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Herman Cain: Communities have right to ban mosques

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posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:52 PM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


I agree that socialism sounds good on paper but probably can't work. For one, if you do away with capitalism entirely and instate communism where everybody makes the same amount you eliminate incentive to work in the most diligent manner that you can muster. I see nothing wrong with our system; but I respect your right to disagree with it, that's what its all about.




posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 04:20 PM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 



I see liberties are being pushed aside for the argument of safety.


Oh, I agree with you there. I see a large group on the PTB who would like to see Islam expand. Conservatives have always been greatly in favor of religion.

The problem is that the liberal elites have gotten so many people tied up into the political correctness guilt trip, that people are convinced that they no longer have the right to defend themselves.

We are getting hit with the ole one two punch, a right followed by a left. We better start defending ourselves, because we are in a fight, maybe you just don't see it?

This thread isn't about silencing anyone, it is in fact just the opposite, which is pointing out that we have the right to speak out and fight this Islamic invasion aided by both the right and left in our political spectrum.

Are you claiming that people don't have the right to protest and speak out against an intolerant religion that spreads hate and bigotry?

If a community has the right to ban a strip club, and restrict bars to licensing requirements, why doesn't a community have the right to restrict a mosque? I don't see why religion should get special treatment. At least the strip clubs and the bars pay taxes.

When you see religious freaks start putting up their own posters, to establish their own laws in a community, where the Muslim presence has grown since the building of the Mosque, then you have just cause to shut down the mosque. When Muslims start threatening people for not meeting their standards, then it is time for the community to take action, and shutting down the mosque could be just the beginning.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 04:47 PM
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reply to post by Tib50
 



"Daring to question the moral integrity" of the founder of the Pagan Moon God Death Cult?

Well, I think it can safely be said that he was the only founder of a major world "religion" who PERSONALLY BEHEADED 600 PEOPLE IN A SINGLE DAY.

Gosh, how's that for "moral integrity"?


First of all, I will not debate the idea that Islam is a "Pagan Moon God Death Cult". I entertain the theory that all religions are descended from pagan/mystic schools. And any religion who believes in the end times can be considered a death cult. But this is a debate for another time.

Secondly, the accusation you make that he personally beheaded the men of the Jewish Banu Qurayza tribe is false. The Jews were accused (evidence supported this and many historians agree) of aiding the Meccians. This lead to a battle in which the Jewish tribe lost. The tribe (who were allies of Muhammad) were charged with treason, Muhammad appointed Sa'd ibn Mua'dh to be judge and decide there fate. Sa'd ibn Mua'dh asked if they would like to be judged by the law of the Torah (Jewish law) which they all accepted. The penalty for deception and betrayal according to Jewish law is death. So all the men and young men were beheaded (by no specific individual, and minus those who converted to Islam to avoid death) and the women and children were enslaved.

I have attempted to be unbiased and look for something supporting your argument in the matter. But almost every site I check that used the exact same phrase that you posted is blocked by my office computer filter because they support hate speech and racial bigotry (I hate corporate fascism).

As for moral integrity, I corrected myself in a previous post. All those who practice principles such as slavery deserve shame.
edit on 20-7-2011 by Openeye because: (no reason given)
edit on 20-7-2011 by Openeye because:

edit on 20-7-2011 by Openeye because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 04:59 PM
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Originally posted by Sovaka

Originally posted by Kitilani

Originally posted by Sovaka
As I quoted from the Wiki page on Mecca, they ban any non-Muslims from entering their city.
Why should they have the right to ban a certain people from their cities, yet not allow anyone else banning them from their city?

In all things equal was the point of my post.


You are saying that the US should conform to the religious intolerance of Mecca? Should the US strive to be like the worst?


If that is the will of the people... Then that is the will of the people, and the people should get what they want.

WTH says Muslims are the worst?! I have found most of the times that Christians are worse than Muslims.
I find it a lot more pleasant to talk to Muslims than Christians as they don't try and force their religion on me.
Plus I don't have them knocking on my door every other weekend asking if I have heard of Muhammad.


Of course you don't have them asking you to convert. They simply kill anyone who isn't Muslim.

Read this article and the comments afterward.

ivarfjeld.wordpress.com...


