you don't know the truth that Jesus spoke of when he said:

Jhn 17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

Jhn 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth: thy word is truth.

So why then do you hold God's Word the Bible in contempt?

reply to post by edmc^2

I do indeed KNOW the truth - it's the truth that Jesus spoke of. That is, the Bible, God's written word IS the truth (Jhn 17:17)

Incorrect my friend... Though the truth IS what Jesus spoke of, he was not talking about what is written in the bible... At that point the bible as we have it wasn't written yet. As usual i will say to you, read the ENTIRE chapter before you make such statements... Cherry picking fails every time, at least when you're dealing with me... As you've found out before.

By learning and applying God's Infallible Word we are sanctified.

True, but as i've said, you do not understand what words they are that sanctify you and others... as you've shown within this thread.

But you though hold God's written Word the Bible in contempt thus you don't know the truth that Jesus spoke of when he said:

Jhn 17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

Again, if you'd stop cherry picking and read the entire chapter, you might understand what i mean... Since you are too lazy i will sumerize for you. In this chapter Jesus speaks to God and glorifies his word.

...

1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:

...

He makes several statements that show him to be "beneath" his father, which he said thoughout his ministry....

...

6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

...

then states that by these words he has been given, he and others are santified...

...

11And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

...

And IF you understood what he spoke of within this chapter, you might understand how you are wrong about the bible and its infallible nature. Within this book you CAN find Gods word which Jesus spoke. That does not mean the entire bible was his word or even truth for that matter.

This entire thread i've been showing you the faults within your beliefs, yet you still do not see the truth. You prefer to believe what you were taught as opposed to what you can read for yourself. This is quite evident by the cherry picking, because the verses you post are not what you say they are...

Gods word is truth as the verse you posted said, but the "entire bible" is NOT Gods word... i've shown you this many times and yet you still do not see, which is why i've called you blind. Though if you chose to look beyond what you've been taught, the truth can and will set you free.

AND...

I can even give you another hint... Though you will likely still not see the truth because i've given you more truth in this thread then your religion EVER has... but again you chose not to see that truth.

So here goes....

Read the last verse in that book you're using for your cherry picking.... i hope you will see the truth within it. Why i haven't given up on you yet is truely beyond me, but all things happen for a reason as they say...

26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.

So why then do you hold God's Word the Bible in contempt?

This is your thread my friend, why do you not pay attention to what others post?

The bible is not Gods word... Though Gods word is within its pages. My contempt comes from the lies about God that are written by those that wrote this book.

IF this book was infallible there would be no lies within its pages... God condoning the murder rape and torture of his own children is a blatent lie according to what Jesus taught. What he taught is that God is love, and a loving God would not even consider such things. If there are lies within its pages, the book is not Gods word.

Logical?

Do you see what im saying?

reply to post by edmc^2

And yet by your admission you deem God's word the Bible a forgery.

You promote publications by people who deem God's Word worthless - a forgery and you go against the words of the Lord Christ Jesus when he said:

Jhn 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth: thy word is truth. (ASV)

Saying harsh things on this forum is not conducive of happy thoughts in myself. But there is a reason why I do such things and you do not fail to provide me with further examples. You take what I said about the forged "Pastoral Letters" and use that to make out that I say the entire Bible is forged.
Do you really think that 1&2 Timothy was what Jesus had in mind when he said "thy word"?

reply to post by Akragon


I’m sorry, you say I cherry pick – yet you’re doing exactly what you’re accusing me of.

Here’s what you said:

The bible is not Gods word... Though Gods word is within its pages. My contempt comes from the lies about God that are written by those that wrote this book.

(my apologies for not quoting your entire post – didn’t wanna make this post longer)

So tell me please, which part of the Bible will not pass mustard to you? Better yet, let’s do this – do you believe that the entire book of John is the Word of God or just parts of it? If just parts of it – which ones are not INSPIRED of God? Which verses are you going to CHERRY PICKED? How about the Pentateuch (five books of Moses)? Is the book of Genesis INSPIRED of God or just the ones you approved of? If so, which ones are you going to cherry picked? Which ones are you taking out? Be honest please.

Below is a list of the 66 books of the Bible. Which ones should be taken out per your estimation?

Written by Moses
1. Genesis
2. Exodus
3. Leviticus
4. Numbers
5. Deuteronomy

OT Narratives
6. Joshua
7. Judges
8. Ruth
9. 1 Samuel
10. 2 Samuel
11. 1 Kings
12. 2 Kings
13. 1 Chronicles
14. 2 Chronicles
15. Ezra
16. Nehemiah
17. Esther

Wisdom Literature
18. Job
19. Psalms
20. Proverbs
21. Ecclesiastes
22. Song of Songs

Major Prophets
23. Isaiah
24. Jeremiah
25. Lamentations
26. Ezekiel
27. Daniel

Minor Prophets
28. Hosea
29. Joel
30. Amos
31. Obadiah
32. Jonah
33. Micah
34. Nahum
35. Habakkuk
36. Zephaniah
37. Haggai
38. Zechariah
39. Malachi

NT Narratives
40. Matthew
41. Mark
42. Luke
43. John
44. Acts

Epistles by Paul
45. Romans
46. 1 Corinthians
47. 2 Corinthians
48. Galatians
49. Ephesians
50. Philippians
51. Colossians
52. 1 Thessalonians
53. 2 Thessalonians
54. 1 Timothy
55. 2 Timothy
56. Titus
57. Philemon

General Epistles
58. Hebrews
59. James
60. 1 Peter
61. 2 Peter
62. 1 John
63. 2 John
64. 3 John
65. Jude

Apocalyptic Epistle by John
66. Revelation

took the list from this site - www.logosmultimedia.com...