Ask yourself, how many videos have you watched online of ANY denomination of religion apart from Islamic ones, that vividly and horrifically display innocent people beheaded?

Anything? No, I'm not talking about ethnic killings in Russia. I'm talking direct religion linked murder.

Whether it's a extremist minority or not, you simply do not see other religious factions so zealously attacking and killing outsiders. It just doesn't happen anymore, except in the Middle East.

You know, I love the diversity that our world has, especially within the Middle East, but I don't think anyone has ever stopped to ask these people if they feel the same about us, and whether or not the differences in cultures outside of their own are appreciated and respected as well as they expect their own to be.

It would seem this is not the case for them.
edit on 20-7-2011 by yourignoranceisbliss because: formatting



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 07:18 PM
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Originally posted by Openeye
All those who practice principles such as slavery deserve shame.


And all those who practice principles such as teaching their children how to commit RITUAL HUMAN SACRIFICE to a Pagan Moon God, by cutting the throat and slowly sawing off the head of a helplessly bound captive, screaming and choking in agony on his own blood? That does not deserve shame, in your view?

Or judicially sanctioned rape of women whose male relatives have committed a crime, with the rape often carried out BY THE JUDGES THEMSELVES? That does not deserve shame, in your view?

Or teaching children to blow themselves up, or chopping off their hands?

Or throwing homosexuals off high buildings?

Honestly, the list of horrific, religiously sanctioned Islamic atrocities is so long and so revolting, so utterly depraved, so abhorrent to every concept of humanity, so similar to satanic black magic rituals, that it leaves one almost speechless with amazement that anyone with an ounce of morality or decency could even conceive of defending it for a single moment.

It is YOU YOURSELF who deserves shame !



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 07:53 PM
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reply to post by Tib50
 


Well if you re read my post I said


All those who practice principles such as slavery deserve shame.


I am implying that any such act comparable to slavery is condemnable. All of the examples you just cited would fit into this category. I have never and will never condone these actions, so please do not put words in my mouth (or in my post...however you want to say it).

If people in this thread haven't realized, I am not defending Islam nor do I defend any established religion. I am defending those who practice Islam in peace, people who you and others don't seem to believe exist. And I would have to say to this, you are wrong. Wholesome righteous Muslims are very real and have been persecuted by the same fundamentalist Islamic powers which you are giving examples of.

The "terrorist" organizations of today (which include most Arab political factions) have killed more Muslims than anyone else, because they are attempting to bring back the old ways which for the last 30 or so years have been dying off and being replaced (just as in the other Abrahamic Religions ) with new interpretations of holy words and new philosophies. They created a form of propaganda which made many fear the west, just as the US created propaganda so we would fear the middle east. I suggest all to watch this The Power of Nightmares to understand what I'm talking about.

P.S.

The ritual human sacrifice aspect of Jihad that you bring up is very interesting, I had never thought of that. But I would not call this a black magic principle ( I am fairly well versed in many schools of mysticism ), but it is similar. Sacrificing ones life for God is one of the greatest honors present in all the holy books from the mid east. I was reading a story about the US Christian soldiers who have bible passages on their guns, and say its Gods will that they kill Muslims.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 08:12 PM
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communities have the right to ban mosques and people have the right buy, sell, construct and worship in any building they choose.

they cancel each other out. herman cain is an idiot.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:31 PM
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Originally posted by disasternaut
reply to post by SaturnFX
 


I agree that socialism sounds good on paper but probably can't work. For one, if you do away with capitalism entirely and instate communism where everybody makes the same amount you eliminate incentive to work in the most diligent manner that you can muster. I see nothing wrong with our system; but I respect your right to disagree with it, that's what its all about.


Wait, why would you say socialism wouldn't work, then start talking about communism as to why it wont work...

its like me saying I don't think the republic will work, so I start pointing out flaws of a monarchy..
its two completely seperate systems..matter of fact, socialist countries tend to fiercely hate communist countrys...

A socialism works...its in place already in areas that are the most educated, healthy, and cultured on earth...the happiest places on earth if you read the reports. (check denmark, sweden, etc)

Socialism takes a whole bunch of taxes from everyone, close to 60%, and provides you with pretty much anything you would need for a pretty nice life....homes, food allowance, etc.
Anything extra you purchase with the money you make..so there is still plenty of class progression...you can do minimal and enjoy a pretty nice yet not drenched with material treasure type existance, or you can try and end up with some very nice stuff...all depends on how much you want to work.

Check out this article Here
top 10 happiest places on earth...you will find it heavily favors socialist style economys..the US didn't even break the top 10.

What our American news agencys has done is spun socialism into communism, and communism does suck. but the comparison is like comparing apples to a ball of dung...its disinformation to sedate the population into not realizing what truth is. Just like yourself, you (I am sure unintentionally) said socialism probably wouldn't work because...then you go into communism..makes no sense.

Final add...northern eurpoean countries are not full socialism...its a socio-capitalist setup...compared to us, they are total socialism, compared to pure socialism, they are capitalists...its actually a exceptionally well working hybrid



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:39 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by ollncasino
 


They are a hostile force with a clear aim of conquest. Round them up and send them all back to Bangladesh.

Tolerance is one thing, but allowing a group of immigrants to act like this is not something any society should have to tolerate. Who cares if they are second or third generation. If they insist on conquering the nation to which their parents or grandparents migrated, deport them.

Pre-arrange everything, set up surveillance in the area, surround them with a force more than capable of doing what is needed, and in the middle of the night, round them up and ship them out.




just like little julio gonzales!

those images came into my head, sorry.

i could roll with that, cept i think that his instance was wrong.

they also would have to charged with something to be deported for.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:44 PM
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reply to post by poet1b
 


Protest, chant, gather, do whatever you want...its a free country and your right to protest is protected as free speech

And their right to buy and build a mosque is also protected with the same rights you have to protest.

You sure you want to eliminate that right? its not a slippery slope, its a cliff.

But, I digress, if all we are doing is removing the freedom of religion, then I could be talked into it...I will state though that once that goes through, there will be a large atheist backlash that will attempt to remove all religious institutions, community after community.

The christians and jews worship a blood god, a god demanding you kill someone if they work on sundays, or stone a woman if she commits adultry, etc...this is clearly a political organization.

Don't think they are infiltrators? Well tell me, why do I go to the supermarket and see "kosher" food all over the place? why do I witness lights all around town, including government structures right around the end of the year celebrating a christian holiday?

I may be looking at this the wrong way...we should make it to where religion...all religion...gets banned from communitys...hell, once one community falls, precidence is set and voila...

Then we can work on dangerous speech...talks by people about overthrowing the government..2nd amendment lovers, conspiracy theorists..lets shut it all down...yay!



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:45 PM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Socialism and communism are basically the same principle; maybe not to a "t" but they are quite similar. Again,I believe that system that focuses on spreading the wealth instead of free market capitalism would lower people's work incentive and could be detrimental to their character. I'm aware that some socialistic countries are declared happy and prosperous; but if you look at Greece I think you see a prime example of socialism gone awry.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:46 PM
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Originally posted by fooks
they also would have to charged with something to be deported for.


They are charged with not lubbing america
and will be deported...back to where erm...where we think they should probably be..just keep flying a plane until you see brown people


yee-haw,



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:47 PM
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Originally posted by disasternaut
reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Socialism and communism are basically the same principle; maybe not to a "t" but they are quite similar. Again,I believe that system that focuses on spreading the wealth instead of free market capitalism would lower people's work incentive and could be detrimental to their character. I'm aware that some socialistic countries are declared happy and prosperous; but if you look at Greece I think you see a prime example of socialism gone awry.


Socialism is to Communism

What Capitalism is to Anarchy.

The government of Greece is a parliamentary republic...not a socialism
edit on 20-7-2011 by SaturnFX because: democracy...republic..



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:48 PM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Ive gotta tell you that you've got religion all wrong, at least from a Christian standpoint. God is full of mercy and killing is extremely prohibited.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:50 PM
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Originally posted by disasternaut
reply to post by SaturnFX
 


Ive gotta tell you that you've got religion all wrong, at least from a Christian standpoint. God is full of mercy and killing is extremely prohibited.