Which books are you going to cherry picked?

Fair warnings before you do it:

““I am bearing witness to everyone that hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone makes an addition to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this scroll; 19 and if anyone takes anything away from the words of the scroll of this prophecy, God will take his portion away from the trees of life and out of the holy city, things which are written about in this scroll.” (Revelation 22:18-19)

Is the quote above cherry picking to you also? Should I quote the entire Chapter or for that matter the entire book of Revelation to arrive at the above warning? Very impractical huh?

But you know I can quote the entire Bible here or the entire chapter but the MODS will not allow it. Plus if I do that you might not be able to keep up. So I quote the specific verses to get to the point! But if you prefer that I quote the entire chapter to arrive at a specific point, by all means I have no problem with that. I can go verse by verse or even word by word with an explanation of each verse and words then zero in on the specific verse/word. I can do that but will you be able to catch up?

So back to my question – which part of the Bible you deem not part of the Bible or as the other poster here say – a forgery?

As for me I will repeat what the apostle Paul said:

“All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.” (2 Timothy 3:16-17)

(Again should I quote the entire chapter or the entire book to arrive at the verses above? Or are you also going to discard the above Bible verses too in order to support your claim?


ty

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by edmc^2

 

And yet by your admission you deem God's word the Bible a forgery.

You promote publications by people who deem God's Word worthless - a forgery and you go against the words of the Lord Christ Jesus when he said:

Jhn 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth: thy word is truth. (ASV)

Saying harsh things on this forum is not conducive of happy thoughts in myself. But there is a reason why I do such things and you do not fail to provide me with further examples. You take what I said about the forged "Pastoral Letters" and use that to make out that I say the entire Bible is forged.
Do you really think that 1&2 Timothy was what Jesus had in mind when he said "thy word"?

Harsh things? Huh? If I did sorry, but I think I didn't do such a thing - I'm here to defend God's Infallible written Word the Bible. It's been so maligned by so many even by some who profess to believe in it. If such defense is considered a "harsh thing" then so be it. I'm glad to do it.

So again, why do you say the "Pastoral Letters" of the apostle Paul forgery?

To quote Paul:

“All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.” (2 Timothy 3:16-17)

Are the texts above forgery? If so please prove it in defense of your claim.

reply to post by edmc^2

As for me I will repeat what the apostle Paul said:

“All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.” (2 Timothy 3:16-17)

You are going right back to the same argument I was criticizing you earlier for.
You are using the words of a forger who manufactured "letters" from the now dead Paul to support the official version of an ecclesiastical hierarchy which did not exist in the lifetime of Paul. The forgery was covered up by that same hierarchy which the so-called letters supported.
Now you use the same words from the same forger to support the use of forged letters as being the authoritative word of God. That is circular logic at work. Could you find another such verse from a book of Paul that the authorship of is not in dispute?

reply to post by edmc^2

I was talking about harsh things I said about you.
Such as, that you had a trickster spirit, which was making you say sneaky little things instead of talking straight, then again, making you say things that were not true, about what I said.
Now that trickster spirit is making you think what I wrote about myself, I was saying about you.
I suggest you work on your writing on this forum without the aid of such spirits because they do not serve you well.
You have these evil spirits on account of a false philosophy which you support, as a form of idolatry in your heart, for words written on parchment, rather than the true word of God that should be written on your heart.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by edmc^2

 

I was talking about harsh things I said about you.
Such as, that you had a trickster spirit, which was making you say sneaky little things instead of talking straight, then again, making you say things that were not true, about what I said.
Now that trickster spirit is making you think what I wrote about myself, I was saying about you.
I suggest you work on your writing on this forum without the aid of such spirits because they do not serve you well.
You have these evil spirits on account of a false philosophy which you support, as a form of idolatry in your heart, for words written on parchment, rather than the true word of God that should be written on your heart.

edit on 12-10-2011 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

Interesting. I have "a trickster spirit" that's controlling me.

So if I say that the Bible is the written word of God - it's a trick?

Yet not only my mind but my heart says that the Bible IS the WRITTEN WORD OF GOD.

Does this mean the "trickster spirit" is tricking me?

So if I repeat God's written Words such us the ones proclaimed by the Lord Christ Jesus, does it mean that I'm being trick by the " trickster spirit"?

For instance If I say:

Mat 5:3 Blessed [are] the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Mat 5:4 Blessed [are] they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.

Mat 5:5 Blessed [are] the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

Mat 5:6 Blessed [are] they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.

Mat 5:7 Blessed [are] the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.

Mat 5:8 Blessed [are] the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

Mat 5:9 Blessed [are] the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.

Mat 5:10 Blessed [are] they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Mat 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

Mat 5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great [is] your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

Does this mean I'm being tricked by the "trickster spirit"?

If so then I quote what Jesus said:

Mar 3:24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand.

Mar 3:25 And if a house is divided against itself, that house will not be able to stand.

Mar 3:26 And if Satan has risen up against himself and is divided, he cannot stand, but is coming to an end.

How can this be?

reply to post by edmc^2

Are the texts above forgery? If so please prove it in defense of your claim.

I already said where you can find the information, such as from Wilipedia, and from Bart Ehrman's book, Forged.
I found another bit of information I will quote from a book.

• Individual authors: The range of literary levels of the NT authors can be displayed as follows:
Table

Wallace, Daniel B. (2009-05-11). The Basics of New Testament Syntax: An Intermediate Greek Grammar (Kindle Locations 316-317). Zondervan. Kindle Edition.

Here is one reason that the supposed letters to Timothy would jump out at you as being different from the other books by Paul, they are written in a completely different style.