How many pages of scripture would satisfy you to the total debunking of that claim?
would a couple hundred examples of "mercy through death" make you see things differently?

The god of the christians...is a blood god...


Islam claims their religion is a peaceful religion also...guess what..



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 09:57 PM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


"Greece's governments have been dependent on aid since the end of the civil war. The influence of leftwing politics has been strong, with the communist party coming 4th in 1974 and 1977 and 3rd in 1981 with between 9 and 11% of the vote during this time, with more moderate socialists winning power in 1981. Since then the socialists have won a majority of Greek elections, and the communists have come third in all but one of the elections in that time. In other words, Greece is used to being governed with the principles of big government and socialism. The current Prime Minister, George Papandreaou might consider how his father, Andreas, when he was Prime Minister, ran enormous budget deficits in the 1980s when he was PM. Greece has been living beyond its means for a very long time.

When it joined the then European Economic Community in 1981, it was one of the poorest new members. Its membership ushered in a period of 20 years when it, along with Spain and Portugal, got the bulk of the subsidies for infrastructure and development that the EU now lavishes upon the likes of Romania and Bulgaria. Greece was one of the biggest recipients of Western European aid. This helped to bolster Greece's addiction to debt and budget deficits."

SOURCE: libertyscott.blogspot.com



posted on Jul, 21 2011 @ 09:12 AM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 


And it is the right of the people to shut down that mosque if it is deemed a threat to the community, just like shutting down a strip club, or any other type of establishment that is deemed a danger to the community.

Just because they call it a religion doesn't mean they can do what they want. That is quite the expansion of the intent of the first amendment. What if human sacrifice is a part of the religion? Should that be ignored as well?

We aren't going to be seeing atheist rally to shut down all churches, they really don't have that kind of lobby.

Shutting down or protesting radical cults is not that uncommon. From all I see, Islam is a giant cult, that has a very violent past, and current reputation built up long before its current attempt to take over the west.



posted on Jul, 21 2011 @ 09:13 AM
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I agree that there is a parallel with sacrificing to the devil when it comes to suicide bombers and to some extent honour killings within the circles of Islam.

Think how many kids are taught in the Gaza strip to act as sacrifices for their religion; this is no different to sacrificing to Baal like in the Old Testament, in the same region as well.

Some has to ask what Islam is and what baggage it brings to society and what the message is.

If you had to compare what it believes to what the devil in the Christian believe system would do then here is a comparison and why maybe their beliefs and the Christian world is so different.

In Islam we get this upside down version of the Bible here is why,

If Jesus was born in a special from a Virgin conception way why was not Muhammad if he was superior?

There is no original sin in Islam; only sin after maturing unlike Christianity the devil never gave the fruit to Eve.

Islam rejects the Christian view that Jesus was God incarnate or the son of God, that he was ever crucified or resurrected, or that he ever atoned for the sins of mankind.

Muhammad ordered stoning of women Jesus Christ taught us not to be hypocrites as we are not without sin.

Judas replaces Christ on the Cross, who according to the Bible was possessed by Satan and betrayed Jesus but in this according to the Koran he was not, so the devil gets away with this story.

No historical evidence Jesus was a Muslim, no mention of that religion anywhere prior 600 AD, no historical scriptures mentions the word Islam, but plenty of concerning Israel, the Jews Christians and Christ has been found.

The Koran has no first hand backup of events that happened in the New Testament the NT testifies itself with people who claimed to have seen and witnessed the events.

The Holy Spirit guided the people to write the gospels and books of the Bible, The Koran denies the Holy Spirit and the mystery of the trinity.

Adam and Eve were 90 feet tall and man get smaller as time went on according to the Koran, the bible mentions age of man declining as time went on but warns us of Giants that Nephilim who invaded creation itself.

Isaac and not Ishmael is the chosen bloodline of Abraham according to the Bible, Sarah sent Ishmael and Hager to the dessert and today they remain as a kingdom there, in North Africa and the Middle East of the dry heat.

Jerusalem is not mentioned by name in the Koran but only by a vague dream.

Temple mount is a prophetic time piece, the future is not set until the Jews build a new Temple there and wait for the return of their/Our Messiah Christ.

According to Islamic view, Isa (Jesus) son of Mary, was a prophet and messenger of God. It is believed that Jesus was not crucified; instead he was raised bodily. According to many hadith, he will return to Earth. At the time appointed by God, Jesus will physically return to this world and aid the Mahdi. According to some sects of Shia Islam, the Mahdi also descends. He will break the cross, kill the swine, slaughter the Dajjal and end all wars, ushering in an era of peace. The messianic era comes after Jesus kills ad-Dajjal, the false messiah antichrist figure in Islam, and defeats his followers.

The Bible says a false Messiah figure will appear along with the false prophet and the image of the beast. There will be two witnesses before hand and some say two individuals some say two nations but for Islam they could pose a threat according to their teachings and cast them as Dajjal.

While from the Christian view Isa/Jesus and the Mahdi sound like the anti-Christ and false prophet.

Armageddon is based in the Middle East, In Iraq where a 200,000 million army will gather.

Nations will gather against Israel today they are Islamic in nature if not the people are by faith.

The Gog and Magog War is also Middle East based and is said to involve Libya, Syria and Persia and Russia at some point in the future.

The Bible warns of false Messiahs and false versions of the Gospel being preached and the Koran does just that.

The two views from the west and the east about God and the future becomes a tug of war and at some point an historical war where either one is true or one is false and is covering up the truth of world religious history.

This covering up and shutting down Jewish and Christian history is a silent war at most times, where either Tombs of famous Prophets are hidden or banned to see in Islamic circles to Churches and evidence of the Christian heritage and archaeology is either painted by Islamic art, covered up or thrown in the skip. For 200 years and ongoing excavations have proved what the Bible says and yet this is just the start and if we gave the Arabs a chance they would never let you know, so there is a hidden war of knowledge going on and to some extent even writing about these views on the Internet .

Creating Mosques in some circles I believe give the same impact of covering up another culture and belief foundations which was fought for in the past spiritually. Some say there is a lot in common with Islam and Christianity, but I say there are a lot of things which are completely the opposite from one another to the point of losing one’s identity and freedoms. It has come to a point where the Christ- less society needs Islamic morals and politicians are asking them for their support and they have abandoned their own words of wisdom.
The UK and America has about 2% population each of Muslims and yet the divide and fear rattles throughout both nations so what happens at 10% and 20% the dividing line will reach civil war and this is evident across the world.

Don’t get me wrong this is not about individual Muslims being cast as bad, we all wish to help understand the differences and do treate them like everyone else, but I feel the religion itself can be silent imposing like a snake wrapping up its prey without escape and without freedom and funnily enough some face death for trying to leave it.



posted on Jul, 21 2011 @ 10:47 AM
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reply to post by The time lord
 


I think I have said it on other threads. The more I look at Islam, the more Muhammad looks like the anti-Christ.

The religion is anti everything, except Islam. This indicates a very fundamental, very destructive flaw in the philosophy on which the religion is founded.

It is like people who believe in human sacrifice are moving in next door.

Freedom of religion doesn't mean we should have to tolerate this.

Christ taught forgiveness, Muhammad taught jihad.



posted on Jul, 21 2011 @ 11:16 AM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by SaturnFX
 


And it is the right of the people to shut down that mosque if it is deemed a threat to the community, just like shutting down a strip club, or any other type of establishment that is deemed a danger to the community.

Just because they call it a religion doesn't mean they can do what they want. That is quite the expansion of the intent of the first amendment. What if human sacrifice is a part of the religion? Should that be ignored as well?

Conceptually, no problem
if they actually attempt to sacrifice someone, then there is a problem

Remember, the core of christianity is human sacrifice..people hold up the sacrifice all the time, claiming he died for our sins (we had to kill him to purify ourselves in his blood).
Christianity loves its human sacrifice.



We aren't going to be seeing atheist rally to shut down all churches, they really don't have that kind of lobby.

Shutting down or protesting radical cults is not that uncommon. From all I see, Islam is a giant cult, that has a very violent past, and current reputation built up long before its current attempt to take over the west.

Ya, thats what I see of all religions built on the god of abraham

Yehweh is a blood god that has caused untold amounts of death since its conception till now, be it under the hands of the jews, the christians, or the muslims.





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